Durrie Parks Smile acetates up for sale for $10,000

[Chocolate Shake Man]

Can we ask him why he took a writing credit on Wind Chimes on BWPS despite the fact that it sure seems like he didn't write those lyrics and wasn't credited on Smiley and given that it was the first Smile track recorded sure makes it seem like it was probably a song that Brian had before he partnered up with VDP?

But then why is 'Wind Chimes' one of the Van Dyke Parks acetates for sale?  

Ouch! Good question.

You can decide whether or not this is a good response, but I do think that Van Dyke had an interest in the album that extended beyond his lyrics - as witnessed by his very active role in the studio throughout the sessions. I'm sure he would have been eager to hear versions of songs for the album that were near-finished, whether he wrote the lyrics or not.

Any good???

VDP does claim authorship of Wind Chimes.  If I recall correctly, the lack of credit on the Smiley Smile version was one of the first things he addressed with Brian when returning to work on BWPS.  I believe he talked about it in Priore's second Smile book.

Yeah, I know. Thing is, I am not prepared to believe that those are his lyrics regardless of whether or not he claimed authorship. Just as I'm not prepared to believe he didn't write the lyrics to He Gives Speeches even though he claims not to have written them. But whatever - not a belief I'm willing to die for either.

[guitarfool2002]

AMEN. People still keep searching for "THE" SMiLE seemingly buried somewhere in the recorded fragments. There isn't such a thing.

That's stating the obvious. My earlier analogy about the archaeologist focusing on his map as he's standing on top of the very treasure he's been seeking without realizing it was that too often these searches and the efforts behind them may be focused in the wrong direction.

If we're looking for a greater understanding of Smile, or a more complete picture of what happened and why, there are some areas which are worth a closer look. If we're looking for a more complete Smile through the recorded fragments, perhaps some new finds may be interesting but ultimately they won't add up to much more than what we have. And it becomes a rehash of the same information.

All I'm saying is there are some fascinating areas to investigate from a new or different angle, and the more people who look at those brings more chances of someone seeing it just a little differently and perhaps deciphering one more part of the riddle.

Is this the thread to do that? Probably not. Too much gets lost and ignored.

[John Manning]

Is this the thread to do that? Probably not. Too much gets lost and ignored.

This is the best thread for months.  Really really appreciating the efforts of those with the knowledge.

[guitarfool2002]

Is this the thread to do that? Probably not. Too much gets lost and ignored.

This is the best thread for months.  Really really appreciating the efforts of those with the knowledge.

I agree with that, it is an awesome thread, but at the same time do many have the time to backtrack through all the pages and read all the posts? What can happen is the same information posted on page 14 gets regurgitated and reworded on page 19 and the original points get ignored or lost in the shuffle.

Not that it's a bad thing, I'm just observing the repetition of ideas. 

[guitarfool2002]

i think this came from Al Kooper (not known as a druggy so possibly more reliable than others but this was decades after the event)

You should possibly read his autobiography!

I've been meaning to as he's worked or been involved with some of my favourite musicians.
I'll assume for now that he did inhale.

Al Kooper is a big Pet Sounds/Smile fan, no confirmation needed but worth noting. I wouldn't doubt he's not laid his eyes on this board at various times, if he's not even a regular visitor in between his gigs.

When I saw the Smile live show in Boston, the pass we got came with a ticket...which I declined because I had already purchased a ticket and had traveled to the show from PA with another friend. So my Boston-based friend gave that ticket to one of his friends, and that complimentary ticket happened to be next to Al Kooper's seat. So they were sitting with Al Kooper in Boston watching the Smile concert. I don't regret passing up that seat, at all, but it was cool they got to sit with Al Kooper for that show, as he is an unabashed Smile and Brian fan. I would have enjoyed seeing his reaction at various points, as that show was one of the greatest if not the greatest musical experiences I've ever had. Even from the seats farther back...

[Chocolate Shake Man]

AMEN. People still keep searching for "THE" SMiLE seemingly buried somewhere in the recorded fragments. There isn't such a thing.

That's stating the obvious. My earlier analogy about the archaeologist focusing on his map as he's standing on top of the very treasure he's been seeking without realizing it was that too often these searches and the efforts behind them may be focused in the wrong direction.

If we're looking for a greater understanding of Smile, or a more complete picture of what happened and why, there are some areas which are worth a closer look. If we're looking for a more complete Smile through the recorded fragments, perhaps some new finds may be interesting but ultimately they won't add up to much more than what we have. And it becomes a rehash of the same information.

All I'm saying is there are some fascinating areas to investigate from a new or different angle, and the more people who look at those brings more chances of someone seeing it just a little differently and perhaps deciphering one more part of the riddle.

Agreed. There will always be a hole with Smile that cannot be completely filled up. This is why it is interesting to consider (indeed even just guess at) what Brian's thought process may have been at particular points in the journey. I don't think as a poster noted above that there was never a plan for anything and it was all carefree. There may not have been an overall plan and certain things were probably in consistent flux, but I do firmly believe that when Brian had the guys standing around the microphone singing "dit dit dit heroes and-a villains" that he did have an idea in his head as to what he was going to do with it. And I do think that through discussion and investigation we may get a clearer idea as to what that was.

Another thing that confuses me is He Gives Speeches. It is a fragment but a fragment from a time when Brian wasn't really recording random fragments. By that point he had recorded Wind Chimes, Look, Wonderful, and was about to do Holidays. Wind Chimes was a song of fragments but they were pretty much recorded together and it was fairly certain where things were going to go. Off the top of my head, Holidays and Look may have been recorded in sections but are not quite songs with parts in the same way that other Smile-era songs are. Wonderful meanwhile is a complete track. It seems to me that He Gives Speeches would make more sense if it were recorded in January but it wasn't. So I do really wonder what's going through Brian's head on that one, especially since this is a period of the sessions where he really has it together and is going full steam.

[bgas]

Is this the thread to do that? Probably not. Too much gets lost and ignored.

This is the best thread for months.  Really really appreciating the efforts of those with the knowledge.

I agree with that, it is an awesome thread, but at the same time do many have the time to backtrack through all the pages and read all the posts? What can happen is the same information posted on page 14 gets regurgitated and reworded on page 19 and the original points get ignored or lost in the shuffle.

Not that it's a bad thing, I'm just observing the repetition of ideas. 

Thing is tho, where can it be discussed?  While I'm not going to add much to the discussion, I agree it's great to read/follow;
   Still:  every thread, it seems,gets waylaid/sidetracked with extraneous postings.
The only way around this ( to my mind) is constant monitoring/excising of those posts, or self control by everyone. Neither of which will happen
  Still, it's really great reading what folks are saying, even though alot of it is more than I can grasp; I just can't get into listening to the bits time and again.  Never have

 Now which thrift store has Siegel's acetate buried at the bottom of a pile?  (Or is it in the Scranton landfill with the 400,000 Smile booklets?)

[ash]

Actually this has probably come up before but I am curious if anyone has any thoughts about considering what Heroes and Villains might have sounded like at particular stages. What might a fall Heroes have sounded like? How about a December version? January? February?

I made an edit of what an early H&V might have sounded like. https://vimeo.com/51757254

Interesting ideas! Do we know for certain that DYLW only evolved into a seperate track later on? It would make sense for it to be an integral part of early concepts Brian had for H&V. Also the Fire intro? IK it's labelled H&V Intro both on the tape box and now later on TSS, but is it certain that this is a H&V fragment? It seems just so unattached from the rest of the H&V ideas Brian had. Did it later become Fire when Brian decided it wasn't going to be featured on H&V and proceeded to record the 2nd part of Fire?

What is listed as Heroes intro organ waltz is in F but the organ moves to Aflat7 at the end which lines it up well for heroes (C sharp). This Aflat7 is buried/mixed out under the whistles on the "finished" take. It has nothing to do with Fire except on Linnetts mixes and BWPS. There is also the Chimes intro recorded earlier (in Emajor ?) which is a similar piece so it was probably an idea BW was enthused with more than once. Problem is there is no apparent way of getting to or from E major with the pieces we know. Maybe the tape runs slow/fast by a semitone ?? As mentioned in my previous post about Heroes versions (p.18 ?) the Dec 19th session might have helped us work this one out but the tape is missing if the session actually took place at all.

[guitarfool2002]

AMEN. People still keep searching for "THE" SMiLE seemingly buried somewhere in the recorded fragments. There isn't such a thing.

That's stating the obvious. My earlier analogy about the archaeologist focusing on his map as he's standing on top of the very treasure he's been seeking without realizing it was that too often these searches and the efforts behind them may be focused in the wrong direction.

If we're looking for a greater understanding of Smile, or a more complete picture of what happened and why, there are some areas which are worth a closer look. If we're looking for a more complete Smile through the recorded fragments, perhaps some new finds may be interesting but ultimately they won't add up to much more than what we have. And it becomes a rehash of the same information.

All I'm saying is there are some fascinating areas to investigate from a new or different angle, and the more people who look at those brings more chances of someone seeing it just a little differently and perhaps deciphering one more part of the riddle.

Agreed. There will always be a hole with Smile that cannot be completely filled up. This is why it is interesting to consider (indeed even just guess at) what Brian's thought process may have been at particular points in the journey. I don't think as a poster noted above that there was never a plan for anything and it was all carefree. There may not have been an overall plan and certain things were probably in consistent flux, but I do firmly believe that when Brian had the guys standing around the microphone singing "dit dit dit heroes and-a villains" that he did have an idea in his head as to what he was going to do with it. And I do think that through discussion and investigation we may get a clearer idea as to what that was.

Another thing that confuses me is He Gives Speeches. It is a fragment but a fragment from a time when Brian wasn't really recording random fragments. By that point he had recorded Wind Chimes, Look, Wonderful, and was about to do Holidays. Wind Chimes was a song of fragments but they were pretty much recorded together and it was fairly certain where things were going to go. Off the top of my head, Holidays and Look may have been recorded in sections but are not quite songs with parts in the same way that other Smile-era songs are. Wonderful meanwhile is a complete track. It seems to me that He Gives Speeches would make more sense if it were recorded in January but it wasn't. So I do really wonder what's going through Brian's head on that one, especially since this is a period of the sessions where he really has it together and is going full steam.

Good points. To expand that train of thought around "Speeches", I've been puzzled by the sidetrack sessions which were done in both January and around March/April, at those times when Brian was seemingly trying to complete various parts of Smile, specifically focusing on Heroes (Jan-Feb 67) and Vegetables (April).

If the focus were on getting the various bits and pieces recorded and readied to help complete the missing parts, or whatever the case may be, why would they devote studio time and booking musicians for Jasper Daily, Dennis, and Carl? These side projects had nothing to do with Smile proper - as far as we know. And from what we can hear, they were not connected with anything musical or thematic with the Smile project.

Consider January 67 - Good Vibrations had been #1 worldwide for the weeks just preceding the new year, the buzz around the band and that single was strong, and a follow-up was anticipated. So naturally it would appear many of the immediate sessions at that time were for something related to Heroes, if not cleaning up the other album tracks from the fall.

Why would they break that stride, if not change the focus, by working on tracks in the studio that would have no relevance to the project at hand?

If we look at the Pet Sounds timeline, does it not look like nearly everything Brian did in the studio was centered around work on that album? There was a focus, there was a goal, the sessions reflected that. We don't see Brian working on "Here Today" one day then calling in Jasper to sing a few novelty songs the next, or having Carl or Dennis test their production skills on musical sketches. The work on the album was the goal.

Now we go to early 67, the focus seems to have been scattered, which lines up with what those like Anderle have said about the Smile process in general.

If studio time and access was an issue as reported, why book half dozen or more sessions with AFM musicians for songs that would seem to have no connection to the immediate goal of getting a single released and assembling a full album? And those are songs/sessions which ultimately led nowhere productive.

It reminds me of the "Speeches" issue: How and where does it all fit? And it suggests too that the focus wasn't as sharp as maybe it needed to be, even though Heroes was given extensive work in early '67.

At least in Fall '66, even with the spoken word sessions, we can connect the concepts or ideas if not the content itself to something designated for Smile. Not so with the side projects when getting a single and album finished was the immediate goal.

[Cam Mott]

Early '67 coincides with the time they were planning to sue Capitol, break their contract and start their own label and film company. With all due respect to Anderle's observation hadn't Brian previously pretty much always had outside productions going on since almost the start of the group?

Has anyone sorted out the keys of all of the H&V and H&V Part II bits?

We probably should move this to a new thread? I had an H&V Part II: "electric boogaloo" one a year or so ago. Ash has one too I think he said.

[Tricycle Rider]

While I know there's no getting to the bottom of SMiLE, I DO wish that somehow, SOMEONE, could sit Brian down at some sort of roundtable discussion with people like Al Kooper, David Crosby, Van Dyke, Danny Hutton, Michael Vosse and ANYONE else who could add to the discussion, etc...with all of the H&V pieces ready in chronological session order, so you could play a piece, and then discuss what he was conceiving about the song at that point.

While this is just a RIDICULOUS idea that could never happen, I do believe we would find out some things about the ever changing structure of H&V that we have not yet heard.

[Bicyclerider]

As far as Al, Bruce's negative recollections of Smile - it appears to me that has to do with Brian's behavior and dominating personality along with his simultaneous indecision and erratic mood swings.  The fact they were working on fragments and having no understanding of the big picture, which was itself becoming increasingly blurry for Brian.  It's understandable that they can admire and praise the music now but have bad memories of when it was created - Brian has said exactly that himself.  It's the first time Brian's eccentricities and bizarre behavior spill so much into the studio, although this was really an extension of what had happened with Good Vibrations but most of those were instrumental sessions.

He Gives Speeches is correctly observed to be anomalous at that point - the other songs, although worked on in sections- Look, Child for example - had all the sections recorded at one session, and then edited together.  He did then rerecord some sections in the GV mode, but at each session a track was completed.  Speeches clearly seems like a fragment and is either a section intended for another song already recorded - in the early days many thought it was to be part of Wonderul - or it was the first example of what Brian's new modus operandi was to be with Heroes, Surf's Up, Vegetables, etc.

I agree Van Dyke, although he gives all the musical credit to Brian, was much more instrumental (no pun intended) in developing the overall concept and "plan" for Smile.  That's why when Van says he knew nothing of movements in 1967, I believe no movements were planned then.  He was the words and big ideas guy, but he had to work those ideas into an ever more mercurial and erratic Brian.

[Bicyclerider]

Also, I don't see the Carl and Dennis sessions as breaking stride or slowing down Smile.  Brian's recording schedule was intermittent and I don't believe Brian participated in Carl or Dennis's sessions.  Brian, focussed on the singles, may have hoped the other band members might be able to contribute to the album and it might get finished that much quicker.  The Jasper Daily sessions are something else though, probably a symptom of Brian's drug induced ADD and used as a welcome respite from the pressures of trying to achieve perfection with Smile in the studio.

[Cam Mott]

Has anyone who is able worked out the keys of the individual H&V sections as they are on TSS? Thanks.

[hypehat]

This help?

   "Heroes and Villains: Verse (Master Take)"     (10/20/66)   0:57 - C#
4.   "Heroes and Villains: Barnyard (Master Take)"     (10/20/66)   1:12  -G#
5.   "Heroes and Villains: I'm in Great Shape"     (10/27/66)   4:59 - G#?
6.   ""Heroes and Villains: Intro (Early Version)"     (12/??/66)   0:35 - E
7.   "Heroes and Villains: Do a Lot"     (01/03/67)   0:53 - E
8.   "Heroes and Villains: Bag of Tricks"     (01/03/67)   2:58 I think it's C#, but kinda freeform so hard for me to tell
9.   "Heroes and Villains: Mission Pak"     (01/03/67)   0:55 - G#
10.   "Heroes and Villains: Bridge to Indians"     (01/03/67)   1:47 - C#
11.   "Heroes and Villains: Part 1 Tag"     (01/03/67)   1:19 - C#
12.   "Heroes and Villains: Pickup to 3rd Verse"     (01/03/67)   0:55 - C#
13.   "Heroes and Villains: Children Were Raised"     (01/27/67)   2:07 - C#
14.   "Heroes and Villains: Part 2 (Cantina track)"     (01/27/67)   1:21 - C#
15.   "Heroes and Villains: Whistling Bridge"     (01/27/67)   1:14 - C#
16.   "Heroes and Villains: Cantina"     (01/27/67)   1:36 - C#
17.   "Heroes and Villains: All Day"     (01/27/67)   2:19 - C#, I think - Dada is in C, but this appears to be a semitone up?
18.   "Heroes and Villains: Verse Edit Experiment"     (01/27/67)   0:48 - C#
19.   "Heroes and Villains: Prelude to Fade"     (02/15/67)   3:43 C#
20.   "Heroes and Villains: Piano Theme"     (02/15/67)   2:43 - G#
21.   "Heroes and Villains: Part 2"     (02/20/67)   2:31 - Eb
22.   "Heroes and Villains: Part 2 (Gee) (Master Take)"  - Eb
23.   "Heroes and Villains: Part 2 Revised"     (02/20/67)   1:54 - Eb
24.   "Heroes and Villains: Part 2 Revised (Master Take)"  - Eb
25.   "Heroes and Villains: Part 3 (Animals) (Master Take)" - Eb
26.   "Heroes and Villains: Part 4"     (02/20/67)   2:36 - Eb
27.   "Heroes and Villains: Part Two (Master Take)"  - Ebm
28.   "Heroes and Villains: Fade"  - G#
29.   "Heroes and Villains: Verse Remake"     - C#
30.   "Heroes and Villains: Organ Waltz/Intro"  - F (I think?)
31.   "Heroes and Villains: Chorus Vocals"     - Ebm
32.   "Heroes and Villains: Barbershop"  - C#
33.   "Heroes and Villains: Children Were Raised (Remake)" (and the subsequent Children were Raised bits)  - C#

[Cam Mott]

Wow, well done.

Now what does it mean? Just kidding..... kind of. Anything about the keys of bits for H&V #57020 v. bits for H&V Part II #57045 jump out at anybody for any reason? The "verse remake", what is the key Brian intends to change it to according to his demo on the tape?

[Cabinessenceking]

AMEN. People still keep searching for "THE" SMiLE seemingly buried somewhere in the recorded fragments. There isn't such a thing.

That's stating the obvious. My earlier analogy about the archaeologist focusing on his map as he's standing on top of the very treasure he's been seeking without realizing it was that too often these searches and the efforts behind them may be focused in the wrong direction.

If we're looking for a greater understanding of Smile, or a more complete picture of what happened and why, there are some areas which are worth a closer look. If we're looking for a more complete Smile through the recorded fragments, perhaps some new finds may be interesting but ultimately they won't add up to much more than what we have. And it becomes a rehash of the same information.

All I'm saying is there are some fascinating areas to investigate from a new or different angle, and the more people who look at those brings more chances of someone seeing it just a little differently and perhaps deciphering one more part of the riddle.

Agreed. There will always be a hole with Smile that cannot be completely filled up. This is why it is interesting to consider (indeed even just guess at) what Brian's thought process may have been at particular points in the journey. I don't think as a poster noted above that there was never a plan for anything and it was all carefree. There may not have been an overall plan and certain things were probably in consistent flux, but I do firmly believe that when Brian had the guys standing around the microphone singing "dit dit dit heroes and-a villains" that he did have an idea in his head as to what he was going to do with it. And I do think that through discussion and investigation we may get a clearer idea as to what that was.

Another thing that confuses me is He Gives Speeches. It is a fragment but a fragment from a time when Brian wasn't really recording random fragments. By that point he had recorded Wind Chimes, Look, Wonderful, and was about to do Holidays. Wind Chimes was a song of fragments but they were pretty much recorded together and it was fairly certain where things were going to go. Off the top of my head, Holidays and Look may have been recorded in sections but are not quite songs with parts in the same way that other Smile-era songs are. Wonderful meanwhile is a complete track. It seems to me that He Gives Speeches would make more sense if it were recorded in January but it wasn't. So I do really wonder what's going through Brian's head on that one, especially since this is a period of the sessions where he really has it together and is going full steam.

He was still considering putting 'comedy' into the album at this point and I guess this tune was one if the tunes he came up with and had it hastily recorded in order to get it out of the way.

[hypehat]

Wow, well done.

Now what does it mean? Just kidding..... kind of. Anything about the keys of bits for H&V #57020 v. bits for H&V Part II #57045 jump out at anybody for any reason? The "verse remake", what is the key Brian intends to change it to according to his demo on the tape?

No worries!
Yeah, I started by looking at 'Part Two' on the 45 that came with the box.... all the chants are in Eb! Most of them seem to switcheroo at the end so they finish on a C#, which is why, say, Gee works at the start of the TSS album sequence.

As for the Verse Remake... he instructs Chuck to record in C# (which they subsequently play in), then I think says he'll speed it up to E? Which is a REALLY odd idea. It's either they record in C# to know how fast to play in E (he says that a lot, then seems to get wound up in the arrangement with the cello player for the rest of the tape), but the end game appears to be recording quickly in E to slow down to C#, but they never got round to that? Also, why would you do that?

[guitarfool2002]

As for the Verse Remake... he instructs Chuck to record in C# (which they subsequently play in), then I think says he'll speed it up to E? Which is a REALLY odd idea. It's either they record in C# to know how fast to play in E (he says that a lot, then seems to get wound up in the arrangement with the cello player for the rest of the tape), but the end game appears to be recording quickly in E to slow down to C#, but they never got round to that? Also, why would you do that?

The main reason I can think of beyond matching keys to fit into the whole sequencing thing would be to accommodate someone's vocal range. If Brian or Carl or Al or whoever had a specific range where their voice broke on either a high or a low note, or if their sweet spot in their voice was in C#, let's say, and they could really nail a high note in a strong voice, they'd track the song in that key and lay the vocals on top. But if Brian was looking to match keys to other sections, he could use the oscillator to vari-speed the tape and pitch it up a minor 3rd to E...a key where perhaps the sections he wanted to join it with were in. So the vocals could be sung in a lower key, then sped up to match wherever it was going to be placed.

That is just a pure guess: The Beatles would similarly vari-speed tracks - playing the live tracks either slower or faster then slowing down or speeding up the tape - for purely textural reasons because they liked how it affected the overall sound and the way the texture of the sounds themselves would change when played back at different speeds on tape. She Said She Said and Rain are two examples of this.

When I did the key analysis of the proposed Smile tracks years ago, it was interesting to see how you could group the album almost into two specific sides by matching the compatible keys of songs with the other songs, as demonstrated above with much of Heroes being in C# or a close related key. That post is still on this board somewhere, I know I reposted it about a year ago but don't know where.

[Tricycle Rider]

As for the Verse Remake... he instructs Chuck to record in C# (which they subsequently play in), then I think says he'll speed it up to E? Which is a REALLY odd idea. It's either they record in C# to know how fast to play in E (he says that a lot, then seems to get wound up in the arrangement with the cello player for the rest of the tape), but the end game appears to be recording quickly in E to slow down to C#, but they never got round to that? Also, why would you do that?

What I think Brian is up to here is, he wants Chuck to record them in C# at the tempo Brian wants for the verses, then speed the tape up to the key of E, so that the musicians will know what tempo to play at in the key of E, so that when you slow it down, it will be in C# at the tempo Brian originally wanted to begin with. What I think is happening is, Brian has fallen in love with the sound of the Vari-Speed recording techniques that he heard on "Strawberry Fields Forever" (Released on February 13, 1967 in the US) and wants to do something similar on this H&V tracking date, 15 days later on March 1, 1967. I think the story Michale Vosse tell's in the documentary "Beautiful Dreamer" about him and Brian hearing "Strawberry Fields Forever" on the car radio, and the effect it had on Brian, lends some weight to this idea. 

For those of you who are not musicians, what Vari-Speed recording does is change the timber and texture of recorded sounds, in a way that is different to using standard studio recording console EQ. That's why Chuck Britz tell's Brian "It might make it loud, depending on the instrumentation"

Though this idea didn't reach fruition for the H&V verse tracking re-record, Brian did use it later on the Smiley Smile LP track "She's Goin' Bald".

I think this answers the questions Bubba-Ho-Tep asked earlier:

What about the verse remake?

Why is he starting over?

And then why does he go back and use the original verse for the finished single?

And I think it shows Brian still feeling competitive at this point rather than losing focus, as expressed by Bicyclerider earlier:

For me the rerecording of the verse and fade were attempts to redo the a side of the Heroes single.  It shows how Brian was losing focus and his judgment was impaired - I don't think anyone would consider the verse or fade remakes superior to the originals.  He's making progress on the b side and then decides to scrap the a side?  Indecision, lack of confidence, inability to complete anything - Smile was self destructing and Brian was in meltdown.

As far as the H&V Fade re-record goes:

Why are we calling it a re-record, when it's technically the first time that this section is recorded as the H&V Fade?

He did originally record a section almost identical on November 14, 1966, but that was technically called "Part 2" of "My Only Sunshine".

I think Brian is recording the H&V Fade on February 28, 1967, because he really liked the sound and feel of "My Only Sunshine, Part 2" as the Fade for the "Cantina" version he mixed down on February 10, 1967, but didn't want to cripple "My Only Sunshine" in order to use it. I think this shows that SMiLE is still on the table at this point.

ALL OF THE ABOVE IMHO

[guitarfool2002]

As for the Verse Remake... he instructs Chuck to record in C# (which they subsequently play in), then I think says he'll speed it up to E? Which is a REALLY odd idea. It's either they record in C# to know how fast to play in E (he says that a lot, then seems to get wound up in the arrangement with the cello player for the rest of the tape), but the end game appears to be recording quickly in E to slow down to C#, but they never got round to that? Also, why would you do that?

What I think Brian is up to here is, he wants Chuck to record them in C# at the tempo Brian wants for the verses, then speed the tape up to the key of E, so that the musicians will know what tempo to play at in the key of E, so that when you slow it down, it will be in C# at the tempo Brian originally wanted to begin with. What I think is happening is, Brian has fallen in love with the sound of the Vari-Speed recording techniques that he heard on "Strawberry Fields Forever" (Released on February 13, 1967 in the US) and wants to do something similar on this H&V tracking date, 15 days later on March 1, 1967. I think the story Michale Vosse tell's in the documentary "Beautiful Dreamer" about him and Brian hearing "Strawberry Fields Forever" on the car radio, and the effect it had on Brian, lends some weight to this idea.  

For those of you who are not musicians, what Vari-Speed recording does is change the timber and texture of recorded sounds, in a way that is different to using standard studio recording console EQ. That's why Chuck Britz tell's Brian "It might make it loud, depending on the instrumentation"

Though this idea didn't reach fruition for the H&V verse tracking re-record, Brian did use it later on the Smiley Smile LP track "She's Goin' Bald".

I'd argue no one hearing the Strawberry Fields single new on the radio in 1967 knew or would know it had been vari-speeded, including Brian. There are no obvious clues or sections to pick up on it, if you listen without knowing what we know now about the mixing. Emerick did that gradual speed-up of the slow section to match the keys so well and so seamlessly, and the edit going into the "fast" section was unknown to the majority of listeners for quite some time, even Lennon didn't spot it during the playbacks and it was his own song.

The "She's Goin Bald" case is a little different - yes it's a form of vari-speeding tape but with that machine they were able to change speed/pitch without affecting the time/length of the track, which was the breakthrough in that technology. If they had an Eltro for the Heroes sessions with Chuck, Brian's request would have been handled a bit different since he could change the pitch to anything he wanted without having to adjust the original tempo or whatever (the bit he says about playing it fast...), provided the machine didn't crap out.

So the theory about vocal pitching isn't a possibility? because Brian had sung at least one lead this way, slowing the backing track down to cut his lead vocal then speeding it back up for mixdown. Not to mention Caroline No which i think may have been also sped up to really bring out the emotion of his high notes in the hook as much as affect overall texture by changing the key.

[Bubba Ho-Tep]

I think Brian is recording the H&V Fade on February 28, 1967, because he really liked the sound and feel of "My Only Sunshine, Part 2" as the Fade for the "Cantina" version he mixed down on February 10, 1967, but didn't want to cripple "My Only Sunshine" in order to use it. I think this shows that SMiLE is still on the table at this point.

ALL OF THE ABOVE IMHO

But then why is every version of OMP/Sunshine that we've heard prior to box set is one with that part 2 piece missing?

[guitarfool2002]

To dig a little deeper into the possible origins of Brian using vari-speed tape techniques on his records, please take a minute to watch this video I made on YouTube. It's only a minute long, the music kicks in at around 12 seconds:

Direct link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=XmdQ0jc6rQg

The true father/pioneer of using vari-speed on hit records was Les Paul, and he was doing it in the 1940's. Watch and listen to the video, the Les Paul track is vari-speeded all over, not just the overall mix but also the individual guitar tracks. I know because I had to learn the solo for an audition, found out it was vari-speeded and then knew why it was impossible to play along with the recording since Les used several open-string runs not possible on a regular guitar. So I borrowed a Tascam PortaStudio 4-track cassette machine back in the day and slowed it down to get the original key he played in.

I hear a connection. Please take a listen! 

[hypehat]

As for the Verse Remake... he instructs Chuck to record in C# (which they subsequently play in), then I think says he'll speed it up to E? Which is a REALLY odd idea. It's either they record in C# to know how fast to play in E (he says that a lot, then seems to get wound up in the arrangement with the cello player for the rest of the tape), but the end game appears to be recording quickly in E to slow down to C#, but they never got round to that? Also, why would you do that?

The main reason I can think of beyond matching keys to fit into the whole sequencing thing would be to accommodate someone's vocal range. If Brian or Carl or Al or whoever had a specific range where their voice broke on either a high or a low note, or if their sweet spot in their voice was in C#, let's say, and they could really nail a high note in a strong voice, they'd track the song in that key and lay the vocals on top. But if Brian was looking to match keys to other sections, he could use the oscillator to vari-speed the tape and pitch it up a minor 3rd to E...a key where perhaps the sections he wanted to join it with were in. So the vocals could be sung in a lower key, then sped up to match wherever it was going to be placed.

That it's a re-record of something that The Beach Boys had already sung on, in the key of C#, is the thing. There's no vocal reason why making it higher would make it somehow easier for someone to hit a note....

There's also nothing really there for it to be linked to in the key of E - Do A Lot? One of the early intro bits?

That session appears to have him playing in C#, at the normal tempo, in order to speed it up to E so they know how fast to play in E. So they were going toplay it in E, then slow that back down to C#. So maybe it's not a vocal reason, but Brian just wants it to sound even thicker.

RE: The Strawberry Fields question, the edit is kinda infamous now, but I wonder how easy it would be to hear on the radio or on a 45 on 1967 equipment. And there's no indication he would have known it was varispeeded apart from a vague guess or a hunch, as it wasn't common knowledge upon it's release, I'd wager.

[Tricycle Rider]

To guitarfool2002:
I want to let you know that I was responding to hypehat's post, and didn't have the benefit of seeing your post before I posted mine.

After reading yours, I think I agree with you on this. I was about to respond with some info on Les Paul, but you beat me to it! 

To Bubba-Ho-Tep:
Was the version of OMP/YAMS/FADE from the comp tape before or after the February 10 Cantina mix of H&V?