gfxgfx
 
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
logo
 
gfx gfx
gfx
659368 Posts in 26414 Topics by 3755 Members - Latest Member: Joanne Figueroa July 04, 2020, 02:36:49 PM
*
gfx*HomeHelpSearchCalendarLoginRegistergfx
gfxgfx
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.       « previous next »
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 Go Down Print
Author Topic: Rocky Pamplin to be Interviewed on WFMU June 13  (Read 3502 times)
guitarfool2002
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 9021


"Barba non facit aliam historici"


View Profile WWW
« Reply #50 on: June 15, 2020, 11:09:23 AM »

12 noon EST, Rocky coming up on the broadcast in minutes: http://stream0.wfmu.org/freeform-128k

I think these are archived too so anyone interested can listen later

Is this where the interview is? I'm 30 minutes in and it has just been music I don't like. I can't skip forward either.

No, that is the current live stream of the station. Go to this link, scroll down to the archive for June 13, and click on pop-up player and you'll be able to fast-forward and rewind. Start around 1:03 into the broadcast I think...EDIT 1:04.50

https://wfmu.org/playlists/SH
Logged

"All of us have the privilege of making music that helps and heals - to make music that makes people happier, stronger, and kinder. Don't forget: Music is God's voice." - Brian Wilson
Magic Transistor Radio
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2922


Bill Cooper Mystery Babylon


View Profile
« Reply #51 on: June 15, 2020, 11:10:09 AM »

I found it on another link. I couldn't take any more of that music with no mention of the interview! Don't even think it was the right episode!
Logged

"Over the years, I've been accused of not supporting our new music from this era (67-73) and just wanting to play our hits. That's complete b.s......I was also, as the front man, the one promoting these songs onstage and have the scars to show for it."
Mike Love autobiography (pg 242-243)
rab2591
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 5157


"My God. It's full of stars."


View Profile
« Reply #52 on: June 15, 2020, 11:33:49 AM »

Here's a rough but accurate transcription of the part in question (I didn't transcribe all of the "um"s and repeated words):

[Ron Hamady] "There were people that took exception to the credit that we gave Mike Love in the book. There's a Mike Love camp and a Brian Wilson camp, and sometimes those two camps are at odds with each other and when I listen to Rocky talk about all of his experiences when the book was being edited, I said "That should be in the book, Rocky. That should be in the book, Rocky. That should be in the book." - he just told me story after story after story..."

[Rocky interjects] "And Ron put them all in the book."

[Ron continues] "Well, I put a bunch of them in the book and it really fleshed things out considerably. But the one thing that Rocky did not realize was his tremendous respect for Mike Love. When Rocky would talk about how that band survived...Mike Love was the glue that held that band together."

[source: https://wfmu.org/archiveplayer/?show=93892&archive=187375&starttime=]

So Rocky has "tremendous respect" for Mike Love? Let's hear it from Rocky himself (read the parts in yellow to get the meat of the quote):

Mike is the only person on the PLANET entitled to use the name "BEACH BOY-S in any fashion shape or form... EVEN Brian can't use it... Brian gladly gave it to Mike JUST TO GET AWAY FROM HIM... as far as he could GET!  That's when Brian PUT TOGETHER his own GROUP of GENIUS MUSICIANS... who can actually PLAY an INSTRUMENT!

Because I took it even one GIANT step further... and took a meeting with Brian's Lawyers at the Brentwood Mezzaluna restaurant... and PLAYED it for them!  They, then, got me...    MY OWN ATTORNEY ... Charles English... who secured IMMUNITY for me!  And then the SH*T really hit the fan for MIKE... (to the tune of millions)...TO LEARN THE REST... you'll just have to read the book when it comes out!  And it will COME OUT!   And Beach Boy fans will "BOO"... Mike off the stage!  And Brian and Stephen will both HAVE THE LAST LAUGH!!!

Mike-y threw a POOL DECK CHAIR at Brian  Transcendental Meditation and SCREAMED, "I'm NOT SINGING THOSE FU*KING WORDS OF Van Dyke Parks... Mike-y REALLY JUST DID NOT WANT Brian WRITING WITH ANYONE ELSE... (Now why would that be?...) Maybe because then...Mike-y WOULD NOT get 50% of Brian's PUBLISHING? Shocked Shocked  That would be when Brian said..."OK...YOU WRITE THE SONGS, MIKE!...I'm CHECKING OUT!"  And Brian did! HE WENT TO BED FOR 10 YEARS! LOL LOL  All you Beach Boy FANS CAN THANK MIKE-Y FOR THAT!!!

God... you are unbelievably slow... YES, THE SMOKING GUN TAPE IS of Stan AND me Air Quotes  (It's called "PROOF") Stan doesn't really love Mike-y... or he would NEVER HAVE TAPED THIS CONVERSATION... AND THEN GIVEN IT TO STEPHEN! : Unless, OF COURSE, he was STUPID!

IN THE MIKE LOVE-LESS dictionary!  While Mike-y was pretending to practice "meditation"... he was really just napping and SCHEMING!   I have coined the word "SCHEMATATION"  to describe this.

DO NOT LET MIKE'S PHONY MEDITATION SH*T FOOL YA ... THERE IS NOTHING SPIRITUAL ABOUT MIKE...  MIKE'S GOD IS "MONEY!'

I REPEAT... MIKE IS CONDESCENDING TOWARDS BRIAN...  THINKS HE'S BETTER THAN BRIAN...  LOL LOL  IF YOU ONLY KNEW THE HALF OF IT! Smiley Smiley DON'T LET MIKE'S FAKE MEDITATION FOOL YA!

Page 2... SNEAKY STAN TAPED IT... and that's not all STAN TAPED... Wait till Mike-y gets an earful of the "SMOKING GUN TAPE"... where Stan tapes he and I talking about...          WHO LIED BEST IN COURT FOR... MIKE

[For those curious about where all of Rocky's words can be found: http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php?action=profile;u=9448;sa=showPosts;start=0]

Mike's god is money. People lied in court for Mike. Smoking gun tapes. Mike is condescending towards Brian. Mike is a schemer. Mike threw a pool deck chair at Brian.

And all of a sudden Rocky had an epiphany that Mike is deserving of tremendous respect? Something just doesn't add up here.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2020, 11:38:39 AM by rab2591 » Logged

Bill Tobelman's SMiLE site
Magic Transistor Radio
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2922


Bill Cooper Mystery Babylon


View Profile
« Reply #53 on: June 15, 2020, 11:51:22 AM »

I just listened to the interview. I own the book and already read it. I am probably a bit more open to his side of the story than most. I didn't read anything in the book that contradicts things I have heard from other books and documentaries of that period.  It doesn't mean that he was a good choice to work with Brian. I would have said the same of Eugene Landy wrote a book. Is it possible that they are lying? Sure. But I want to at least get a different perspective.

Obviously he doesn't have all his facts straight. Such as Brian being in bed for 10 years. But he wasn't around until 1976. Maybe he was going back to Brian's break down 10 years earlier. He mentioned that Brian worked on Smile. I have read elsewhere that there was talks of putting Do You Like Worms on the LA Light Album. Is it possible that Brian worked on some Smile tracks at that time? How Rocky speaks of Dennis and Carl offends people, but Carl was in the worst shape of his life at the time. Dennis was also going down hill and could be a confrontational person. I also read negative things about Mike, so I don't think this was pro Mike. If anything, it was pro Brian. Rocky seemed to hate the rock n roll attitude of all the Beach Boys minus Brian. I don't agree with him punching Carl and beating up Dennis.

I recall asking a couple years ago why Eugene Landy is acceptable to talk about, make books and movies about, but some people don't even want to discuss Rocky! I never got an answer. No one has asked Brian about Rocky, but he gets asked about Landy often. I would like more clarity on why Rocky is a more sensitive issue than Landy.
Logged

"Over the years, I've been accused of not supporting our new music from this era (67-73) and just wanting to play our hits. That's complete b.s......I was also, as the front man, the one promoting these songs onstage and have the scars to show for it."
Mike Love autobiography (pg 242-243)
Steve Latshaw
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 539


View Profile
« Reply #54 on: June 15, 2020, 01:38:21 PM »

<<He mentioned that Brian worked on Smile. I have read elsewhere that there was talks of putting Do You Like Worms on the LA Light Album.>>
1. In the final issue of David Leaf's Pet Sounds newsletter, there's an interview with Bruce about the forthcoming first CBS Beach Boys album.  Bruce mentions that James Guercio wanted to begin the album with Do You Like Worms and end it with Can't Wait Too Long.
2. A couple of years later, just before the release of Ten Years of Harmony, Bruce discusses his idea of putting together a Smile collage.
Logged
Debbie KL
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 817


View Profile
« Reply #55 on: June 15, 2020, 03:04:53 PM »

Here's a rough but accurate transcription of the part in question (I didn't transcribe all of the "um"s and repeated words):

[Ron Hamady] "There were people that took exception to the credit that we gave Mike Love in the book. There's a Mike Love camp and a Brian Wilson camp, and sometimes those two camps are at odds with each other and when I listen to Rocky talk about all of his experiences when the book was being edited, I said "That should be in the book, Rocky. That should be in the book, Rocky. That should be in the book." - he just told me story after story after story..."

[Rocky interjects] "And Ron put them all in the book."

[Ron continues] "Well, I put a bunch of them in the book and it really fleshed things out considerably. But the one thing that Rocky did not realize was his tremendous respect for Mike Love. When Rocky would talk about how that band survived...Mike Love was the glue that held that band together."

[source: https://wfmu.org/archiveplayer/?show=93892&archive=187375&starttime=]

So Rocky has "tremendous respect" for Mike Love? Let's hear it from Rocky himself (read the parts in yellow to get the meat of the quote):

Mike is the only person on the PLANET entitled to use the name "BEACH BOY-S in any fashion shape or form... EVEN Brian can't use it... Brian gladly gave it to Mike JUST TO GET AWAY FROM HIM... as far as he could GET!  That's when Brian PUT TOGETHER his own GROUP of GENIUS MUSICIANS... who can actually PLAY an INSTRUMENT!

Because I took it even one GIANT step further... and took a meeting with Brian's Lawyers at the Brentwood Mezzaluna restaurant... and PLAYED it for them!  They, then, got me...    MY OWN ATTORNEY ... Charles English... who secured IMMUNITY for me!  And then the SH*T really hit the fan for MIKE... (to the tune of millions)...TO LEARN THE REST... you'll just have to read the book when it comes out!  And it will COME OUT!   And Beach Boy fans will "BOO"... Mike off the stage!  And Brian and Stephen will both HAVE THE LAST LAUGH!!!

Mike-y threw a POOL DECK CHAIR at Brian  Transcendental Meditation and SCREAMED, "I'm NOT SINGING THOSE FU*KING WORDS OF Van Dyke Parks... Mike-y REALLY JUST DID NOT WANT Brian WRITING WITH ANYONE ELSE... (Now why would that be?...) Maybe because then...Mike-y WOULD NOT get 50% of Brian's PUBLISHING? Shocked Shocked  That would be when Brian said..."OK...YOU WRITE THE SONGS, MIKE!...I'm CHECKING OUT!"  And Brian did! HE WENT TO BED FOR 10 YEARS! LOL LOL  All you Beach Boy FANS CAN THANK MIKE-Y FOR THAT!!!

God... you are unbelievably slow... YES, THE SMOKING GUN TAPE IS of Stan AND me Air Quotes  (It's called "PROOF") Stan doesn't really love Mike-y... or he would NEVER HAVE TAPED THIS CONVERSATION... AND THEN GIVEN IT TO STEPHEN! : Unless, OF COURSE, he was STUPID!

IN THE MIKE LOVE-LESS dictionary!  While Mike-y was pretending to practice "meditation"... he was really just napping and SCHEMING!   I have coined the word "SCHEMATATION"  to describe this.

DO NOT LET MIKE'S PHONY MEDITATION SH*T FOOL YA ... THERE IS NOTHING SPIRITUAL ABOUT MIKE...  MIKE'S GOD IS "MONEY!'

I REPEAT... MIKE IS CONDESCENDING TOWARDS BRIAN...  THINKS HE'S BETTER THAN BRIAN...  LOL LOL  IF YOU ONLY KNEW THE HALF OF IT! Smiley Smiley DON'T LET MIKE'S FAKE MEDITATION FOOL YA!

Page 2... SNEAKY STAN TAPED IT... and that's not all STAN TAPED... Wait till Mike-y gets an earful of the "SMOKING GUN TAPE"... where Stan tapes he and I talking about...          WHO LIED BEST IN COURT FOR... MIKE

[For those curious about where all of Rocky's words can be found: http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php?action=profile;u=9448;sa=showPosts;start=0]

Mike's god is money. People lied in court for Mike. Smoking gun tapes. Mike is condescending towards Brian. Mike is a schemer. Mike threw a pool deck chair at Brian.

And all of a sudden Rocky had an epiphany that Mike is deserving of tremendous respect? Something just doesn't add up here.

I guess it's about the "mu-u-ny" and not being sued, as always. I didn't know Rocky well. I just remember him sitting for hours when he was "working for" Brian in his living room lifting dumb-bells in front of a mirror he had propped up on the floor. He seemed thrilled with himself. Both Brian and I just had an incredulous look at this show. Oh, and by the way. I'll be selling my book for $1000 each any day now (yes, I'm being sarcastic). I'm thinking that it was the LA Times that once considered the $$$ that hangers on of celebrities made each year. It was pretty impressive. I guess it's a business.
Logged
mtaber
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 317


View Profile
« Reply #56 on: June 15, 2020, 03:54:41 PM »

Landry is the more ďtalked aboutĒ figure in Brianís history because he was more important (in a negative way of course) than Rocky.  Rocky was more of a bystander. 
Logged
Magic Transistor Radio
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2922


Bill Cooper Mystery Babylon


View Profile
« Reply #57 on: June 15, 2020, 03:59:29 PM »

Landry is the more ďtalked aboutĒ figure in Brianís history because he was more important (in a negative way of course) than Rocky.  Rocky was more of a bystander. 

If Landy is more negative, then why is Rocky a more sensitive issue? Why can't people ask Brian about his memory with Stan and Rocky?
Logged

"Over the years, I've been accused of not supporting our new music from this era (67-73) and just wanting to play our hits. That's complete b.s......I was also, as the front man, the one promoting these songs onstage and have the scars to show for it."
Mike Love autobiography (pg 242-243)
Magic Transistor Radio
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2922


Bill Cooper Mystery Babylon


View Profile
« Reply #58 on: June 15, 2020, 04:02:44 PM »

Here's a rough but accurate transcription of the part in question (I didn't transcribe all of the "um"s and repeated words):

[Ron Hamady] "There were people that took exception to the credit that we gave Mike Love in the book. There's a Mike Love camp and a Brian Wilson camp, and sometimes those two camps are at odds with each other and when I listen to Rocky talk about all of his experiences when the book was being edited, I said "That should be in the book, Rocky. That should be in the book, Rocky. That should be in the book." - he just told me story after story after story..."

[Rocky interjects] "And Ron put them all in the book."

[Ron continues] "Well, I put a bunch of them in the book and it really fleshed things out considerably. But the one thing that Rocky did not realize was his tremendous respect for Mike Love. When Rocky would talk about how that band survived...Mike Love was the glue that held that band together."

[source: https://wfmu.org/archiveplayer/?show=93892&archive=187375&starttime=]

So Rocky has "tremendous respect" for Mike Love? Let's hear it from Rocky himself (read the parts in yellow to get the meat of the quote):

Mike is the only person on the PLANET entitled to use the name "BEACH BOY-S in any fashion shape or form... EVEN Brian can't use it... Brian gladly gave it to Mike JUST TO GET AWAY FROM HIM... as far as he could GET!  That's when Brian PUT TOGETHER his own GROUP of GENIUS MUSICIANS... who can actually PLAY an INSTRUMENT!

Because I took it even one GIANT step further... and took a meeting with Brian's Lawyers at the Brentwood Mezzaluna restaurant... and PLAYED it for them!  They, then, got me...    MY OWN ATTORNEY ... Charles English... who secured IMMUNITY for me!  And then the SH*T really hit the fan for MIKE... (to the tune of millions)...TO LEARN THE REST... you'll just have to read the book when it comes out!  And it will COME OUT!   And Beach Boy fans will "BOO"... Mike off the stage!  And Brian and Stephen will both HAVE THE LAST LAUGH!!!

Mike-y threw a POOL DECK CHAIR at Brian  Transcendental Meditation and SCREAMED, "I'm NOT SINGING THOSE FU*KING WORDS OF Van Dyke Parks... Mike-y REALLY JUST DID NOT WANT Brian WRITING WITH ANYONE ELSE... (Now why would that be?...) Maybe because then...Mike-y WOULD NOT get 50% of Brian's PUBLISHING? Shocked Shocked  That would be when Brian said..."OK...YOU WRITE THE SONGS, MIKE!...I'm CHECKING OUT!"  And Brian did! HE WENT TO BED FOR 10 YEARS! LOL LOL  All you Beach Boy FANS CAN THANK MIKE-Y FOR THAT!!!

God... you are unbelievably slow... YES, THE SMOKING GUN TAPE IS of Stan AND me Air Quotes  (It's called "PROOF") Stan doesn't really love Mike-y... or he would NEVER HAVE TAPED THIS CONVERSATION... AND THEN GIVEN IT TO STEPHEN! : Unless, OF COURSE, he was STUPID!

IN THE MIKE LOVE-LESS dictionary!  While Mike-y was pretending to practice "meditation"... he was really just napping and SCHEMING!   I have coined the word "SCHEMATATION"  to describe this.

DO NOT LET MIKE'S PHONY MEDITATION SH*T FOOL YA ... THERE IS NOTHING SPIRITUAL ABOUT MIKE...  MIKE'S GOD IS "MONEY!'

I REPEAT... MIKE IS CONDESCENDING TOWARDS BRIAN...  THINKS HE'S BETTER THAN BRIAN...  LOL LOL  IF YOU ONLY KNEW THE HALF OF IT! Smiley Smiley DON'T LET MIKE'S FAKE MEDITATION FOOL YA!

Page 2... SNEAKY STAN TAPED IT... and that's not all STAN TAPED... Wait till Mike-y gets an earful of the "SMOKING GUN TAPE"... where Stan tapes he and I talking about...          WHO LIED BEST IN COURT FOR... MIKE

[For those curious about where all of Rocky's words can be found: http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php?action=profile;u=9448;sa=showPosts;start=0]

Mike's god is money. People lied in court for Mike. Smoking gun tapes. Mike is condescending towards Brian. Mike is a schemer. Mike threw a pool deck chair at Brian.

And all of a sudden Rocky had an epiphany that Mike is deserving of tremendous respect? Something just doesn't add up here.

I guess it's about the "mu-u-ny" and not being sued, as always. I didn't know Rocky well. I just remember him sitting for hours when he was "working for" Brian in his living room lifting dumb-bells in front of a mirror he had propped up on the floor. He seemed thrilled with himself. Both Brian and I just had an incredulous look at this show. Oh, and by the way. I'll be selling my book for $1000 each any day now (yes, I'm being sarcastic). I'm thinking that it was the LA Times that once considered the $$$ that hangers on of celebrities made each year. It was pretty impressive. I guess it's a business.

If it was about the money, then why did he release the book when he did? Why not 2012? And why is it so evil to write to make money? Someone else released the book 50 Songs to cash in on the 50th anniversary. I would think that was more to cash in than this.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2020, 04:31:45 PM by Magic Transistor Radio » Logged

"Over the years, I've been accused of not supporting our new music from this era (67-73) and just wanting to play our hits. That's complete b.s......I was also, as the front man, the one promoting these songs onstage and have the scars to show for it."
Mike Love autobiography (pg 242-243)
mtaber
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 317


View Profile
« Reply #59 on: June 15, 2020, 04:49:08 PM »

I certainly donít think Rocky is a more ďsensitiveĒ issue. Heís just a less ďrelevantĒ issue.

Anyone who followed Rockyís posts on this site a couple of years ago, then also read the thread Ron had about the book more recently, has to wonder about the 180 degree change in the story.  My own opinion is that there was fear of legal action from Mike if the story didnít paint him in glowing terms.  Which makes the book worthless.   
Logged
Magic Transistor Radio
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2922


Bill Cooper Mystery Babylon


View Profile
« Reply #60 on: June 15, 2020, 05:16:04 PM »

I certainly donít think Rocky is a more ďsensitiveĒ issue. Heís just a less ďrelevantĒ issue.

Anyone who followed Rockyís posts on this site a couple of years ago, then also read the thread Ron had about the book more recently, has to wonder about the 180 degree change in the story.  My own opinion is that there was fear of legal action from Mike if the story didnít paint him in glowing terms.  Which makes the book worthless.   

People keep saying that. I never got the sense from reading the book that it paints Mike in glowing terms. I think the years that Rocky worked with Brian all 3 Wilsons were struggling.  Mike and Al were keeping the band alive at that time. If he worked with Brian from 72-74 and said that Mike was keeping the band alive, I would have an issue with that statement. Now I do think Rocky takes too much credit for saving Brian's life. Given that Brian was in worse shape in the early 80s. But I don't know what Brian's condition was when Rocky and Stan got fired.
Logged

"Over the years, I've been accused of not supporting our new music from this era (67-73) and just wanting to play our hits. That's complete b.s......I was also, as the front man, the one promoting these songs onstage and have the scars to show for it."
Mike Love autobiography (pg 242-243)
rab2591
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 5157


"My God. It's full of stars."


View Profile
« Reply #61 on: June 15, 2020, 05:35:04 PM »

From what I gather, people were expecting a lot of dirt on Mike - enough for people to "boo" him off stage (in Rocky's own words). It went from some 35 chapters to 28 apparently (from what we were told of it, and read of it in the excerpts that were posted). Not that editing doesn't take place for books like this, but people were promised one thing and got another. TBH I haven't read the book, and I'm curious if there is mention of this "SMOKING GUN TAPE" that supposedly proves Mike brought in fake witnesses to the trial.

Why did he not release the book in 2012? Probably lack of foresight. He probably saw all the money the 50th was raking in from people who actually prepared for it, and wanted to jump on the wagon. It probably took a while to write the thing, a long while to find a publisher willing to release it...thus it got released when it did. Plenty of Beach Boys books have come out post-2012.

Why don't people ask Brian about Rocky and Stan? I mean, how many people care about Rocky and Stan? Comparing those two's "notoriety" to Landy's is greatly unfair. More random and less-hardcore fans know that Brian was controlled by a psychiatrist...but ask them about Rocky Pamplin and they'd give you a blank stare. Why waste interview questions on characters that very few of the public know anything about? Not saying that people shouldn't ask Brian about Rocky, but I don't think it's unusual that he isn't asked.

I would love to know the end-game of Rocky when it came to hyping up this "SMOKING GUN TAPE" and other topics - it is clear to anyone that such topics would be a no-go for any publisher. Makes me wonder if Rocky was doing it to get Mike's attention...

PS, Debbie, thanks for your response! I love reading those snippets of you and Brian during that time.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2020, 05:36:06 PM by rab2591 » Logged

Bill Tobelman's SMiLE site
Don Malcolm
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 851



View Profile
« Reply #62 on: June 15, 2020, 10:25:51 PM »

I think many are hopeful that somewhere in the next few copyright releases, someone will turn up a demo of "Mess of Help" with the original lyrics. My recollection is that they won't be found in the session; even if the original lyrics were used in December, they were (according to those who would know...) wiped off in favor of Jack's lyrics when in the home stretch.

Debbie, do you have any other sense of just who it was who "inspired" our wandering boys? Some bopper at a club on the strip? And at the risk of extreme political incorrectness, can anyone describe how to do "the Chicano rumble"? (probably involves a lot of ducking, which I am doing right now)

And speaking of "(according to) those who would know", AGD is already in denial mode about Ron Hamady's performance on the Michael Shelley interview over at you-know-where, tut-tut-tutting about prerecording and attempting to explain away the abruptness of the truncated interview when anyone listening with any sense of tone or pace will clearly note how Shelley sounds extremely uncomfortable at what he's hearing from Hamady. In response to AGD's featherbedding, we'll just trot out the word that our ever-charmingly arrogant Briton would use if he could only join us here--bollocks!  3D  Smokin

Rab, the type of response that I think most of us would like to see from Brian concerning Stan and Rocky would something analogous to the great story about his "correction" on the autographed album he signed for Don Henley. But instead of him changing "great" to "good," it would be something like if he were handed an LP signed by Stan and Rocky, and if he simply crossed out their names and returned it to the person who'd given it to him without saying a word...
Logged
Steve Mayo
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 1153



View Profile
« Reply #63 on: June 16, 2020, 06:22:29 AM »

<<He mentioned that Brian worked on Smile. I have read elsewhere that there was talks of putting Do You Like Worms on the LA Light Album.>>
1. In the final issue of David Leaf's Pet Sounds newsletter, there's an interview with Bruce about the forthcoming first CBS Beach Boys album.  Bruce mentions that James Guercio wanted to begin the album with Do You Like Worms and end it with Can't Wait Too Long.
2. A couple of years later, just before the release of Ten Years of Harmony, Bruce discusses his idea of putting together a Smile collage.


In the same pet sounds magazine from 11/78 bruce first mentions the idea of a collage of smile material in addition to the above two songs guercio wanted on la light. He said he wanted brian to put the collage together. Bruce said he dropped the idea of a collage for la light because brian didnít want it on the lp.
Logged
c-man
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 4657


View Profile WWW
« Reply #64 on: June 16, 2020, 06:29:21 AM »

<<He mentioned that Brian worked on Smile. I have read elsewhere that there was talks of putting Do You Like Worms on the LA Light Album.>>
1. In the final issue of David Leaf's Pet Sounds newsletter, there's an interview with Bruce about the forthcoming first CBS Beach Boys album.  Bruce mentions that James Guercio wanted to begin the album with Do You Like Worms and end it with Can't Wait Too Long.
2. A couple of years later, just before the release of Ten Years of Harmony, Bruce discusses his idea of putting together a Smile collage.


In the same pet sounds magazine from 11/78 bruce first mentions the idea of a collage of smile material in addition to the above two songs guercio wanted on la light. He said he wanted brian to put the collage together. Bruce said he dropped the idea of a collage for la light because brian didnít want it on the lp.

Yeah, I really REALLY doubt Brian did any work on the SMiLE tapes in '77-'78. It IS true that Dennis and the Brother Studios engineers pulled all the tapes out of the vaults, and did some cataloging and rough mixes. The tapes were reportedly played over the sound system of the Boys' jet plane on one of their tours of the Midwest within the next year or so. So Brian would have likely heard the tapes, but I think this was after Rocky was gone. And there was obviously interest from Guercio and CBS - but not from Brian. Smiley

Of course, Brian DID produce another unreleased album for the BBs shortly after Love You's completion - that being Adult Child. Perhaps THAT'S what Rocky's thinking of?
Logged
c-man
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 4657


View Profile WWW
« Reply #65 on: June 16, 2020, 06:34:01 AM »


And speaking of "(according to) those who would know", AGD is already in denial mode about Ron Hamady's performance on the Michael Shelley interview over at you-know-where, tut-tut-tutting about prerecording and attempting to explain away the abruptness of the truncated interview when anyone listening with any sense of tone or pace will clearly note how Shelley sounds extremely uncomfortable at what he's hearing from Hamady. In response to AGD's featherbedding, we'll just trot out the word that our ever-charmingly arrogant Briton would use if he could only join us here--bollocks!  3D  Smokin


Playing devil's advocate here - and I'll admit to not yet having heard the interview myself, mostly out of indifference - but AGD states that he was told by the interviewer himself that the show was pre-recorded and edited, with one final question & answer being cut. For what it's worth.
Logged
Magic Transistor Radio
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2922


Bill Cooper Mystery Babylon


View Profile
« Reply #66 on: June 16, 2020, 08:02:53 AM »

From what I gather, people were expecting a lot of dirt on Mike - enough for people to "boo" him off stage (in Rocky's own words). It went from some 35 chapters to 28 apparently (from what we were told of it, and read of it in the excerpts that were posted). Not that editing doesn't take place for books like this, but people were promised one thing and got another. TBH I haven't read the book, and I'm curious if there is mention of this "SMOKING GUN TAPE" that supposedly proves Mike brought in fake witnesses to the trial.

Why did he not release the book in 2012? Probably lack of foresight. He probably saw all the money the 50th was raking in from people who actually prepared for it, and wanted to jump on the wagon. It probably took a while to write the thing, a long while to find a publisher willing to release it...thus it got released when it did. Plenty of Beach Boys books have come out post-2012.

Why don't people ask Brian about Rocky and Stan? I mean, how many people care about Rocky and Stan? Comparing those two's "notoriety" to Landy's is greatly unfair. More random and less-hardcore fans know that Brian was controlled by a psychiatrist...but ask them about Rocky Pamplin and they'd give you a blank stare. Why waste interview questions on characters that very few of the public know anything about? Not saying that people shouldn't ask Brian about Rocky, but I don't think it's unusual that he isn't asked.

I would love to know the end-game of Rocky when it came to hyping up this "SMOKING GUN TAPE" and other topics - it is clear to anyone that such topics would be a no-go for any publisher. Makes me wonder if Rocky was doing it to get Mike's attention...

PS, Debbie, thanks for your response! I love reading those snippets of you and Brian during that time.

Rocky and Stan were with Brian for 3 years! This during the darkest period in the Beach Boys career! They almost broke up in 78, all 3 Wilsons were addicted to drugs, etc. Honestly, I think this is a fascinating period to learn about! I think the only reason Landy got more attention is because the Beach Boys were getting more attention in 1976 after greatest hits went platinum, Rock n Roll Music was a hit and Brian was back on the road. In 1990 after recently having a number 1 hit and the Beach Boys getting in the Rock n Roll hall of fame.  1977-1980, the Beach Boys were under the radar.

In terms of the baggage he had on Mike, can we really blame that on Rocky? Surely, Stan and Steve got to proof read the book and word got out to Mike. If a law suit was threatened,  he had no choice. This is true of any biography or documentary about people that are living. Unfortunately, they may either not want certain facts out there, or they don't think it's accurate. Who knows.

Rocky may have talked about the 90s law suit of Mike on here, but the book all took place from 76 to 80. So they may have refocused the book. I also heard that originally, this was Steve's story. I believe he was close to the situation of the 90s lawsuit which makes more sense.
Logged

"Over the years, I've been accused of not supporting our new music from this era (67-73) and just wanting to play our hits. That's complete b.s......I was also, as the front man, the one promoting these songs onstage and have the scars to show for it."
Mike Love autobiography (pg 242-243)
rab2591
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 5157


"My God. It's full of stars."


View Profile
« Reply #67 on: June 16, 2020, 09:20:07 AM »

Regarding Rocky and Stan, Iím not denying that asking Brian about them wouldnít be interesting. Iím just saying that you had a psychiatrist who literally controlled Brianís life, co-created music with him, had the surf nazis spy on him, and attempted to take everything he had (and basically attempted to kill Brian). Comparatively Rocky and Stanís story isnít nearly as epic...which is why they arenít as prominent in the story of Brianís life (whether or not they should be).

As for the Mike stuff, I can agree with what you wrote. But part of me thinks thereís more to it, but Iíll leave it at that.
Logged

Bill Tobelman's SMiLE site
Magic Transistor Radio
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2922


Bill Cooper Mystery Babylon


View Profile
« Reply #68 on: June 16, 2020, 02:37:30 PM »

Regarding Rocky and Stan, Iím not denying that asking Brian about them wouldnít be interesting. Iím just saying that you had a psychiatrist who literally controlled Brianís life, co-created music with him, had the surf nazis spy on him, and attempted to take everything he had (and basically attempted to kill Brian). Comparatively Rocky and Stanís story isnít nearly as epic...which is why they arenít as prominent in the story of Brianís life (whether or not they should be).

As for the Mike stuff, I can agree with what you wrote. But part of me thinks thereís more to it, but Iíll leave it at that.

I know it's not as epic, but someone got on me a few years ago for suggesting that we ask Brian about Rocky because it's too sensitive of an issue. But since the book came out, many people are claiming that it is full of lies. That is why I am interested in knowing what Brian, Marylin, Stan, Steve, or anyone else who was close to the situation has to say. I am willing to over look historical inaccuracies with false memories. They all do this. It does it mean they are lying.

I think that certain facts being left concerning a living person is always an issue with a biography. Some people are just a bit more protective of their reputation than others. Not sure we can blame Rocky for that. It sounds like Ron was more concerned with the p.r. side of it. Not to blame him either. It may just be the smart thing to do.
Logged

"Over the years, I've been accused of not supporting our new music from this era (67-73) and just wanting to play our hits. That's complete b.s......I was also, as the front man, the one promoting these songs onstage and have the scars to show for it."
Mike Love autobiography (pg 242-243)
Debbie KL
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 817


View Profile
« Reply #69 on: June 16, 2020, 02:38:08 PM »

I think many are hopeful that somewhere in the next few copyright releases, someone will turn up a demo of "Mess of Help" with the original lyrics. My recollection is that they won't be found in the session; even if the original lyrics were used in December, they were (according to those who would know...) wiped off in favor of Jack's lyrics when in the home stretch.

Debbie, do you have any other sense of just who it was who "inspired" our wandering boys? Some bopper at a club on the strip? And at the risk of extreme political incorrectness, can anyone describe how to do "the Chicano rumble"? (probably involves a lot of ducking, which I am doing right now)

And speaking of "(according to) those who would know", AGD is already in denial mode about Ron Hamady's performance on the Michael Shelley interview over at you-know-where, tut-tut-tutting about prerecording and attempting to explain away the abruptness of the truncated interview when anyone listening with any sense of tone or pace will clearly note how Shelley sounds extremely uncomfortable at what he's hearing from Hamady. In response to AGD's featherbedding, we'll just trot out the word that our ever-charmingly arrogant Briton would use if he could only join us here--bollocks!  3D  Smokin

Rab, the type of response that I think most of us would like to see from Brian concerning Stan and Rocky would something analogous to the great story about his "correction" on the autographed album he signed for Don Henley. But instead of him changing "great" to "good," it would be something like if he were handed an LP signed by Stan and Rocky, and if he simply crossed out their names and returned it to the person who'd given it to him without saying a word...

Those were the lyrics that I remember fairly clearly. I would bet that Brian wouldn't say a thing about Stan and Rocky. It's not what he does.

Apparently I'm still being shamed by other people on this board for noting that people made money off of Brian. Why is that such an issue for them? I'd enjoy an explanation.
Logged
guitarfool2002
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 9021


"Barba non facit aliam historici"


View Profile WWW
« Reply #70 on: June 16, 2020, 02:51:06 PM »

Landy was a public figure, of course the interest and attention on him would go beyond two guys hired for a few years to bodyguard Brian and try to keep him clean of dope. That's not saying their stories are not of interest, because they are to help fill in even a small part of the band's history for interested fans. But Landy's fame and infamy goes way beyond that of Rocky, or Jack Reilly, or anyone else who served a behind the scenes role in the 70's.

I think the issue is getting away from what Rocky actually said versus what's in the book.

Anyone else notice during the interview that Rocky barely mentioned Mike Love? A lot of it was instead his admiration for Brian and how nice of a guy Brian was. That lined up more with Rocky's previous comments and book excerpts than what Ron seems to have injected into the narrative. Notice Ron was the one who squeezed in a talking point about Mike-as-savior and how he helped "remind" Rocky how much Rocky admired Mike.

As can be seen plain as day for anyone reading here, it wasn't what Rocky thought a few years ago, nor was it what he wrote in his original 36 chapter manuscript before Ron signed on as a co-author.

That is the frustration for a lot of people who have been posting about this.

I'd also ask if the question is why hasn't Brian been asked about Rocky and Stan, why hasn't Mike been asked about Steve and Stan, his own brothers? The Love brothers had been estranged for years to the point where one brother was posting comments across the web against his brother, and also actively promoting Rocky as he was shopping his original book! I'd think there would be as much interest in what tore the Love brothers apart as there would be for Rocky, but you'd be hard-pressed to find such a question asked of Mike in at least the past 15-20 years.

And I'd still like to know what Rocky being reminded of an admiration for Mike Love has to do with the narrative of Rocky telling his story in light of the accounts Rocky told previously. It feels like a square-peg/round-hole scenario maybe coming for reasons of appeasement versus actually adding something essential to the story.
Logged

"All of us have the privilege of making music that helps and heals - to make music that makes people happier, stronger, and kinder. Don't forget: Music is God's voice." - Brian Wilson
SMiLE Brian
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 8191



View Profile
« Reply #71 on: June 16, 2020, 02:59:13 PM »

Ron Hamady strangely has the same talking points pushed on this board a few years back....
Logged

And production aside, Iíd so much rather hear a 14 year old David Marks shred some guitar on Chug-a-lug than hear a 51 year old Mike Love sing about bangin some chick in a swimming pool.-rab2591
CenturyDeprived
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 5188



View Profile
« Reply #72 on: June 16, 2020, 05:05:28 PM »

If Rocky ever wrote a rough draft of his book back when he was in the original state of mind that he was in (at the time of his original posts), I suppose that draft might be as much of a holy grail to some as some lost SMiLE tapes or the Inside Pop reels LOL

I just don't know how anyone can take a word Rocky says seriously after changing his tone like that, or how his co-author can promote the book with a straight face, being that those many original posts are a thing that exists.  Those posts didn't not happen. Yet Rocky and Ron just have to keep pretending that those posts don't exist, continuing a charade, to what end I'm not sure of.

It's interesting to think of what the reception to the book would have been, had Rocky not done those original posts. I suppose it would just be dismissed as relatively boring and devoid of as much insider info as it might have been assumed he might have otherwise had to share - but now we *know* that Rocky had more to say... much more it would seem... and was muted for reasons we can only speculate. 
« Last Edit: June 16, 2020, 05:15:12 PM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
Magic Transistor Radio
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2922


Bill Cooper Mystery Babylon


View Profile
« Reply #73 on: June 16, 2020, 08:53:23 PM »

Landy was a public figure, of course the interest and attention on him would go beyond two guys hired for a few years to bodyguard Brian and try to keep him clean of dope. That's not saying their stories are not of interest, because they are to help fill in even a small part of the band's history for interested fans. But Landy's fame and infamy goes way beyond that of Rocky, or Jack Reilly, or anyone else who served a behind the scenes role in the 70's.

I think the issue is getting away from what Rocky actually said versus what's in the book.

Anyone else notice during the interview that Rocky barely mentioned Mike Love? A lot of it was instead his admiration for Brian and how nice of a guy Brian was. That lined up more with Rocky's previous comments and book excerpts than what Ron seems to have injected into the narrative. Notice Ron was the one who squeezed in a talking point about Mike-as-savior and how he helped "remind" Rocky how much Rocky admired Mike.

As can be seen plain as day for anyone reading here, it wasn't what Rocky thought a few years ago, nor was it what he wrote in his original 36 chapter manuscript before Ron signed on as a co-author.

That is the frustration for a lot of people who have been posting about this.

I'd also ask if the question is why hasn't Brian been asked about Rocky and Stan, why hasn't Mike been asked about Steve and Stan, his own brothers? The Love brothers had been estranged for years to the point where one brother was posting comments across the web against his brother, and also actively promoting Rocky as he was shopping his original book! I'd think there would be as much interest in what tore the Love brothers apart as there would be for Rocky, but you'd be hard-pressed to find such a question asked of Mike in at least the past 15-20 years.

And I'd still like to know what Rocky being reminded of an admiration for Mike Love has to do with the narrative of Rocky telling his story in light of the accounts Rocky told previously. It feels like a square-peg/round-hole scenario maybe coming for reasons of appeasement versus actually adding something essential to the story.

Interesting points here. So could it be a similar situation to Brian's book 'Wouldn't it Be Nice' in which Landy inserted a lot of his own ideas into the book? I don't know much about Ron, but it's possible he changed Rocky's story to fit his own. Don't know if Rocky is aware, has read the book, or even cares.

As for Mike, he does bring up his brothers whenever he is asked about fighting Dennis Wilson and hitting Carl. He is quick to point out that it was Stan and Rocky. I am inclined to believe Mike, because in Endless Wave, Mike takes the side of Dennis and Carl. He even wanted Steve fired at the time. But some historians like to paint the picture that Mike was in cahoots with his brothers and Rocky.
Logged

"Over the years, I've been accused of not supporting our new music from this era (67-73) and just wanting to play our hits. That's complete b.s......I was also, as the front man, the one promoting these songs onstage and have the scars to show for it."
Mike Love autobiography (pg 242-243)
Magic Transistor Radio
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2922


Bill Cooper Mystery Babylon


View Profile
« Reply #74 on: June 16, 2020, 08:58:43 PM »

Ron Hamady strangely has the same talking points pushed on this board a few years back....

As Rocky, or as today? I mean was Ron already pushing the story in a softer direction?
Logged

"Over the years, I've been accused of not supporting our new music from this era (67-73) and just wanting to play our hits. That's complete b.s......I was also, as the front man, the one promoting these songs onstage and have the scars to show for it."
Mike Love autobiography (pg 242-243)
gfx
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 Go Up Print 
gfx
Jump to:  
gfx
Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines Page created in 0.258 seconds with 21 queries.
Helios Multi design by Bloc
gfx
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!