New Beach Boys release will make you 'SMiLE'

[buddhahat]

I'm not totally against using BWPS as a template (if there is a playable album part of the release, if it happens of course, if, if, if) in some way but I think the best option would be to use the handwritten tracklist and 'see label' disclaimer. This would maintain the 66/67 sessions own identity seprate fro the BW solo release, and also get around the presrnting-a-finished-album hurdle.

[Pretty Funky]

My gameplan would be a two-part release:

A single disc of the 'best' bits for the general public...

A 3/4/more disc box set of the sessions for the likes of us.

As for a title, well, The Smile Sessions 1966-67 has a certain ring to it, wouldn't you say ?  As for 'undermining BWPS, so what ? Brian isn't fussed or he'd never have agreed to the original material seeing the light of day. BWPS is done, it was done 20 years ago today, almost to the hour. It's long dropped off Brian's radar.

Brians rader for sure but what about the BWPS label Nonesuch. Surely they would be displeased if Brian, via the Beach Boys ok'd another version?
I just think any Capitol release in the same order as BWPS would be a nod to Nonesuch that 'Yeah, you got the SMiLE album but we want to highlight where it came from.'

[Andrew G. Doe]

My gameplan would be a two-part release:

A single disc of the 'best' bits for the general public...

A 3/4/more disc box set of the sessions for the likes of us.

As for a title, well, The Smile Sessions 1966-67 has a certain ring to it, wouldn't you say ?  As for 'undermining BWPS, so what ? Brian isn't fussed or he'd never have agreed to the original material seeing the light of day. BWPS is done, it was done 20 years ago today, almost to the hour. It's long dropped off Brian's radar.

Brians rader for sure but what about the BWPS label Nonesuch. Surely they would be displeased if Brian, via the Beach Boys ok'd another version?

Were Capitol displeased when Brian did Pet Sounds Live ?  I cannot understand this bizarre reverence for BWPS - yes, a great piece of music, but all it was at base was the best live rendition of the fragments, as Darian was at pains to point out. The entire 3rd section was a 2003 construct.

[Pretty Funky]

I added another line while you replied to me AGD. Your point about a disc for the public is going to need a track listing of some kind. 'The public' are going to get confused. All I'm saying is using the BWPS listing is an option that could acknowlege the only 'official' release of SMiLE.

We nuts can enjoy the other 3-4 disc's anyway we want.

[Pretty Funky]

Like you I remember when PS Live was released and the tours. The press at the time was very positive and talked up the 1966 release and I would assume sales went up because of it compared say, to the previous year.

Money for jam for Capitol IMO.

[Les P]

BWPS is done, it was done 20 years ago today, almost to the hour. It's long dropped off Brian's radar.

Wow.  Time flies...it only feels like seven.  

[Pretty Funky]

I think the subject got him riled.

So he has a good topic to bite into when he wakes up tomorrow, how about this?

BWPS template.
Al (he bought it up) and the boys record new links and the entire 3rd section.
Original Good Vibrations with Mikes lyrics to close!

If it sounds crazy, have a read about the Rolling Stones Exile On Main Street re-release.

There,that should get him choking on his Twinings English Breakfast.

Peace on earth and tongue in cheek!

[rab2591]

I added another line while you replied to me AGD. Your point about a disc for the public is going to need a track listing of some kind. 'The public' are going to get confused. All I'm saying is using the BWPS listing is an option that could acknowlege the only 'official' release of SMiLE.

We nuts can enjoy the other 3-4 disc's anyway we want.

I see your point, but I don't think it's that big of a deal.

To add to the confusion: I think it is important to remember that the tracks will have different names as apposed to BWPS - Do You Dig Worms?, Holidays, Love To Say Da Da, Look!, Mrs O Leary's Fire, - and there is no way that the people putting this set together are going to deviate from the 66/67 names. My point is that no matter what, this album will be pure confusion to your average joe (hell, it is confusing to us and most of us probably own nearly every book on the subject!). They should just read the liner notes to clear up some of the confusion.

In my humble opinion, many people who see this album in Barnes and Noble will have no recollection of Brian's SMiLE album and they will most likely think that 'SMiLE' is just another surfing "hits" compilation. Little will they know they will be listening to a teenage symphony to God when they play it!

[Pretty Funky]

I still need to be convinced that a label like Capitol is interested in promoting what was in effect a unfinished project to a small group. Us!
What will be the hook that may mean the project turns a profit? What will shift 100 thousand units compared to 1000?

[Les P]

In my humble opinion, many people who see this album in Barnes and Noble will have no recollection of Brian's SMiLE album and they will most likely think that 'SMiLE' is just another surfing "hits" compilation. Little will they know they will be listening to a teenage symphony to God when they play it!

Probably true!  Another reason to release this soon, before ALL of us who know what it is are dead!

[Pretty Funky]

...and Barnes and Noble!

[rab2591]

 

[Les P]

I'm not totally against using BWPS as a template (if there is a playable album part of the release, if it happens of course, if, if, if) in some way but I think the best option would be to use the handwritten tracklist and 'see label' disclaimer. This would maintain the 66/67 sessions own identity seprate fro the BW solo release, and also get around the presrnting-a-finished-album hurdle.

I know I'm in the minority here, and that it will never happen… But IN ADDITION TO a box set that contains original vintage tracks, I would welcome a disk based on the 1966 list, without links, using released versions plus song assemblies as indicated on GVBS, BWPS, and “unofficial” recordings, with new lead vocals added where obviously missing.  Based on what we know is available (assuming anyone had ever heard “unofficial” recordings), that really only leaves vocals possibly needed on:

DYLW - 4 verse lines

IIGS - depends on what you use, but say IIGS/Barnyard and all you have to add is 8 lines.  

CIFOFM - would probably have to record BWPS lyrics for  the verse - 2 lines.  Although, if a 1966 lead sheet with original verse lyrics and melody turned up, wouldn’t we rather hear a real (albeit aging) Beach Boy sing it in 2011 than forever gaze longingly at a page in a CD booklet?

The Elements – as usual, the major mystery.  This would probably be cobbled together from instrumentals or chants like MOLC, Water chant, Fall Breaks, etc and wouldn’t require lyrical or vocal additions.

It wouldn't have to be presented as the "completed" Beach Boys Smile, they could add a disclaimer that it never was truly finished.  The casual listener won’t know or care that they aren’t hearing vintage vocals on 3 songs, and will get a more “finished” sounding product.  The purists like us will have the original untampered tracks in a box set.  

Again, this will never happen (partly because it might re-open the whole argument about the lyrics…).  But when making this list I am again surprised how close to complete this album could have been at the time of the planned 1972 Brother/Reprise release.

[Les P]

...and Barnes and Noble!

And CDs!

[Andrew G. Doe]

BWPS is done, it was done 20 years ago today, almost to the hour. It's long dropped off Brian's radar.

Wow.  Time flies...it only feels like seven.  

Seven is the new 20. 

[Jay]

Having failed to muster up enough patience to read this entire thread post by post, I hope I don't get chewed out if this was already brought up. I wonder if SMiLE will be released as a "cohesive album"? Yes, I know that many pieces were never finished or even recorded, but I'm just curios if The Beach Boys and/or whoever owns SMiLE(Capitol?) will try to follow the structure of BWPS, or if it'll just be a cd or two of various pieces.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Having failed to muster up enough patience to read this entire thread post by post, I hope I don't get chewed out if this was already brought up. I wonder if SMiLE will be released as a "cohesive album"? Yes, I know that many pieces were never finished or even recorded, but I'm just curios if The Beach Boys and/or whoever owns SMiLE(Capitol?) will try to follow the structure of BWPS, or if it'll just be a cd or two of various pieces.

Excellent question, and personally, I have no idea... but I think to use BWPS as a template would be a most unwise notion, given that at the very least 33% of it - and possibly much more - has no validity pre-2003.

[The Shift]

Having failed to muster up enough patience to read this entire thread post by post, I hope I don't get chewed out if this was already brought up. I wonder if SMiLE will be released as a "cohesive album"? Yes, I know that many pieces were never finished or even recorded, but I'm just curios if The Beach Boys and/or whoever owns SMiLE(Capitol?) will try to follow the structure of BWPS, or if it'll just be a cd or two of various pieces.

Excellent question, and personally, I have no idea... but I think to use BWPS as a template would be a most unwise notion, given that at the very least 33% of it - and possibly much more - has no validity pre-2003.

I don't think BWPS can be used as a template. It's another beast entirely and shouldn't even be borne in mind -  I think from the point of view of a 2011 release of 66/67 tapes, they should start from the point of view that BWPS 2004 never happened (except within liner notes).

 I'd like a CD of as many SMiLE songs can be presented in finished or gosh-darn-near-finished form, presented in either chronological or alphabetical order, then another 40 CDs of sessions, and another ten of mixes/trial mixes.
Plus a few DVD's and CDs of contemporary live gigs and appearances, humour and chanting tapes, smog rants, parties, and conversations with cab drivers. And Inside Pop. And Jasper Daley tapes.

That's all.  It's not much.

[guitarfool2002]

Two things that cannot happen in my opinion:

Do not sweeten, fix, enhance, or add to any original tapes. Notice I did not say mix, as that is perhaps a necessity that would cause some controversy and set any official project apart from the raw SOT tapes. I just have visions of Bruce and Al adding vocals...I shudder to think.

The best case against trying to assemble the Smile pieces in any cohesive way beyond presenting them as fragments like they did in 1993 would be the Good Vibrations example.

Pretend the final #1 hit single mix had never been released: If you were to take all of the available sessions, fragments, early and test mixdowns, etc of the song Good Vibrations, and attempt to create a cohesive 3+ minute song from those pieces, does anyone think it would come close to the final version Brian eventually approved and released in 1966? The big issue there is...we still do not have the vocal sessions available to work with! So no matter how close we could get after patching the instrumental pieces together, we'd have no group vocals or final lyrics to work with. It could not be done. The Smile comparison is valid at that point.  

[Bicyclerider]

Instead of BWPS as the "template" I'd use Carl's announced list of tracks in 1972-73 as the model for the more accessible "single" disc version. 

[guitarfool2002]

Instead of BWPS as the "template" I'd use Carl's announced list of tracks in 1972-73 as the model for the more accessible "single" disc version. 

Do we want accessible or historic? Even a list from Carl in 1972 is tainted by the fact that a good chunk of Smile from 66-67 had already been released, re-recorded, re-configured, and re-used since Smiley Smile in summer '67, and something like "Child Is Father..." was by then known as the tag to Surf's Up rather than part of a greater whole. And some of those re-uses which had happened by the time Carl had that list were far from where they were originally imagined.

We won't even bring up "Wonder-Bill" aarrgghh...

It's like navigating through a minefield when handling those tapes! Not that I've ever done either of those things.

[drbeachboy]

I think we're going to get whatever Brian is happy with releasing. If he wants it sweetened, then it will be sweetened. You're right in the sense that most likely only mixing will be done, but what gets released will be to Brian's liking and you can bank on that. As many have said here, the vocals comment by Al was the halfhearted backtrack to calm the rumor down. I doubt that any new vocals will be added, but I wouldn't be surprised if Surf's Up winds up with a new string section on the 2nd half as was originally planned. That's Brian's prerogative isn't it? We'll see soon enough, I suppose.

[punkinhead]

Can't help but feel somewhat skeptical about all this.  Jardine has made several comments in recent years that could be considered slightly inaccurate (*cough* reunion tours).  Honestly, if the Beach Boys version of SMiLE does indeed get released, just what kind of release would it be?  Although a lot had been recorded for it, I always thought it was far from completed.  Could Capitol compile something together that would be a satisfying release?  

Although I'd still welcome a SMiLE release, I'm still kind of hoping for a release that encompasses the group's entire 50-year career; not just one time period from it.  Would love to see a box set release of something similar to the Endless Harmony and Hawthorne, CA albums.  

If you want something created for the past 50 years, what goes in that set from the past 15 years?
Basically after Stars and Stripes Vol. 1

Well that's easy: a proper release of "You're Still A Mystery" and the Beach Boys' version of "Soul Searchin'". 

sure, it's easy, to add two tracks...but what else? this is 50 years not 40. 

[drbeachboy]

Instead of BWPS as the "template" I'd use Carl's announced list of tracks in 1972-73 as the model for the more accessible "single" disc version.  

Do we want accessible or historic? Even a list from Carl in 1972 is tainted by the fact that a good chunk of Smile from 66-67 had already been released, re-recorded, re-configured, and re-used since Smiley Smile in summer '67, and something like "Child Is Father..." was by then known as the tag to Surf's Up rather than part of a greater whole. And some of those re-uses which had happened by the time Carl had that list were far from where they were originally imagined.

We won't even bring up "Wonder-Bill" aarrgghh...

It's like navigating through a minefield when handling those tapes! Not that I've ever done either of those things.

You don't know that for sure. Child tacked on to Surf's Up was Brian's idea, not Carl's. The fact that Brian offered that ending when originally opposed to finishing and adding Surf's Up to the new album tells me Brian had plans at one time or another to do that. Your Wonder-Bill example is terrible. That was a "Live" medley for concert, not as an add on to Smile. Nobody has yet stated what this release will exactly be like. I'm going to by it whatever Brian decides to do with it for release. It's his baby to do with however he pleases.

[guitarfool2002]

Instead of BWPS as the "template" I'd use Carl's announced list of tracks in 1972-73 as the model for the more accessible "single" disc version.  

Do we want accessible or historic? Even a list from Carl in 1972 is tainted by the fact that a good chunk of Smile from 66-67 had already been released, re-recorded, re-configured, and re-used since Smiley Smile in summer '67, and something like "Child Is Father..." was by then known as the tag to Surf's Up rather than part of a greater whole. And some of those re-uses which had happened by the time Carl had that list were far from where they were originally imagined.

We won't even bring up "Wonder-Bill" aarrgghh...

It's like navigating through a minefield when handling those tapes! Not that I've ever done either of those things.

You don't know that for sure. Child tacked on to Surf's Up was Brian's idea, not Carl's. The fact that Brian offered that ending when originally opposed to finishing and adding Surf's Up to the new album tells me Brian had plans at one time or another to do that. Your Wonder-Bill example is terrible. That was a "Live" medley for concert, not as an add on to Smile. Nobody has yet stated what this release will exactly be like. I'm going to by it whatever Brian decides to do with it for release. It's his baby to do with however he pleases.

Terrible is a strong word, Dr., but I don't regret using that example. It's just my opinion of a beautiful Smile track being interpreted as something far different from where it was and even from where it was released on Smiley. Not suggesting at that point it was an "add on to Smile", but just pointing out one unfortunate (IMO) reuse of a Smile track from the era when Carl had his list.

The difference is that BWPS was in fact Brian's baby, under his own contract with another label. He did what he wanted to do with it, along with his collaborators, and he did not use a single second of original recordings from the vault. When Capitol is involved with archived tapes, it becomes more of a boardroom decision where Brian just can't go off on his own without having the other members voice their opinions and wishes. Those same issues have come up for years, from the 93 box set to issues with the Pet Sounds Sessions liner notes.

I'll be first in line to get anything should it come out, don't get me wrong! I'd camp outside Tower Records with my guitar playing BB's tunes if Tower were still in business.