The Stephen Desper Thread

[Stephen W. Desper]

Cool post, Stephen. My point has more to do with the music rather than the lyrics and message... Don't get me wrong, I think its fine and dandy that Mike wants to spread a little political love...I have nothing against it. I just cant stand that dreadful song (musically)...and so that you know, my original post was to take light hearted. I wasnt trying to be mean spirited or anything

And yes, Ive listened to SDT a numerous amount of times, I just let it play now everytime I have Surf's Up on

take care

  Fair enough ~swd

[Stephen W. Desper]

Stephen, I have a question -- could you review the 1974-76 thread and make any comments you feel able to make without violating relationships?  Something to the effect of "yes, there was a split between Carl/Dennis vs Mike/Al earlier than 1977" would suffice.  I know that you probably can't say much if anything, but if tension existed I would think you would have seen it.

Please refine your question. ~swd

[Jeff Mason]

Is it true to say that a rift developed between Carl and Dennis on one side and Mike and Al on the other side over a conflicting vision of the band's direction and potential? That is to say, that Dennis and Carl wanted to continue pushing forward along the lines of the Holland/Surf's Up direction while Mike and Al were content to sell records and give people what they wanted, and pursuing an image of the band as it existed in 1964?  I won't begin to speculate on what Brian thought of all of this.  Some of us see this as a critical dynamic in the band's history, while others think that Carl and Dennis were just as happy to do music like 15 Big Ones and give up the focus of the music as it had developed in the early 70's.  If you feel comfortable commenting on the interaction of the band members in laying out the band's vision, that would be awesome.

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

I just cant stand that dreadful song (musically)

Do you have something against the classic blues chord progression?

[I. Spaceman]

Stephen.

I have an important question.

Why...for the sake of humanity...did you let the Beach Boys put 'Student Demostration Time' on Surf's Up? I mean I know they have the final say in their tracklisting, but couldnt you have 'accidentally' burned the master reel?

Thanks for your consideration in this matter
your friend
-J$

You're a dick.

[Fantastico!]

Stephen.

I have an important question.

Why...for the sake of humanity...did you let the Beach Boys put 'Student Demostration Time' on Surf's Up? I mean I know they have the final say in their tracklisting, but couldnt you have 'accidentally' burned the master reel?

Thanks for your consideration in this matter
your friend
-J$

You're a dick.

yes, and a funny one at that!!!  Come on, that's FUNNY!

[Jonas]

I just cant stand that dreadful song (musically)

Do you have something against the classic blues chord progression?

I liked it the first time around, it is necessary to be used again and again and again and again and again?

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

I liked it the first time around, it is necessary to be used again and again and again and again and again?

So I take it you don't like any western music post 1870?

[Jonas]

That's a cute generalization, but this isnt a LOST episode so quit digging so deep.

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

Believe it or not, I've managed to avoid seeing even a second of an episode of Lost.  It's on past my bedtime.

[Jeff Mason]

Josh has a point there -- if you complain about a song because it uses the "same old blues progression", you really are complaining about much of 50's/60's pop/rock at a minimum.  I could see you squirm at some of the lamer lyrics, but the track itself words aside is a great rocker.  In my dream world, they scrap the new lyrics and just do Cell Block #9 like they did live (which was AWESOME) and make a classic album track.  But as it is it still is a lot of fun.

[Jonas]

Excuse me, I made a mistake. I originally thought he asked if I have something against Cellblock #9, not a 'classic blues chord progression', unless he was infact being specific. Either way, just because I dont like one song doesnt mean I dislike a chord progression. Don't be ridiculous.

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

I'm just trying to get at what you dislike about the song, because I don't think I've ever heard somebody call it out based not on the lyrics, but on the track.  I'd like some specificity.  I've always considered the song pretty airtight from a purely musical standpoint.  At least within a Beach Boys context.  For me, it's a bit of a treat to hear Carl play in that style.  It's fun for me to hear his progression from surf licks at the age of 15 to a confident studio pro.  You can hear the thought and effort behind getting Mike's voice to sound like it's bouncing off of walls in an acoustically live outdoor space.  How many vocals had been processed to sound like that at that point?  To be honest, it's not something I'd listen to or like if I wasn't emotionally invested in the performers, but in the case of the Beach Boys, I think it's a really pretty game effort in a style that they hadn't really attempted much.  That's really what it comes down to.  I mean, sure, you're either going to like it or you're not.  Who knows why?  But calling it "dreadful", particularly directly to somebody who invested a lot of time in getting the track to sound a certain way seems a little much.

Stephen, I've never understood the violent fan reaction to this song.  I feel bad that you have to defend it.  I don't know if it's simply Mike's involvement that turns the anti-Mike people off to it immediately or what, but I for one cherish the recording.  Of course, I'm an unabashed Mike-lover, but even so when I listen to the track my mind is transported somewhere else.  Not a tense student demonstration, or Vietnam, but to a cool place in Bel Air where a bunch of cool people are recording music.  Apologies for the sappiness of all of that.

[Sheriff John Stone]

The only thing that really bothers me is the VOLUME of the track. To my ears anyway, the song sounds louder than the rest of the tracks on the Sunflower/Surf's Up two-fer. After "Disney Girls" fades, it's kind of jarring. Maybe it's supposed to be that way...

[Jonas]

Stephen's investment in the song is purely with sound engineering. Does the track sound great? Absolutely! Also, im not an Mike Love-Hater. I don't hate on anyone or anything, was Cell Block #9 a cool song? Sure, but does it have to be remade for a political driven song? Not in my opinion.

My original post wasn't to be taken completely serious, it was just a lil gag for fun. Also, the correlation of disliking a song based on a basic blues chord progression and not liking anything base on that progression, is ridiculous.

[Jeff Mason]

It's not ridiculous based upon the way you worded your post, which said that it was the use itself of the progression that was your issue.  That's how we all are reading it at least.

That song is awesome for the chance for Carl to stretch out and PLAY.  He never got enough opportunity to do that and most people, BB fans included, don't know how good a player he was.

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

Stephen's investment in the song is purely with sound engineering. Does the track sound great? Absolutely! Also, im not an Mike Love-Hater. I don't hate on anyone or anything, was Cell Block #9 a cool song? Sure, but does it have to be remade for a political driven song? Not in my opinion.

So what is it that you have against the song?  What does the purpose of the remake matter if you're not concerned with the lyrical content?  I really am interested in your opinion here, I'm not trying to make points or criticize.

it's kind of jarring. Maybe it's supposed to be that way...

Most riots are, I guess.

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

That song is awesome for the chance for Carl to stretch out and PLAY.  He never got enough opportunity to do that and most people, BB fans included, don't know how good a player he was.

Carl was the best kind of guitarist.  The kind that never lets on exactly how good they are.  I mean, it's a nice mystery.  I have no idea if Carl could shred, but I do know that he had something in reserve that I'm not privy to.  And I like that.

[Jonas]

My point has more to do with the music rather than the lyrics and message... Don't get me wrong, I think its fine and dandy that Mike wants to spread a little political love...I have nothing against it. I just cant stand that dreadful song (musically)...and so that you know, my original post was to take light hearted. I wasnt trying to be mean spirited or anything Wink

Perhaps I should have been more specific and have written 'cellblock number 9'...I never said I had anything against the riff or progression.

aeijtzsche: Maybe its the combination of the lyrics and song? I dont know, I liked the idea someone mention if they were to just remake the original cellblock #9, and as I said before, Im all for Mike dropping some political-love but the combination of that, this song, the sirens, and everything that composes this song, just doesnt sound good to me.

I am allowed to dislike -A- Beach Boy song, right?

[Jeff Mason]

That makes sense -- if you don't like the original riot, you wouldn't like the remake either.

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

I am allowed to dislike -A- Beach Boy song, right?

Only if you can verbalize why you dislike the song using extremely specific language calling from a vocabulary involving the physiological, psychological, neurological, musical, and acoustical disciplines.

[Stephen W. Desper]

The only thing that really bothers me is the VOLUME of the track. To my ears anyway, the song sounds louder than the rest of the tracks on the Sunflower/Surf's Up two-fer. After "Disney Girls" fades, it's kind of jarring. Maybe it's supposed to be that way...

IT's called virtural loudness or apparent volume and is covered in my book on this song. Yes it was done on purpose and for a purpose.  ~swd

[c-man]

That song is awesome for the chance for Carl to stretch out and PLAY.  He never got enough opportunity to do that and most people, BB fans included, don't know how good a player he was.

Carl was the best kind of guitarist.  The kind that never lets on exactly how good they are.  I mean, it's a nice mystery.  I have no idea if Carl could shred, but I do know that he had something in reserve that I'm not privy to.  And I like that.

I've heard that in the last decade or so of his life, when he was living in Colorado, Carl would often sit in with blues bands at a local club.  That's something we're not privy to!

C-Man

[Cam Mott]

I agree with Stephen, some of us appreciate it from a certain life experience.

Stephen, I wondered if you remember if it was Mike who brought the song Cell Block #9 to the table or was it someone else's [Brian, Carl, Al, Dennis, Bruce] idea to use the song [Cell Block #9] and they then asked Mike to write relevant lyrics?

[c-man]

I agree with Stephen, some of us appreciate it from a certain life experience.

Stephen, I wondered if you remember if it was Mike who brought the song Cell Block #9 to the table or was it someone else's [Brian, Carl, Al, Dennis, Bruce] idea to use the song [Cell Block #9] and they then asked Mike to write relevant lyrics?

For all we know, it coulda been Jack Rieley's idea...sounds like it, although he probably would've wanted to write the lyrics himself it was.  But who knows...he might've suggested it, and Mike might've said "Ooh, I'll write 'em!".

C-Man