Mike the dominant creative force when it came to conceptual content?

[rab2591]

http://www.fsunews.com/story/life/2015/05/06/beach-boys-tallahassee/70896652/

New Mike interview. Last question, he is asked "Lastly, do you have any words of wisdom for young, aspiring musicians?" and of course he has to turn it into boasting about his own supposed accomplishments. I totally understand that Mike was gifted lyrically, but conceptually? Surfing was Dennis's idea, Pet Sounds, Smile, Wild Honey, Friends were definitely Brian. Is there any evidence that Mike was a dominant creative force when it came to conceptual ideas about the music?

[Douchepool]

I'd say after Love You he was pretty much the top dog as far as the band's creative direction in the studio was concerned.

[SMiLE Brian]

And that's when the quality went to hell.

[drbeachboy]

I didn't read anything there that was braggadocious. Nothing even considered cocky. Pretty tame in my estimation, and true.

[Douchepool]

As far as his collaborations with Brian, Michael's not saying anything out of the ordinary. Brian was melancholy. Michael was Mr. Positivity. It's not like he was sitting on an uncomfortable seat or anything.

[rab2591]

Just odd that he thinks conceptually he was the dominant force in that relationship, considering that Dennis came up with the surfing idea, not sure who thought of the car idea - but I was under the impression it was more of a Gary Usher influence. The more sentimental output from Mike and Brian was obviously more of a Brian idea (Today! album). I'm not at all disputing his outstanding lyrical contribution, but from my point of view, conceptually Mike wasn't at all the dominant force.

[Douchepool]

We weren't there. I'll take Michael or Brian at their words.

[Cam Mott]

You don't think Mike came up with concept of the lyrics he wrote?

[wilsonart1]

LMAO

[filledeplage]

I didn't read anything there that was braggadocious. Nothing even considered cocky. Pretty tame in my estimation, and true.

Agreed.  

Consistent with being a lyricist.  

Melody - Brian

Lyrics - Mike

[drbeachboy]

Just odd that he thinks conceptually he was the dominant force in that relationship, considering that Dennis came up with the surfing idea, not sure who thought of the car idea - but I was under the impression it was more of a Gary Usher influence. The more sentimental output from Mike and Brian was obviously more of a Brian idea (Today! album). I'm not at all disputing his outstanding lyrical contribution, but from my point of view, conceptually Mike wasn't at all the dominant force.

Did I miss something in that article? Where did he say he was the dominant force? He called Brian a great arranger and composer, and only that he was a better lyricist than Brian. Even Brian would likely agree with that.

[rab2591]

You don't think Mike came up with concept of the lyrics he wrote?

I'm saying others came up with the concepts of surfing, the love songs. He wrote brilliant lyrics for the concepts. At a certain level I'm sure he was very conceptually involved, but dominant creative force in that arena? I doubt it.

[rab2591]

Just odd that he thinks conceptually he was the dominant force in that relationship, considering that Dennis came up with the surfing idea, not sure who thought of the car idea - but I was under the impression it was more of a Gary Usher influence. The more sentimental output from Mike and Brian was obviously more of a Brian idea (Today! album). I'm not at all disputing his outstanding lyrical contribution, but from my point of view, conceptually Mike wasn't at all the dominant force.

Did I miss something in that article? Where did he say he was the dominant force? He called Brian a great arranger and composer, and only that he was a better lyricist than Brian. Even Brian would likely agree with that.

"He was a gifted arranger and composer of music, but lyrically and conceptually, I was always the dominant creative force in that relationship."

I totally agree that Mike is one of the most talented lyricists, no arguments there. In regards to conceptual content I have to disagree.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

He also said conceptually, as well.

Edit

Rab got it

[SMiLE Brian]

Mike is just too hungry to claim credit where it is not due. He should be proud of what he did in reality and not brag about being BW's equal. Nobody is.

[Cam Mott]

You don't think Mike came up with concept of the lyrics he wrote?

I'm saying others came up with the concepts of surfing, the love songs. He wrote brilliant lyrics for the concepts. At a certain level I'm sure he was very conceptually involved, but dominant creative force in that arena? I doubt it.

What others (besides Dennis one time) came up with the lyric concepts in his collaborations with Brian?

[Douchepool]

I don't think Michael has ever argued that he is Brian's equal. Brian's biggest fan is Michael.

[drbeachboy]

Just odd that he thinks conceptually he was the dominant force in that relationship, considering that Dennis came up with the surfing idea, not sure who thought of the car idea - but I was under the impression it was more of a Gary Usher influence. The more sentimental output from Mike and Brian was obviously more of a Brian idea (Today! album). I'm not at all disputing his outstanding lyrical contribution, but from my point of view, conceptually Mike wasn't at all the dominant force.

Did I miss something in that article? Where did he say he was the dominant force? He called Brian a great arranger and composer, and only that he was a better lyricist than Brian. Even Brian would likely agree with that.

"He was a gifted arranger and composer of music, but lyrically and conceptually, I was always the dominant creative force in that relationship."

I totally agree that Mike is one of the most talented lyricists, no arguments there. In regards to conceptual content I have to disagree.

Brian always says that he composes first, lyrics later. If Mike has full control over the lyric, then he has conceptual control. He is deciding what the song will be about. I think that is all he means.

[rab2591]

You don't think Mike came up with concept of the lyrics he wrote?

I'm saying others came up with the concepts of surfing, the love songs. He wrote brilliant lyrics for the concepts. At a certain level I'm sure he was very conceptually involved, but dominant creative force in that arena? I doubt it.

What others (besides Dennis one time) came up with the lyric concepts in his collaborations with Brian?

Brian himself, for one.

[Larry Franz]

Find someone with which to collaborate, someone whose strengths complement your strengths. That's the thing I did with my cousin Brian. He was a gifted arranger and composer of music, but lyrically and conceptually, I was always the dominant creative force in that relationship.

Put less pretentiously:

"When we worked together, I wrote most of the lyrics". True. 

"I also had most of the ideas about subject matter". Questionable.

The other problem here is the implication that Mike had an artistic vision, which he was able to express when he "found" his cousin:

"You too can be a successful songwriter if you do what I did. If you don't have an amazingly talented cousin who wants to start a band and write songs with you, find someone like that."

It's like Steve Martin's old joke: You can be a millionaire and never pay taxes! How is that possible? First, get a million dollars. Second, ....

[Douchepool]

What's pretentious about those remarks?

[srealist]

Mike being a dominant force in his relationship with Brian seems accurate enough.

[Wirestone]

It's an incredibly outrageous statement.

Mike has nearly finished rewriting the band's history in his image. It's not enough that he gets to be the lyricist to some of Brian's most successful songs, and the band's onstage front man. He has to now believe he was the band's dominant creative force.

That will be the mission statement of the book, mark my words. It's nuts.

[srealist]

@Wirestone, spot on.

[CenturyDeprived]

It's an incredibly outrageous statement.

Mike has nearly finished rewriting the band's history in his image. It's not enough that he gets to be the lyricist to some of Brian's most successful songs, and the band's onstage front man. He has to now believe he was the band's dominant creative force.

That will be the mission statement of the book, mark my words. It's nuts.

The compliment of Brian had to be followed by a "but". But of course.
And since when should the term "always" be used like it was in that article? Often at best.