SMiLE Sessions box set!

[guitarfool2002]

My bad - visa application is clearly not Brian's hand.

Would you agree it may be Diane's writing, as I thought I remembered about that passport form a few posts ago? I'm still trying to recall where that scan came from.

[Ron]

I'd say whoever finished the application wrote the tracklist.

Why do you say that?  I don't see any similarities, and some of the similar strings of letters are completely different.  D's, I's, G's, etc.  

I also think whoever wrote the application, finished it.. look at the street address, the numerical part is identical (because you can't write numerics in cursive) but then they finished the address the second time in cursive.  Same person wrote the whole application, just stopped and finished in cursive for whatever reason.  Maybe because they're A CRAZY GENIUS??? lol  Also look at the number they put under date of birth, it matches the address above.  Same writer, all the way through the application. 

I think the Wild Honey/Smile tracklists are the same person.  The visa is somebody else.  If Brian wrote the "Diane Rovell" note, he did not write the visa, because look at the "A"'s, and also look at the "L" in Wilson.  On the Visa it's very  structured, on the "Diane Rovell" note it's really loose and sloppy.

[runnersdialzero]

Holidays=Worms=Dada=Little Pad?

...

[ghost]

have we had it finger printed yet?

[runnersdialzero]

i've never put much stock at all in the handwritten list and never understood why anyone did. has anyone actually bothered to listen to it in that order? total clusterfuck. pet sounds and smiley smile flow brilliantly, i just don't think this is anything more than a list of songs that were being worked on in no specific order.

[juggler]

i've never put much stock at all in the handwritten list and never understood why anyone did. has anyone actually bothered to listen to it in that order? total clusterf*ck. pet sounds and smiley smile flow brilliantly, i just don't think this is anything more than a list of songs that were being worked on in no specific order.

When the list was used for the mock-up of the back cover, it came with the words "see label for correct playing order."  As such, I don't think even the list's biggest fans claim that it was intended as the running order.

Love it or loathe it, the list has played a major role in the history of Smile.   Its value or importance shouldn't be overestimated.  It's not definitive.  It doesn't answer every question, and it certainly was subject to change.  But it's not worthless, either. It's not something that can just be ignored.  It's a snapshot of where the project stood in 12/66, and it's valuable for that reason.  

Let's face it.  The fact that certain tracks are or are not on the list has been a factor in whether or not those tracks have been considered part of the Smile "canon." For example, bits and pieces like "You're Welcome," "He Gives Speeches" and "With Me Tonight" are not on the track list and have been relegated to 2nd-class status as "outtakes."  On the other hand, nothing on the list is considered an "outtake."   Coincidence?  I think not.  If Vega-Tables were not on the track list, I can totally imagine many people arguing that it was never intended to be its own track on Smile.  The booklet implies that it's a mere section of "The Elements," and since Brian had recorded no instrumental track for it as of 12/66, why would anyone think it was intended as its own song on the Smile album?  Similarly, if there were no list, I can totally imagine people saying things like, "What do you mean 'He Gives Speeches' wouldn't have been part of Smile?  It sounds totally finished to me!"

I would argue that the list had at least an indirect influence on BWPS.  Sure, a few things like Barnyard, Look and Holidays aren't on the list but do appear on BWPS. But did Brian, VDP and Darian dare leave anything off of BWPS that WAS on the list?  No.

[JohnMill]

i've never put much stock at all in the handwritten list and never understood why anyone did. has anyone actually bothered to listen to it in that order? total clusterf*ck. pet sounds and smiley smile flow brilliantly, i just don't think this is anything more than a list of songs that were being worked on in no specific order.

When the list was used for the mock-up of the back cover, it came with the words "see label for correct playing order."  As such, I don't think even the list's biggest fans claim that it was intended as the running order.

Love it or loathe it, the list has played a major role in the history of Smile.   Its value or importance shouldn't be overestimated.  It's not definitive.  It doesn't answer every question, and it certainly was subject to change.  But it's not worthless, either. It's not something that can just be ignored.  It's a snapshot of where the project stood in 12/66, and it's valuable for that reason.  

Let's face it.  The fact that certain tracks are or are not on the list has been a factor in whether or not those tracks have been considered part of the Smile "canon." For example, bits and pieces like "You're Welcome," "He Gives Speeches" and "With Me Tonight" are not on the track list and have been relegated to 2nd-class status as "outtakes."  On the other hand, nothing on the list is considered an "outtake."   Coincidence?  I think not.  If Vega-Tables were not on the track list, I can totally imagine many folks arguing that it was never intended to be its own track on Smile.  The booklet implies that it's a mere section of "The Elements," and since Brian had recorded no instrumental track for it as of 12/66, why would anyone think it was intended as its own song on the Smile album?  Similarly, if there were no list, I can totally imagine people saying things like, "What do you mean 'He Gives Speeches' wouldn't have been part of Smile?  It sounds totally finished to me!"

I would argue that the list had at least an indirect influence on BWPS.  Sure, a few things like Barnyard, Look and Holidays aren't on the list but do appear on BWPS. But did Brian, VDP and Darian dare leave anything off of BWPS that WAS on the list?  No.

You probably aren't wrong.  Whomever drafted that list it did/does have a major influence as to how this album was viewed.  I mean it wasn't just a casual jotting down of song titles.  There was a purpose behind it as those same titles later appeared on the back slick of the the album.  

The thing is if you look at those song titles, granted we don't know exactly what The Elements would've consisted of but all those other songs are structurally speaking complete pieces of music.  Now obviously in some cases these songs weren't brought to completion until after SMiLE was in the can but you get my point.  The only song on that list that I can make an argument about being a fragment is "I'm In Great Shape" and I've always personally that there was more to that song than what we know of today.  I just think much like The Elements, Brian never got around to expanding on that particular theme/song.  

So what I'm trying to convey is there is a reason the songs on that listing are given a wider territory so to speak than the ones not listed there.

[Phoenix]

Sure, a few things like Barnyard, Look and Holidays aren't on the list but do appear on BWPS.

The only song on that list that I can make an argument about being a fragment is "I'm In Great Shape" and I've always personally that there was more to that song than what we know of today.  

"Barnyard" is the first section of the song referred to on the handwritten list as "The Old Master Painter".  That's where it is on BWPS.  That's where it is on TSS.

The "I'm In Great Shape" on the hand written list is the MEDLEY of "I'm In Great Shape/I Wanna Be Around/Workshop".  That's where it was also on BWPS.  It's changed position is the only real sequencing change between BWPS and TSS and as I say in one of the posts linked below, I think it was done in an effort to group together most of the songs with origins as sections of "Heroes And Villains", to give a stronger sense of continuity, when the first disc is listened to in tandem with the "Heroes And Villains" sessions disc.

"I Ran"/"Look"/"Song For Children" is either the second half of the song listed on the hand written list as "Wonderful" (which would explain that song's abrupt ending) or the first half of the song written on the list as "Child Is Father Of The Man" (which explains why the "Child" chorus can be sung along with it and why Brian used that chorus part in "Song For Children" on BWPS).  This song had three different titles but people who KNOW Brian recorded the album modularly can't seem to believe it, as well as these other short "songs" are just more Smile SECTIONS.

"Holiday(s)", "Love To Say Dada" and anything else "missing" was either intended to be part of "The Elements" (which tho unfinished at the time, was on the list) or more than likely,  cut along with "He Gives Speeches", etc.

http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,10643.msg196493.html#msg196493

http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,10016.msg208597.html#msg208597

[runnersdialzero]

"Barnyard" is the first section of the song referred to on the handwritten list as "The Old Master Painter".  That's where it is on BWPS.  That's where it is on TSS.

The "I'm In Great Shape" on the hand written list is the MEDLEY of "I'm In Great Shape/I Wanna Be Around/Workshop".  That's where it was also on BWPS.  It's changed position is the only real sequencing change between BWPS and TSS and as I say in one of the posts linked below, I think it was done in an effort to group together most of the songs with origins as sections of "Heroes And Villains", to give a stronger sense of continuity, when the first disc is listened in tandem with the "Heroes And Villains" sessions disc.

o okay, let's just start making stuff up. imo.

[Phoenix]

Sure because Brian would NEVER group those "songs" together.
Execpt for that time when he did.  And released the official album that way.

[Phoenix]

I suppose people who believe each Smile section should be listed with their own individual titles refer to Brian's 2004 arrangement of "Heroes And Villains" as "Heroes And Villains/In The Cantina/My Children Were Raised/Sunny Down Snuff/Bridge To Indians" or something similarly confusing?  

"Heroes And Villains" (2004) = "Heroes And Villains/In The Cantina/My Children Were Raised/Sunny Down Snuff/Bridge To Indians"
"I'm In Great Shape" (1967 & 2004) = "I'm In Great Shape/I Wanna Be Around/Workshop"

Is that so hard for someone familiar with Brian's 1966 production style to believe?

[Runaways]

i've heard some people talk about things and i'm not sure exactly what they refer to.

what is false barnyard

[Dunderhead]

i've heard some people talk about things and i'm not sure exactly what they refer to.

what is false barnyard

the thing that ends the "sections" on GVbox and the "alternate version" on the twofer.

[Phoenix]

The last section on the 93 box set version of the Cantina "Heroes And Villains".  From what I've heard it was originally(?) the final section of "The Old Master Painter" (following the "My Only Sunshine" section) and I'm hoping we get to hear it there on TSS.

[Runaways]

oo i like me some false barnyard

[Ron]

Sure because Brian would NEVER group those "songs" together.
Execpt for that time when he did.  And released the official album that way.

LOL!  I'm with you man.  It's so damn disrespectful!  The guy is idolized for the album, but at the same time nobody takes his opinion of what the album was, lol.  The nerve of it!  He created all this stuff but people think they know better than him what the deal is.  You can take the #1 SMiLE expert in the world and Brian's knowledge of the album is 10 fold that.  He not only decided what order the stuff went in, he decided what notes to play.  The only reason people can argue about titles is because he invente the titles!

I mean I know it's all "Duh Ronnie, we know that" but apparently some people don't! 

[JohnMill]

The last section on the 93 box set version of the Cantina "Heroes And Villains".  From what I've heard it was originally(?) the final section of "The Old Master Painter" (following the "My Only Sunshine" section) and I'm hoping we get to hear it there on TSS.

Yeah there is also something called "Barnshine" which is "False Barnyard" with some "You Are My Sunshine" vocals I believe by Mike Love.  The reason it's called "False Barnyard" btw (for those who don't know) is that this piece of music was originally thought to be "Barnyard" when it first surfaced.  The real "Barnyard" subsequently appeared and thus this piece of music was referred to as "False Barnyard".

[Phoenix]

Correct!  I should have said, "I hope it shows up on the box WITH those missing vocals." 

[brother john]

EDIT: Look at the photo of her and Brian in the studio where he's without a shirt and she's massaging his shoulders. That picture says it all.

It was, after all, Diane that Brian first fell in love with, was it not, before settling for Marilyn.

And yes, Diane could well shed a great deal of light on the whole proceedings. The question is: why hasn't she?

Every other associate, friend, half friend and hanger-on has cashed in, why hasn't she? It can't be because she doesn't know anything, because as you hypothesise she must know a lot. Maybe out of respect, loyalty?

The other thing to bear in mind is no matter what anyone has to say about Smile, the only stuff that will be printed is what the BW management/Melinda deem appropriate, and will doubtless be interesting, but only part of the truth.

[Dunderhead]

Can anybody explain Wonderful to me.
TBH that's my least favorite smile song

[Phoenix]

I heard it was about a girl who got pregnant (and gave birth to her "wonderful" child) when she lost her virginity (to a boy who bumped into her "wonderful" reproductive parts).  It could have been speculation on the part of whomever I heard it from but it sounds right to me.

[Dove Nested Towers]

'Wonderful" is a magical, sublimely poetic evocation of first love, one of the most transcendent pieces of the Smile puzzle. I can't imagine that anyone who likes any of Smile wouldn't be transported by it, but to each their own....

[brother john]

Can anybody explain Wonderful to me.
TBH that's my least favorite smile song

What, are you crazy? Is it not beautiful? Is it not musically adventurous? Does it not have about 15 key-changes per second?

[18thofMay]

Ahh Fishmonk!! Wonderful is part of SMiLE's SIMPLE beauty.

[Dunderhead]

I've just never liked the song that much for some reason, but I want to believe guys.

BTW, I was just listening to Lei'd In Hawaii, on the version of Heroes you can hear Mike (?) saying "barbershop" during the harmony verse. I guess that was his pet name for it, that's probably what's on the box set under that name.