Have Bruces vocals stood the test of time better than the others?

[startBBtoday]

I'm curious if anyone else feels this way, but I've never thought that Bruce was the best fit for the Beach Boys. I realize how odd this sounds 47 years after he joined the band... but whenever he has a lead, or whenever he adds a song to an album I think of it as a Bruce Johnston song, not a Beach Boys song written by Bruce.

[Amanda Hart]

I'm curious if anyone else feels this way, but I've never thought that Bruce was the best fit for the Beach Boys. I realize how odd this sounds 47 years after he joined the band... but whenever he has a lead, or whenever he adds a song to an album I think of it as a Bruce Johnston song, not a Beach Boys song written by Bruce.

I know exactly what you mean. Bruce has a very distinct style in his writing and lead singing. The song that he wrote that's closest to classic Beach Boys (or really BW, I guess) style is the one that everyone seems to like the most, Disney Girls. He can blend in with the harmony really well, and that's probably his biggest asset as a Beach Boy. I don't know if it's so much that Bruce wasn't a good fit for The Beach Boys, though, or if The Beach Boys weren't the best fit for Bruce. I wonder if his talent would have been better served outside of the Beach Boys. He obviously wrote a huge hit after he left in the '70s, and had some success producing, so I think he could have carved out a nice place for himself outside of the band if he wanted to.

[startBBtoday]

I'm curious if anyone else feels this way, but I've never thought that Bruce was the best fit for the Beach Boys. I realize how odd this sounds 47 years after he joined the band... but whenever he has a lead, or whenever he adds a song to an album I think of it as a Bruce Johnston song, not a Beach Boys song written by Bruce.

I know exactly what you mean. Bruce has a very distinct style in his writing and lead singing. The song that he wrote that's closest to classic Beach Boys (or really BW, I guess) style is the one that everyone seems to like the most, Disney Girls. He can blend in with the harmony really well, and that's probably his biggest asset as a Beach Boy. I don't know if it's so much that Bruce wasn't a good fit for The Beach Boys, though, or if The Beach Boys weren't the best fit for Bruce. I wonder if his talent would have been better served outside of the Beach Boys. He obviously wrote a huge hit after he left in the '70s, and had some success producing, so I think he could have carved out a nice place for himself outside of the band if he wanted to.

Well put about that the Beach Boys might not have been the best fit for Bruce.

The Beach Boys are a lot of things, and at time very corny, but they were never as sappy as Bruce could be. There are some Bruce parts that I really like, God Only Knows in particular, but even during that song when I hear him distinctly, there's something in the back of my mind that thinks, hmm, that doesn't sound like a Beach Boy.

[Autotune]

I'm curious if anyone else feels this way, but I've never thought that Bruce was the best fit for the Beach Boys. I realize how odd this sounds 47 years after he joined the band... but whenever he has a lead, or whenever he adds a song to an album I think of it as a Bruce Johnston song, not a Beach Boys song written by Bruce.

That's exactly how I feel about Blondie and Ricky.

[Banana]

I've had a love and hate relationship with Bruce over the years.  He's sometimes just so sappy and syrupy that I want to reach into the speaker and strangle him.  Listening to his songs...I've always kind of felt like he was a solo performer being backed by the Beach Boys rather than an integrated member of the group.  He has, at times in their history, come across as a lone wolf type.  Strange considering that he's been an active member of the group for nearly as long as anyone else.

[Lowbacca]

I'm curious if anyone else feels this way, but I've never thought that Bruce was the best fit for the Beach Boys. I realize how odd this sounds 47 years after he joined the band... but whenever he has a lead, or whenever he adds a song to an album I think of it as a Bruce Johnston song, not a Beach Boys song written by Bruce.

That's exactly how I feel about Blondie and Ricky.

You could say the same thing about Dennis and his (compositional) contributions to BBs LPs - if you wanted to make that point. Or Al, for that matter.
Musically it boils down to the bipolarity and merging between Brian's and Mike's styles that formed their signature sound (for which both are almost equally responsible). All the other guys' influences were secondary, be it Denny/Carl/Al, later Bruce, or Blondie/Ricky or whoever.

[JanBerryFarm]

I honestly can't think of one Bruce contribution (including his vocal insert on Calf.Girls) that I couldn't do without.

He played bass like a spastic.

There, now that I have the negative stuff out of the way, let me say that I totally admire and groove behind his work with 'Bruce and Terry' and 'The Rip Chords'.

And there's other stuff I agree with him on too.

He's too much like Regis Philbin (not that that's a bad thing) for the Beach Boys. Unfortunately, he's a done deal. A product of the desperation of the mid-6o's Beach Boys. I blame Brian for all this. 

[startBBtoday]

I'm curious if anyone else feels this way, but I've never thought that Bruce was the best fit for the Beach Boys. I realize how odd this sounds 47 years after he joined the band... but whenever he has a lead, or whenever he adds a song to an album I think of it as a Bruce Johnston song, not a Beach Boys song written by Bruce.

That's exactly how I feel about Blondie and Ricky.

You could say the same thing about Dennis and his (compositional) contributions to BBs LPs - if you wanted to make that point. Or Al, for that matter.
Musically it boils down to the bipolarity and merging between Brian's and Mike's styles that formed their signature sound (for which both are almost equally responsible). All the other guys' influences were secondary, be it Denny/Carl/Al, later Bruce, or Blondie/Ricky or whoever.

I can certainly see Blondie and Ricky, they were just around so much less time. It may also have to do with the fact that most songs that Bruce sings are songs that Bruce also wrote. If songs like Hold On Dear Brother were scattered over 40+ years of recordings, it would be just as glaring for me. Sail On Sailor, despite being a Blondie vocal, is a BW composition and sounds like one.

Also, I like country-influenced rock a whole lot more than sappy pop songs.

As for Dennis and Al, I just don't agree that those don't sound like Beach Boys songs. Maybe it's because the majority of my Beach Boys listening has been pre 1967, but since those voices have been prominent and blended from the earliest days when they have leads or compositions on records, it doesn't stand out to me. It's also just that they have that certain Wilson/Jardine accent.

I also think that Dennis always seemed to be influenced by Brian a lot more than Bruce was.

[filledeplage]

I'm curious if anyone else feels this way, but I've never thought that Bruce was the best fit for the Beach Boys. I realize how odd this sounds 47 years after he joined the band... but whenever he has a lead, or whenever he adds a song to an album I think of it as a Bruce Johnston song, not a Beach Boys song written by Bruce.

I know exactly what you mean. Bruce has a very distinct style in his writing and lead singing. The song that he wrote that's closest to classic Beach Boys (or really BW, I guess) style is the one that everyone seems to like the most, Disney Girls. He can blend in with the harmony really well, and that's probably his biggest asset as a Beach Boy. I don't know if it's so much that Bruce wasn't a good fit for The Beach Boys, though, or if The Beach Boys weren't the best fit for Bruce. I wonder if his talent would have been better served outside of the Beach Boys. He obviously wrote a huge hit after he left in the '70s, and had some success producing, so I think he could have carved out a nice place for himself outside of the band if he wanted to.

Well put about that the Beach Boys might not have been the best fit for Bruce.

The Beach Boys are a lot of things, and at time very corny, but they were never as sappy as Bruce could be. There are some Bruce parts that I really like, God Only Knows in particular, but even during that song when I hear him distinctly, there's something in the back of my mind that thinks, hmm, that doesn't sound like a Beach Boy.

Mike Love said something such as that they were larger that the "sum of the parts." A math concept, coming from someone else who was awful at Math as me (google interview) it really kind of fits what this dynamic is all about.  

Everyone brings something to that table.  And, perhaps his absence, served him as well as I think the separation of the entities was, post Carl.  Each brings that "je ne sais quoi" quality to the BB table, not unlike David Marks' concept of the "bubble" that's surrounding them when they work together.  

Often, it is a subtle, sort of sublime quality which emerges as the glue that binds people together.  And, notwithstanding a Grammy recognition, the genre and background were similar, proceeding along a cultural path which had a commonality of sorts, and the rest is history.  

My take, after seeing the bands separately, and in this reunion 7 times, is that each member, is like a limb on the BB tree, as in a family.  If you saw off a branch, there is no prosthesis to substitute.  That is clear with the losses of Dennis and Carl. But, on some level, they function ( or sometimes "dysfunction") as a family but, are nevertheless a "family", of sorts, who have learned to adapt, be tolerant of the other members, and who can accept themselves and the others in their and our adult world, respectfully.  

It is a model of tolerance and like winning the Olympics.  No one thought this was possible, and yet, there is sort of a mythical Olympic torch.


They all sound great.  They are not 20, but really, who cares?  Not me?  

[SMiLE Brian]

I'm curious if anyone else feels this way, but I've never thought that Bruce was the best fit for the Beach Boys. I realize how odd this sounds 47 years after he joined the band... but whenever he has a lead, or whenever he adds a song to an album I think of it as a Bruce Johnston song, not a Beach Boys song written by Bruce.

That's exactly how I feel about Blondie and Ricky.

I feel like that about them too.

[startBBtoday]

I'm curious if anyone else feels this way, but I've never thought that Bruce was the best fit for the Beach Boys. I realize how odd this sounds 47 years after he joined the band... but whenever he has a lead, or whenever he adds a song to an album I think of it as a Bruce Johnston song, not a Beach Boys song written by Bruce.

I know exactly what you mean. Bruce has a very distinct style in his writing and lead singing. The song that he wrote that's closest to classic Beach Boys (or really BW, I guess) style is the one that everyone seems to like the most, Disney Girls. He can blend in with the harmony really well, and that's probably his biggest asset as a Beach Boy. I don't know if it's so much that Bruce wasn't a good fit for The Beach Boys, though, or if The Beach Boys weren't the best fit for Bruce. I wonder if his talent would have been better served outside of the Beach Boys. He obviously wrote a huge hit after he left in the '70s, and had some success producing, so I think he could have carved out a nice place for himself outside of the band if he wanted to.

Well put about that the Beach Boys might not have been the best fit for Bruce.

The Beach Boys are a lot of things, and at time very corny, but they were never as sappy as Bruce could be. There are some Bruce parts that I really like, God Only Knows in particular, but even during that song when I hear him distinctly, there's something in the back of my mind that thinks, hmm, that doesn't sound like a Beach Boy.

Mike Love said something such as that they were larger that the "sum of the parts." A math concept, coming from someone else who was awful at Math as me (google interview) it really kind of fits what this dynamic is all about.  

Everyone brings something to that table.  And, perhaps his absence, served him as well as I think the separation of the entities was, post Carl.  Each brings that "je ne sais quoi" quality to the BB table, not unlike David Marks' concept of the "bubble" that's surrounding them when they work together.  

Often, it is a subtle, sort of sublime quality which emerges as the glue that binds people together.  And, notwithstanding a Grammy recognition, the genre and background were similar, proceeding along a cultural path which had a commonality of sorts, and the rest is history.  

My take, after seeing the bands separately, and in this reunion 7 times, is that each member, is like a limb on the BB tree, as in a family.  If you saw off a branch, there is no prosthesis to substitute.  That is clear with the losses of Dennis and Carl. But, on some level, they function ( or sometimes "dysfunction") as a family but, are nevertheless a "family", of sorts, who have learned to adapt, be tolerant of the other members, and who can accept themselves and the others in their and our adult world, respectfully.  

It is a model of tolerance and like winning the Olympics.  No one thought this was possible, and yet, there is sort of a mythical Olympic torch.


They all sound great.  They are not 20, but really, who cares?  Not me?  

I think that's kind of the thing though, if Bruce's branch was cut off, I don't think I'd care too much.

I don't dislike the guy by any means, I just think that when he's showcased it's more of a solo thing than a group effort. When it's Bruce, it's BRUCE.

[SIP.FLAC]

I honestly can't think of one Bruce contribution (including his vocal insert on Calf.Girls) that I couldn't do without.

He played bass like a spastic.

There, now that I have the negative stuff out of the way, let me say that I totally admire and groove behind his work with 'Bruce and Terry' and 'The Rip Chords'.

And there's other stuff I agree with him on too.

He's too much like Regis Philbin (not that that's a bad thing) for the Beach Boys. Unfortunately, he's a done deal. A product of the desperation of the mid-6o's Beach Boys. I blame Brian for all this. 

This is pretty much my opinion of Bruce. Just don't enjoy the guys voice all that much. Surfer Pajama Party though.

[JanBerryFarm]

I honestly can't think of one Bruce contribution (including his vocal insert on Calf.Girls) that I couldn't do without.
He played bass like a spastic.
There, now that I have the negative stuff out of the way, let me say that I totally admire and groove behind his work with 'Bruce and Terry' and 'The Rip Chords'.
And there's other stuff I agree with him on too.
He's too much like Regis Philbin (not that that's a bad thing) for the Beach Boys. Unfortunately, he's a done deal. A product of the desperation of the mid-6o's Beach Boys. I blame Brian for all this. 

This is pretty much my opinion of Bruce. Just don't enjoy the guys voice all that much. Surfer Pajama Party though.

I have observed that Bruce enjoys himself an awful lot. Perhaps too much. A guy should be up beat, but he's so up beat I want to beat him up. (naw...just kidding..can't resist a pun)

But seriously, he's over there to the far right, and it's almost like 'The Bruce show' ...he's trained-seal clapping, adjusting his mic, not singing much, darting about trying to generate enthusiasm in the midst of enthusiasm.
And he always has this 'knowing' grin on his face, as though he's in on some secret info or a hidden joke.

All that's fine I guess, but ya know what? I'm SOOOO glad Dave Marks doesn't behave like that.



 

[Juice Brohnston]

Bruce has been good for the band....and the band good for Bruce!

[SIP.FLAC]

I honestly can't think of one Bruce contribution (including his vocal insert on Calf.Girls) that I couldn't do without.
He played bass like a spastic.
There, now that I have the negative stuff out of the way, let me say that I totally admire and groove behind his work with 'Bruce and Terry' and 'The Rip Chords'.
And there's other stuff I agree with him on too.
He's too much like Regis Philbin (not that that's a bad thing) for the Beach Boys. Unfortunately, he's a done deal. A product of the desperation of the mid-6o's Beach Boys. I blame Brian for all this. 

This is pretty much my opinion of Bruce. Just don't enjoy the guys voice all that much. Surfer Pajama Party though.

I have observed that Bruce enjoys himself an awful lot. Perhaps too much. A guy should be up beat, but he's so up beat I want to beat him up. (naw...just kidding..can't resist a pun)

But seriously, he's over there to the far right, and it's almost like 'The Bruce show' ...he's trained-seal clapping, adjusting his mic, not singing much, darting about trying to generate enthusiasm in the midst of enthusiasm.
And he always has this 'knowing' grin on his face, as though he's in on some secret info or a hidden joke.

All that's fine I guess, but ya know what? I'm SOOOO glad Dave Marks doesn't behave like that.



 

I like that he does a ridiculous fake laugh at everything Mike says. Also Bruce kind of looks like a young guy in old guy make up (is this the real Bruce?)

[SIP.FLAC]

I think it would be really cool if we could put Bruce on stage and have a holographic Beach Boys play with him. But only he would see it and everyone in the crowd just sees Bruce clapping and laughing.

[Aegir]

Nearly every band Bruce was in before the Beach Boys was a Beach Boys ripoff band. He wrote tons of Beach Boys knockoffs. It confounds me why he didn't use that skill he had of aping Brian's style when he wrote songs for the Beach Boys.

[Lowbacca]

Nearly every band Bruce was in before the Beach Boys was a Beach Boys ripoff band. He wrote tons of Beach Boys knockoffs. It confounds me why he didn't use that skill he had of aping Brian's style when he wrote songs for the Beach Boys.

Maybe an attempt to validate his position in the BBs by showing how he might be able to widen their musical range? I doubt he would have impressed Brian or Mike much by emulating what they had done for a number of years. And of course, to stand on his own musical feet, keeping an identity. Thus, instead of writing the next "Catch A Wave" or "Hawaii", he wrote stuff like "Deirdre" (!), "Disney Girls (1957)", and so forth.

I listened to his 1963 solo LP "Surfin' 'Round The World" the other day, and I must say I wasn't much impressed. 70% instrumentals, and the few full-fledged tunes with vocals are mosty forgettable. Not in the same league as Mike and Brian's 1963 output.

[startBBtoday]

Nearly every band Bruce was in before the Beach Boys was a Beach Boys ripoff band. He wrote tons of Beach Boys knockoffs. It confounds me why he didn't use that skill he had of aping Brian's style when he wrote songs for the Beach Boys.

Maybe an attempt to validate his position in the BBs by showing how he might be able to widen their musical range? I doubt he would have impressed Brian or Mike much by emulating what they had done for a number of years. And of course, to stand on his own musical feet, keeping an identity. Thus, instead of writing the next "Catch A Wave" or "Hawaii", he wrote stuff like "Deirdre" (!), "Disney Girls (1957)", and so forth.

I listened to his 1963 solo LP "Surfin' 'Round The World" the other day, and I must say I wasn't much impressed. 70% instrumentals, and the few full-fledged tunes with vocals are mosty forgettable. Not in the same league as Mike and Brian's 1963 output.

That and by the time he was contributing as a song writer, the band was well passed that style of music. He proved that he could write surf, car and summer knockoffs, not the stuff they were doing in the late 60s and 70s.

[AndrewHickey]

I think there's a couple of reasons people might be thinking this way:
Firstly, I think Bruce is the only songwriter in the band who didn't write songs for multiple voices very often, or give other band members leads (the chorus of She Believes In Love Again and the last verse of Endless Harmony are the only examples I can think of of Bruce writing a lead vocal for another band member). And then none of the other band members wrote lead vocal parts for Bruce to sing -- his only lead lines in a song written by someone else are, I think, his parts in Lonely Days and Add Some Music and his vocal on At My Window.

So you can hear a Carl vocal on a Dennis song, or a Dennis vocal on a song by Mike and Brian, or whatever, and the whole band are playing a part -- so then when you hear Carl sing a Carl song or Dennis sing a Dennis song, it still sounds like the same band, even if none of the others are on there. But then you hear Bruce singing a Bruce song, and never hear him singing anyone else's songs and never hear anyone else singing his songs.

The other thing, I think, is that precisely because we have these semi-detached Bruce contributions, the contributions where he is more collaborative get overlooked, and he blends into the background *too* well. No-one thinks of Somewhere Near Japan as 'a Bruce song' even though he's one of the writers. And no-one thinks of his keyboard playing as an important part of the band's late-70s/early-80s live sound, even though a quick comparison between the version of You Are So Beautiful on the 76 TV special and the version at Knebworth shows an immense difference in the keyboard parts.

Bruce seems to either be *totally* in the background or *totally* in the foreground, and rarely taking an equal share of the limelight, but I don't think that's wholly Bruce's fault... I certainly think he's been very valuable to the band over the years.

[Autotune]

Do not overlook Bruce's musical skills.

Great keyboard player. Great harmony singer. Great arranger. Learns quickly. Has a very critical, on-the-spot ear for other people's music. He's good consultant for Brian or the other guys when it comes to studio work. He was given major vocal parts as soon as he got into the group. Supported the BBs in many ways... Becoming more active as Brian withdrew, battling on the road (gee look at the Olympia show from the late 60s, he performs is ass off), promoting Pet Sounds in England, being supportive of the guys, being -by far mostly- very nice to the fans through the years, producing L.A. when he was asked. He's kept both an involved and detached outlook for the band.

I want him on board. And some of the bitter, smart-ass remarks about him in this thread piss me off.

[JanBerryFarm]

Do not overlook Bruce's musical skills.

Great keyboard player. Great harmony singer. Great arranger. Learns quickly. Has a very critical, on-the-spot ear for other people's music. He's good consultant for Brian or the other guys when it comes to studio work. He was given major vocal parts as soon as he got into the group. Supported the BBs in many ways... Becoming more active as Brian withdrew, battling on the road (gee look at the Olympia show from the late 60s, he performs is ass off), promoting Pet Sounds in England, being supportive of the guys, being -by far mostly- very nice to the fans through the years, producing L.A. when he was asked. He's kept both an involved and detached outlook for the band.

I want him on board. And some of the bitter, smart-ass remarks about him in this thread piss me off.

*raises hand* I'm a smart-ass, but I'm not bitter. 

[Banana]

I'll say this...when he did Disney Girls during the reunion show I caught I sang every line...while quite a few people around me left to get another beer!  Darn fine song...always been a favorite of mine.  I love the line: "Oh reality, it's not for me...and it makes me laugh..."  People can say what they want about him...but that song is a classic in my mind.    

[lance]

Bruce is great. Blondie and Ricky are great. They are all great. I do agree that his songs stick out a bit, as do Blondie and Ricky. But I am glad we have them.

And Surfin' Round the World seriously ROCKS. 

[hypehat]

He played bass like a spastic.

Lovely. You hateful old bastard.