SMiLE Sessions box set!

[Roger Ryan]

I agree. I'm In Great Shape had so much potential. Just listen to the piano demo. One of the most playful and original melodies I've ever heard. "Freshen air around my head/mornings tumble out of bed/eggs and grits and lickety-SPLIT. look at me jump I'm in the great shape of the open country...". I want more!

I can't imagine the 1966 model "I'm In Great Shape" resembled what is on BWPS. Brian's songs from that era had a verse/chorus/verse structure where the BWPS version is really a bunch of bits strung together. I'd bet the "eggs & grits" section was the verse or chorus and cycled through the song. Of course, there were Great Shape sessions we don't have tapes for so we don't really know how complete it was in 1966.

But wasn't one of Brian's reasons for abandoning SMiLE the fact that he had only recorded "bits" that he didn't know how to string together? Clearly this wasn't the case for many of the songs ("Cabin Essence" and "Surf's Up" for example), but perhaps it was true for enough of them that Brian feels the statement is accurate. For BWPS, he just accepted that certain tracks would be bits strung together instead of properly-structured songs which is how he may have originally envisioned SMiLE.

[guitarfool2002]

"tape explosion effect" = reverb. All you do is make sure that the reel you're recording on also has its volume potted up on the mixing board. The further up it's potted, the wetter the reverb. Obviously, whoever put the effect on gradually potted up the music. Same effect that's on the "sections" track on disc 2 of the Good Vibrations set, the section immediately before "false Barnyard."

The effect on that track and others like Heroes is more like a tape delay signal being maxed out and feeding back on itself. If you have a basic analog delay pedal for guitar, you can try to get the same saturated sound by turning up the feedback/regen/repeat/mix (depending on the pedal) controls until it starts feeding back on itself. It's a lot of fun actually.

The classic example of reverb feeding back on itself is part of what Hank Cicalo did with the fadeout on "Pleasant Valley Sunday" by the Monkees. It's a different effect than Brian's "tape explosion".

[ghost]

"tape explosion effect" = reverb. All you do is make sure that the reel you're recording on also has its volume potted up on the mixing board. The further up it's potted, the wetter the reverb. Obviously, whoever put the effect on gradually potted up the music. Same effect that's on the "sections" track on disc 2 of the Good Vibrations set, the section immediately before "false Barnyard."

The effect on that track and others like Heroes is more like a tape delay signal being maxed out and feeding back on itself. If you have a basic analog delay pedal for guitar, you can try to get the same saturated sound by turning up the feedback/regen/repeat/mix (depending on the pedal) controls until it starts feeding back on itself. It's a lot of fun actually.

The classic example of reverb feeding back on itself is part of what Hank Cicalo did with the fadeout on "Pleasant Valley Sunday" by the Monkees. It's a different effect than Brian's "tape explosion".

Why weren't you and H and everyone else working with Brian's band for BWPS? We got Pro Tools and digital keyboard harpsichords when you guys were existing knowing all these little things?

No offense really to Brian's band. I say bad things but that's to compliment the Beach Boys or the other musicians Brian used. They seem to always get a cooler groove, that's just my opinion. I never feel that Brian's band truly lets loose into a groove. It's a strange situation really and I think many will agree. Brian's band is talented - I don't think anyone will refuse them that - but there's a "something missing" that we hear on the older recordings. And it's odd - most of Brian's band probably know a good amount about Smile but the Wrecking Crew really had no idea did they? And yet their playing is tighter and yet looser. The Wrecking Crew playing that funky part of Wind Chimes is some surreal, abstract stuff! cartoon-consciousness. think of birds. for each line - birds on a branch. Little Bird- Charles Manson.

[buddhahat]

"tape explosion effect" = reverb. All you do is make sure that the reel you're recording on also has its volume potted up on the mixing board. The further up it's potted, the wetter the reverb. Obviously, whoever put the effect on gradually potted up the music. Same effect that's on the "sections" track on disc 2 of the Good Vibrations set, the section immediately before "false Barnyard."

The effect on that track and others like Heroes is more like a tape delay signal being maxed out and feeding back on itself. If you have a basic analog delay pedal for guitar, you can try to get the same saturated sound by turning up the feedback/regen/repeat/mix (depending on the pedal) controls until it starts feeding back on itself. It's a lot of fun actually.

The classic example of reverb feeding back on itself is part of what Hank Cicalo did with the fadeout on "Pleasant Valley Sunday" by the Monkees. It's a different effect than Brian's "tape explosion".

Why weren't you and H and everyone else working with Brian's band for BWPS? We got Pro Tools and digital keyboard harpsichords when you guys were existing knowing all these little things?

No offense really to Brian's band. I say bad things but that's to compliment the Beach Boys or the other musicians Brian used. They seem to always get a cooler groove, that's just my opinion. I never feel that Brian's band truly lets loose into a groove. It's a strange situation really and I think many will agree. Brian's band is talented - I don't think anyone will refuse them that - but there's a "something missing" that we hear on the older recordings. And it's odd - most of Brian's band probably know a good amount about Smile but the Wrecking Crew really had no idea did they? And yet their playing is tighter and yet looser. The Wrecking Crew playing that funky part of Wind Chimes is some surreal, abstract stuff! cartoon-consciousness. think of birds. for each line - birds on a branch. Little Bird- Charles Manson.

Yeah but isn't this the major question: why were most things cooler in the 60s - music, design, illustration etc? I don't think it's just about being a better band. All those wrecking crew dudes were coming from a totally different, 'straight' perspective and a formal training that made them the perfect band to deliver Brian's goofy, simplistic, abstract, beautiful stuff. Plus the music itself was new and fresh and I think there's a certain amount of energy contained within something that is relevant and part of the now, compared to a facsimile performed 38 years after the fact in a totally different historical context. However learned the wondermints are about Brian's original style and techniques they are always just faking it, however effectively.

[Micha]

Hey Sean --

I just got the new EMI schedule and The Smile Sessions have been bumped AGAIN.

New street is November 1.

10/04/11   11/01/11   BEACH BOYS, THE   SMILE SESSIONS, THE (2 CD)
10/04/11   11/01/11   BEACH BOYS, THE   SMILE SESSIONS, THE (BOX SET)
10/04/11   11/01/11   BEACH BOYS, THE   SMILE SESSIONS, THE (VINYL)

If they postpone it two more weeks, I can have it for free. I can have it as a birthday wish then.

[Micha]

think of birds. for each line - birds on a branch. Little Bird- Charles Manson.

In fact I think you ARE Charles Manson.

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

"tape explosion effect" = reverb. All you do is make sure that the reel you're recording on also has its volume potted up on the mixing board. The further up it's potted, the wetter the reverb. Obviously, whoever put the effect on gradually potted up the music. Same effect that's on the "sections" track on disc 2 of the Good Vibrations set, the section immediately before "false Barnyard."

The effect on that track and others like Heroes is more like a tape delay signal being maxed out and feeding back on itself. If you have a basic analog delay pedal for guitar, you can try to get the same saturated sound by turning up the feedback/regen/repeat/mix (depending on the pedal) controls until it starts feeding back on itself. It's a lot of fun actually.

The classic example of reverb feeding back on itself is part of what Hank Cicalo did with the fadeout on "Pleasant Valley Sunday" by the Monkees. It's a different effect than Brian's "tape explosion".

Why weren't you and H and everyone else working with Brian's band for BWPS? We got Pro Tools and digital keyboard harpsichords when you guys were existing knowing all these little things?

No offense really to Brian's band. I say bad things but that's to compliment the Beach Boys or the other musicians Brian used. They seem to always get a cooler groove, that's just my opinion. I never feel that Brian's band truly lets loose into a groove. It's a strange situation really and I think many will agree. Brian's band is talented - I don't think anyone will refuse them that - but there's a "something missing" that we hear on the older recordings. And it's odd - most of Brian's band probably know a good amount about Smile but the Wrecking Crew really had no idea did they? And yet their playing is tighter and yet looser. The Wrecking Crew playing that funky part of Wind Chimes is some surreal, abstract stuff! cartoon-consciousness. think of birds. for each line - birds on a branch. Little Bird- Charles Manson.

Well, they didn't ask!  I've made my peace with BWPS and regret a lot of the things I said about it when it came out--although the harpsichord thing still bothers me.

It is a good question, even if you love the sound of BWPS--why does it sound different?  Yes, there are differences in tape and digital, different instruments, different mics, etc, etc.  But I don't think that's really it.  There are throwback recordings that use all old equipment and you can still tell they were recorded yesterday.

So what is it?  I think it's very much cultural.  The Wrecking Crew were just different people that Brian's band, or even musicians today.  Not better or worse, but different.  A lot of them served in the military.  A lot of them grew up in smoky jazz clubs.  I've written extensively about the underlying swing that the jazz guys brought to the music.  Help Me Rhonda, for instance--the swing on there comes from years of studying and playing jazz.  Playing jazz is exactly what you describe above--loose but tight.  Barney Kessel is an outstanding example of this.  Listen to his solo guitar records, his playing can be sort almost sloppy--but he's still hitting all the notes.  It's just an ethic and an attitude.  

What Brian's band brings to the table is great familiarity with the music.  Unlike the Wrecking Crew, who spent 2 hours learning the parts and then cut the track in a half hour or maybe longer, Brian's band grew up with Brian's music--sort of like the W grew up with Jazz.  It's not a perfect analogy, but it seems apt enough.

How does that filter down to the record?  I don't know.

When I open my studio (and I hope this is not some pipe dream but I honestly would like to open a studio at some point, if anybody is interested in joining forces and capital, let me know...) I certainly would be gathering time trusted gear and be running tape and UA compressors and have a physical echo chamber, sure--but I'd hire jazz musicians to come in and play as often as possible.  But that is neither here nor there.

[Kevin Loy]

Yeah but isn't this the major question: why were most things cooler in the 60s - music, design, illustration etc? I don't think it's just about being a better band. All those wrecking crew dudes were coming from a totally different, 'straight' perspective and a formal training that made them the perfect band to deliver Brian's goofy, simplistic, abstract, beautiful stuff. Plus the music itself was new and fresh and I think there's a certain amount of energy contained within something that is relevant and part of the now, compared to a facsimile performed 38 years after the fact in a totally different historical context. However learned the wondermints are about Brian's original style and techniques they are always just faking it, however effectively.

Hello everyone (newbie here),

This is part of the reason why things were 'cooler' in the 60s:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xP4wsURn3rw

[pixletwin]

Yeah but isn't this the major question: why were most things cooler in the 60s - music, design, illustration etc? I don't think it's just about being a better band. All those wrecking crew dudes were coming from a totally different, 'straight' perspective and a formal training that made them the perfect band to deliver Brian's goofy, simplistic, abstract, beautiful stuff. Plus the music itself was new and fresh and I think there's a certain amount of energy contained within something that is relevant and part of the now, compared to a facsimile performed 38 years after the fact in a totally different historical context. However learned the wondermints are about Brian's original style and techniques they are always just faking it, however effectively.

Hello everyone (newbie here),

This is part of the reason why things were 'cooler' in the 60s:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xP4wsURn3rw

Man, this board has had a slew of great first newbie posts. Thank you for bringing the wisdom of Frank into this thread. 

[rab2591]

Yeah but isn't this the major question: why were most things cooler in the 60s - music, design, illustration etc? I don't think it's just about being a better band. All those wrecking crew dudes were coming from a totally different, 'straight' perspective and a formal training that made them the perfect band to deliver Brian's goofy, simplistic, abstract, beautiful stuff. Plus the music itself was new and fresh and I think there's a certain amount of energy contained within something that is relevant and part of the now, compared to a facsimile performed 38 years after the fact in a totally different historical context. However learned the wondermints are about Brian's original style and techniques they are always just faking it, however effectively.

Hello everyone (newbie here),

This is part of the reason why things were 'cooler' in the 60s:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xP4wsURn3rw

Man, this board has had a slew of great first newbie posts. Thank you for bringing the wisdom of Frank into this thread. 

I was gonna say the same thing....fantastic first post. For the last 15 years I have heard virtually the same thing on the mainstream radio. We need a music revolution.

[tansen]

Yeah but isn't this the major question: why were most things cooler in the 60s - music, design, illustration etc? I don't think it's just about being a better band. All those wrecking crew dudes were coming from a totally different, 'straight' perspective and a formal training that made them the perfect band to deliver Brian's goofy, simplistic, abstract, beautiful stuff. Plus the music itself was new and fresh and I think there's a certain amount of energy contained within something that is relevant and part of the now, compared to a facsimile performed 38 years after the fact in a totally different historical context. However learned the wondermints are about Brian's original style and techniques they are always just faking it, however effectively.

Hello everyone (newbie here),

This is part of the reason why things were 'cooler' in the 60s:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xP4wsURn3rw

Man, this board has had a slew of great first newbie posts. Thank you for bringing the wisdom of Frank into this thread.  

I was gonna say the same thing....fantastic first post. For the last 15 years I have heard virtually the same thing on the mainstream radio. We need a music revolution.

Thumbs up!

[Shady]

U2's 20th anniversary edition of Achtung Baby is relased the same day as SMilE (not that I really believe the release date)

Artwork and pre order has been out for a while,  

[Heysaboda]

Okay - and here's the other one that will get brought up before too long: Despite the lyric sheet (both the '71 SURF'S UP one and the BWPS one), the word being sung in "Surf's Up" is colonnaded, not columnated.  

Thank you for pointing that out, Roger.  I listened to BWPS last night and Brian does indeed appear to sing "colonnaded" or whatever the word is.  I've been hearing it wrong.

But did Van Dyke actually mean for "columnated" to be sung?

It IS an impressive, strikingly poignant image in the song.

[rab2591]

U2's 20th anniversary edition of Achtung Baby is relased the same day as SMilE (not that I really believe the release date)

Artwork and pre order has been out for a while,  

Yeah, it's also $600+ lol.

I only noticed the preorder today - I tried looking it up on amazon a few days ago and couldn't find it.

[Mike's Beard]

Yeah everyone buy it so Bono can make more millions that he won't give to the starving nations, the twat.

[tansen]

Glad I really dislike U2 - one less boxset to think about

[Shady]

I hate U2 too, and I'm Irish 

But if they can put a box that elaborate together in time for November, SMiLE must be really crazy

[hypehat]

But then they're dealing with an album that was finished - Same with the Floyd boxsets. It's not quite the same.....

[Shady]

Yeah, I guess...

I'm just getting restless for this damn box set..

I've been one of the more patient posters but I can only take so much 

[tansen]

Yeah, I guess...

I'm just getting restless for this damn box set..

I've been one of the more patient posters but I can only take so much  

Box set?

 

[monicker]

I will get molotov c*cktails thrown at me for this...
I was one of the few original detractors back then, and yeah, the harpsichord thing still bothers me. When i say it still bothers me, though, it's not that it's an issue of listening to the record and it getting in the way, because i don't ever hear the record. I've probably heard it like three times since the initial plays in 2004. What i mean is the idea and implications of its use (or non-use). And the only reason i am thinking about it now (other than the fact that it was just brought up a few posts ago) and bringing it up myself, is that just the other day it popped into my mind for a very specific reason--i rented a harpsichord. Just for me. For little old me. For a few days. For my unknown recordings. I am nobody. I am nothing. And, almost like walking into a Wal-Mart or something, i just acquired a harpsichord. Just like that. Pretty much effortlessly, and, surprisingly, not that expensive. And i live nowhere. I live in a little nothing of a town, not LOS ANGELES. And so one of my first thoughts was WTF, BRIAN WILSON, arguably the most important figure in 20th century pop, a person who is a living legend around the western world, re-recorded his masterpiece, the most famous unfinished/unreleased record in the annals of pop music, and...they used Kurzweil samples? Still doesn't make any sense. The difference is it doesn't irritate me anymore, it's just perplexing. Anyway, i concede:    and i will stop now.

[Shady]

Yeah, I guess...

I'm just getting restless for this damn box set..

I've been one of the more patient posters but I can only take so much  

Box set?

 

Yeah, the smile box set we've all been waiting for   

[tansen]

I will get molotov c*cktails thrown at me for this...
I was one of the few original detractors back then, and yeah, the harpsichord thing still bothers me. When i say it still bothers me, though, it's not that it's an issue of listening to the record and it getting in the way, because i don't ever hear the record. I've probably heard it like three times since the initial plays in 2004. What i mean is the idea and implications of its use (or non-use). And the only reason i am thinking about it now (other than the fact that it was just brought up a few posts ago) and bringing it up myself, is that just the other day it popped into my mind for a very specific reason--i rented a harpsichord. Just for me. For little old me. For a few days. For my unknown recordings. I am nobody. I am nothing. And, almost like walking into a Wal-Mart or something, i just acquired a harpsichord. Just like that. Pretty much effortlessly, and, surprisingly, not that expensive. And i live nowhere. I live in a little nothing of a town, not LOS ANGELES. And so one of my first thoughts was WTF, BRIAN WILSON, arguably the most important figure in 20th century pop, a person who is a living legend around the western world, re-recorded his masterpiece, the most famous unfinished/unreleased record in the annals of pop music, and...they used Kurzweil samples? Still doesn't make any sense. The difference is it doesn't irritate me anymore, it's just perplexing. Anyway, i concede:    and i will stop now.

Hear, hear!

[tansen]

Yeah, I guess...

I'm just getting restless for this damn box set..

I've been one of the more patient posters but I can only take so much  

Box set?

 

Yeah, the smile box set we've all been waiting for    

ahhh, THAT box set

[homeontherange]

The fuzz thing bothers me more..