gfxgfx
 
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
logo
 
gfx gfx
gfx
474510 Posts in 16032 Topics by 2918 Members - Latest Member: jimmy19029 October 02, 2014, 03:41:55 AM
*
gfx*HomeHelpSearchCalendarLoginRegistergfx
gfxgfx
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.       « previous next »
Pages: 1 ... 7 8 9 10 11 [12] 13 14 15 16 17 ... 23 Go Down Print
Author Topic: Durrie Parks Smile acetates up for sale for $10,000  (Read 28710 times)
FatherOfTheMan (Vito Salutation)
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2056


The Producer


View Profile Email
« Reply #275 on: March 05, 2013, 06:02:57 PM »

i just mean, it's $ 10,000 guys, who'd spend that on something they know so little about?
Logged

***TAKE A BREAK NOW AVAILABLE!*****
http://mikeleroy.bandcamp.com/album/take-a-break
EgoHanger1966
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2768



View Profile
« Reply #276 on: March 05, 2013, 06:18:31 PM »

i just mean, it's $ 10,000 guys, who'd spend that on something they know so little about?

I know what you meant.
Again...don't be so naive.
Logged

Hal Blaine:"You're gonna get a tomata all over yer puss!"
Brian: "Don't say puss."
Zach
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 1255



View Profile
« Reply #277 on: March 05, 2013, 06:22:14 PM »

i just mean, it's $ 10,000 guys, who'd spend that on something they know so little about?

I know what you meant.
Again...don't be so naive.
Is that a hint that you bought them? Tongue
Logged

https://soundcloud.com/zachrwolfe - My soundcloud page. Largely BB-related stuff, some not. I'd love if you payed it a visit!
https://www.youtube.com/user/ZachRWolfe - My Youtube profile - mostly my old covers, but also is the best place to listen to e-Collab efforts produced by me.
EgoHanger1966
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2768



View Profile
« Reply #278 on: March 05, 2013, 06:29:44 PM »

i just mean, it's $ 10,000 guys, who'd spend that on something they know so little about?

I know what you meant.
Again...don't be so naive.
Is that a hint that you bought them? Tongue

I may be crazy, but i'm not that crazy!
Logged

Hal Blaine:"You're gonna get a tomata all over yer puss!"
Brian: "Don't say puss."
Tricycle Rider
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 105


View Profile
« Reply #279 on: March 05, 2013, 06:37:08 PM »

SOMEBODY here is!  3D
« Last Edit: March 05, 2013, 06:42:15 PM by Tricycle Rider » Logged

The most powerful thing in the world is imagination
EgoHanger1966
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2768



View Profile
« Reply #280 on: March 05, 2013, 06:50:21 PM »

SOMEBODY here is!  3D

C'mon now, this is exactly what I was saying in my previous posts. If you think the only people interested in these are on this board, you're livin' in a netherland.
Logged

Hal Blaine:"You're gonna get a tomata all over yer puss!"
Brian: "Don't say puss."
Tricycle Rider
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 105


View Profile
« Reply #281 on: March 05, 2013, 07:16:59 PM »

Color me a Netherlandian then! Smiley (just having a bit of fun, mate!)

Seriously, I wonder who DID buy them?
Logged

The most powerful thing in the world is imagination
KittyKat
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1434



View Profile
« Reply #282 on: March 05, 2013, 09:25:19 PM »

If the site lets a person add the acetates twice (winding up with quantity: 2) to the shopping cart, there's no saying if they really sold yet or not. It doesn't seem like the most well-run website. So it's hard to say if they sold, until they either take the item down or put a larger notice that they've sold. I suppose they could be waiting for the check to clear or the credit card company full $10,000 credit to hit their account.

Unless there are multiple copies of these rare acetates.
Logged
sweetdudejim
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2002



View Profile Email
« Reply #283 on: March 05, 2013, 11:41:34 PM »

Worth noting that while this is infinitely interesting and is worth more than any fan guess, much like the Cantina version, it's probably just a work in progress structure that Brian felt worked one day of his life and should not be angrily argued for as the definitive end-all-be-all of "Heroes And Villains" structures.

I was thinking about this same basic idea earlier too. We all knew "I'm In Great Shape" was considered as a part of "Heroes And Villains" before this information, but it is interesting to now have a bit more of a clue as to where it might have been placed. But yeah, "Heroes..." is one of the songs that we know how Brian woulda done it, cuz he did indeed finish it, for better or worse by mid '67 (better in my opinion).

I think that one thing that we will probably never have much of a clue about though is what a standalone  "I'm In Great Shape"  track woulda been. I'm assuming it wouldn't have just been that one section. Maybe "I Wanna Be Around" and "Friday Night" woulda been involved, maybe not.

But anyways, I know somebody mentioned this earlier, but I think it would be interesting if somebody worked up a version of "Heroes..." with "Great Shape" edited in. Now obviously we don't have that exact take that Andy talked about, but it would still be interesting. And I would totally do it, but I have had no luck with editing the SMiLE things together before.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2013, 06:18:38 AM by sweetdudejim » Logged
bossaroo
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1164


...let's be friends...


View Profile Email
« Reply #284 on: March 06, 2013, 12:17:06 AM »

I slapped this together. It doesn't do that much for me but it's not bad. Ultimately I prefer I'm In Great Shape as a separate entity along with I Wanna Be Around and Friday Night. I like to think that's where IIGS was headed, and obviously that's how it ended up on BWPS.

https://soundcloud.com/bossaroo/heroes-villains-great-shape
« Last Edit: March 06, 2013, 12:21:10 AM by bossaroo » Logged
Micha
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2160



View Profile WWW
« Reply #285 on: March 06, 2013, 12:22:49 AM »

But anyways, I know somebody mentioned this earlier, but I think it would be interesting if somebody worked up a version of "Heroes..." with "Great Shape" edited in.

I did, didn't like it, junked it. Cheesy

SOMEBODY here is!  3D

C'mon now, this is exactly what I was saying in my previous posts. If you think the only people interested in these are on this board, you're livin' in a netherland.

Let's hear what the Don has to say about this! Grin
« Last Edit: March 06, 2013, 12:24:12 AM by Micha » Logged
Iron Horse-Apples
Guest
« Reply #286 on: March 06, 2013, 02:21:09 AM »

Worth noting that while this is infinitely interesting and is worth more than any fan guess, much like the Cantina version, it's probably just a work in progress structure that Brian felt worked one day of his life and should not be angrily argued for as the definitive end-all-be-all of "Heroes And Villains" structures.

I was thinking about this same basic idea earlier too. We all knew "I'm In Great Shape" was considered as a part of "Heroes And Villains" before this information, but it is interesting to now have a bit more of a clue as to wear it might have been placed. But yeah, "Heroes..." is one of the songs that we know how Brian woulda done it, cuz he did indeed finish it, for better or worse by mid '67 (better in my opinion).

I think that one thing that we will probably never have much of a clue about though is what a standalone  "I'm In Great Shape"  track woulda been. I'm assuming it wouldn't have just been that one section. Maybe "I Wanna Be Around" and "Friday Night" woulda been involved, maybe not.

But anyways, I know somebody mentioned this earlier, but I think it would be interesting if somebody worked up a version of "Heroes..." with "Great Shape" edited in. Now obviously we don't have that exact take that Andy talked about, but it would still be interesting. And I would totally do it, but I have had no luck with editing the SMiLE things together before.

Well yes, the '67 Smiley version is the finished version. I'm just interested in hearing Heroes stuff from the missing period when IIGS was part of the song
Logged
The Heartical Don
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 4625



View Profile Email
« Reply #287 on: March 06, 2013, 02:28:19 AM »

But anyways, I know somebody mentioned this earlier, but I think it would be interesting if somebody worked up a version of "Heroes..." with "Great Shape" edited in.

I did, didn't like it, junked it. Cheesy

SOMEBODY here is!  3D

C'mon now, this is exactly what I was saying in my previous posts. If you think the only people interested in these are on this board, you're livin' in a netherland.

Let's hear what the Don has to say about this! Grin

 Embarrassed I confess. I bought them. No great shakes, at least not on my old Dansette record player. The fact that the crystal needle is very worn, its pressure is circa 8 gm, and that the 3" speaker inbuilt in the lid is not really hifi either, may have contributed to a less than ecstatic listening experience. Especially the H&V/IIGS chimera was gruesome, and even after 100 listens I couldn't see what all the fuss is about.

So I donated the lot to a good cause: IIRC it's in North-Korea.

Hope this info helps.

THD.
Logged

80% Of Success Is Showing Up
buddhahat
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2373


Hi, my name's Doug. Would you like to dance?


View Profile
« Reply #288 on: March 06, 2013, 06:52:37 AM »

Worth noting that while this is infinitely interesting and is worth more than any fan guess, much like the Cantina version, it's probably just a work in progress structure that Brian felt worked one day of his life and should not be angrily argued for as the definitive end-all-be-all of "Heroes And Villains" structures.

Yes, it's clear that Heroes was in a constant sate of flux throughout 66/67, but that's excatly why this is such a cool find. Arguing anything about IIGS's placement within H&V was pretty futile when you were basing your argument on the Humble Harv demo, but now (potentially) we have evidence that Brian at least planned for it to precede "My Children Were Raised" at one point, just as Cantina would in the early 67 edit.

Listening to those two sections together on Bossaroo's mix (of course Andy has described a different version of IIGS than we've heard) there's a real sense of narrative - you get a much stronger sense of the male narrator running throughout the song. The intro to the song where he's been in this town so long etc, then the two sections we're discussing in this thread: he's describing waking up, having breakfast, appreciating the land, and going on to describe his kids growing up. If, like me, you believe Barnyard then to be the fade to this version, you then potentially have the same character describing his interactions with the barnyard, so it's much more a linear story told by one guy, rather than the more abstract Cantina edit that jumps to a scene about a girl in a cantina then an arrest and ends with a wordless section, or the even more abstract 45 edit that detours into the spooky bicycle rider theme.

Of course we don't know how Brian would've resolved other parts of the song at the time he apparently edited IIGS and My children together. Personally I'm with Bicycle Rider that if you swap cantina for IIGS and false barnyard fade for Barnyard you have it! Certainly the easiest and most logical solution based on what we have, even if it is not proven. I'd love to hear an edit that followed that sequence if anyone has the skills ....
« Last Edit: March 06, 2013, 07:02:48 AM by buddhahat » Logged

Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes ......
zaval80
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 16


View Profile Email
« Reply #289 on: March 06, 2013, 08:32:38 AM »

Obviously Brian has tried every way to edit H&V, what with Bicycle Rider into verse and verse into Bicycle Rider edits we know from bootlegs, and all the others.

There is one thing I can't figure out, though. At the end of Track 10, CD1, SOT UM 17 we have the "Hold On" section - and there clearly is a skip at the very end of that section. I never paid much attention to it, thinking it was a digital skip on my copy - and, sure enough, on TSS box in the "Early Outtake Section" track (Track 24, CD4, TSS), "Hold On" does not have that skip.

But then I've got another copy of SOT UM 17, and then yet another one - and they all have the same skip. I decided to have a closer look and magnified the offending spot in the Soundforge - and it did not look like a digital skip to me, but rather as a (bad) edit.

Anybody noticed this, any thoughts? SOT UM discs sound very good on the overall, no other skips like that on them.
Logged
Mr. Cohen
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1536


View Profile Email
« Reply #290 on: March 06, 2013, 09:04:27 AM »

I had a theory awhile ago that people liked. Basically, I believe "In the Cantina" replaced "I'm In Great Shape" and "False Barnyard" (or whatever the heck it's called) really did replace "Barnyard". It makes sense structurally. And then Brian spun off the farming bits onto their song, "Barnyard Suite", which was never finished.
Logged
Cam Mott
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2389


View Profile Email
« Reply #291 on: March 06, 2013, 11:16:39 AM »

If I understand andy correctly, IIGS probably does not have the distortion at the end, I take it as a butt cut edit before the distortion into butt cut edits of the next two sections. Yes? No? Anybody tried that as an approximation? Could a couple of or all versions of the IIGS instru track [sans Harv demo] be layered to simulate a version with fuller instrumentation? You know by someone not me, someone with the appropriate skills. Would that work?
Logged

"Bring me the head of Carmen Sandiego" Lynne "The Chief" Thigpen
Bubba Ho-Tep
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 1090



View Profile
« Reply #292 on: March 06, 2013, 11:35:55 AM »

I had a theory awhile ago that people liked. Basically, I believe "In the Cantina" replaced "I'm In Great Shape" and "False Barnyard" (or whatever the heck it's called) really did replace "Barnyard". It makes sense structurally. And then Brian spun off the farming bits onto their song, "Barnyard Suite", which was never finished.

‘Barnyard’ seems so sluggish and slow, both in it’s “finished” recorded state and (especially) in the Humble Harv tape. While I don’t argue it could potentially be meant for the fade, it certainly seems like an odd choice. Doesn't have that "riding off into the sunset" feeling that...uh...."false barnyard" has.

And it has lyrics of it's own (though so does "good night m'baby sleep tight m'baby"). Were the lyrics intentionally discarded when it became a mere fade? And if so, what was it conceived as? Another interlude?

If these words were to appear at the end, are they saying that the entire wild west story was merely the fantasy of a simple farmer, who fell down in the pig pen and bumped his head and dreamed the song during 2 and a half minutes of unconciousness or something? Will he leave his hat on next time to cushion the blow?
« Last Edit: March 06, 2013, 11:36:46 AM by Bubba Ho-Tep » Logged

Does anybody even read my fucking posts?

Quote
Watch your tone. I know more about UMe purchasing Capitol than you can EVER, EVER fathom."
buddhahat
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2373


Hi, my name's Doug. Would you like to dance?


View Profile
« Reply #293 on: March 06, 2013, 11:49:39 AM »

If I understand andy correctly, IIGS probably does not have the distortion at the end, I take it as a butt cut edit before the distortion into butt cut edits of the next two sections. Yes? No? Anybody tried that as an approximation? Could a couple of or all versions of the IIGS instru track [sans Harv demo] be layered to simulate a version with fuller instrumentation? You know by someone not me, someone with the appropriate skills. Would that work?

I've wondered about the distortion too. Why record it with distortion if Brian was not intending to edit out of the explosion effect? But then it's unlikely he'd have IIGS end in the distortion, then have the dum dum whistle distortion section replicate the effect shortly afterwards within the song. It's a shame Andy can't remember whether the explosion effect was present at the end of the IIGS he heard. If there's no tape explosion in the version he heard, maybe Brian had decided to feature the effect later in the song at that point (i.e. in the dum dum whistle distortion section).

Nothing sounds as good coming out of that explosion effect as Barnyard imo. Maybe when he was recording it at the end of IIGS he planned to follow it immediately with the Barnyard fade as per Mark Linnett's edit on TSS. Then a while later he decided to place some sections in between IIGS and Barnard (e.g. My Children were raised, dum dum whistle distortion). Pure, groundless speculation but there you go!

I would love to hear this edit of IIGS + My chldren more than anything right now, but I fear the acetates may have been snapped up by a collector with no will to share the recordings. Let's hope that's not the case.
Logged

Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes ......
buddhahat
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2373


Hi, my name's Doug. Would you like to dance?


View Profile
« Reply #294 on: March 06, 2013, 11:53:46 AM »

I had a theory awhile ago that people liked. Basically, I believe "In the Cantina" replaced "I'm In Great Shape" and "False Barnyard" (or whatever the heck it's called) really did replace "Barnyard". It makes sense structurally. And then Brian spun off the farming bits onto their song, "Barnyard Suite", which was never finished.

‘Barnyard’ seems so sluggish and slow, both in it’s “finished” recorded state and (especially) in the Humble Harv tape. While I don’t argue it could potentially be meant for the fade, it certainly seems like an odd choice. Doesn't have that "riding off into the sunset" feeling that...uh...."false barnyard" has.

And it has lyrics of it's own (though so does "good night m'baby sleep tight m'baby"). Were the lyrics intentionally discarded when it became a mere fade? And if so, what was it conceived as? Another interlude?

If these words were to appear at the end, are they saying that the entire wild west story was merely the fantasy of a simple farmer, who fell down in the pig pen and bumped his head and dreamed the song during 2 and a half minutes of unconciousness or something? Will he leave his hat on next time to cushion the blow?

Barnyard would work as a great fade with the crazy lyrics, for me. H&V was a comedy remember so it fulfills that description much better than the later incarnations that don't feature Barnard. The only thing that is comedic in the cantina edit is the "You're Under Arrest" shout. Both IIGS and Barnyard are lyrically humorous.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2013, 11:58:38 AM by buddhahat » Logged

Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes ......
rab2591
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2929


"My God. It's full of stars."


View Profile
« Reply #295 on: March 06, 2013, 11:58:57 AM »

If I understand andy correctly, IIGS probably does not have the distortion at the end, I take it as a butt cut edit before the distortion into butt cut edits of the next two sections. Yes? No? Anybody tried that as an approximation? Could a couple of or all versions of the IIGS instru track [sans Harv demo] be layered to simulate a version with fuller instrumentation? You know by someone not me, someone with the appropriate skills. Would that work?

This was my interpretation of his description of the transition from IIGS to the 'boys and girls' section (though I added the vocals to the harpsichord section): https://soundcloud.com/robert-borszich/im-in-decent-shape/s-334m0

It's seems to work really well - though it's probably not even close to what Andy was talking about.
Logged

Check out Bill Tobelman's SMiLE site!

#OSDCampaign2014

Here is what I know; Brian worked his ass off on this record whether some here want to believe that or not; let the music speak for itself.
rockandroll
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2015


View Profile
« Reply #296 on: March 06, 2013, 12:11:51 PM »

I had a theory awhile ago that people liked. Basically, I believe "In the Cantina" replaced "I'm In Great Shape" and "False Barnyard" (or whatever the heck it's called) really did replace "Barnyard". It makes sense structurally. And then Brian spun off the farming bits onto their song, "Barnyard Suite", which was never finished.

‘Barnyard’ seems so sluggish and slow, both in it’s “finished” recorded state and (especially) in the Humble Harv tape. While I don’t argue it could potentially be meant for the fade, it certainly seems like an odd choice. Doesn't have that "riding off into the sunset" feeling that...uh...."false barnyard" has.

And it has lyrics of it's own (though so does "good night m'baby sleep tight m'baby"). Were the lyrics intentionally discarded when it became a mere fade? And if so, what was it conceived as? Another interlude?

If these words were to appear at the end, are they saying that the entire wild west story was merely the fantasy of a simple farmer, who fell down in the pig pen and bumped his head and dreamed the song during 2 and a half minutes of unconciousness or something? Will he leave his hat on next time to cushion the blow?

Heroes and Villains is such a mystery in part for the reasons you guys are talking about. At the time, Brian was into a particular period of Smile where he was doing this 3-section style song - Cabinessence, Do You Like Worms, and Heroes and Villains basically fall into that category. It seems as if at first just as Cabinessence had "Home on the Range," "Iron Horse," and "Crow Cries" and Worms had "Plymouth Rock," "Bicycle Rider," and Hawaiian Chant, Heroes seemed to have "Been in this Town," "Great Shape" and "Barnyard." However, it is really hard to see how those parts hang together in the way that it works for Cabin and Worms. And YET despite the fact that it doesn't seem to me, at least, that they don't hang together, it was nevertheless this that Brian saw as being the follow-up to Good Vibrations. So in some way, the whole thing must have made sense to him.

But as the project grows, things get more confusing. Suddenly you have Heroes and Villains Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, and Part 4. And all those parts seem to have radically different parts within them. It becomes really difficult to even get the beginning of an idea as that what he's on about. I just spent a good amount of time yesterday listening specifically to the Heroes bits on Smile Sessions, and it doesn't help matters. For a while I was thinking that the "dit dit dit Heroes and-a Villains" parts would have been thought of as the chorus in the same way that "I'm pickin' up Good Vibrations" was but even that doesn't really seem to hold up as per the slates Brian was giving.

Anyway, I'd love to hear more discussion on this, but I don't know if this is the right place or where that place might be.
Logged
buddhahat
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2373


Hi, my name's Doug. Would you like to dance?


View Profile
« Reply #297 on: March 06, 2013, 12:30:31 PM »

I had a theory awhile ago that people liked. Basically, I believe "In the Cantina" replaced "I'm In Great Shape" and "False Barnyard" (or whatever the heck it's called) really did replace "Barnyard". It makes sense structurally. And then Brian spun off the farming bits onto their song, "Barnyard Suite", which was never finished.

‘Barnyard’ seems so sluggish and slow, both in it’s “finished” recorded state and (especially) in the Humble Harv tape. While I don’t argue it could potentially be meant for the fade, it certainly seems like an odd choice. Doesn't have that "riding off into the sunset" feeling that...uh...."false barnyard" has.

And it has lyrics of it's own (though so does "good night m'baby sleep tight m'baby"). Were the lyrics intentionally discarded when it became a mere fade? And if so, what was it conceived as? Another interlude?

If these words were to appear at the end, are they saying that the entire wild west story was merely the fantasy of a simple farmer, who fell down in the pig pen and bumped his head and dreamed the song during 2 and a half minutes of unconciousness or something? Will he leave his hat on next time to cushion the blow?

Heroes and Villains is such a mystery in part for the reasons you guys are talking about. At the time, Brian was into a particular period of Smile where he was doing this 3-section style song - Cabinessence, Do You Like Worms, and Heroes and Villains basically fall into that category. It seems as if at first just as Cabinessence had "Home on the Range," "Iron Horse," and "Crow Cries" and Worms had "Plymouth Rock," "Bicycle Rider," and Hawaiian Chant, Heroes seemed to have "Been in this Town," "Great Shape" and "Barnyard." However, it is really hard to see how those parts hang together in the way that it works for Cabin and Worms. And YET despite the fact that it doesn't seem to me, at least, that they don't hang together, it was nevertheless this that Brian saw as being the follow-up to Good Vibrations. So in some way, the whole thing must have made sense to him.

But as the project grows, things get more confusing. Suddenly you have Heroes and Villains Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, and Part 4. And all those parts seem to have radically different parts within them. It becomes really difficult to even get the beginning of an idea as that what he's on about. I just spent a good amount of time yesterday listening specifically to the Heroes bits on Smile Sessions, and it doesn't help matters. For a while I was thinking that the "dit dit dit Heroes and-a Villains" parts would have been thought of as the chorus in the same way that "I'm pickin' up Good Vibrations" was but even that doesn't really seem to hold up as per the slates Brian was giving.

Anyway, I'd love to hear more discussion on this, but I don't know if this is the right place or where that place might be.

I think if you accept the two sided Heroes theory it makes more sense of a lot of the odd sections such as those dit dit parts. They seem to me like a showcase of the Beach Boys vocal acrobatics - riffs on the Heroes theme that would've been perfect B side material: nothing more, nothing less.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2013, 12:31:25 PM by buddhahat » Logged

Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes, Bedroom Tapes ......
rockandroll
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2015


View Profile
« Reply #298 on: March 06, 2013, 12:39:03 PM »

I think if you accept the two sided Heroes theory it makes more sense of a lot of the odd sections such as those dit dit parts. They seem to me like a showcase of the Beach Boys vocal acrobatics - riffs on the Heroes theme that would've been perfect B side material: nothing more, nothing less.

Well, I don't fully accept that theory. Again, this just doesn't jive with him by early 1967 referring to sections as Part 1, Part 2, Part 3, and Part 4. Part 2 does have some vocal acrobatics stuff like Gee but it also has the DYLW riff in it and the Cantina section. Part 3 has some of the "doo doo Heroes and Villains" parts but it certainly wouldn't be enough for a B side. Part 4 is the the dum dum whistle distortion section as it was called above. The way Brian was talking about these parts, to me, does not suggest that there was any of this A-side/B-side business going on at this point.
Logged
Cam Mott
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 2389


View Profile Email
« Reply #299 on: March 06, 2013, 12:44:04 PM »

If I understand andy correctly, IIGS probably does not have the distortion at the end, I take it as a butt cut edit before the distortion into butt cut edits of the next two sections. Yes? No? Anybody tried that as an approximation? Could a couple of or all versions of the IIGS instru track [sans Harv demo] be layered to simulate a version with fuller instrumentation? You know by someone not me, someone with the appropriate skills. Would that work?

I've wondered about the distortion too. Why record it with distortion if Brian was not intending to edit out of the explosion effect? But then it's unlikely he'd have IIGS end in the distortion, then have the dum dum whistle distortion section replicate the effect shortly afterwards within the song. It's a shame Andy can't remember whether the explosion effect was present at the end of the IIGS he heard. If there's no tape explosion in the version he heard, maybe Brian had decided to feature the effect later in the song at that point (i.e. in the dum dum whistle distortion section).

Nothing sounds as good coming out of that explosion effect as Barnyard imo. Maybe when he was recording it at the end of IIGS he planned to follow it immediately with the Barnyard fade as per Mark Linnett's edit on TSS. Then a while later he decided to place some sections in between IIGS and Barnard (e.g. My Children were raised, dum dum whistle distortion). Pure, groundless speculation but there you go!

I would love to hear this edit of IIGS + My chldren more than anything right now, but I fear the acetates may have been snapped up by a collector with no will to share the recordings. Let's hope that's not the case.


If he cut it off, maybe he just didn't like it when assembled or didn't think it lent itself to an edit the way he liked or it started to sound gimmicky to him. Who knows.
Logged

"Bring me the head of Carmen Sandiego" Lynne "The Chief" Thigpen
gfx
Pages: 1 ... 7 8 9 10 11 [12] 13 14 15 16 17 ... 23 Go Up Print 
gfx
Jump to:  
gfx gfx
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!