Brian Reimagines Gershwin

[Howie Edelson]

Sure.

"Everything that I am or ever will be is in the music. If you want to know me, just listen."

Dennis Wilson to Jon Stebbins
Westwood, 1978

[Peter Ames Carlin]

Oh, and now that I've gone back to read a little more, a few other observations:

1. Howie's observation that the album is 'heavily tweaked' implies, what? Heavy auto-tuning? Not according to a lot of objective, even hard-eyed folks I've spoken to who were actually in the studio at the time. As opposed to earlier, more slapdash efforts, this time BW worked eight-hour days, sitting alone at the mic at Ocean Way, to make sure his leads were as rich and full as they could be. A guy at the record label said there's one or two auto-tune moments, and that's that.

2. Brian doing what he doesn't want to do? - Here and there, I'm sure. Peter Reum's point, which I think is absolutely right, is that above and beyond the usual give-and-take of a commercial artist, Brian rarely does anything he doesn't want to do for long periods of time. E.g., touring for more than a decade. And while it's pretty to think he's right down to brass tacks talking to you one day in 2006, I've had plenty of similar talks over the last 12 years (and more than a few less connected ones) and he'll still contradict himself from one moment to the next, depending on what he's feeling that hour of that day. As of a week ago last Thursday he was taking serious, visible pride in his touring work.

3. You know what Brian really wanted to do? The fucking Gershwin album. He's been talking about it for years. When Disney offered him a deal to cover Disney songs those wicked, wicked people who are ruining his life told Disney they could have that album. . . but only if they let him do the Gershwin album he wanted to do first. Now you can tell me what's tragic about that. The fact that he's not involved in some wanky 50th anniversary tribute? I don't see it that way.

[Peter Ames Carlin]

Ah, the Stebbins quote. Yes, it is a cool quote. Here are the salient facts about how it came to be in my book, sans attribution. In stark contrast to virtually every other quote I used. Am I sorry I didn't call out Stebbins by name? You bet I am, which is why I apologized to him in 2006. And as I also told him then, here's what happened.

1. I didn't read Jon's book. Not that I consciously dissed it, or that I didn't try to find a copy. I simply couldn't find a copy when I went looking, and then had a ton of other stuff to sift through. Whatever,  it was basically impossible for me to steal it from there.
2. What I did read, repeatedly, were other articles/books/websites that used his quote without citing its source. I actually spent some time retracing my steps there, since I felt bad about Jon feeling irked, and quickly found a handful of stories/sites that had the full quote, minus any attribution.
3. So that's what happened. It was a lapse, of sorts. I'm sorry it happened. But for you, or anyone, to imply that I did it it on purpose, well, that seems kind of weird.

[Jon Stebbins]

I actually spent some time retracing my steps there, since I felt bad about Jon feeling irked, and quickly found a handful of stories/sites that had the full quote, minus any attribution.
 

I think you're misremembering this Peter. I appreciate the apology, and the quote has since become something of a standard after its prominent use to promote the Sony Legacy POB package in 2008. But the reason i mentioned it to you in the first place after seeing it in your book in '06 is that the quote had never appeared anywhere (that I know of) prior to that other than in my book and on my website...therefore I expected at least a bibliography mention in your book. When i brought this to your attention you insisted it had come from some alternate source other my site or my book, however, you were unable to come up with this mysterious other source. You made some suggestions as to where you may have found it, but after re-checking you admitted to me in a public forum that you were mistaken. You told me you were mystified as to where you had found the quote...and apologized to me for having no explanation and no attribution for the quote. Now you are telling Howie something different, saying that you indeed found the quote in "a handful of stories/sites." I have yet to find an earlier source for the quote (besides my book and my site) than your book. If you have since solved the mystery I am intrigued to know the source.

[Andrew G. Doe]

I am decidedly not a fan of autotune - I am a singer who has never used it on my own voice, but I can hear it in a second when it is used, even tastefully as on BWPS. I don't hear autotune on this album, except for on "The Like in I Love You" but I could be mistaken anyhow.

No autotune on this album, I'm told - if there is it was added during the 2nd mix.

[Peter Ames Carlin]

Jon - This is getting absurd. We're talking about ten words in a 100,000 word-plus book that I wrote five-plus years ago. You're asking me to go back and trace the specific steps of how and where I found one quote out of the hundreds that derived from my own interviews, from years worth of books, magazines, news articles, etc. etc. etc. Is it possible today to fire up the good old Google and jump right back to where I was five years ago? Is the Internet even remotely the same as it was back then? I have no idea. I can tell you that I just did a Google search and, within less than a second, the browser came back with 960,000 pages it believes has the words 'dennis wilson' and 'if you want to know me' on them. Not all have the precise quote, but may do.  Including a DW bio on Rotten Tomatoes, which is where the following graf appears:

Stephen Kalinich in an interview with Adam Webb stated that "He had soul in his music and he was a master. And yet a primitive master in the sense that he may not have heard all of Beethoven or Bach but he had a feeling of combining the pain and the joy together." He remained honest throughout his songs, which he sung in a soulful croon. Dennis never felt loved and it was something that he always sought. This can clearly be seen in his song "Time" from his 1977 solo album Pacific Ocean Blue where the lyrics state "Known a lot of women, but they don't fill my heart; with love completely..." Dennis once stated “The greatest success in life is to feel I’m something for someone; the feeling of falling in love, the newness of love.� A lot of Dennis’ songs are expressed not only with great passion but also with great sorrow, and it is only in his music as Dennis describes that people can gain a true understanding of the person he was. "Everything that I am or will ever be is in the music. If you want to know me, just listen."

Do you see the attribution there? Me either. Do you suppose this is the only article on the Internet, or anywhere else in the world, that has lifted your quote? I don't. If only because I see fragments of my own interviews with all kinds of people pop up places. And if it's just ten words out of a book, or even a 3,000-word article? I really, honestly don't care that much.

Sometimes quotes, like brand-names, fall into popular usage. It kind of sucks, but that's just how it goes. I just find it difficult to sit here and have Howie, or anyone, accuse me of plagiarism. That's the sort of scorched earth, make-him-deny-it type of discussion that corrupts what has until this point been a really collegial and interesting conversation about a fascinating new record.


I

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

The album is fucking brilliant.  Brian's best vocals since his glory days. Period. I do hear autotune on a few things, but we're talking a few notes spread across the entire thing, not even a few per song. And really...who the hell cares?! Autotune can NOT make someone who can't sing sound good...that is a stupid myth started by people who've never been in the studio. It's used so sparingly on the album that I can say it's no different from when the Beach Boys would sing at a lower key then speed the track back up.

BWRG is freaking *brilliant*, featuring Brian singing more tenderly then he has, again, since the glory days.  I can definitely tell that Brian worked his ass off. Towards the end of Summertime, specifically the "No No Don't You Cry" parts...spine-tingling.

I am absolutely floored by Brian's singing... I'm excited to see how this will do. Another Grammy, perhaps...?

[runnersdialzero]

Anyway, I guess some people are beginning to lump double-tracking into the category of unnecessary vocal tricks with autotune. It is ridiculous to do so. What's next, are people going to bash Brian for overdubbing instead of tracking every single instrument and vocal live in the studio? These are all just tools to make a good recording, autotune included.

And for anyone who is against double-tracking, it is used on California Girls and tons and tons of other songs by the Beach Boys / Beatles / et. al.

It's not about disliking double tracking out of principle, Brian just sounds much, MUCH better these days when he's single tracked. Sounded great in the 60s, not so lately.

Autotune is a completely different beast, and is not "just a tool to make a good recording." Not that that's relevant, here - I do still hear it on the single, but can't hear it elsewhere on the album.

[Runaways]

i gotta say the solo in "i've got a crush on you" surprised me too.  i looove guitar solos with that sound.  I'm not huge on the beatles, but they did that well.  Harrison's solo on the single version of let it be is prob my fav solo ever.  a lil different than the one here, but similar. 

[buddhahat]

I'll make you a deal Peter; You don't steal original one-of-a-kind personal Dennis Wilson quotes from other author's books and I won't "doubt" Peter Reum, who made the most ridiculous and inaccurate quote about Brian Wilson that I have ever read. A quote so silly, backwards, and incorrect that I felt the need to immediately call him on it.  A quote so off that -- politics be damned -- YOU should have called him on it. It's a historian's DUTY to call people on inaccuracies -- even if they were a source for your book and even if you're riding high on being invited to some listening party.

Even if Peter.
Even if.

Not that Peter needs me or anyone to stick up for him, but I don't understand why it's necessary to air such grievances on a public message board. Seems a bit mean spirited to me. Can't this sort of thing just be carried out via PMs?

[A Million Units In Jan!]

Seriously-I don't care how much you know, who you know, or how much you think you know, you don't need to air your personal problems with each other on here.

[brother john]

Re: the album (to change the subject back for a moment), the stream that I've heard is compressed quite a lot more than the free download from bw.com and its also lacking quite a lot of its high end. Before we make criticisms or judgements of the record it would be worth waiting until we've all heard the real thing on CD.

Having said that, Brian seems to be singing well on it, and while there may be no Autotune (TM) on it there is certainly some (every good DAW has a manual pitch correction plugin which will raise or lower pitch by however many degrees are deemed necessary) kind of pitch correction here and there, despite what some people believe to the contrary. There are a small number of moments where I believe I hear it in Brian's higher and lower registers, where he struggles the most. There are some notes that, with the best will in the world, it would be unrealistic to think he could reach perfectly, no matter how patiently he sat at the microphone. But, who cares, as I'd much rather have him in tune than out of tune.

One thing that has exercised me a little, given some of the comments I've read in this thread, is that if Gershwin wrote the songs, Mertens arranged the strings and the links in between the songs, and the band came up with most of the instrumentation (given that they know what BW wants by now) what, apart from sing it, did Brian actually do?

And finally, as I don't know the Gershwin catalogue very well, I'm going to source all the tracks on BWRG and make a Gershwin Imagines Gershwin album to listen to as a comparison, as I think that would help me appreciate BW's disc all the more!  

[Yorick]

I can't believe how good this record is!!!

[hypehat]

One thing that has exercised me a little, given some of the comments I've read in this thread, is that if Gershwin wrote the songs, Mertens arranged the strings and the links in between the songs, and the band came up with most of the instrumentation (given that they know what BW wants by now) what, apart from sing it, did Brian actually do?

And finally, as I don't know the Gershwin catalogue very well, I'm going to source all the tracks on BWRG and make a Gershwin Imagines Gershwin album to listen to as a comparison, as I think that would help me appreciate BW's disc all the more!  

Well, Brian picked the songs. I imagine he also is responsible for the quite drastic reimaginings of some of the tunes ('I Got Rhythm' seems like something Brian would do), and the arrangements of said tunes, even if i can imagine Brian being vague about it - 'Hey, how about some banjo/make it a little bouncier' , stuff like that.

The other thing is, and people seem to forget, is that Brian can say no to his band. Some might argue he doesn't say 'no' enough (Mexican Girl, anyone?), but I can imagine he turns down more than enough of the ideas of his Wondermints.

Also, I hate to see my posts being misinterpreted. If you had actually bothered to read my post properly, Mr Carlin, you would have noticed I 'love his vocals', except I thought they were perhaps a little bit much on 'Summertime'. Whilst I didn't say so, I wrote that after listening to the record for the first time, and now my opinion has changed somewhat. You also appeared to miss the post where i raved nearly exclusively about how good Brian's voice was on this record. It seems you have no friggin' idea what you are talking about. Sorry to argue (As I do love the book), and it seems the post was made with good intentions, but there it is.

Phew, I think it's time for me to meditate  *Sticks on BWRG again* Post that mix when you finish, Brother John? Was going to do something like that myself....

[Andrew G. Doe]

One thing that has exercised me a little, given some of the comments I've read in this thread, is that if Gershwin wrote the songs, Mertens arranged the strings and the links in between the songs, and the band came up with most of the instrumentation (given that they know what BW wants by now) what, apart from sing it, did Brian actually do?

Brian did the arrangements with Paul, back in summer 2009. Brian also, y'know, produced it and did the original mix (which I have on excellent authority is very little different from what we have) the PvM and Darian.

[Amy B.]

More than the autotune issue, I care about the fact that Brian really sounds like he wants to be singing these songs. He sounds like he was really into the project (which has been suggested in the press and in this thread) and is in a sense caressing the melodies with his voice, like he used to do in the old days. Clearly he loves the songs, and if that's the case, then it's highly likely he wanted to be involved with their production, backing up AGD's assertion that he was.

[runnersdialzero]

Brian did the arrangements with Paul, back in summer 2009. Brian also, y'know, produced it and did the original mix (which I have on excellent authority is very little different from what we have) the PvM and Darian.

Shoot - sounds like he was more involved in this than... well... when WAS the last time he was that involved?

[The Heartical Don]

Brian did the arrangements with Paul, back in summer 2009. Brian also, y'know, produced it and did the original mix (which I have on excellent authority is very little different from what we have) the PvM and Darian.

Shoot - sounds like he was more involved in this than... well... when WAS the last time he was that involved?

Sweet Insanity?

[buddhahat]

Re: the album (to change the subject back for a moment), the stream that I've heard is compressed quite a lot more than the free download from bw.com and its also lacking quite a lot of its high end. Before we make criticisms or judgements of the record it would be worth waiting until we've all heard the real thing on CD.

Having said that, Brian seems to be singing well on it, and while there may be no Autotune (TM) on it there is certainly some (every good DAW has a manual pitch correction plugin which will raise or lower pitch by however many degrees are deemed necessary) kind of pitch correction here and there, despite what some people believe to the contrary. There are a small number of moments where I believe I hear it in Brian's higher and lower registers, where he struggles the most. There are some notes that, with the best will in the world, it would be unrealistic to think he could reach perfectly, no matter how patiently he sat at the microphone. But, who cares, as I'd much rather have him in tune than out of tune.

One thing that has exercised me a little, given some of the comments I've read in this thread, is that if Gershwin wrote the songs, Mertens arranged the strings and the links in between the songs, and the band came up with most of the instrumentation (given that they know what BW wants by now) what, apart from sing it, did Brian actually do?

And finally, as I don't know the Gershwin catalogue very well, I'm going to source all the tracks on BWRG and make a Gershwin Imagines Gershwin album to listen to as a comparison, as I think that would help me appreciate BW's disc all the more!  

Sounds like a good idea to compile all the gershwin material. I'd be interested to hear that if you get round to it (please!).

As for the question: what did Brian do, I think it's a fair one, and one that bedevils this record particularly since it is ostensibly a covers album. I have listened to a few other versions of the songs and I hear some significant tweaks of chords, phrasing, rythym etc. that definitely make the songs more Brian, besides all the other differences (Merten's arrangements etc.). I'd be amazed if he wasn't involved in this 'rewriting' process. Of course this is just my hunch but I'll stand by it. I really think there's a tendency for BW fans (and I'm as much to blame for this as anyone else here) to take a sort of worst case scenario standpoint that Brian is actually no longer capable of doing anything musically. I don't feel there is any evidence to back this up, besides the occasional insider who has 1st hand testimony from a band member that Brian did zilch (of course they can never divulge said source!). Actually in all the interviews of his bandmembers that I have watched, they seem genuinely in awe still of his talents. Of course they might be faking their admiration for the cameras, but for me it's enough (that and the fact his great new songs: MAD, Oxygen To The Brain, Message Man, Nothing But Love sound through and through like Brian songs - I know the last one is a collaboration but without even hearing the Gershwin original, I'll eat my hat if that's not mostly Brian's work). When in doubt I ask myself this question: If the wondermints were putting these albums out without Brian, do I honestly believe they would sound the same? Of course not - only BW can write a song like Morning Beat.

Brian did the arrangements with Paul, back in summer 2009. Brian also, y'know, produced it and did the original mix (which I have on excellent authority is very little different from what we have) the PvM and Darian.

Well the evidence according to Andrew, makes my optimistic hunch look positively cynical!! Great to hear that he was so involved. Excuse the cliche but I do think the proof is in the pudding with this album - it's a joy to listen to and I'd argue, although I've only been listening for a day or so that it's the best thing he's done since BW 88, and the production way surpasses that album.

[Wirestone]

What did Brian do?

Pretty much the same thing he's done on every record he's produced since 1970 and Sunflower.

That is, he figured out the general way he wanted the songs to sound (chords, groove, etc.) and recorded basic backing tracks after telling the musicians -- to varying degrees of specificity -- how he wanted the parts to go. Sometimes (TLOS), he'd created demos that conveyed most of that information. The group sometimes adds ideas, of course.

Then he arranged the vocal parts -- every BW record (IJWMFTT excepted) features vocals directed and arranged and sometimes all sung by him.

Then he left it largely to others to put finishing touches (string arrangements, etc) on the tracks, and handle the detailed bits of mixing.

This isn't new, or particularly unusual. This is how Brian has made records most of his adult life (with the exception of the early, super focused, super hit) years. The difference, this time, is not Brian's level of participation. It's his level of dedication and the quality of the results.

EDIT: The one part that is different seems to be that Brian selected the songs. Most of his other recent records have been sequenced or selected by associates, either for creative (TLOS) or commercial (BW88) purposes.

[Yorick]

Andrew, do you perhaps know why it was decided not to use Brian's original mix if it is supposed to be almost identical to the one we have now?

[Wirestone]

Grammy.

[Andrew G. Doe]

That's my understanding - Disney are looking at the Grammys.

[b00ts]

More than the autotune issue, I care about the fact that Brian really sounds like he wants to be singing these songs. He sounds like he was really into the project (which has been suggested in the press and in this thread) and is in a sense caressing the melodies with his voice, like he used to do in the old days. Clearly he loves the songs, and if that's the case, then it's highly likely he wanted to be involved with their production, backing up AGD's assertion that he was.

Amy, you hit the nail on the head. I haven't heard Brian sound this close to the early days since the mid-70s. Incredible stuff!

[grillo]

    I was really impressed with the album. BW is sounding like he actually wants to be making an album. The mix is nice, with brian's single-tracked leads not too high in the mix. Although I like some of Brian and Mark's mixes recently, this is far superior and sounds 'professional'. Way to go Bri!!!