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680600 Posts in 27601 Topics by 4068 Members - Latest Member: Dae Lims March 29, 2024, 05:06:21 AM
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1  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Documentary! on: March 26, 2024, 08:30:28 PM
Folks should be prepared for this to *not* be the thorough type of documentary people on this board would want.

Remember when John Stamos did that 2000 ABC miniseries movie about the Beach Boys and it stopped in like 1974?

Be prepared for the "coverage" scope so to speak on this new doc to be something more like that.

That's too bad, HeyJude.  You'd think with (what I believe are) good directors like Frank Marshall and Thom Zimny, that would have been at least been a couple parts, maybe along the lines of Zimny's work on "Elvis: The Searcher."  It's unfortunate we won't ever get something Anthology-styled, though obviously it a) would have been difficult to negotiate relationship landmines within the group (even with IAG/Azoff involved, I guess) and b) would have to be somewhat condensed because of The Beach Boys' 60(+) years together(-ish) rather than 10(+ if counting Quarrymen years and their early lives) for The Beatles.

HeyJude, since Frank Marshall is involved, will it be something more similar to the all-too-brief-but-still-very-nice Bee Gees "How Can You Mend A Broken Heart?" documentary from 2020?
2  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The order of the stack on: March 15, 2024, 05:34:08 PM
Where was Dave's spot in the vocal stack on the first few albums?

Where was Dave's spot in the vocal stack on the first few albums?
I believe Brian wasn’t keen on letting him sing in the records- I don’t think he’s singing on any of them, but I’m happy to be corrected.

From what I recall reading, David Marks remembers doubling Dennis' part, though I also remember reading that those with access to tapes (or really good ears at discerning harmony) have a hard time trying to find him in the stack on those albums.
3  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The order of the stack on: March 13, 2024, 05:25:01 PM
I think I recall reading here that Brian had Carl and Dennis switch spots in the stack around 1964, but I’m not entirely positive. There has been a little discussion here, if I recall correctly. I believe (at the very least) that the “Sail On Sailor: 1972” box sessionography and the Pet Sounds sessionography on c-man’s website list vocal order in the stack (I’m not sure if that is also true of c-man’s sessionography for The Beach Boys Today).
4  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Man, we were on such a roll… on: February 06, 2024, 08:59:26 PM
Hi Till I Die,

Definitely agree with you on pretty much everything (if not everything) you posted.  I definitely trusted Howie Edelson, Mark Linett, and Alan Boyd as they prepared Feel Flows and Sail On Sailor, and I still trust them to this day.  From what I've heard/read/as I understand it, some sort of 2023 box (most likely to celebrate the 1973 "In Concert" live album) was being prepared for some type of release.  Capitol reportedly killed a (physical at first, and then presumably also a digital/streaming) release based on "poor" sales below expectation for the Sail On Sailor box set.  I still haven't had a chance to pick that one up because of the high price it initially had, even though I've heard it's gone down since on various online stores.  I've also heard that this was a source of frustration for many and that the 2022 box cost was higher than the somewhat similarly sized 2021 box set.  So it looks like corporate (American) greed once more killed our chance to hear more archival music. 

Occasionally, they dump bits and pieces for brief periods of time to extend the copyright (like they did on Bandcamp in the past); I don't know if they did something similar this year (I don't think they did, though).  I haven't seen lately if Howie has posted anything here, on the other board, or on Facebook (partly because I haven't had a chance to do much music leisure reading here (and elsewhere since mid-August).   I'll have to try to find some time to relax and see if any new information has been revealed since I last checked.  (I think a 2024 EP of Caribou material is possible, but it really all depends on Capitol, assuming the band and BRI/Iconic are on board).  Fingers crossed!!

PS: what about a fan club subscription service if rare releases in many formats to service the fans.. flac/wav/mp3.

Back in 2006, before I was a member here, there was a plan to make a website/subscription service called Beach Boys Central for that purpose, but it never came to fruition.
5  Smiley Smile Stuff / Ask The Honored Guests / Re: Beach Burlesque Lead Vocal on: February 03, 2024, 04:23:24 PM
Also, The Old Ranger, I don’t know if this was I unintentional, but you posted this in the “Ask the Honored Guests” section.
6  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Unreleased Songs Masterlist: Material to expect from further archival releases on: January 16, 2024, 11:21:52 PM
Some other tracks that may exist that were inexplicably left off the Feel Flows set.  Hope these see the light of day soon:
- Susie Cincinnati (Early version, recorded 12/24/69)

I’m pretty sure c-man and Joshilyn confirmed this existed - or at least did exist. During one thread relating to the recording of this song (maybe on a thread about Brian’s bass credits?), it was confirmed that the credits on 15BO for this song aren’t accurate and combine credits from both versions. The first version has Brian on bass, Carl on guitar, and Al producing the basic track. The second has Al on guitar, Carl producing the basic track, and Dennis Dragon on drums (plus overdubbed rhythm and lead guitars from Carl). Bruce might be playing keyboards, and Captain Daryl Dragon is either on bass on keyboards.
7  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The Board Is Back on: January 14, 2024, 03:55:04 AM
It may have been set to no longer access sites that use http instead of https (which costs extra for websites, and some of us site owners can't afford to pay extra). There may be a setting in the browser you can change to let you access "unsecured" http sites.

So that's the reason why the board doesn't use https?  I never knew that upgrading would cost extra.  Theoretically (Emdeeh, I know you aren't responsible for the board, but as a site owner), would it be possible to upgrade to https if many of us contributed a one-time donation or once-per-year donation?  I'm asking just because everything I've read/heard is that https websites are safer/more protected than HTTP websites.  Thanks!!
8  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Box set/copyright dump… on: November 30, 2023, 01:42:36 PM
NEWLY UNEARTHED Van Dyke Parks SMiLE ACETATE???  Where did this news come from?!

What does it consist of???  Where can I find out more about it???


Love and merci,
Dan Lega 

Dan Lega, I think Rebel is referring to the version of Child Is The Father of the Man released on the Friends copyright dump Wake the World. IIRC, Mark Linett and Alan Boyd weren’t allowed by BRI to buy the acetate and/or Van Dyke’s ex-wife Durrie wouldn’t sell it, but Mark and Alan were able to record that one song over the phone? If I am 100% wrong, I’d love for someone to correct me.
9  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Box set/copyright dump… on: November 28, 2023, 04:42:01 AM
I bet there's still going to be a copyright dump.  Howie hinted at some sort of release in a Facebook post, and it appears to have been referring to a copyright dump given what I've heard from others regarding the "poor" sales of the Sail On Sailor box.  My bet is we see some sort of live 1973 release.  I think we could see an Endless Summer box (as I think c-man or HeyJude once referred to one) with alternates of those classics in 2024, with maybe a copyright dump of the Caribou recordings.  2025 could have both a Beachago live release (maybe as a more mainstream release/single show/best of) and a "1965" box to cover Today & Summer Days and Summer Nights.   Maybe I'm too much of an optimist (on these things; I'm a pessimist on many others - an optimistic pessimist).   Grin
10  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Thread for various insignificant questions that don't deserve their own thread! on: August 27, 2023, 11:16:04 PM
Anyone know why Brian's 2004 solo album "Gettin' In Over My Head" still isn't available to stream or download?  Don't make sense to me, it's a perfectly good album and should be widely available again!

Hi Bedroom Tapes, I don’t have a good answer, especially because I haven’t heard the album myself. I thought the general consensus was that Brian and Melinda aren’t so fond of it now, but I could very well be wrong and welcome a correction if necessary.

I do remember reading in (I think) an interview (conducted by someone I can’t remember) with Alan Boyd and Mark Linett, in which Mark said that he wasn’t aware of that and that he would look into it. I can’t remember exactly when this interview took place but I want to say it was no earlier than the release of the 1968/2018 archive sets and no later than around the time of the release of Feel Flows in 2021.
11  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Alternate SMiLE History Attempt on: August 27, 2023, 11:12:39 PM
Hi guitarfool and juggler,

I’m not denying Brian’s unique sense of humor (comedy skits on some of the early albums and also those recorded for Smile), and I agree that the karate kick with Elvis was very likely a joke, meant to be an ice-breaker, etc. However, I have a hard time believing that none of these stories were (drug-) or mental health-related, specifically the one about Brian digging a grave in his backyard. I don’t know as much about Brian’s personal life as you both (and many others here on the forum) do, so I’ll gladly largely retract my statement if you have more info that I likely don’t know about.
12  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian AI Project. on: August 27, 2023, 10:57:08 PM
I caught a little bit of Smile AD's livestream today where he talked about the making of these tracks. For those who don't really dig this mix, it may be worth scanning through those 'making-of' livestreams. Not because it'll change your mind about how you feel about the mix (though it might), but it really shows the amount of time, energy, and care that went into this project. Just from a technical perspective, this mix is an astonishing achievement. And hearing Smile AD talk about his reasoning for mixing things certain ways, adding in AI vocals in certain places, it really makes sense once you listen to his reasoning.

I was blown away at how many tracks he had for each song - double tracked vocals, bass lines that were beautifully (and seemingly perfectly) extracted so he could mix them better. The clippings/edits he did just to one of his vocal tracks was very cool to see. Other highlights were how he added in various sounds to help achieve a more impactful sound. He would scroll up/down through the tracks for whatever song he was talking about, and I feel like sometimes it was an endless scroll because he had so many tracks (in a good way, it just shows how much work he put into each of these songs).

I know this wasn’t directed at me, rab, but I realized I should (briefly) further explain my thoughts on the AI topic, since I can’t remember if I said one specific part before. I am not denying the effort that some users such as Smile AD are putting into these projects (though I will still insist that many other users are just doing something without effort for the sake of it). I definitely understand the intrigue and what if’s regarding the band’s music. There is likely some alternate or something that never existed or used to exist that each and every one of us wants to hear. However, I don’t understand why we’d listen to AI recreate The Beach Boys when we have the real thing, and so much of it? The amount of material the band has released (solo material included) is a ton of material, let alone the amounts of alternates and unreleased and/or previously unknown material surfacing constantly on the archive sets (since 1981/1993, but especially since 2013). Ok, I think I’ve bored you all enough now.  Grin I’ll keep quiet.
13  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Brian AI Project. on: August 15, 2023, 10:10:49 PM

I'm wonderin', has Rio Grande been AI'd yet??

I've probably mentioned this before, but the idea of AI helping create a Pet Sounds-era-sounding Love You album is intriguing to me, and in addition to that I'd love to hear the '88 album given the same treatment (and saying that, I love the synths and production on both of those albums, I'm just intrigued by the idea of making them sound like they were recorded in the 60s with Pet Sounds era instruments).

If only AI could re-write Landy's contributions to '88 Grin

I know this wouldn’t happen either way, but I’d rather have someone like Darian, perhaps with or without contributions from Brian and Al, handle this sort of a thing. Brian’s band knows how to recreate this stuff to a T, and maybe with Scott Totten and John Cowsill no longer with Mike, something magical could happen. After all, Al did tease a possible Brian album next year. Darian and the band could handle the arrangements and help Brian and Al (if they chose to contribute) with lyrics. Obviously, I know this is extremely unlikely, especially potential input from Brian and Al, but as Lonely Summer said above, I don’t want to listen to AI stuff and justify its existence/support future creations. I’m sure those of us here are doing this with good intentions and a lot of hard work, but this stuff is too dangerous to me. Someone wanting to attack any of the band members could create deepfakes audio instantly, and that could spread fast. I think AI should be left to demixing, as HeyJude has said, and if Mark Linett, Alan Boyd, and Howie Edelsoj could get a hold of that (type of) technology (for a reasonable/fair price), that could be interesting for attempting new mixes of 62-63 and 65 material (LDC, Today, SDSN, etc) if they ever receive archive releases down the line.
14  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The legacy of \ on: August 12, 2023, 10:13:00 PM
I might not have the longest or most eloquent comments to post, as many of you have had before me. But I will say that I think guitarfool2002 (Craig) has pretty much nailed it. I could use more colorful language, but I won’t, partly because of board rules: Wenner was/is a tool.

Regarding the smoking, cutting class, rebellion culture cited as part of rock and roll: that may be true for some, but it definitely wasn’t true for all. After all, some of the biggest artists themselves were pretty clean-cut people before, during, and/or their time in the spotlight.

Regarding BTTYS itself, I think it’s a good song. It’s not their best song, but certainly not the worst either. I agree with school spirit being a thing of the pre-Kennedy times, and regardless of how people felt about their high schools, I believe many were still cheering their schools’ teams on. Definitely didn’t blow their career; in my opinion, that was Smiley Smile.

I don’t buy the idea that The Beach Boys or Brian in particular were insincere when writing and recording new material. They may have not respected it well enough on the stage most of the time in the ‘60s, but I don’t think the music itself comes off as insincere. You don’t have to be a surfer to be part of the culture, hang out with surfers, etc. in the ‘60s.

The idea of cool is also extremely overrated, but I think I’ve ranted enough for now.

EDIT: Fixed typo/possible autocorrect mistake.
15  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / Re: Elvis Presley on: August 04, 2023, 07:29:22 PM


I really think he was a guy that lived in a very small hermetically sealed environment and that is boring-so leads to drugs. Same story of Michael Jackson and even Prince. Instead of traveling and having fun-he was just in a hotel or in Graceland with his small group-not being challenged. Even the guys knew what was up-they talked in the Guralnick book about how exciting it was to go see Jackie Wilson at a club in the 60s because Elvis  did such things so rarely.  Instead of having those experiences he isolated himself


I think you're absolutely right although I don't know if this situation led to the drugs or other circumstances (remember that it was pretty common in the 50s for musicians on the road to take amphetamines). But the man certainly lived in his own reality and judging by some of his bevahior his psyche seems to have taken damage by that.


Right…the drugs may have started with pills on the road that everyone did in those days. The Guaralnick book suggests it first became a problem around 1965-6, which was at his career low point-as the films really declined in quality and he put on weight. Still what ever problems he had at that time did not leak out to the public and he had a very clean image as late as 1971. But that is when he started to just have a hard time staying in control and people started to know occasional troubling behavior in the studio and on the road. By 72 he was becoming kind of erratic and it shows on screen in that film

I haven't read the Guralnick books yet (I know, I'm a bad diehard fan   LOL ), but I thought it was practically a fact that Elvis didn't start taking drugs until he was in the army, so around 1958?
16  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: God Only Knows Instruments/Credits on: July 30, 2023, 01:14:10 AM
Hi all,

I’ve read this topic before, and I want t preface by saying I’m not doubting anyone’s research, especially those by Craig, Joshilyn, Will, and their team. However, I do have one question. While listening to the SiriusXM BB channel recently, they played a clip wi Bruce talking about his memories watching Brian (producing), Carl, and The Wrecking Crew cutting the backing track for GOK. Since we now know Carl didn’t play on GOK, is there a specific session that we think Bruce may be mixing up memories about?
17  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: What's Mike said now? on: July 30, 2023, 01:11:45 AM
Whenever I would voice my disagreement at the Beach Boys performing at the gig sponsored by the organization that promoted trophy hunting, or at the Trump rally, or Mike Love and Dean Torrence performing at Mar a Lago on New Years' Eve of 2020 without a mask in sight, I would get dismissed as simply a Mike Love hater who will never like anything Mike does because of the supposed nasty things he's done to the band. I will admit that I am not a Mike Love fan. I will never defend his politics, though, and I will never like him personally. Believe it or not, there are some issues in this world that are more important than the Beach Boys, and in my opinion, Mike is on the wrong side of them 99.9999% of the time.

I don’t want to restart this debate, but I didn’t know Dean was with Mike at Mar a Lego on NYE 2020.
18  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / Re: Elvis Presley on: July 09, 2023, 09:25:13 PM
It’s hard to get into the Elvis on tour because he just wasn’t the same guy as in That’s the way It Is. He seems serious or depressed and sedated/sluggish and while not fat he looks too pale and clearly on drugs of some kind.Not at all the same fun loving guy depicted in That’s the Way It Is. In 1970 he seemed to be enjoying every minute of making music but in On tour it’s like a job that he can’t way to get over with. In That’s the Way It Is there’s a spontaneity about his performance but in On Tour it seems like every gesture and utterance is pre planned

Ian, I’m not sure if that’s entirely true. He seems to have some fun with Lawdy Miss Clawdy and the gospel jam session (and maybe more, but those are the first ones that come to my head.) He was also going through the separation period so that might be part of it, too. Yes, he’s not as overjoyed as he is during TTWII, but it’s not all doom and gloom.
19  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: New Brian Song coming. on: July 02, 2023, 03:38:04 PM

Did anyone save the photos? The link is dead for me.
20  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Scott Totten and John Cowsill depart Beach Boys band on: June 16, 2023, 12:58:28 PM
It’s official. In a comment on a Facebook post about his website, John Cowsill wrote “I was let go by The Beach Boys.”
21  Non Smiley Smile Stuff / General Music Discussion / Re: The Beatles on: June 14, 2023, 08:54:28 AM
I think it's being reported incorrectly in that article, Rocker.  On my local news this morning, it was reported that AI is being used to clean up/purify the vocal, so I'm assuming it's Peter Jackson's "demixing" technology used to isolate the vocal without any cassette noise.  Many fans think it's Now and Then.  I hope Ringo is involved,n and maybe they have some spare guitar work from George from when they briefly worked on this song in the '90s.
22  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: The \ on: June 10, 2023, 08:37:29 PM
I thought Mark Linett and Alan Boyd talked about doing a 1973 live box set this year, but as I’m guessing there’s not enough studio material for 1974 and 1975, perhaps a Brian Is Back box can come in 2024 or 2025 (hopefully alongside some live material from 1974-1977 or so as well.)
23  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Scott Totten and John Cowsill depart Beach Boys band on: May 27, 2023, 12:34:51 AM
The plot thickens. John Cowsill just posted a photo of him with his arm around his replacement.
24  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Mike Love at The Grammy Museum - L.A. - 11/16/22 on: May 11, 2023, 09:20:51 PM
Does anyone know if this was saved somewhere? The link is dead now, unfortunately, and I never had a chance to watch it. Thanks!!
25  Smiley Smile Stuff / General On Topic Discussions / Re: Scott Totten and John Cowsill depart Beach Boys band on: May 10, 2023, 10:19:51 PM
There's video floating around of the new guys in Mike's band. While it has been apparent for some time what Mike is aiming at when he adds/replaces members, it's very clear here in my opinion that he's swapping members out for younger members.

The new drummer appears to be one of those players that plays a really low-to-the-ground kit on a high stool, so it kind of looks like he's playing a kid's drum set, or that he's standing while playing.

I'm seeing some YouTube comments and comments in other places that truly seem to think Totten and Cowsill just retired. C'mon people. This isn't rocket science. When two guys are gone at the *exact same time*, that's doesn't sound like an organic decision to retire. As with the vast, vast majority of backing band changes over the years, I don't believe this was a voluntary exit.

I'm guessing that getting younger guys at a cheaper price hit two of the main goals that could have motivated Mike in this decision.

All just my opinion of course....

Are Scott Totten and John Cowsill that much older than some of the newer additions (their replacements, the bassist, and the saxophonist), though? I don’t mean to doubt your expertise, HeyJude, but I really doubt Scott would have given Mike such a pleasant Facebook post if he and Cowsill were canned. I just FB friended Scott; while I don’t plan to ask him about this, I have to say I am tempted.  Wink

I saw the video you're referring to from May. Looks like the new guitar player on the opposite side of the stage don't know who he is. Would be nice if they were announced as to who they were and what their backgrounds were but knowing Mike love we may or may not get that. And PS I have to continue to say after all these years I still don't care for Christian love voice it sounds extremely Bland and toneless

I’ll have to look around for this video.



Not anymore:



University of St Thomas Beach Boy Concert, 6 May 2023


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xztUf5-DFBg

Hi Rocker, thanks for posting the link.
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