Brian's Wouldn't It Be Nice Vocal

[Youre Under Arrest]

My version of the album (which is the 2001 remaster), Mike sings the "and maybe if..." bridge. However, I was listening to the full album on Youtube and it appears that Brian sings this part. Was this in the original? If not, why did Mike's part replace Brian or vice-versa.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGTdmLhKEBk

Here's the link. it starts around 1:05.

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

Here's what happened:

Mike did the bridge vocal, and they mixed down what would become the album master.

Then, after they did that, Brian went back and gave the bridge a go, erasing Mike's vocal from the multitrack tape.

When Mark Linett returned to the multitracks to remix the album in stereo, Mike's vocal was no longer available, so he just used Brian.

When digital technology got to the point where discrete elements could be extracted from mono, that tech was used to get Mike's vocal relatively isolated, and it has been added to the stereo mix now, in post Pet Sounds box set stereo releases, despite the phasey sound.

[runnersdialzero]

When digital technology got to the point where discrete elements could be extracted from mono, that tech was used to get Mike's vocal relatively isolated, and it has been added to the stereo mix now, in post Pet Sounds box set stereo releases, despite the phasey sound.

They should give it another go with this digital extraction trickery they used on the recent stereo mixes, as the results on current pressings are not so good (imo). Phase city, it is ;(

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

When digital technology got to the point where discrete elements could be extracted from mono, that tech was used to get Mike's vocal relatively isolated, and it has been added to the stereo mix now, in post Pet Sounds box set stereo releases, despite the phasey sound.

They should give it another go with this digital extraction trickery they used on the recent stereo mixes, as the results on current pressings are not so good (imo). Phase city, it is ;(

They should have just left Brian's vocal on it.  What the hell is wrong with it not matching the mono?

But at least we have the option, I guess.

[runnersdialzero]

I have no issues with the Brian-sung bridge (I think he does a better job singing it, actually), but I understand why some aren't into the idea of it being more common on radio etc.

[guitarfool2002]

I agree, after adjusting to not hearing Mike on the bridge, the stereo box-set mix of that song became my favorite, and the one I listen to most. That goes for every copy of Pet Sounds I own, the stereo box set mix is my choice.

Since this topic was covered many times over, a discussion of the actual vocal would be a nice conversation.

Listen to the way Brian attacks that vocal, either on the vocals-only track or the SOT. *That* is what a lead vocal on an all-time classic hit record sounds like. It's also the aspect that too many cover singers fail to include in their vocal, and they go for the soft-pretty-sweet elements rather than an all-out, belt-it-out vocal on that lead as Brian did. Al Jardine consistently nailed it in concert, though.

[Austin]

Listen to the way Brian attacks that vocal, either on the vocals-only track or the SOT. *That* is what a lead vocal on an all-time classic hit record sounds like. It's also the aspect that too many cover singers fail to include in their vocal, and they go for the soft-pretty-sweet elements rather than an all-out, belt-it-out vocal on that lead as Brian did. Al Jardine consistently nailed it in concert, though.

Yes.

Maybe it's just my loss, but honestly, I am baffled by the folks who out and out prefer Mike's vocal to Brian's. And that's not saying anything about the phasing and extraction-y nature of the 2001 mix. Brian's impassioned delivery, the way he effortlessly shifts from edgy to delicate -- it's the perfect amount of emotion, easily one of my absolute favorite vocal moments.

[runnersdialzero]

Listen to the way Brian attacks that vocal, either on the vocals-only track or the SOT. *That* is what a lead vocal on an all-time classic hit record sounds like. It's also the aspect that too many cover singers fail to include in their vocal, and they go for the soft-pretty-sweet elements rather than an all-out, belt-it-out vocal on that lead as Brian did. Al Jardine consistently nailed it in concert, though.

Yes.

Maybe it's just my loss, but honestly, I am baffled by the folks who out and out prefer Mike's vocal to Brian's. And that's not saying anything about the phasing and extraction-y nature of the 2001 mix. Brian's impassioned delivery, the way he effortlessly shifts from edgy to delicate -- it's the perfect amount of emotion, easily one of my absolute favorite vocal moments.

Yerp. Mike is great elsewhere on Pet Sounds, and there are times when I wonder if I prefer his vocal for "I'm Waiting For The Day", but Brian just nails that part and brings something to it that suits the song so much better than Mike's vocal.

[Rocker]

I prefer Mike's vocals rather than Brian's on bridge. I think, he sang it better, his voice somehow fits very well to the melody.

I agree. Brian's voice just doesn't fit for that part imo. When he says that he doesn't like his singing on "Let him run wild" because he sounds like a girl I am more thinking of this part on WIBN (and not in a very good way unfortunately)

But this thread showed once again how important it is to have the mono mix and also listen to it. There are quite some parts missing/different on the stereo mix (the second "You still believe in me" lead track, Brian's second part at the end of GOK and iirc his overdub onto his high voice in the end is also not there, some strange sound on IJWMFTT and of course the bridge on WIBN). So always make sure that you also listen to the mono mix even if just for having heard the original parts



@ runnersdialzero: Oh yes, "I'm waiting for the day" with Mike on lead is awesome ! Brian did a great job on that but I think Mike sounds even better. His singing is just so strong

[hypehat]

Listen to the way Brian attacks that vocal, either on the vocals-only track or the SOT. *That* is what a lead vocal on an all-time classic hit record sounds like. It's also the aspect that too many cover singers fail to include in their vocal, and they go for the soft-pretty-sweet elements rather than an all-out, belt-it-out vocal on that lead as Brian did. Al Jardine consistently nailed it in concert, though.

Yes.

Maybe it's just my loss, but honestly, I am baffled by the folks who out and out prefer Mike's vocal to Brian's. And that's not saying anything about the phasing and extraction-y nature of the 2001 mix. Brian's impassioned delivery, the way he effortlessly shifts from edgy to delicate -- it's the perfect amount of emotion, easily one of my absolute favorite vocal moments.

Why are you baffled? It's how the vast majority of people on the planet heard it first because it's THE FINISHED ALBUM.

[Runaways]

i love both vocals.  i definitely don't think it fits one voice over the other.

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

Listen to the way Brian attacks that vocal, either on the vocals-only track or the SOT. *That* is what a lead vocal on an all-time classic hit record sounds like. It's also the aspect that too many cover singers fail to include in their vocal, and they go for the soft-pretty-sweet elements rather than an all-out, belt-it-out vocal on that lead as Brian did. Al Jardine consistently nailed it in concert, though.

The best thing to do is to get out the SOT and "extract" (by hard panning) Brian's single-tracked, un-reverbed vocal from the first vocal take, and hear how good it is without any studio enhancement.

[guitarfool2002]

Listen to the way Brian attacks that vocal, either on the vocals-only track or the SOT. *That* is what a lead vocal on an all-time classic hit record sounds like. It's also the aspect that too many cover singers fail to include in their vocal, and they go for the soft-pretty-sweet elements rather than an all-out, belt-it-out vocal on that lead as Brian did. Al Jardine consistently nailed it in concert, though.

The best thing to do is to get out the SOT and "extract" (by hard panning) Brian's single-tracked, un-reverbed vocal from the first vocal take, and hear how good it is without any studio enhancement.

I had a actually written something along those lines in that post, noting the lack of any studio trickery or digital effects which are ubiquitous in 2012, but I did some self-editing and didn't want to make it about the use of modern vocal effects! But I absolutely, 100% agree, that this is a perfect example of the *performance* being the most important element of that vocal track. If Brian had done anything less, it simply would not work, and try telling that to certain modern producers who make a ton of money by doing all kinds of sonic gimmickery on half-assed vocals.

What hammered it home about the importance of an all-out performance on a record like WIBN even more than I had heard or been told before was getting into "Ain't No Mountain High Enough", Marvin's and especially Tammi's vocal just explodes out of the speakers with no obvious trickery or effects...a friend after hearing it isolated said "that's what makes a hit record..." and it stuck with me. And WIBN is a prime example.

For all of the accolades as composer-producer-whatever, Brian had one helluva set of pipes, and it wasn't all about the falsetto sweetness as some would think...he could really belt it out.

[Austin]

Why are you baffled? It's how the vast majority of people on the planet heard it first because it's THE FINISHED ALBUM.

Okay, okay -- baffled is probably too strong a word. I do get that. Like I said, utterly reasonable preference, probably my loss (note to self: avoid posting to message boards after a night of drinking). I still stand by my main point: I've always heard this extra it factor in Brian's performance that I've never gotten from Mike's. Compounded with the extraction issues in the revised stereo mix, and it's just never been a difficult choice for me.

Now, if you excuse me, I'm going to go kick up a fuss on why I prefer Brian to Carl on Break Away.

[Summer_Days]

:de-lurk:

I prefer Mike's bridge vocal not because he sings it better (and he sure as hell wasn't a better singer than Brian) but because that's how the song was originally released in 1966. It goes along with why I prefer mono to the new stereo mixes - it's original 1966 goodness (okay, so remastered too, which isn't original I suppose, but hey).

[I. Spaceman]

Vocal tradeoffs between Brian and Mike are part of what makes life worth living.

[guitarfool2002]

:de-lurk:

I prefer Mike's bridge vocal not because he sings it better (and he sure as hell wasn't a better singer than Brian) but because that's how the song was originally released in 1966. It goes along with why I prefer mono to the new stereo mixes - it's original 1966 goodness (okay, so remastered too, which isn't original I suppose, but hey).

This could get into the whole history-versus-aesthetics debate, but if preserving original goodness is a goal, then the whole idea of remastering or reissuing the Beach Boys collection in 2012 could be considered a moot point, and a simple needledrop of a virgin-vinyl pressing of, say, the "Today" album would better serve the legacy of the work rather than a cleaned-up, freshened-up, frequency-boosted remaster.

Because ultimately, someone pressing play on one of those new 2012 album remasters isn't getting anywhere near the listening experience someone had in 1965, again if preservation is the order of the day over pure aesthetics. And for the record, in my book, 1965 would win any day in my dusty, stodgy old book, but then again I also prefer the stereo Pet Sounds because the clarity and separation revealed many brilliant musical moments that were buried for years. And also, Brian listened and approved it just as he would have done with Chuck Britz if it were 1966, and I still think in my naive ways that Brian would have wanted that level of clarity if such technology were available to him when mixing the album(s) in the 60's.

[Joshilyn Hoisington]

Brian had one helluva set of pipes, and it wasn't all about the falsetto sweetness as some would think...he could really belt it out.

I think Brian has been pretty consistently under-rated as a singer.  His ability was really something for a pop singer, just how much he could do with his voice.

[halblaineisgood]

Since this topic was covered many times over, a discussion of the actual vocal would be a nice conversation.

Listen to the way Brian attacks that vocal, either on the vocals-only track or the SOT. *That* is what a lead vocal on an all-time classic hit record sounds like. It's also the aspect that too many cover singers fail to include in their vocal, and they go for the soft-pretty-sweet elements rather than an all-out, belt-it-out vocal on that lead as Brian did. Al Jardine consistently nailed it in concert, though.

you're right on the money, friend. There's just something so off putting about
singers doing a wimpy cover of WIBN. It violates the spirit of the song. Very un-rock n roll.
Brian simply knocks it out of the f***ing park!

[drbeachboy]

Since this topic was covered many times over, a discussion of the actual vocal would be a nice conversation.

Listen to the way Brian attacks that vocal, either on the vocals-only track or the SOT. *That* is what a lead vocal on an all-time classic hit record sounds like. It's also the aspect that too many cover singers fail to include in their vocal, and they go for the soft-pretty-sweet elements rather than an all-out, belt-it-out vocal on that lead as Brian did. Al Jardine consistently nailed it in concert, though.

you're right on the money, friend. There's just something so off putting about
singers doing a wimpy cover of WIBN. It violates the spirit of the song. Very un-rock n roll.
Brian simply knocks it out of the f***ing park!

Absolutely on the money. Al is the only other singer who does the song justice, and for the same exact reason. He sings it with gusto.

[I. Spaceman]

And also, Brian listened and approved it just as he would have done with Chuck Britz if it were 1966, and I still think in my naive ways that Brian would have wanted that level of clarity if such technology were available to him when mixing the album(s) in the 60's.

Brian loved mono. Brian would agree to a 5.1 dance remix of Pet Sounds if he thought it would go to #1.

[Al Jardine: Pick Up Artist]

The Live Aid version is actually pretty good. For the few seconds you can actually hear Brian over Al(?), he gets pretty close to the whiny, almost out of breath, sung from the bottom of his chest quality of the original.

[Ron]

Listen to the way Brian attacks that vocal, either on the vocals-only track or the SOT. *That* is what a lead vocal on an all-time classic hit record sounds like. It's also the aspect that too many cover singers fail to include in their vocal, and they go for the soft-pretty-sweet elements rather than an all-out, belt-it-out vocal on that lead as Brian did. Al Jardine consistently nailed it in concert, though.

Yup.  I agree.  I think what most covers of the song miss, is the all-out excitement that's in Brian's voice.  It IS a beautiful song, but when you sing it beautifully, you miss that little element that Brian threw in it to make it like you said, an all-time classic. 

I love the way he says words like "the-En"  "Wouldn't It Be Nice! If We Were Older! The-En We Wouldn't Have To Wait So Long!"  It's just so hyped up

Most covers I've heard turn it into this lazy, laid back, beautiful ballad.  The whole greatness of the song is how he captures what it feels to be 18 and in love. 

It's a near perfect song as recorded.  In my opinion if somebody said 'greatest song ever' I wouldn't argue.  It's at least a contender. 

I agree too about Al.  He's still singing it pretty good, too. 

[Chris Brown]

Absolutely one of Brian's best leads, he does indeed knock it out of the park.  I think he sounds a lot better than Mike on the bridge, mostly because Mike's vocal there has always sounded "phoned in" to me, but also because, well, he's Brian f-ing Wilson and in 1966 anything he sang was awesome.

[tpesky]

One of the most pleasant surprises of this tour has been Al's return to lead vocalist of WIBN after many years.  He's helped out by Jeff in parts and depending on the concert, the mix seems to vary but there are some that are mixed perfectly with almost all Al and just Jeff helping on high notes. He is the only one who can nail the phrasings and the strength of that lead like Brian did.  Carl is arguably one of the greatest singers ever in rock but he just couldn't nail WIBN like younger Brian and then Al (even still today)