place for compiling any new information on a next BB album

[Andrew G. Doe]

1 - "biggest fan": if you really needed me to pepper that comment with smileys then I'm not sure you should be let out into the cold hard world where people use humor, sarcasm, irony and self-deprecation. Oh, and jokes. Seriously. You're too delicate a flower to be exposed to such things.

Or... maybe I should take that as a compliment that, such is my standing in this forum - and indeed the BB fan world in general - anything I say will be taken as gospel truth*. Thank you.

And no, from some posts here and elsewhere it would truly appear that many fans just want more product, irrespective of potential quality. Like nearly 30 studio albums isn't enough.

2 - "It seems like no album is indeed it right now": which is why I said "currently". I could probably add "and for the foreseeable future".**


[* - this is also a joke]
[** - this isn't]

[Lonely Summer]

But if what's best for The Beach Boys is to go out on top, then there shouldn't be this other band masquerading as The Beach Boys. It dilutes the legacy. If they wanted to bill their shows as Mike Love's Beach Boys, or A Tribute to the Beach Boys, that would be okay. Joey Molland has toured for years doing Badfinger songs as Joey Molland's Badfinger, because obviously, it can't be the original group, 3 of the originals are dead. Felix Cavaliere tours doing Rascals music as Felix Cavaliere's Rascals; Gene Cornish and Dino Danelli tour as The New Rascals.

[Andrew G. Doe]

But if what's best for The Beach Boys is to go out on top, then there shouldn't be this other band masquerading as The Beach Boys. It dilutes the legacy.

Judging on the evidence since 1998, Brian's people and Carl's estate would seem to disagree with you. As for diluting the legacy... I think they did that pretty well anyway from 1981 to roughly 1993. It's not as if M&B have single-handedly pulled the band's reputation down into the gutter: that's been a work in progress since 1967, with an occasional generous assist from Brian.

[The Shift]

Someone needs to change the title of this thread from "information" to "gloom, pessimism and speculation"

[Sheriff John Stone]

Someone needs to change the title of this thread from "information" to "gloom, pessimism and speculation"

I think you're onto something, John, about changing/starting a new thread. We exhausted "the death" of C50 and all of the reasons for its demise - according to us anyway. I'm not sure we should entirely change this thread, the professor's thread, which focuses specifically on the recording of a new album. I do think it's time to ask the question: What are Brian, Al, Carl's estate, and maybe even David going to do about this Beach Boy's situation now. Yeah, Mike took his ball and went home, but, in a way, the ball is now in Brian and Al's court - if they want it to be.

[SMiLE Brian]

Only time will tell, I hope they make an album this year or next. Then tour to promote it.

[Andrew G. Doe]

And I hope they don't... and that's what makes this place so fascinating, vital and occasionally combative. World would be a very dreary place if we all agreed on everything.

Mind, the arms merchants would be out of a job...

[Andrew G. Doe]

Someone needs to change the title of this thread from "information" to "gloom, pessimism and speculation"

I think you're onto something, John, about changing/starting a new thread. We exhausted "the death" of C50 and all of the reasons for its demise - according to us anyway. I'm not sure we should entirely change this thread, the professor's thread, which focuses specifically on the recording of a new album. I do think it's time to ask the question: What are Brian, Al, Carl's estate, and maybe even David going to do about this Beach Boy's situation now. Yeah, Mike took his ball and went home, but, in a way, the ball is now in Brian and Al's court - if they want it to be.

Keep hearing about how heartbroken Brian, Alan & David were when Mike followed the script and went back to his own version of the band (which, btw, is officially sanctioned by BRI... but never mind). Exactly how heartbroken ? To judge purely from the available evidence, not very: Brian made one lengthy statement to the LA Times five months ago, since when he seems to have forgotten about it entirely and started recording for himself, Alan has made a few oblique references to the affair and David has, as ever, maintained a dignified silence. Strikes me this is a bunch of people who aren't actually that fussed. Now, I could be entirely wrong and there could be moves afoot beneath the radar to relieve Mike of his exclusive license... but that's highly unlikely, if only for the well-aired financial implications. I think that all concerned now realise that it's done: C50 is over, time to move on, or go back as is your wont.

[SMiLE Brian]

*sigh* I can't believe you are happy about going back to the status-quo. Why do you want the group to stay divided, M&B aren't a good representation of the BBs sound anymore after seeing what the C50 did. The money from M&B cannot be that great if they tour small casinos along with paying the band. The remaining money is then divided four ways in BRI. I guess M&B will tour until they die at this point.

The group should make albums without touring together if BW still wants to make records under the BBs name.

[SMiLE Brian]

At least make an EP in 2013 to keep the fans interested.

[Sheriff John Stone]

Someone needs to change the title of this thread from "information" to "gloom, pessimism and speculation"

I think you're onto something, John, about changing/starting a new thread. We exhausted "the death" of C50 and all of the reasons for its demise - according to us anyway. I'm not sure we should entirely change this thread, the professor's thread, which focuses specifically on the recording of a new album. I do think it's time to ask the question: What are Brian, Al, Carl's estate, and maybe even David going to do about this Beach Boy's situation now. Yeah, Mike took his ball and went home, but, in a way, the ball is now in Brian and Al's court - if they want it to be.

Keep hearing about how heartbroken Brian, Alan & David were when Mike followed the script and went back to his own version of the band (which, btw, is officially sanctioned by BRI... but never mind). Exactly how heartbroken ? To judge purely from the available evidence, not very: Brian made one lengthy statement to the LA Times five months ago, since when he seems to have forgotten about it entirely and started recording for himself, Alan has made a few oblique references to the affair and David has, as ever, maintained a dignified silence. Strikes me this is a bunch of people who aren't actually that fussed. Now, I could be entirely wrong and there could be moves afoot beneath the radar to relieve Mike of his exclusive license... but that's highly unlikely, if only for the well-aired financial implications. I think that all concerned now realise that it's done: C50 is over, time to move on, or go back as is your wont.

I have ideas on a smaller scale that might satisfy everyone, using the Mike, Brian Al, Bruce, Dave lineup - just a June, July, August summer tour, a tour (a la Bob Dylan & Willie Nelson) of minor league ballparks, a holiday/Christmas tour in November and December, reviving the Chicago/Beach Boys tour (it always worked), doing a tour with the kids/family opening up (what is their name, California Saga?), doing a Pet Sounds tour, or doing a tour to promote a possible new BB album.

It doesn't have to be the 60-70 dates tour, maybe 50 tops. The big problem of course, again, is going from a Mike & Bruce Beach Boys to an ADVERTISED Beach Boys with Brian Wilson et al and then reverting BACK to the Mike & Bruce Beach Boys. I see no smooth way to transition around that. Just some thoughts.

EDIT: I was trying to list some shorter-type tours that would easier on them physically, they could get back to their own lifestyles quicker, and they wouldn't be as likely to want to kill each other.

[SMiLE Brian]

Maybe changing M&B's band name to "The Beach Boys celebration" would be a good compromise.

[Shady]

I still think "The Mike and Bruce experience" is the right choice.

You would expect cheerleaders at a show like that

[AndrewHickey]

I still think "The Mike and Bruce experience" is the right choice.

You would expect cheerleaders at a show like that

They haven't done the cheerleading thing since before Carl died, I think...

[Shady]

Nah, they've done it since Carl passed

[bgas]

Maybe you can convince them all to go the way of certain "oldies" groups, then we could have:

Brian Wilson's Original Beach Boys  Featuring Al Jardine and David Marks

Mike Love's Touring Beach Boys with  Classic member Bruce Johnston

unless, of course, Al wants to take on his own short bus tours

[AndrewHickey]

Nah, they've done it since Carl passed

Are you sure? I genuinely don't know -- it's not been something anyone's mentioned in any show reports I've read in the last fifteen years, or in any Youtube videos I've seen, and it certainly wasn't in any of the five Mike & Bruce shows I've seen, but none of that necessarily means anything if it's something they only do on occasion, in certain shows.

The money from M&B cannot be that great if they tour small casinos along with paying the band.

According to the court cases between BRI and Al Jardine in 1999, Mike's license requires him to pay BRI "a royalty of 20 percent of the first $1 million and 17.5 percent of receipts thereafter."

I've seen people here say they'd been in touch about booking Mike & Bruce's band, and were told that their performance fee was $100,000 . I've not been able to find a confirmation of that, but this site -- http://www.celebritytalent.net/sampletalent/114/the-beach-boys/ -- claims to be able to book Al and David for $75,000+, so $100,000 is probably roughly right. I've no idea how some of the smaller venues pay that, but that's their business, I suppose.

So assuming Mike & Bruce play 150 shows in a year, that's $15,000,000, of which $2,650,000 goes to BRI, assuming the same license terms as in 1999. Brian would make songwriting royalties on top of that (as would Al for those dates where they play All This Is That). Split between the four owners of BRI, that's $662,500 a year each.

If anyone wants to pay me $662,500 a year to stay at home while they go to work, I'll accept the offer...

[SMiLE Brian]

Cheerleaders from 2008, watch Mike....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJIlUgqAiNY

How many shows will M&B play this year?

This website has the 2011 tour dates
http://oldies.about.com/od/recordshows/a/Beach-Boys-Tour-Dates.htm

[AndrewHickey]

Cheerleaders from 2008, watch Mike....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJIlUgqAiNY

Fair enough. I stand corrected. Definitely not a regular thing any more though.

How many shows will M&B play this year?

This website has the 2011 tour dates
http://oldies.about.com/od/recordshows/a/Beach-Boys-Tour-Dates.htm

Nothing like the full dates -- it looks like that was just c&p'd from the BBFC site at some point early in the year, and not updated. I can't find a fuller list for 2011, but doing a YouTube search for Beach Boys 2011 gives shows in Red Bank, Colorado State Fair, the Ronald Reagan library, Madrid, Santiago, Lincoln California and more -- and that's just the ones on the first couple of pages of YouTube results, plus they play a lot of private functions that aren't listed publicly.

The BBFC site has 42 dates listed between March 1 and Sept 20, and they *definitely* played a lot of shows before March, and there are huge swathes of June, July, August and September, their peak touring times, that have no shows announced yet (only seven shows in Juy, one in August and two in September have been announced yet). I'd be *astonished* if it works out as less than a hundred shows this year.

[SMiLE Brian]

Hey, we both can agree about the cheerleaders being lame at the end of day.

If M&B does turn out to do 100 shows a year, I wonder how much longer they can tour at that pace. They aren't getting younger and Bruce had heart surgery a while back.

[Rob Dean]

Cheerleaders from 2008, watch Mike....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJIlUgqAiNY

How many shows will M&B play this year?

This website has the 2011 tour dates
http://oldies.about.com/od/recordshows/a/Beach-Boys-Tour-Dates.htm

That video was from a cruise ship gig , outside next to a pool , however the pool was a lot smaller than that at Seawold 

[AndrewHickey]

If M&B does turn out to do 100 shows a year, I wonder how much longer they can tour at that pace. They aren't getting younger and Bruce had heart surgery a while back.

I think they'll, quite literally, do it until one or both of them drops dead. Bruce's heart surgery was about nine years ago, and it doesn't seem to have slowed him down.

[Rob Dean]

Cheerleaders from 2008, watch Mike....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJIlUgqAiNY

How many shows will M&B play this year?

This website has the 2011 tour dates
http://oldies.about.com/od/recordshows/a/Beach-Boys-Tour-Dates.htm

So in 2011 they did (other than Private Gigs , which could be quite a few ) 50 Shows @ assuming $100k = $5M , Royalties to BRI of $ 900k , Split 4 ways = $225k each (ie $4.5k each show) nice !

(Just one thing to consider , the $100k per gig is the guarantee  and there will be times when their fee increases due to excess ticket sales to contract etc...)

[hypehat]

2012 was a magical year - excellent new album, stunning C50 shows and a huge dollop of critical acclaim. Everything aligned, all the dots were joined. Anyone here really think that's going to happen again, and without the impetus of the anniversary ? Seriously ?

I'm just gonna assume The Beach Boys are your favorite group Andrew. Maybe I'm wrong.

But I gotta ask why you wouldn't want your favorite group to possibly make new music. They are still alive and doing well. If they made 12 new songs, and only one was good, it would still be worth it, because it would be great new music from my favorite group. I don't understand the point of wishing against something you love.

It's wishing against it because he loves it. I feel the same way as AGD on this.

So you'd rather them not even try? By that kinda reasoning, maybe they should have never followed up Pet Sounds, cuz gosh, what a high point to go out on. Or Bob Dylan shoulda quit after Blonde On Blonde, because you know he's gonna make Down In The Groove at some point.

I understand that they could put out a totally uninspired, embarrassing effort as a new album. But it could always be great. I'd rather have them work together with the chance of something good happening, rather then have no chance of great new Beach Boys work.

Exactly. God, to be of the mindset of, "If it can't be 10/10 brilliant, I don't give a f*** about it," I seriously can't imagine. Come on, guys.

I want posterity to remember The Beach Boys of 2012, that final shining moment in the sun where they reached back through their 50 year history and pulled it all together for one last, wonderful, bitter-sweet go round and not The Beach Boys of 201? who put out an average album and didn't tour it. Every champ who comes back always has that one fight too many. I want my boys to buck that trend and go out on top. In this respect, I'm probably a bigger fan than all of you combined because I want what's best for them, not what's best for me (new album, another tour, gimme gimme gimme, want want want).

Now I know your tongue is somewhat in cheek, but you don't know whats 'best' for these odd twats any better than I do. So come off it.

I know you are so concerned that they might ruin their (lets be frank here) average comeback record with a shite follow up, but let's be honest, it wouldn't be the first time.

In my opinion, I want The Beach Boys to go out on top. So they should record another album. They have it in them. They need a replacement Joe Thomas with actual taste, but they have it in them.

[Pretty Funky]

All 4 licensee holders cheapen the legacy IMO and it is a bit rich to then bleat about it after the fact. As has been stated many times, Brian and Al seem to be happy cashing Mike's checks even if they claim to be wanting to continue touring.

Despite what Bruce said at Seaworld about he and Mike being the Beach Boys, I have since 1998 thought of them as a Mike Love show in everything but name. Mike doesn't seem to complain (in public at least) about paying whatever for the rights, just as Brian, Al and Carls estate don't complain about getting the checks.

What would really surprise me would for Mike to grow a set and go out using his name only as does Waters, Ringo to name a few. He has talked his contribution to the group up for decades so it would be his chance to prove it.