BEACH BOYS ARCHIVE INCLUDES 1972 CARNEGIE HALL TAPES

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

Smile will eat Smiley Smile and become it. Sort of like the alien in The Thing!

[Justin]

Anyone think there's still hope for the Carnegie Hall shows to be released?  Any updates from our Honored Guests?

[Les Chan]

I am a believer!   I am!

[The Shift]

It's one of my major 2012 hopes.

[oldsurferdude]

Being one of the best shows I've ever seen them do, it could take it's place right up there with TSS.

[Mikie]

Early 70's. My favorite concert era as a Beach Boys fan.

[Shady]

Imagine having this as a newly remastered  CD..

Oh my! 

[Justin]

Being one of the best shows I've ever seen them do, it could take it's place right up there with TSS.

Luck you!...listening to the show as we have it...I find Mike's behavior a little odd.  From the beginning of the show he kind of scolds the audience for the cat-calls and screams; lecturing them on the fact that they're recording the show.  I dunno, seemed like harmless calls from the audience, I didn't think they were being very disruptive.  Mike calling them "punks" was out of place--they were after all fans.  My impression is that it put off the audience for a good part of the show until Mike had to kind of tell them to act out again and "infuse a little more happiness or joy or something...."  Seemed to me like the audience backed off so much after Mike corrected them earlier that they were loosing their presence in the recording. 

Since you were there....was there any of that feeling? 

[Jay]

Ok, here's a question for everybody. If they were to release the 1972 Carnegie Hall tape(s), would you want it totally, 100% unedited, "warts and all"? If I recall correctly(it's been a while since I listened to it) there were some really long pauses between songs. The intro to "Long Promised Road" for example is much longer than what you hear on the Endless Harmony cd.

[Justin]

Good question Jay and such a topic can be a controversial one amongst fans and live recordings of their favorite artists/bands....some want the untouched recording as-is...while others don't care.  I for one, don't care...and wouldn't mind if they edited the concert down removing the long unnecessary gaps in between songs.  It's their right to do so. I would doubt they would give us the full concerts like that....there would be no benefit for doing so...it would only waste space on a CD thus waste a lot of money.  I found the way they edited the chatter before "Long Promised Road" on the EH cd was creative.

[Jay]

I found the way they edited the chatter before "Long Promised Road" on the EH cd was creative.

That's another point. I wouldn't mind if little things like that got edited out. Some feedback here, a "false start" there. But I would NOT be ok with a guitar solo or electric keyboard solo(there are quite a few in "Help Me Rhonda" lol) being edited out to shorten a song. Or something like removing Dennis's coda to "Only With You".

[hypehat]

But there's no way in hell they would edit any actual performance out.
I don't mind them editing out the constant fiddling with the snare drum or lengthy stage banter, however.

[The Shift]

Greedy I know, but it'd be great to have both - as we have with the official Knebworth release and the unofficial unadulterated Stoneage release of the same gig. Different listening occasions call for different experiences.

[Justin]

In the Elvis boot world, fans get upset when concerts are edited down and released on the official bootleg label...they don't want the chatter or the false starts edited out.  To me, the general rule should be that the full, raw concert should be found on the bootlegs and the edited, cleaned up concert should be on the official label.  Sure, that's not totally applicable here considering we don't even have the complete Carnegie Hall show to enjoy but let's hope that if/when they do release it...we should be happy it's released at all.  And yes, I'd want both shows too.  I doubt we'd see both complete shows but probably a concert made up of the two.

[oldsurferdude]

Being one of the best shows I've ever seen them do, it could take it's place right up there with TSS.

Luck you!...listening to the show as we have it...I find Mike's behavior a little odd.  From the beginning of the show he kind of scolds the audience for the cat-calls and screams; lecturing them on the fact that they're recording the show.  I dunno, seemed like harmless calls from the audience, I didn't think they were being very disruptive.  Mike calling them "punks" was out of place--they were after all fans.  My impression is that it put off the audience for a good part of the show until Mike had to kind of tell them to act out again and "infuse a little more happiness or joy or something...."  Seemed to me like the audience backed off so much after Mike corrected them earlier that they were loosing their presence in the recording.  

Since you were there....was there any of that feeling?  

Justin-I wish to aplologize-I attended the 71 show at Carnegie. Sorry, man.  

[Mikie]

For studio sessions takes, the banter is fine, and sometimes interesting. The talking and carrying on is fine (i,e, SOT sessions) and sometimes funny (Dance, Dance, Dance session) but some of Mike Love's banter is monotonous on, say, the 1966 Michigan shows, where he just talks and talks and talks and talks between songs. I know Dennis eventually got tired of it, and I'd be real surprised if the rest of the band didn't get tired of it too. After some of those '66 shows (one was funny where they tried out Good Vibrations for the first time and Mike says he's looking for a fire hydrant he's so nervous) but MAN, after awhile it was.......JUST SHUT UP!!! In 68 it was the same thing promoting TM and I've heard a couple of shows even in '71 where Mike just goes off on these looooong tangents!!!  

Where was I? Oh yeah, for live performances, you gotta edit out some of the long carrying on between songs, or you're gonna find yourself fast-forwarding to the next song after you've heard it once.

[Justin]

Being one of the best shows I've ever seen them do, it could take it's place right up there with TSS.

Luck you!...listening to the show as we have it...I find Mike's behavior a little odd.  From the beginning of the show he kind of scolds the audience for the cat-calls and screams; lecturing them on the fact that they're recording the show.  I dunno, seemed like harmless calls from the audience, I didn't think they were being very disruptive.  Mike calling them "punks" was out of place--they were after all fans.  My impression is that it put off the audience for a good part of the show until Mike had to kind of tell them to act out again and "infuse a little more happiness or joy or something...."  Seemed to me like the audience backed off so much after Mike corrected them earlier that they were loosing their presence in the recording.  

Since you were there....was there any of that feeling?  

Justin-I wish to aplologize-I attended the 71 show at Carnegie. Sorry, man.  

haha it's alright..still lucky that you saw a true Beach Boys show!  Still have the ticket stub?

[oldsurferdude]

This may seem a bit far fetched, but I never purchased a ticket. Drove from Philly to NYC with no ticket in hand. I knew it was a sell out but no, I was a fan and had to pull out all the stops. Parked across the street from CH, approached either an usher or a guard in front of the doors and informed him  of what I had done to get there. He told me to come back after the crowd was in, slip him 5 or 10.00 and he'd let me in. I calmly strolled down the aisle toward the front, found a no-show seat and watched the show. To this day, it all seems like a dream.

[Justin]

Way too cool!  Man, could any of us pull that off today? Doubt it.  I'll try it at one of the Reunion shows and let you know    Thanks for sharing!

[Rocker]

For studio sessions takes, the banter is fine, and sometimes interesting. The talking and carrying on is fine (i,e, SOT sessions) and sometimes funny (Dance, Dance, Dance session) but some of Mike Love's banter is monotonous on, say, the 1966 Michigan shows, where he just talks and talks and talks and talks between songs. I know Dennis eventually got tired of it, and I'd be real surprised if the rest of the band didn't get tired of it too. After some of those '66 shows (one was funny where they tried out Good Vibrations for the first time and Mike says he's looking for a fire hydrant he's so nervous) but MAN, after awhile it was.......JUST SHUT UP!!! In 68 it was the same thing promoting TM and I've heard a couple of shows even in '71 where Mike just goes off on these looooong tangents!!!  

I wondered why the intro to California Girls was cut on Live In London, until I heard the bootleg. Those are the kind of things Mike should never have done imo

[Mikie]

Exactly! I mean, you listen to those live boots from 1966 thru 1969 and sometimes the guy doesn't know when to stop! And there's no real excuse for it - it's not like he's biding time because somebody's fixing a broken guitar string or adjusting the sound levels/mix or arguing amongst themselves in the background about what to play next or burning time on purpose because they didn't have many songs to play. Mike just carried on forever!!

So if/when they ever come out with a new live show or compilation form that era, there's a LOT to edit out there.

[oldsurferdude]

My favorite Beach Boy's most significant problem was not that he was a strange looking bald man, it was, as most of us know, his egocentric nature. He had to be totally convinced that his audience was in dire need to hear his bleatings about the most trite subjects on Earth  between songs. His "jokes" were moronic as was his endless babbling between songs. I can handily recount Carl's eye rolling at it and Dennis icily staring at him as if to say "cut the sh*t and get going". And, apparently, his wildly out of control ego is still healthy  and  thriving according to USA Today in reference to the upcoming reunion. Rolling Stone contributing editor DeCurtis says, "it seems the strategy(of the tour) is to position Mike Love as Brian Wilson's (creative) equal, though that's not remotely the case. I f this is going to work, MIKE CAN'T FEEL SLIGHTED."  

[SMiLE Brian]

My favorite Beach Boy's most significant problem was not that he was a strange looking bald man, it was, as most of us know, his egocentric nature. He had to be totally convinced that his audience was in dire need to hear his bleatings about the most trite subjects on Earth  between songs. His "jokes" were moronic as was his endless babbling between songs. I can handily recount Carl's eye rolling at it and Dennis icily staring at him as if to say "cut the sh*t and get going". And, apparently, his ego is still healthy, wildly out of control and  thriving according to USA today in reference to the upcoming reunion. A fellow by the name of DeCurtis says, "it seems the strategy(of the tour) is to position Mike Love as Brian Wilson's (creative) equal, though that's not remotely the case. I f this is going to work, MIKE CAN'T FEEL SLIGHTED."   

Your reasons for not liking Mike are valid if you saw the lovester blabber on in public. I can't listen to him talk on live in michigan or the french show from 1969 on youtube.

[Dave Modny]

I wondered why the intro to California Girls was cut on Live In London, until I heard the bootleg. Those are the kind of things Mike should never have done imo

Your reasons for not liking Mike are valid if you saw the lovester blabber on in public. I can't listen to him talk on live in michigan or the french show from 1969 on youtube.

I'm immediately flashing back to Mike's blurt during the chorus of Denny's sublime reading of You've Got To Hide Your Love Away from one of the '66 Michigan State sets. Ugh.

(If the powers that be ever release that track...and they should...I would only hope they would fly-in/sub-in that tainted line from another chorus, or from the version that exists of the band's other performance set. I'd reckon the luxury of a multitrack mixdown wouldn't even completely eviscerate that aural stain)

PS - That means I also agree with the notion of putting the best foot forward with any commercial BBs live CD (within reason). Carnegie included.

[Aegir]

I like what Mike says at shows, especially shows in countries where the majority of the audience can't understand him. I find his corniness really endearing.