SMiLE Sessions box set!

[Andrew G. Doe]

do we know for sure that Brian filled out his own visa application?

how do we know the Stack o Tracks list is in Carl's hand?
if it is, then it would appear the SMiLE tracklist was indeed written by Carl.

the giveaway being the capital letter "I" on 'I'm in Great Shape' and 'In My Room'

'Cause we do - the collector who had/has these has an impeccable reputation (not me, obviously).

[The Heartical Don]

Man, Canada loves SMiLE, number 1 baby..

In some strange way i've never felt more proud to be Canadian. Ha.

I always wanted to pinch Geneviève Bujold's butt.

[monicker]

This at least proves one thing and a very key thing at that. Whoever wrote the 12 song tracklist was still in the fold and close to the band when they were finishing Wild Honey, rather than being some faceless Capitol or some random studio person. It would seem like Diane would fit that description. Keep in mind that a person’s print and cursive can look very, very different. The print in the Hawaii example, if that’s Diane, which it certainly looks like a woman’s handwriting, doesn’t necessarily disprove it being Diane in the Smile tracklist, as that one is in cursive. But it does look a lot like Carl’s writing. As bossaroo pointed out, the capital I in both examples are exact. However, look at the capital G in Great Shape and in Good To My Baby--totally different.

It seems like it would be so easy for someone to show Diane a copy of the list and ask her. She seems to have it really together still and be pretty reliable. I’m really surprised no one’s asked her. Actually, one of the things i am looking most forward to in the liner notes is her anecdotes. I think she is a key person, extremely close to Brian, both personally and professionally, who seems to have been seldom interviewed over the years. I feel like she’s definitely a missing link. Very excited to hear what she has to say. Marilyn too, but more from a personal, behind closed doors standpoint.

[bsten]

Funny they choose a surfboard for the light up box set - wasn't "surf's down" in 1967? 

[Bicyclerider]

It seems like it would be so easy for someone to show Diane a copy of the list and ask her. She seems to have it really together still and be pretty reliable. I’m really surprised no one’s asked her. Actually, one of the things i am looking most forward to in the liner notes is her anecdotes. I think she is a key person, extremely close to Brian, both personally and professionally, who seems to have been seldom interviewed over the years. I feel like she’s definitely a missing link. Very excited to hear what she has to say. Marilyn too, but more from a personal, behind closed doors standpoint.

This is a very important point.  We've heard from anderle, Vosse, Siegel, Van Dyke, Brian, and some of the session players about Smile - what about Diane?  She was at almost every session, probably wrote the track list, was in Brian's inner circle, no doubt talked with him or overheard his ideas about the album, track sequence, the two part Heroes single, The Elements, the Van Dyke walk out - why hasn't she been interviewed about all this?

[harrisonjon]

Will the overdubs recorded for Our Prayer in 1968 ever be available?

[monicker]

It seems like it would be so easy for someone to show Diane a copy of the list and ask her. She seems to have it really together still and be pretty reliable. I’m really surprised no one’s asked her. Actually, one of the things i am looking most forward to in the liner notes is her anecdotes. I think she is a key person, extremely close to Brian, both personally and professionally, who seems to have been seldom interviewed over the years. I feel like she’s definitely a missing link. Very excited to hear what she has to say. Marilyn too, but more from a personal, behind closed doors standpoint.

This is a very important point.  We've heard from anderle, Vosse, Siegel, Van Dyke, Brian, and some of the session players about Smile - what about Diane?  She was at almost every session, probably wrote the track list, was in Brian's inner circle, no doubt talked with him or overheard his ideas about the album, track sequence, the two part Heroes single, The Elements, the Van Dyke walk out - why hasn't she been interviewed about all this?

Yeah, Diane has definitely been the most intriguing to me over the years and the most obvious go-to person for answers. Being the contractor, theoretically she'd have been at every session, no? She would have been there before the musicians even started filing in. And at the end of the session, when everyone would leave and go home, i'm betting she'd often go home with Brian--hang out at the house with her sister and brother-in-law (and uhmm, you know). They were close. I get the impression that Brian confided in her a lot, maybe even more than Marilyn. He probably expressed to her his worries and fears, where his mind was at. They had a weird connection. And i find it highly unlikely that he wouldn't have mentioned musical ideas to her in passing over the course of all that time, or at least that she overheard stuff or was simply around a lot when things were discussed and were being formed. She was in his most immediate, closest circle. When the Vosse posse went home at the end of the night, i'm sure Diane was still there. She was around more than the Beach Boys and even Chuck himself, as she would have followed Brian from studio to studio. It was her JOB to contract the musicians. She probably spent more time (in a working professional environment, at least) with Brian than Marilyn spent with Brian. Who else would know as many intimate details as she would? She'd certainly know more than the Beach Boys themselves, as they were often touring, and even when they weren't, they wouldn't necessarily attend every session. She saw the progression of the Smile sessions and what Brian was doing and where he was at, from beginning to end. No one else really, except for Brian had that sort of insight. She must have known at least a little bit about different titles, sections, versions, etc. Think about it, she would be there the entire session, from Brian teaching the players their parts, to hearing them rehearse, to sitting through all the takes, etc. She was in the ultimate dream seat, THE fly on the wall, only more, because she was Brian's good pal, and so they talked and probably joked around. It seems natural that he would have told her certain things about the music, or that she'd at least hear him tell others certain things.

I've always thought Diane Rovell holds the key to a much further understanding of Smile and what was happening in that time period. I remember years ago when i first read that she was the contractor, it blew my mind. If i were a journalist, or in charge of the box set liner notes, she undoubtedly would be the first person i'd go to. And think about it, it's very easy for Al, Mike, and Bruce to have a patchy memory about this stuff and mix stuff up and condense events because their presence was sporadic. But Diane's was consistent. And she had a much more grounded lifestyle than the touring, rock n roll lifestyle that the Boys had. Also think about how the Smile era would probably stand out more in her mind since Brian was doing something special and she admired him. The session players, yeah, to them it was just a gig like any other and they may have not been impressed, not to mention they didn't get the big picture, but Diane was witnessing her brother-in-law, a close friend and more, at work on his most adventurous, unique, and peculiar music. I wouldn't be surprised at all to learn that she was his single biggest supporter throughout the period.  

EDIT: Look at the photo of her and Brian in the studio where he's without a shirt and she's massaging his shoulders. That picture says it all.

[Shady]

The 31'st is gonna be great..

Halloween party at night and picking up the SMiLE 2 disc during the day 

Seriously going to to the best day ever

[Andrew G. Doe]

Will the overdubs recorded for Our Prayer in 1968 ever be available?

They'll be on the 20/20 box.

[GeorgeFellInHisHorn]

Will the overdubs recorded for Our Prayer in 1968 ever be available?

They'll be on the 20/20 box.

mmmm. don't tease me 

[Andrew G. Doe]

The 31'st is gonna be great..

Halloween party at night and picking up the SMiLE 2 disc during the day 

Seriously going to to the best day ever

No, this is The Best Day Ever !

[Amazing Larry]

If it wasn't for the production, that song would UNLISTENABLE.

[Mike's Beard]

Yuk! I could not get off youtube fast enough!!

[guitarfool2002]

Apologies for posting the handwriting samples without tags or labels: It was a bit confusing but I'm glad the dates and origins were posted to clear it up.

Those were remnants of previous discussions I've had online and offline about that Smile memo, and the reason why it's cut-and-pasted the way it is was to show the similarities between the Smile memo and parts of the Wild Honey memo. Others have noticed the same writing style on certain letters, which is one sure sign.

I picked those JPEGS up through the years, from various websites, discussions, and boards: all credit to the original posters. I can clarify a few if my memory on them is still up to par:

The bottom sample, with Bill Halverson's name: I think that was part of the "Wild Honey" package that included the handwritten memo, the typewritten version of the memo with corrections, and that little bit of paper with the credits for engineering and design. Some of the writing looks the same as the actual Wild Honey memo, other words do not.

The passport application: Again my memory may be off a bit but didn't Diane Rovell fill in the sections of that form? I think that was posted as part of a Beach Boys memorabilia auction? I just can't remember, but I seem to remember it was Diane who filled in a lot of that info. Again, corrections more than appreciated!

I should have been more careful posting that stuff without a description  or history behind it - because I can't remember some of those details or if they were ever confirmed, like the case of Diane writing the passport. I may be confusing that passport with something else.

[Dunderhead]

does anyone have a full image of the handwriten tracklist? I can't find it anywhere. I remember it used to be on the smile shop, but that's not around anymore.
Man, I really miss that site, I used to spend hours there.

[ghost]

It seems like it would be so easy for someone to show Diane a copy of the list and ask her. She seems to have it really together still and be pretty reliable. I’m really surprised no one’s asked her. Actually, one of the things i am looking most forward to in the liner notes is her anecdotes. I think she is a key person, extremely close to Brian, both personally and professionally, who seems to have been seldom interviewed over the years. I feel like she’s definitely a missing link. Very excited to hear what she has to say. Marilyn too, but more from a personal, behind closed doors standpoint.

This is a very important point.  We've heard from anderle, Vosse, Siegel, Van Dyke, Brian, and some of the session players about Smile - what about Diane?  She was at almost every session, probably wrote the track list, was in Brian's inner circle, no doubt talked with him or overheard his ideas about the album, track sequence, the two part Heroes single, The Elements, the Van Dyke walk out - why hasn't she been interviewed about all this?

Yeah, Diane has definitely been the most intriguing to me over the years and the most obvious go-to person for answers. Being the contractor, theoretically she'd have been at every session, no? She would have been there before the musicians even started filing in. And at the end of the session, when everyone would leave and go home, i'm betting she'd often go home with Brian--hang out at the house with her sister and brother-in-law (and uhmm, you know). They were close. I get the impression that Brian confided in her a lot, maybe even more than Marilyn. He probably expressed to her his worries and fears, where his mind was at. They had a weird connection. And i find it highly unlikely that he wouldn't have mentioned musical ideas to her in passing over the course of all that time, or at least that she overheard stuff or was simply around a lot when things were discussed and were being formed. She was in his most immediate, closest circle. When the Vosse posse went home at the end of the night, i'm sure Diane was still there. She was around more than the Beach Boys and even Chuck himself, as she would have followed Brian from studio to studio. It was her JOB to contract the musicians. She probably spent more time (in a working professional environment, at least) with Brian than Marilyn spent with Brian. Who else would know as many intimate details as she would? She'd certainly know more than the Beach Boys themselves, as they were often touring, and even when they weren't, they wouldn't necessarily attend every session. She saw the progression of the Smile sessions and what Brian was doing and where he was at, from beginning to end. No one else really, except for Brian had that sort of insight. She must have known at least a little bit about different titles, sections, versions, etc. Think about it, she would be there the entire session, from Brian teaching the players their parts, to hearing them rehearse, to sitting through all the takes, etc. She was in the ultimate dream seat, THE fly on the wall, only more, because she was Brian's good pal, and so they talked and probably joked around. It seems natural that he would have told her certain things about the music, or that she'd at least hear him tell others certain things.

I've always thought Diane Rovell holds the key to a much further understanding of Smile and what was happening in that time period. I remember years ago when i first read that she was the contractor, it blew my mind. If i were a journalist, or in charge of the box set liner notes, she undoubtedly would be the first person i'd go to. And think about it, it's very easy for Al, Mike, and Bruce to have a patchy memory about this stuff and mix stuff up and condense events because their presence was sporadic. But Diane's was consistent. And she had a much more grounded lifestyle than the touring, rock n roll lifestyle that the Boys had. Also think about how the Smile era would probably stand out more in her mind since Brian was doing something special and she admired him. The session players, yeah, to them it was just a gig like any other and they may have not been impressed, not to mention they didn't get the big picture, but Diane was witnessing her brother-in-law, a close friend and more, at work on his most adventurous, unique, and peculiar music. I wouldn't be surprised at all to learn that she was his single biggest supporter throughout the period.  

EDIT: Look at the photo of her and Brian in the studio where he's without a shirt and she's massaging his shoulders. That picture says it all.

Great post man. Score her email from your other honey.

[Ron]

Brian's quote pretty much sums up why Disc 1 on TSS is the way it is; it's finished in Brian's eye, as well as Van Dyke's too. I am happy that I feel the same way, as well. I kind of feel sad for you guys that have so many issues coming to terms with this release instead of just enjoying it for what it is.

That's how I feel as well.  I was being sarcastic with the quote, I just thought it was pretty cut and dry... Brian completely regards the album as finished, not as a new album but as the same project, finished over 40 years. 

[juggler]

does anyone have a full image of the handwriten tracklist? I can't find it anywhere. I remember it used to be on the smile shop, but that's not around anymore.
Man, I really miss that site, I used to spend hours there.

There's a small photo on this page:
http://smilealbum.tripod.com/smprimer.html

[Ron]

Remember how a lot of people were guessing that Barnyard was going to appear with lead vocals because of Capitol's cryptic etching of the lyrics in the H&V 78 for record store day? Now, Peter Reum has said that only Child and Teeter were mastered from acetate. This bodes well, no? Please correct me if i'm wrong, but hasn't Barnyard always been sourced from acetate? I need a drink.   

The Barnyard on the BWPS helps prove the 'finished version' argument, it was one of my favorite nuances of the entire album.  On the acetate (that you're referencing, the only version of the song we've ever heard) Brian goes " the cook is chopping lumber..." and on 2004 I was surprised to hear him say "the cook is chopping Lummmmbuurrrrrrrrrrr"

Now I know that's very minor.  But it points to the possibility that Brian still remembered the album; and over the years had either changed a few things (like that little melody) or had things he remembered that were never put down on tape.  

[Ron]

Did anybody see in that Irish Times article where its mentioned that Brian is recording an album of covers, apparently primarily consisting of Phil Spector and Chuck Berry tunes? HA! I, personally would love it. But there is a sllliiiiiight marketing problem if this ever happens. What are they gonna call it, Brian Wilson Reimagines Songs by a Guy That Sets Up a Camera to Watch Girls Pee and Also Other Songs Written by a Guy That Apparently Killed Someone? I hope Brian does do this rock 'n roll album he's kept speaking of, but I would really prefer it if it wasn't all covers. Three solo albums in a row using primarily cover tunes? Meh. Maybe he is saving the originals for the new BB album. Not that I really think that proposed Beach Boys album of new material is gonna happen either.

Yeah, I don't think they could release an entire album of those, because you'd have to draw attention to Spector to do it.  Chuck I don't think has any PR problems.  Yeah he set up the camera but everybody has forgot about that by now, lol.  He also went to prison in the 50's, right?  Nobody remembers that. 

If he did an album full of covers, he could have some spector stuff in there, no problem.  Brian has it in his head that he can't write anymore, so he probably WILL do a bunch of covers. 

[drbeachboy]

Brian's quote pretty much sums up why Disc 1 on TSS is the way it is; it's finished in Brian's eye, as well as Van Dyke's too. I am happy that I feel the same way, as well. I kind of feel sad for you guys that have so many issues coming to terms with this release instead of just enjoying it for what it is.

That's how I feel as well.  I was being sarcastic with the quote, I just thought it was pretty cut and dry... Brian completely regards the album as finished, not as a new album but as the same project, finished over 40 years.  

I figured that you were not serious from reading your previous posts, but I don't think everybody did.

[Dunderhead]

Holidays=Worms=Dada=Little Pad?

[Ron]

does anyone know who's website has the handwriting comparisons of Brian, Carl, and Diane? surely someone here does.

I found the handwriting samples: A forgotten thread from March. Enjoy!

It appears some people haven't seen the handwriting from the discussion on the old Smile Shop some years ago, or even the more recent ones linked a few posts ago. I've compiled some of the examples from earlier amateur sleuthing and handwriting analysis attempts. You'll see period examples of Brian, Carl, and Diane and examples to match them up with other samples.

The next are a handful to compare and contrast Brian, Carl, and Diane:

Not as if it matters, but I agree that the handwritten list for Smile didn't come from Brian.  It matches the Wild Honey stuff, which has "Boogalooed it" written in; if you look at Brian's Visa application, he finished it in cursive, and wrote "Hollwood"... if you compare the two words (similar endings in cursive) they're very different.  Two different people.  

[Dunderhead]

I'd say whoever finished the application wrote the tracklist.

[Andrew G. Doe]

My bad - visa application is clearly not Brian's hand.