"I Was Made to Love Her" on Wild Honey and Carol Kaye's claims

[Jay]

Sorry, but I think "Slutsky" is a hilarious name.  Sorry to hijack the thread. As you were. 

[adamghost]

Ugh.  Reading some of Carole Kaye's posts reminded me even more of dealing with one member of the Standells.  Same paranoia of people who disagree with them, dislike of being questioned, excessive moderation and rigid message control, and repeated trumpeting of one's laurels over the contributions of others...not to mention not knowing how to come across well to the public.  And how the other original members feel about him is very similar to some of the Wrecking Crew gang's comments.  I think the person who talked about "hating what they didn't understand" hit the nail on the head.  It's really a shame.

Regarding who played bass on that tune, the whole WH album has terrific bass playing and I've wondered for years who did what.  I agree that Ron Brown is the most likely culprit, but I think Carl and Bruce could have copped it.  While it's true there's a feel issue, both those guys really were masters at reproducing stuff.  I'm always amazed that, long after he stopped playing bass regularly, every time Bruce would sync a bass line for a video or something he would nail it to the wall.  It's not like he HAD to, right?  'Cos the thing wasn't plugged in.  I'm more skeptical that Al could have done it.  Not that Al was a bad musician, but I don't think he was as quick a mime as Carl or Bruce were.

I agree...I don't think they ever would have come up with the bass line, but I could see either one of them learning it and playing it decently.

[endofposts]

I think Carol Kaye hates men and things she doesn't understand.

But the same could be said for a lot of people.

Carol Kaye hates women, too.  I can attest to that.  I also think she understands perfectly, she just chooses to lie. I had an online run-in with her years ago on one of her message boards and she banned me from her board for asking an innocuous question, and explained to me why she banned me in the most incredibly mean e-mails I've ever gotten from anyone.  She has done as bad or worse to several other people, not to mention lying left and right about her credits and dishonoring James Jamerson. She's a rude, mean, mendacious woman.    She is a living embodiment of that Tony Asher phrase "musical genius, amateur human being," except for the musical genius part.  Talented, yes, which makes her behavior even more bizarre.  She knowingly lies, there's no way it's just a mis-remembering.  

[DonnyL]

My experience with Carol has been positive ... I think she's generally a nice lady and regardless of these personal interactions some people have had with her over the internet, she has accomplished more than most of us ever will with regard to the greatest recordings of all time.  So i think we should show some respect.  And I've found in dealing with musicians of the '60s that their memories are not always accurate ... it's disrespectful to call them out on it.  When Sky Saxon told me all of the Seeds records were cut on 16-track tape, i just grinned and had another beer.  I understand historians need to get the facts straight, but the human element is all to often ignored around here.

[Andrew G. Doe]

I'd show respect if she hadn't:

called me a thief on a public forum...

called me a liar and a phony in another public forum from which she barred me responding...

sent unpleasant emails gloating about how she'd banned me from her forum...

dragged my mother into her rant about me...

refused to admit she was wrong when presented with irrefutable evidence...

repeatedly claimed - if you prefer, lied - to have played on songs she didn't, thus belittling the original musician...

She wants respect ? Show me and the other people she's treated similarly some first. I'm sure she's been nothing but pleasant to many, most people, but to me (and others), since 2000, she's been nothing but a vindictive bitch. She might be advised to read up on the libel laws sometime.

[endofposts]

No, people here are not imagining things or not cutting her a fair break.  She is the guilty party.  Period.  She goes out of her way to make personal attacks when no one is attacking her personally whatsoever.  I will give you some details of what went down with her in my instance.  Her message board was at one time an open forum.  I was participating in a discussion with some other posters on the board about the Beach Boys American Family miniseries during the time it was first broadcast.  We were discussing Brian's mental breakdown and drug abuse as it was portrayed in the film.  The discussion did not involve Carol Kaye herself in any way, shape, or form, so we were not talking about her precious session credits or her.  She had not herself participated in the thread until she suddenly decided to offer her two cents at the end.  She claimed that Brian never, ever used drugs in his life and had never, ever been mentally ill, and that the filmmakers were dead wrong to even suggest that.  She said the thread was closed.  She then later deleted the thread.  Fine.  But then I got an e-mail a day later from Carol Kaye, where she said I was wrong about Brian ever using drugs or being mentally ill (okay, fine, whatever, her opinion), that she was banning me from her board for daring to suggest it (even though other people on the thread said the same things), and that my problem, in her opinion, is that I was mentally ill and either a drug user or alcoholic or both.  She said I needed professional help and was a sad case.  I sent her an e-mail back telling her she was a bi-atch (though used a nicer term, I think), she didn’t know me, she was the one who had personal problems and showed that by sending me such an unwarranted personal attack, and that I was blocking her from my e-mail.  And I did.  There’s no excuse whatsoever for her shameful behavior.  I read what she said about AGD on the Blueboard during the time it happened and was appalled.  I had observed her doing it to other people who disagreed with her, as well.  And yes, she lies.  Period.  Not misremembers, she lies.  Read Slutsky’s board about her claims about her playing on Jamerson’s recordings and believe it.  She’s shameful (and has no shame) and what she’s doing is also racist. 

[The Heartical Don]

Re-reading a couple of posts her, notably about the way ms. Kaye suddenly fires out of all cylinders with unwarranted attacks, full of lies and spiced with mean insinuations, I'd say: there is absolutely no way in which one can deal with total irrationality. For some people, 2 + 2 equals 5 if they in any way can benefit from that.

No use in getting upset over such 'adversaries', so to speak. I am sorry to say that her behaviour, as represented here, reminds me of the hallmarks of a true borderline personality. Such people constantly seek to overstep normal human boundaries, in whatever way possible, and also always try to determine the mood in any given setting. Is there a nice atmosphere? The borderliner will destroy it, and create chaos and aggression. Is there perhaps a bit of tension? The borderliner will show an almost sickeningly sweet type of behaviour.

Tragic.

[Mike's Beard]

Anyone who can claim that Brian never touched drugs or suffers from mental illness can't be trusted to give a honest opinion on anything.

[Aegir]

Anyone who can claim that Brian never touched drugs or suffers from mental illness can't be trusted to give a honest opinion on anything.

I was just about to say the same thing.

[The Heartical Don]

Anyone who can claim that Brian never touched drugs or suffers from mental illness can't be trusted to give a honest opinion on anything.

I was just about to say the same thing.

Seconded. I mean: thirded.

[The Heartical Don]

Anyone who can claim that Brian never touched drugs or suffers from mental illness can't be trusted to give a honest opinion on anything.

BTW there never were sessions for any album called SMiLE. All lies.

[Jay]

Brian Wilson himself would most likely be the first one to admit that he has had mental health issues. I wonder what she has to say to that?

[The Heartical Don]

Brian Wilson himself would most likely be the first one to admit that he has had mental health issues. I wonder what she has to say to that?

That it was an imposter who said that.

[Jay]

That reminds me of the Paul is dead rumors. 

[stack-o-tracks]

Brian Wilson himself would most likely be the first one to admit that he has had mental health issues. I wonder what she has to say to that?

That it was an imposter who said that.

Brian Wilson and Paul McCartney died in the same car accident.

The new Brian obv isn't the same one from 1966.

[stack-o-tracks]

That reminds me of the Paul is dead rumors. 

Damnit I should have read the new post that was posted before I was able to reply. You jerk. 

[juggler]

It's actually pretty unsurprising that CK was totally unaware of Brian's drug usage or mental health problems.  Listening to the studio tapes from their era of working together, one can very easily see why she had the perception she had.   BW sounds sober, sensible and articulate.    If Brian was coming to studio while he was high or tripping or delusional, it certainly does not show up in the audio from the Pet Sounds/Smile era sessions.

[Jay]

Do you guys feel the acid yet? 

[The Heartical Don]

Do you guys feel the acid yet? 

No. I never drink battery acid. Ruins the teeth.

[juggler]

Do you guys feel the acid yet? 

Note that the comment is from a vocal session.
The instrumental tracking sessions seem to have been all business.

[hypehat]

Yeah, there's also a tracking session where Brian is telling them about an eye spray that stops them getting bloodshot cos you've smoked too much. I mean, even if she only had the tracking sessions to go on, you could reach the conclusion Brian took drugs. But she's been around Brian for most of his insanely turbulent life, and she thinks he DOESN'T HAVE MENTAL PROBLEMS. Jesus H.

She does sound rather....unstable. What she said to you both is pretty nasty. And I can't believe her constant disrespect of the finest bass player to ever walk the earth

[Jay]

Yeah, there's also a tracking session where Brian is telling them about an eye spray that stops them getting bloodshot cos you've smoked too much. I mean, even if she only had the tracking sessions to go on, you could reach the conclusion Brian took drugs. But she's been around Brian for most of his insanely turbulent life, and she thinks he DOESN'T HAVE MENTAL PROBLEMS. Jesus H.

She does sound rather....unstable. What she said to you both is pretty nasty. And I can't believe her constant disrespect of the finest bass player to ever walk the earth

She hasn't said one word about John Entwistle. 

[John Manning]

What gets me is the amount of time CK spends on Facebook. Phenomenal. And the CK interviews on YouTube, added together, make for more than 102 years of viewing, which means she can't ever have had the time to play bass on Surfin'.

[The Heartical Don]

What gets me is the amount of time CK spends on Facebook. Phenomenal. And the CK interviews on YouTube, added together, make for more than 102 years of viewing, which means she can't ever have had the time to play bass on Surfin'.

 

[Jay]

I think I'll send her a friend request...