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Author Topic: Surfs Up Coda - Brian's Involvement  (Read 3245 times)
adam78
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« on: December 30, 2011, 05:33:30 AM »

I was wondering if anyone could please fill in the gaps of my knowledge regarding the 71 recording of this part of surfs up. I've been doing a bit of searching and only really found what I've already heard. That being that Brian got involved only for this part of the song and completely orchestrated it from start to finish.

Is there anymore info than this? Are there accounts of actually how and when he got involved? I'm sure i read somewhere once that he came out from his bedroom suddenly after hearing them working on it? I love that thought that he wanted to complete an unfinished intention for smile music. Of course, as wiki says, it's unknown whether or not it was a valid 66/67 idea. Is that definitely the case?

Anyway, any help or info on this would be greatly appreciated.
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« Reply #1 on: December 30, 2011, 05:36:15 AM »

I think Desper's book goes into detail about this subject. All i know is the band did the rest of the song, Brian burst into the studio and directed the making of the coda
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« Reply #2 on: December 30, 2011, 05:47:22 AM »

Yeah, I'd wait for Desper or AGD to show up - but what I understand is that they were working on it unsuccessfully until Brian came in and told them what to do. There is also some doubt about whether the coda lyrics are written by VDP, though - I might be mistaken, but I believe they are in Jack Reilly's handwriting on the lyric sheet, according to those in the know.
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« Reply #3 on: December 30, 2011, 07:12:36 AM »

I asked Steve Desper about the recording in 1987 (later published in BBA) and he stated that the band was working on the song with Brian steadfastly refusing to help out. One evening the studio door flew open and Brian was standing there in his bathrobe and began to instruct the guys on how the coda should go. I am going from memory, but will consult my original notes later today.

EDIT: The above recollections are confirmed in my 1987 notes.
« Last Edit: December 30, 2011, 05:05:39 PM by Mooger Fooger » Logged
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« Reply #4 on: December 30, 2011, 07:25:24 AM »

Commence debate on if that's Brian or Al singing..... Razz
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« Reply #5 on: December 30, 2011, 10:14:59 AM »

Commence debate on if that's Brian or Al singing..... Razz

I think it has already been established it's Al right?
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« Reply #6 on: December 30, 2011, 10:27:20 AM »

Interesting that it seems like the exact same story they have for Cool, Cool Water. This is the first time that I have actually heard it in terms of Surf's Up.
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« Reply #7 on: December 30, 2011, 12:28:53 PM »

Interesting that it seems like the exact same story they have for Cool, Cool Water. This is the first time that I have actually heard it in terms of Surf's Up.


And I never heard anything about that and Cool, Cool Water.  Shocked


I think Brian's piano playing on the '66 Surf's up sounds very much like he wanted to put Child Is... there

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« Reply #8 on: December 30, 2011, 02:26:09 PM »

Commence debate on if that's Brian or Al singing..... Razz

I think it has already been established it's Al right?

Yes.
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« Reply #9 on: December 30, 2011, 05:06:55 PM »

Well, if it wasn't Al, it's someone doing an insane impression of him - I always thought it was.
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« Reply #10 on: December 30, 2011, 05:18:52 PM »

Vocal isolation confirms that it's Al.
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« Reply #11 on: December 30, 2011, 10:49:48 PM »

Interesting that it seems like the exact same story they have for Cool, Cool Water. This is the first time that I have actually heard it in terms of Surf's Up.


And I never heard anything about that and Cool, Cool Water.  Shocked


I think Brian's piano playing on the '66 Surf's up sounds very much like he wanted to put Child Is... there



i would assume that coda was always supposed to be there.  It sounds right, and that part was recorded in 67
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adam78
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« Reply #12 on: December 31, 2011, 12:46:42 AM »

Thank you very much for the info guys. And I'd defintely not heard the same went for cool cool water!

So how did he affect that one then? The running order and splicing water chant into the middle etc? Do people think that was a smile intention he was playing out also?
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« Reply #13 on: January 01, 2012, 04:06:42 PM »

Thank you very much for the info guys. And I'd defintely not heard the same went for cool cool water!

So how did he affect that one then? The running order and splicing water chant into the middle etc? Do people think that was a smile intention he was playing out also?

I'm actually pretty sure he said something like "it fits alright, but there is something not quite right about it", referring to the "water chant" section in "Cool Cool Water".

However, when asked lately about the song like on the podcasts for The Warmth of the Sun compilation, he said it was one of his very favorites, if I recall correctly.

As far as why "Cool Cool Water" was on Sunflower I think it was Larry Waronker who heard Brian playing the song on his piano in 1970 or so, and asked them to put the song on the album so they did.

And then, "Surf's Up", apparently Jack Rieley asked Brian to put the song on the album which became Surf's Up, and he promised him he would, even going as far as to help Carl and Jack at some points. He also apparently tried to lead vocal for the first section, but decided it was better for Carl to do it. And then yes, the story about the coda, as already has been related. Van Dyke Parks also takes credit for saying something like "title the album Surf's Up and put the song on there and the album will move (however many) units".
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« Reply #14 on: January 01, 2012, 09:06:02 PM »

Since I was practically living in Brian's house and certainly at the studio most of the time, what is it that you wish to know?
~ Stephen W. Desper
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« Reply #15 on: January 01, 2012, 09:26:25 PM »

Somebody on here not to long ago posted that there was a Surf's Up coda recorded in 1967 that sounded very similar to what was recorded and releaed in 1971. Is this true? If it is, then why wasn't it included on the Smile box?
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« Reply #16 on: January 01, 2012, 09:37:45 PM »

Thank you very much for the info guys. And I'd defintely not heard the same went for cool cool water!

So how did he affect that one then? The running order and splicing water chant into the middle etc? Do people think that was a smile intention he was playing out also?

The water chant was recorded during the Wild Honey sessions, specifically for Cool Cool Water, so I would say not.
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« Reply #17 on: January 01, 2012, 10:30:44 PM »

Since I was practically living in Brian's house and certainly at the studio most of the time, what is it that you wish to know?
~ Stephen W. Desper

Wow. Nice to see you in this thread Mr. Depser. Your work on Sunflower and Surf's Up is magnificent. Anyways, my questions for you would be Brian's level of involvement on "Surf's Up" and "Cool, Cool Water".
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Stephen W. Desper
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« Reply #18 on: January 01, 2012, 10:36:05 PM »

Thank you very much for the info guys. And I'd defintely not heard the same went for cool cool water!

So how did he affect that one then? The running order and splicing water chant into the middle etc? Do people think that was a smile intention he was playing out also?

The water chant was recorded during the Wild Honey sessions, specifically for Cool Cool Water, so I would say not.

COMMENT:  NO it was not. The chant is or was part of the original Smile sessions recorded at Columbia Studios by Brian. He was not involved in the CCW released on "Sunflower." Carl used the chant to tie the first and last sections together. It was his creative decision. The original chant was not a chant. It was a song about a baby with the title, "I love to say Dada." It was never finished or released. ~swd


PS  WILL SOMEONE FIX THIS DAMN SOFTWARE!!!
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sweetdudejim
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« Reply #19 on: January 01, 2012, 11:16:43 PM »

Thank you very much for the info guys. And I'd defintely not heard the same went for cool cool water!

So how did he affect that one then? The running order and splicing water chant into the middle etc? Do people think that was a smile intention he was playing out also?

The water chant was recorded during the Wild Honey sessions, specifically for Cool Cool Water, so I would say not.

COMMENT:  NO it was not. The chant is or was part of the original Smile sessions recorded at Columbia Studios by Brian. He was not involved in the CCW released on "Sunflower." Carl used the chant to tie the first and last sections together. It was his creative decision. The original chant was not a chant. It was a song about a baby with the title, "I love to say Dada." It was never finished or released. ~swd


PS  WILL SOMEONE FIX THIS DAMN SOFTWARE!!!

You say Brian wasn't involved in Sunflower version of "Cool, Cool Water",  but wasn't the second half of the song recorded in 1970? You know, the parts with Brian and Mike both taking the lead? Or was this from 1967 also?
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« Reply #20 on: January 02, 2012, 12:33:15 AM »

Wasn't it recently confirmed that the "water chant" was recorded after Smile? I thought I read something about that around the time of the box sets release.
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« Reply #21 on: January 02, 2012, 01:11:35 AM »

Wasn't it recently confirmed that the "water chant" was recorded after Smile? I thought I read something about that around the time of the box sets release.

That's indeed the case, in the book that came with the 5-cd Smile Sessions it is said that the Cool Cool Water Chant (as it is called) was recorded in October '67.
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« Reply #22 on: January 02, 2012, 05:29:17 AM »

Since I was practically living in Brian's house and certainly at the studio most of the time, what is it that you wish to know?
~ Stephen W. Desper

Wow this is awsome! Sunflower is the best album I've ever heard Mr. Desper. "All I Wanna Do" has the coolest sound.
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« Reply #23 on: January 02, 2012, 05:41:50 AM »

Since I was practically living in Brian's house and certainly at the studio most of the time, what is it that you wish to know?
~ Stephen W. Desper

Wow this is awsome! Sunflower is the best album I've ever heard Mr. Desper. "All I Wanna Do" has the coolest sound.

Over & over, go check out his thread in the Honoured Guests section if you haven't already - A treasure trove.


Stephen, I'd second the call to get a different web browser - They are generally quite good at keeping all your old bookmarks, addresses, passwords, and stuff when you switch over, so don't worry about that. I'm on Google Chrome and suffer no difficulty with the board, but Internet Explorer is notoriously clunky with most facets of the internet. We'd hate to see you leave for a technical issue easily remedied.  Smiley

I have another BB's question, which seems quite simple but the post up there intrigued me - What would happen in a typical day during your tenure in the studio? Did the guys just turn up most days and see what was going on? What usually happened when the group was on tour? Was there even such a thing as a typical day?

Oh, and is Recording The Beach Boys going to get reprinted? I can't find a copy anywhere.
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Syncopate it? In front of all these people?!
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« Reply #24 on: January 02, 2012, 08:49:05 AM »

COMMENT:  NO it was not. The chant is or was part of the original Smile sessions recorded at Columbia Studios by Brian. He was not involved in the CCW released on "Sunflower." Carl used the chant to tie the first and last sections together. It was his creative decision. The original chant was not a chant. It was a song about a baby with the title, "I love to say Dada." It was never finished or released. ~swd

Wow. This is a pretty big break through here.

If the chant was originally not "a chant" then was it just the backing vocals with no "water" vocals?

EDIT: After listening, I don't even know why we called it "The Water Chant" for all those years, it doesn't really even say water, it has a syncopated (wah-do) kind of sound.

I can see how that would be a "baby-ish" sound.

Also, was ILTSD a new attempt at "CIFOTM"? that would actually make sense since he even says "Now that sounds like a baby, that's our baby!" in the CIFOTM sessions.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2012, 08:53:00 AM by FatherOfTheMan » Logged

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