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Author Topic: Thread for various insignificant questions that don't deserve their own thread!  (Read 871548 times)
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« Reply #6800 on: August 27, 2020, 03:02:22 PM »

GVs would be up there to I guess. I think it was Hal Blaine who said sometimes they would set, play a few notes, then Brian would say ‘Thank you gentlemen’ and call it a night. If those same instruments were taken to different studios for a different part of the song over 6 months then do the math.
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« Reply #6801 on: August 27, 2020, 03:13:14 PM »

Can anybody tell me about the dimensions of Gold Star's legendary Echo Chamber?

Also, what speakers and microphone(s) were used?

Such a magical sound, so integral to the BBs and Phil Spector sound.

I can't tell you what its dimensions were, but Herb Alpert knew. He tried to replicate the Gold Star's echo room when he was building out the A&M Studio.
« Last Edit: August 27, 2020, 03:19:26 PM by SBonilla » Logged
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« Reply #6802 on: August 28, 2020, 07:57:51 AM »

What is the largest Brian/BB arrangement in terms of sheer number of instruments? Counting overdubs and all.

I’ve been thinking about it and Three Blind Mice is probably up there.

Like a masochist, I did the maths.

There are 30 musicians playing on the Good Vibrations single, not including Beach Boys who only sang, but the track has 65 individually performed instruments across all sections and overdubs. This isn't counting anything that isn't in the final single mix.
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« Reply #6803 on: August 28, 2020, 08:44:25 PM »

What is the largest Brian/BB arrangement in terms of sheer number of instruments? Counting overdubs and all.

I’ve been thinking about it and Three Blind Mice is probably up there.

Like a masochist, I did the maths.

There are 30 musicians playing on the Good Vibrations single, not including Beach Boys who only sang, but the track has 65 individually performed instruments across all sections and overdubs. This isn't counting anything that isn't in the final single mix.

Then a fan’s work is never done. I’d keep editing Wikipedia to add the correct info, but some editors say this board and historians like c-man (and JH and yourself) aren’t good enough sources. Another reason to look forward to c-man’s future MiC sessionography!!
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« Reply #6804 on: August 29, 2020, 10:07:47 PM »

The clacker or castanet sound that appears in say San Miguel for example - is it one person over dubbing them? Or multiple people playing it?

Was there some mind of delay effect applied? Or did the player slightly delay the second play thru?
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« Reply #6805 on: September 03, 2020, 10:35:17 AM »

The clacker or castanet sound that appears in say San Miguel for example - is it one person over dubbing them? Or multiple people playing it?

Was there some mind of delay effect applied? Or did the player slightly delay the second play thru?

I believe it's Hal Blaine and more Hal Blaine.
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« Reply #6806 on: September 07, 2020, 09:36:57 AM »

The clacker or castanet sound that appears in say San Miguel for example - is it one person over dubbing them? Or multiple people playing it?

Was there some mind of delay effect applied? Or did the player slightly delay the second play thru?

I believe it's Hal Blaine and more Hal Blaine.

I believe you're correct. Smiley
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« Reply #6807 on: September 10, 2020, 07:19:25 PM »

Gold Star's chambers were never precisely measured by outsiders, to my knowledge, so there may not be an official measurement to be found, but the rough measurement is that the two chambers were trapezoidal, and between the two of them took up complementary space in a 400 square foot space, which was about 20 feet a side.  So, since they aren't rectangles it's hard, but it'd have to be something like 200 square feet per chamber, with a long side of up to about 26-28 feet or so depending on how they arranged the trapezoids.

The mics and speakers were not "cheap" in the sense of being poor quality, but maybe cheap in the sense of being standard American fare:  Altec and RCA.
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« Reply #6808 on: September 13, 2020, 11:12:28 AM »

It strikes me as odd that we don't have a known 2nd engineer on most Beach Boys sessions from the 60s or 70s. I know Desper was a one man operation at the home studio, but would Chuck Britz, Larry Levine etc. have regularly worked with unnamed tape ops or was it standard for them to fill both roles? I've only heard of a few - Winston Wong on the Sloop sessions, Bill Halverson at Heider's, and the mystery 'Don T' at Columbia.
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« Reply #6809 on: September 14, 2020, 01:23:15 PM »

I’ve always found that odd myself
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« Reply #6810 on: September 15, 2020, 07:56:33 AM »

I was just wondering if there are any sources on the personnel for the Smiley Smile album? I've noticed on Wikipedia in particular that information on who plays on the album is woefully under-detailed - there's zero detail as to what instruments each member played, and even Bruce Johnston is omitted from the personnel list. I've also noticed that on many of the other, more detailed personnel sections of Beach Boys albums on Wikipedia, credited sources came from Craig Slowinski, while the same isn't the case for Smiley Smile.
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« Reply #6811 on: September 15, 2020, 08:06:58 AM »

I was just wondering if there are any sources on the personnel for the Smiley Smile album? I've noticed on Wikipedia in particular that information on who plays on the album is woefully under-detailed - there's zero detail as to what instruments each member played, and even Bruce Johnston is omitted from the personnel list. I've also noticed that on many of the other, more detailed personnel sections of Beach Boys albums on Wikipedia, credited sources came from Craig Slowinski, while the same isn't the case for Smiley Smile.

That’s been my personal project. I’ve been using whatever I can of Craig Slowinski’s credits to update Wikipedia. I was told by other editors I was only allowed to do something with a source that covered most or all of the album. I couldn’t just list the known credits (I.e. Carl - Vocals, Bass, Guitar on “Good Vibrations” and “Gettin’ Hungry”, Percussion on “Good Vibrations”, etc) for a couple random tracks. I did try to do that using the GV and H&V credits from Wiki, but that was reverted as well. I’ve been using c-man’s ESQ sessionographies but I’ve had to buy backorders and I haven’t bought Smiley Smile’s issue yet (partially because its my least favorite BB album so far). Bruce was omitted because they feel we can’t prove him on GV and maybe Vegetables since he was gone for the recording of most of the album.
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« Reply #6812 on: September 15, 2020, 09:20:50 AM »

Bruce is very definitely on Good Vibrations (and She's Goin' Bald), but he's not on Vegetables, Heroes or anything else. @sloopjohnb72 and I could fill in most credits for Smiley as far as they can be answered, but from what I've heard the wiki editors pretty much won't take a source unless it's on paper or called Andrew Doe, and that's not something that exists for Smiley Smile just yet even in ESQ.
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« Reply #6813 on: September 15, 2020, 07:23:00 PM »

I was just wondering if there are any sources on the personnel for the Smiley Smile album? I've noticed on Wikipedia in particular that information on who plays on the album is woefully under-detailed - there's zero detail as to what instruments each member played, and even Bruce Johnston is omitted from the personnel list. I've also noticed that on many of the other, more detailed personnel sections of Beach Boys albums on Wikipedia, credited sources came from Craig Slowinski, while the same isn't the case for Smiley Smile.

That’s been my personal project. I’ve been using whatever I can of Craig Slowinski’s credits to update Wikipedia. I was told by other editors I was only allowed to do something with a source that covered most or all of the album. I couldn’t just list the known credits (I.e. Carl - Vocals, Bass, Guitar on “Good Vibrations” and “Gettin’ Hungry”, Percussion on “Good Vibrations”, etc) for a couple random tracks. I did try to do that using the GV and H&V credits from Wiki, but that was reverted as well. I’ve been using c-man’s ESQ sessionographies but I’ve had to buy backorders and I haven’t bought Smiley Smile’s issue yet (partially because its my least favorite BB album so far).

That's pretty ridiculous that they won't take most sources, particularly since for many other bands they specify which tracks a particular member played a certain instrument on - case in point Let It Bleed: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Let_It_Bleed. Perhaps a system like that could possibly be implemented? Surely for them to arbitrarily delete credits when it has been proved to be accurate for the reason you stated would be akin to treating dandruff with decapitation, as Frank Zappa would put it.

Bruce is very definitely on Good Vibrations, but he's not on Vegetables, Heroes or anything else. @sloopjohnb72 and I could fill in most credits for Smiley as far as they can be answered, but from what I've heard the wiki editors pretty much won't take a source unless it's on paper or called Andrew Doe, and that's not something that exists for Smiley Smile just yet even in ESQ.

That's interesting as well, I never knew that - though I was aware that Bruce declined to go to Hawaii with the rest of the Beach Boys to record Lei'd In Hawaii. Was there any particular reason for Bruce's general lack of participation?
« Last Edit: September 15, 2020, 07:24:09 PM by Unreconstructed Wilsonite » Logged
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« Reply #6814 on: September 15, 2020, 08:11:24 PM »

I was just wondering if there are any sources on the personnel for the Smiley Smile album? I've noticed on Wikipedia in particular that information on who plays on the album is woefully under-detailed - there's zero detail as to what instruments each member played, and even Bruce Johnston is omitted from the personnel list. I've also noticed that on many of the other, more detailed personnel sections of Beach Boys albums on Wikipedia, credited sources came from Craig Slowinski, while the same isn't the case for Smiley Smile.

That’s been my personal project. I’ve been using whatever I can of Craig Slowinski’s credits to update Wikipedia. I was told by other editors I was only allowed to do something with a source that covered most or all of the album. I couldn’t just list the known credits (I.e. Carl - Vocals, Bass, Guitar on “Good Vibrations” and “Gettin’ Hungry”, Percussion on “Good Vibrations”, etc) for a couple random tracks. I did try to do that using the GV and H&V credits from Wiki, but that was reverted as well. I’ve been using c-man’s ESQ sessionographies but I’ve had to buy backorders and I haven’t bought Smiley Smile’s issue yet (partially because its my least favorite BB album so far).

That's pretty ridiculous that they won't take most sources, particularly since for many other bands they specify which tracks a particular member played a certain instrument on - case in point Let It Bleed: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Let_It_Bleed. Perhaps a system like that could possibly be implemented? Surely for them to arbitrarily delete credits when it has been proved to be accurate for the reason you stated would be akin to treating dandruff with decapitation, as Frank Zappa would put it.

Sorry I worded that terribly. What I meant to say was let’s just say we’re in a world where only credits for GV and H&V existed for Smiley Smile (lost AFMs for the rest, no Sea of Tunes/other outtakes) I couldn’t just write Carl - vocals; guitar and percussion on GV; Brian - vocals, keyboards on GV and H&V; Dennis - vocals; organ on GV; etc.
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« Reply #6815 on: September 15, 2020, 08:54:27 PM »

I was just wondering if there are any sources on the personnel for the Smiley Smile album? I've noticed on Wikipedia in particular that information on who plays on the album is woefully under-detailed - there's zero detail as to what instruments each member played, and even Bruce Johnston is omitted from the personnel list. I've also noticed that on many of the other, more detailed personnel sections of Beach Boys albums on Wikipedia, credited sources came from Craig Slowinski, while the same isn't the case for Smiley Smile.

That’s been my personal project. I’ve been using whatever I can of Craig Slowinski’s credits to update Wikipedia. I was told by other editors I was only allowed to do something with a source that covered most or all of the album. I couldn’t just list the known credits (I.e. Carl - Vocals, Bass, Guitar on “Good Vibrations” and “Gettin’ Hungry”, Percussion on “Good Vibrations”, etc) for a couple random tracks. I did try to do that using the GV and H&V credits from Wiki, but that was reverted as well. I’ve been using c-man’s ESQ sessionographies but I’ve had to buy backorders and I haven’t bought Smiley Smile’s issue yet (partially because its my least favorite BB album so far).

That's pretty ridiculous that they won't take most sources, particularly since for many other bands they specify which tracks a particular member played a certain instrument on - case in point Let It Bleed: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Let_It_Bleed. Perhaps a system like that could possibly be implemented? Surely for them to arbitrarily delete credits when it has been proved to be accurate for the reason you stated would be akin to treating dandruff with decapitation, as Frank Zappa would put it.

Sorry I worded that terribly. What I meant to say was let’s just say we’re in a world where only credits for GV and H&V existed for Smiley Smile (lost AFMs for the rest, no Sea of Tunes/other outtakes) I couldn’t just write Carl - vocals; guitar and percussion on GV; Brian - vocals, keyboards on GV and H&V; Dennis - vocals; organ on GV; etc.

Ah, well that makes sense of course. Though surely there's got to be some sources out there for the rest of the album which can be used without threat of reversion
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« Reply #6816 on: September 16, 2020, 04:01:32 AM »

I was just wondering if there are any sources on the personnel for the Smiley Smile album? I've noticed on Wikipedia in particular that information on who plays on the album is woefully under-detailed - there's zero detail as to what instruments each member played, and even Bruce Johnston is omitted from the personnel list. I've also noticed that on many of the other, more detailed personnel sections of Beach Boys albums on Wikipedia, credited sources came from Craig Slowinski, while the same isn't the case for Smiley Smile.

That’s been my personal project. I’ve been using whatever I can of Craig Slowinski’s credits to update Wikipedia. I was told by other editors I was only allowed to do something with a source that covered most or all of the album. I couldn’t just list the known credits (I.e. Carl - Vocals, Bass, Guitar on “Good Vibrations” and “Gettin’ Hungry”, Percussion on “Good Vibrations”, etc) for a couple random tracks. I did try to do that using the GV and H&V credits from Wiki, but that was reverted as well. I’ve been using c-man’s ESQ sessionographies but I’ve had to buy backorders and I haven’t bought Smiley Smile’s issue yet (partially because its my least favorite BB album so far).

That's pretty ridiculous that they won't take most sources, particularly since for many other bands they specify which tracks a particular member played a certain instrument on - case in point Let It Bleed: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Let_It_Bleed. Perhaps a system like that could possibly be implemented? Surely for them to arbitrarily delete credits when it has been proved to be accurate for the reason you stated would be akin to treating dandruff with decapitation, as Frank Zappa would put it.

Bruce is very definitely on Good Vibrations, but he's not on Vegetables, Heroes or anything else. @sloopjohnb72 and I could fill in most credits for Smiley as far as they can be answered, but from what I've heard the wiki editors pretty much won't take a source unless it's on paper or called Andrew Doe, and that's not something that exists for Smiley Smile just yet even in ESQ.

That's interesting as well, I never knew that - though I was aware that Bruce declined to go to Hawaii with the rest of the Beach Boys to record Lei'd In Hawaii. Was there any particular reason for Bruce's general lack of participation?

Too weird and drugs, those were his reasons. Aside from a Child is Father cameo during one of the April Sound Recorders sessions he wasn't in a studio with them from the end of February to September.
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« Reply #6817 on: September 16, 2020, 04:03:31 AM »


Ah, well that makes sense of course. Though surely there's got to be some sources out there for the rest of the album which can be used without threat of reversion

Stay tuned? It exists, but not published.
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« Reply #6818 on: September 16, 2020, 11:04:35 AM »

Was reading CNN on my phone today and saw one of those sponsored-content ads--this one: "What did historical figures really look like?" And instead of Lincoln (the usual), it was Dennis! Specifically, it was the cover photo from POB, but aged about 10-15 years. (And no, it's not from the "See how dead rock stars might have aged if they'd lived"--THAT Dennis pic is the one where he looks like Scott Bakula.)

So, stupid me, I took the bait and went through the whole slide show to see if Dennis was really included--maybe as Jesus or something. (The aged POB picture did look kinda like the Shroud of Turin, I guess.) But nope--no Dennis! Then, when I went back to CNN so I could snap a grab of the ad with the POB photo, it was gone. So, sorry, but no photographic evidence for right now. (I wasted another 10 minutes searching for it--no luck.)

Anybody else see this?
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« Reply #6819 on: September 21, 2020, 08:11:30 AM »

Was reading CNN on my phone today and saw one of those sponsored-content ads--this one: "What did historical figures really look like?" And instead of Lincoln (the usual), it was Dennis! Specifically, it was the cover photo from POB, but aged about 10-15 years. (And no, it's not from the "See how dead rock stars might have aged if they'd lived"--THAT Dennis pic is the one where he looks like Scott Bakula.)

So, stupid me, I took the bait and went through the whole slide show to see if Dennis was really included--maybe as Jesus or something. (The aged POB picture did look kinda like the Shroud of Turin, I guess.) But nope--no Dennis! Then, when I went back to CNN so I could snap a grab of the ad with the POB photo, it was gone. So, sorry, but no photographic evidence for right now. (I wasted another 10 minutes searching for it--no luck.)

Anybody else see this?

I'd have to guess that cookie-influenced algorithms saw that you visit or search for various Beach Boys related topics...this automatically generates an ad that is appealing to you so you're more likely to click on it (even if the clicked destination has nothing to do with the picture you clicked on). It's just like those ads that know exactly what state or county you live in ("Doctors in Intercourse, Pennsylvania HATE this newfound weight loss trick!"). The internet is one big marketing/advertisement business. It's the reason why Facebook/Google/Twitter can operate their platforms for free: because the business is to compile information about every user and sell it to marketing firms.
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« Reply #6820 on: September 21, 2020, 08:16:56 AM »

I was perusing the Wikipedia page for the Made In California boxset. There are four names listed under the "Compiler" credits:

Alan Boyd
Mark Linett
Dennis Wolfe
Mike Love

The actual credits for the MiC set for the "Compilation Producer" credit lists four names:

Alan Boyd
Dennis Wolfe
Mark Linett
The Beach Boys

But Mike Love is not singled out in that instance. Doing a small bit of digging (nothing extensive) I could not find any source where Mike Love was set apart from the other Beach Boys as a "compiler" for this set. Even the source for the Wikipedia "compiler" credit didn't mention that Mike Love was a compiler.

Anyways, I was just curious if anyone knew why Mike is listed as the sole Beach Boy compiler for MiC on the Wikipedia page?
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« Reply #6821 on: September 21, 2020, 01:38:45 PM »

I was perusing the Wikipedia page for the Made In California boxset. There are four names listed under the "Compiler" credits:

Alan Boyd
Mark Linett
Dennis Wolfe
Mike Love

The actual credits for the MiC set for the "Compilation Producer" credit lists four names:

Alan Boyd
Dennis Wolfe
Mark Linett
The Beach Boys

But Mike Love is not singled out in that instance. Doing a small bit of digging (nothing extensive) I could not find any source where Mike Love was set apart from the other Beach Boys as a "compiler" for this set. Even the source for the Wikipedia "compiler" credit didn't mention that Mike Love was a compiler.

Anyways, I was just curious if anyone knew why Mike is listed as the sole Beach Boy compiler for MiC on the Wikipedia page?

It was added back in 2013 https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Made_in_California&diff=prev&oldid=572190514

My guess is it was based on these quotes:
"Alan Boyd: Quite simply, we wanted to show off the best material from all the different facets of the group’s catalog.

Out of all the surviving band members, Mike Love was especially helpful and involved in putting together the box set."

"Mark Linett: The discs are organized chronologically up until the first half of disc five. The rest of disc five is unreleased live tracks. Disc six is entirely made up of unreleased tracks, acapella tracks, demos, backing tracks etcetera. It was Mike Love’s request that we do it that way and I think he was right. Rather than sticking the rarities in where they would have been organized in a chronological fashion, I think it makes more sense this way and it plays better as well. That said, there is some unreleased material sprinkled throughout the set but they’re more or less finished versions of songs."
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« Reply #6822 on: September 21, 2020, 02:49:53 PM »

Thanks, BBsCovers! For the life of me I can’t find those quotes in the source provided. I’m assuming they are from page 2 of the rock cellar mag article which archive.org can’t link to (and the original article is not found on Rock Cellars website). I found this quote on page 1 and it’s another example of Mike’s support/involvement in the project:

“As a matter of fact, Mike was talking about how one of his dream projects would be a box set with one disc highlighting each of the group members’ strongest moments over the years, which is incidentally something that Mark (Linett) has been wanting to do for many years too.”
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« Reply #6823 on: September 22, 2020, 12:50:38 PM »

Thanks, BBsCovers! For the life of me I can’t find those quotes in the source provided. I’m assuming they are from page 2 of the rock cellar mag article which archive.org can’t link to (and the original article is not found on Rock Cellars website). I found this quote on page 1 and it’s another example of Mike’s support/involvement in the project:

“As a matter of fact, Mike was talking about how one of his dream projects would be a box set with one disc highlighting each of the group members’ strongest moments over the years, which is incidentally something that Mark (Linett) has been wanting to do for many years too.”

https://web.archive.org/web/20130930143358/http://www.rockcellarmagazine.com/2013/09/04/made-in-california-producers-alan-boyd-dennis-wolfe-mark-linett-beach-boys-interview/2/
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« Reply #6824 on: September 22, 2020, 02:51:38 PM »

Thanks, BBsCovers! For the life of me I can’t find those quotes in the source provided. I’m assuming they are from page 2 of the rock cellar mag article which archive.org can’t link to (and the original article is not found on Rock Cellars website). I found this quote on page 1 and it’s another example of Mike’s support/involvement in the project:

“As a matter of fact, Mike was talking about how one of his dream projects would be a box set with one disc highlighting each of the group members’ strongest moments over the years, which is incidentally something that Mark (Linett) has been wanting to do for many years too.”

At this stage seven to eight years later with nothing to show of this "dream project", this story in retrospect really doesn't do Mike any favors.
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