The Autotune Thread

[Aegir]

In terms of tonight's show, Brian's autotune was audible but just barely. I probably wouldn't've noticed it if I wasn't looking for it. Doesn't sound anywhere as bad as the audience recordings I've heard.

I will say though, that I've seen Brian live before and was very impressed by his singing and tonight I thought he was the worst vocalist of the bunch. It's probably the autotune's fault. But again, it wasn't that noticeable. If that makes any sense.

[b00ts]

In terms of tonight's show, Brian's autotune was audible but just barely. I probably wouldn't've noticed it if I wasn't looking for it. Doesn't sound anywhere as bad as the audience recordings I've heard.

I will say though, that I've seen Brian live before and was very impressed by his singing and tonight I thought he was the worst vocalist of the bunch. It's probably the autotune's fault. But again, it wasn't that noticeable. If that makes any sense.

I quite liked Brian's vocals on "I Just Wasn't Made For These Times" and a couple others. They were a lot rougher during the first set than the second. During the second set, there were a few instances where Brian's voice sounded amazing. I think sometimes he has to marshall all his confidence in order to deliver a good performance. It must be tough for him with the auditory hallucinations.

As for the pitch correction/autotune on Brian's voice, you are on the money. It wasn't out of whack as often tonight as it has been in the past, although your comment about Brian being the worst vocalist of the bunch surely applies to his take on "Please Let Me Wonder." The loping, leaping, up-and-down melody of that song makes it very unconducive to pitch correction, and it threw Brian's voice out of whack in some weird ways. Luckily, I was unperturbed by it for the rest of the night.

I posted upthread that I would also report back about what my friend thought regarding Brian's vocal pitch correction, or lack thereof. My friend is a studio musician and singer, like myself, and he has a very good, trained ear. He did not notice the pitch correction until later on, after I had told him about it. I know this is ammunition for those who don't believe any pitch correction is being used, but it's the truth of what my friend heard (or didn't hear). I don't want to make this argument rage on any, but really, it doesn't have to be an argument - some people may hear things that aren't there, and some people may not hear things that are there. C'est la vie.

Personally, I heard the pitch correction on Brian's voice during "Please Let Me Wonder" and in spots here and there throughout the show, but it seemed subtler than it was at the beginning of the tour. I also think the natural reverb at the Beacon makes it a bit harder to detect nuances in individual voices. I am interested in hearing an audio recording of PLMW to see if I still detect it as I did during the show. Anyway, I was happy to not be continually perturbed by Robo-Brian as I basked in the magnificence of the group's harmonies.

Regardless of autotune, Stamos, setlist, cheesy stage background, etc...  anybody who can go to this tour should go. This was one of the greatest concerts I have ever seen. It reminded me vividly of the vitality and ingenuity of this group. It was as much of a mixed crowd as I have ever seen - youngsters, oldsters, etc. all taking in the music and shared history of one of the few truly great, enduring bands of the 1960s.

And here they are in 2012, playing for us live, with a new album around the corner. Good times for Beach Boys fans.

[Aegir]

yeah, I should stop complaining on here about the show, I actually really really enjoyed it.

[b00ts]

yeah, I should stop complaining on here about the show, I actually really really enjoyed it.

Nah, I wasn't trying to shut you down or anything. You paid your money for the tickets, feel free to complain as much as you'd like... we don't want this turning into the Blue Board! It is a place for honest and objective conversation and analysis, sans groupthink.

Still, glad to hear you liked the show! Where were you sitting? We were right at the balcony, great seats with an unobstructed view.

Also, I heard "Guess I'm Dumb" playing during the intermission. Very cool song choice.

[Aegir]

I was on the first floor, row W, towards the left. Only a few rows from the back wall but the sightlines were great.

[Andrew G. Doe]

A question: given that the environment of a TV studio is far more conducive to pitch correction than a concert, and assuming AT is used live (which I for one seriously doubt), why wasn't it used on Fallon ? Some of Brian's vocal on "TWGMTR" was, to be polite, dire.

[Aegir]

That's a good question. Clearly, they don't think they need it for the TV. Though, this was the only live TV appearance so far where you could actually hear Brian.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Something else to chew over:

In terms of tonight's show, Brian's autotune was audible but just barely. I probably wouldn't've noticed it if I wasn't looking for it.

So you only noticed it because you were listening for it, i.e. you were expecting to hear it. And guess what - you did !  

My friend is a studio musician and singer, like myself, and he has a very good, trained ear. He did not notice the pitch correction until later on, after I had told him about it. I know this is ammunition for those who don't believe any pitch correction is being used, but it's the truth of what my friend heard (or didn't hear).

Your friend with the "very good, trained ear" didn't notice the alleged autotune until you told him there (allegedly) was some. In a court of law, that's called a leading question, or influencing the witness. Your friend didn't hear anything amiss until he was told there was a problem. If his ear really is that good, I'd say that was pretty good evidence that there is no problem.

That's a good question. Clearly, they don't think they need it for the TV. Though, this was the only live TV appearance so far where you could actually hear Brian.

Sorry Orville, but that won't fly. Potential live aggregate audience for all 64 shows posted to date - circa 300,000-400,000... TV audience for the Fallon show, something like 2,500,000.

[Wirestone]

Something else to chew over:

In terms of tonight's show, Brian's autotune was audible but just barely. I probably wouldn't've noticed it if I wasn't looking for it.

So you only noticed it because you were listening for it, i.e. you were expecting to hear it. And guess what - you did !  

My friend is a studio musician and singer, like myself, and he has a very good, trained ear. He did not notice the pitch correction until later on, after I had told him about it. I know this is ammunition for those who don't believe any pitch correction is being used, but it's the truth of what my friend heard (or didn't hear).

Your friend with the "very good, trained ear" didn't notice the alleged autotune until you told him there (allegedly) was some. In a court of law, that's called a leading question, or influencing the witness. Your friend didn't hear anything amiss until he was told there was a problem. If his ear really is that good, I'd say that was pretty good evidence that there is no problem.

That's a good question. Clearly, they don't think they need it for the TV. Though, this was the only live TV appearance so far where you could actually hear Brian.

Sorry Orville, but that won't fly. Potential live aggregate audience for all 64 shows posted to date - circa 300,000-400,000... TV audience for the Fallon show, something like 2,500,000.

AGD -- I know it doesn't make sense, but the evidence is pretty clear. There is pitch alteration on BW's live vocals. This entire saga has been perplexing from the start, but give foks who have heard BW live for years credit -- we can tell the difference between treated and untreated vocals.

[Andrew G. Doe]

I'll listen to the Dallas show again, but I don't recall hearing it then... and I know what it sounds like. Just pointing out that the evidence as presented below is seriously compromised by expectations and leading the 'witness'.

[Aegir]

Well, I was listening for it on Fallon and didn't hear it. That kind of puts a wrench in the gears of your argument, don't it?

also, if everyone heard it just because they already thought it was there, then how did anyone hear it in the first place?

[Phoenix]

I've doubted it since it was first brought up and I'm happy to hear AGD is on the same side of the fence.  Helps me sleep better at night knowing that someone more eloquent than I can say anything that needs to be said if things get out of hand.   

[Micha]

There is Autotune on Brian's voice on this tour, it can be detected on some of the YouTube videos, and I don't care and I don't mind. Even if I should detect autotune during the concert I plan to attend, it won't make me enjoy it less at all. So there!

[Andrew G. Doe]

Well, I was listening for it on Fallon and didn't hear it. That kind of puts a wrench in the gears of your argument, don't it?

also, if everyone heard it just because they already thought it was there, then how did anyone hear it in the first place?

Just answered your own question: because they were expecting it for Brian, given past live experience. I note that no-one has discerned AT on anyone else's vocals, and at times Mike could sure use it. Surely if they're going to AT one singer, they'll AT then all ? Just doing one mike doesn't make any sense at all.

[Aegir]

I don't see how that answers my question, why should anyone have expected live autotune on Brian? it was completely unprecedented before this tour.

[an action made by the Beach Boys] doesn't make any sense at all.

par for the course.

[Andrew G. Doe]

'K, just listened to the Dallas show (2nd gig), and Brian's leads on "PLMW", "YSGTM" and the new single - and if there's any auto tune on any of those, especially the latter, then I strongly suggest they sue whoever sold them the software, 'cause it ain't working.  

What I do hear is a mild chorusing effect and Jeff reprising his role as audio safety net. No AT.  

Ah, I can see the man in the striped shirt at the back mouthing "they patched it in after a few gigs because they realised Brian needed help". Sir, to you I say - rehearsals.

[Andrew G. Doe]

[an action made by the Beach Boys] doesn't make any sense at all.

par for the course.

True dat.

[Quzi]

People here truly have a really distorted view of what autotune is capable of doing if they think it'll magically give us even remotely good sounding leads 100% of the time.

Just reaffirming what has already been said close to a dozen times now: autotune does not know what you're supposed to be singing! If Brian's off-key, the autotune is just going to 'perfect' his off-key notes. Autotune ain't gonna improve his pitching ability, give him better breath control or shave forty years off the sound of his voice!

[hypehat]

'K, just listened to the Dallas show (2nd gig), and Brian's leads on "PLMW", "YSGTM" and the new single - and if there's any auto tune on any of those, especially the latter, then I strongly suggest they sue whoever sold them the software, 'cause it ain't working.  

What I do hear is a mild chorusing effect and Jeff reprising his role as audio safety net. No AT.  

Ah, I can see the man in the striped shirt at the back mouthing "they patched it in after a few gigs because they realised Brian needed help". Sir, to you I say - rehearsals.

The man in the striped shirt is also wrong - it's there on recordings from the first show too. And 90% of youtubes. AGD, there are some where it is really obvious.

I don't know what to say other than I hear it - I would really like not to! And I listened to the recordings of that first show in a state which could be described as utter elation..... until Brian piped up.

And I did cold-test one of my friends, by accident - Something from the Raleigh NC show was playing on youtube as she came in to my room with tea and she (who classifies herself as 'quite deaf') went 'Are they using auto-tune?' without any prompting from me. And we know anecdotal evidence is the best evidence!  

I'm not going to a reunion gig, though. So it doesn't matter, really.

[Autotune]

As for the pitch correction/autotune on Brian's voice, you are on the money. It wasn't out of whack as often tonight as it has been in the past,

it's not different from the past, boots. You're comparing the YT videos to your live experience. But you heard, in the venue, the same thing every concert goer has heard. That's why, once you saw them live, your report resembles those of the people who where there. In the venue it does not sound like in those YT videos.

I suggest that you listen to YT videos of the songs you did not detect any autotune in them during the concert. You'll find amazing revelations

I have to agree that it is a great show! And acknowledge your honesty in dealing with this much-debated topic.

[Autotune]

People here truly have a really distorted view of what autotune is capable of doing if they think it'll magically give us even remotely good sounding leads 100% of the time.

Just reaffirming what has already been said close to a dozen times now: autotune does not know what you're supposed to be singing! If Brian's off-key, the autotune is just going to 'perfect' his off-key notes. Autotune ain't gonna improve his pitching ability, give him better breath control or shave forty years off the sound of his voice!

Nonsense. A ptich corrector can correct flat singing of Brian's type if used properly. The BBs sound crew, a professional bunch if there is one, know this stuff inside out. He ain't being pitch-corrected. That's all.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Would someone kindly point me at what they consider to be the most blatant example of BW AT on youtube from the current tour ? Thanks in advance.

[Quzi]

Would someone kindly point me at what they consider to be the most blatant example of BW AT on youtube from the current tour ? Thanks in advance.

I'd say this Sail on Sailor performance (specifically during the bridge) is where I have heard the autotune most clearly: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5X6gLxS9Cw8

A few notes:
- Try to focus on how the Brian's notes 'lock on' to a certain digital sounding frequency, especially on the held notes in the bridge, that's the autotune at work.
- According to the video's owner, this was captured on a Nikon camera which means the audio quality is quite a bit superior than an iPhone's.
- If you have any further qualms relating to the quality of the audio, you can turn the video up to 1080p to increase the quality of the audio.

[Andrew G. Doe]

A few notes:
- Try to focus on how the Brian's notes 'lock on' to a certain digital sounding frequency, especially on the held notes in the bridge, that's the autotune at work.

Thanks, but you just rendered my little experiment pointless by telling me what to listen for: I want to approach any such clip with an open mindset. One observation, though: if they're using AT, then why have someone clearly shading him during the verse ?

[Quzi]

Thanks, but you just rendered my little experiment pointless by telling me what to listen for: I want to approach any such clip with an open mindset. One observation, though: if they're using AT, then why have someone clearly shading him during the verse ?

I can edit that out of my original post and we can bring in Ron to be the guinea pig