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Author Topic: New Beach Boys release will make you 'SMiLE'  (Read 190089 times)
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« Reply #800 on: February 25, 2011, 10:42:43 AM »

Anyone care to take an educated guess at what the price will be for the 78?

Hopefully it'll reflect the period styling of the sleeve. So I reckon £0 1s 6d. (That's old UK money.)


Whoa there!  He said "educated"; what are you doing chiming in?   Grin
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« Reply #801 on: February 25, 2011, 11:24:35 AM »

I have one other Beach Boys 78 (a pressing of Fun Fun Fun b/w Little Honda from India, where 78s were pressed until the late 60s).

How does it sound compared to other formats? Does it have the superiority you imply from your explanation of longer grooves etc?
Sadly not, as it's pressed on shellac (an inherently hissy, noisy medium...it's basically insect poo) rather than lovely smooth vinyl. shellac isn't easy to come by these days (even Paul McCartney couldn't source any for his limited replica Quarrymen 78rpm acetates), so I imagine these BB78s will be pressed on vinyl.


Wow, a Beach Boys 78 rpm from India, pressed on shellac.  I hadn't known any officially released BB 78's existed.  Are you aware of any other BB 78's from India?  Interesting that they were still pressing 78's at that time, and even more so that they were still using shellac.

I do have a 78 rpm record of Fun Fun Fun (b/w 409) pressed on vinyl.  It's a bootleg on Prime Records from around 30 years ago, and has been a staple on my 1946-47 vintage Wurlitzer 1015 jukebox.  The forthcoming release of Good Vibrations on 78 rpm will be a really cool addition to the tunes on the jukebox.

The late 1940's introduction of the 45 rpm single and the 33 1/3 rpm Long Play album caused 78's to basically disappear from the market in the US by the end of the 50's.  For anyone planning to play a 78, it's important to note that a stylus designed for a 78 rpm record has a tip diameter around 4 times larger (about 2.5 to 3 mils) than one designed to play LPs and 45's (about 0.7 mils).  If you play a 78 with a standard LP stylus, the stylus will not have proper contact with the groove side walls, instead riding at the bottom of the groove, resulting in lots of surface noise (especially with shellac records) and a thin, tinny sound.  Some old record players, typically low end ones and those designed for school use, have a flip over stylus, with one side designed for LPs and 45s, and the other for 78s.  

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« Reply #802 on: February 25, 2011, 11:52:43 AM »

Anyone care to take an educated guess at what the price will be for the 78?

Hopefully it'll reflect the period styling of the sleeve. So I reckon £0 1s 6d. (That's old UK money.)


Whoa there!  He said "educated"; what are you doing chiming in?   Grin

Aaaargh... you slammed me just to get post Number 800 !!!!!   Smiley
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« Reply #803 on: February 25, 2011, 12:36:15 PM »

I have one other Beach Boys 78 (a pressing of Fun Fun Fun b/w Little Honda from India, where 78s were pressed until the late 60s).

How does it sound compared to other formats? Does it have the superiority you imply from your explanation of longer grooves etc?
Sadly not, as it's pressed on shellac (an inherently hissy, noisy medium...it's basically insect poo) rather than lovely smooth vinyl. shellac isn't easy to come by these days (even Paul McCartney couldn't source any for his limited replica Quarrymen 78rpm acetates), so I imagine these BB78s will be pressed on vinyl.


Wow, a Beach Boys 78 rpm from India, pressed on shellac.  I hadn't known any officially released BB 78's existed.  Are you aware of any other BB 78's from India?  Interesting that they were still pressing 78's at that time, and even more so that they were still using shellac.


I'm not aware of any others, but unknown 78s from India & The Philippines appear on ebay fairly regularly (I saw a Philippine-pressed 78 copy of Carole King's "Oh Neil" on there not so long ago. Who'd have thought it?), and often in unique a/b side combinations. I mean, it wouldn't surprise me if there's a Phillippine-pressed 78 of Good Vibrations b/w Heroes & Villains out there somewhere...

Does anyone know if this will be a US-only release, or will copies find there way over to the UK through official outlets on Record "Shop" (as we call them) Day?
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« Reply #804 on: February 25, 2011, 12:40:20 PM »

Anyone care to take an educated guess at what the price will be for the 78?

Hopefully it'll reflect the period styling of the sleeve. So I reckon £0 1s 6d. (That's old UK money.)


Whoa there!  He said "educated"; what are you doing chiming in?   Grin

Aaaargh... you slammed me just to get post Number 800 !!!!!   Smiley

To be fair, I only asked the initial question to get post #798 - my lucky number  Grin
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« Reply #805 on: February 25, 2011, 01:28:20 PM »

I have one other Beach Boys 78 (a pressing of Fun Fun Fun b/w Little Honda from India, where 78s were pressed until the late 60s).


Wow, a Beach Boys 78 rpm from India, pressed on shellac.  I hadn't known any officially released BB 78's existed.  Are you aware of any other BB 78's from India?  Interesting that they were still pressing 78's at that time, and even more so that they were still using shellac.

I do have a 78 rpm record of Fun Fun Fun (b/w 409) pressed on vinyl.  It's a bootleg on Prime Records from around 30 years ago, and has been a staple on my 1946-47 vintage Wurlitzer 1015 jukebox.  The forthcoming release of Good Vibrations on 78 rpm will be a really cool addition to the tunes on the jukebox.

The late 1940's introduction of the 45 rpm single and the 33 1/3 rpm Long Play album caused 78's to basically disappear from the market in the US by the end of the 50's.  For anyone planning to play a 78, it's important to note that a stylus designed for a 78 rpm record has a tip diameter around 4 times larger (about 2.5 to 3 mils) than one designed to play LPs and 45's (about 0.7 mils).  If you play a 78 with a standard LP stylus, the stylus will not have proper contact with the groove side walls, instead riding at the bottom of the groove, resulting in lots of surface noise (especially with shellac records) and a thin, tinny sound.  Some old record players, typically low end ones and those designed for school use, have a flip over stylus, with one side designed for LPs and 45s, and the other for 78s.  



Are the 78's on Prime boots?  I was told they were licensed for 78 jukeboxes; never really gave it much thought as to whether that was fact.
I have one, in horrible condition, with LDC on one side, and Lesley Gore singing "Sunshine Lollipops and Roses" on tother.

As for Indian 78's, to a point( in time) I believe they were very slow to catch up with the rest of the world. Probably had to do with the British colony mentality of keeping the locals subservient... Cheesy

Aaaargh... you slammed me just to get post Number 800 !!!!!   Smiley

If only I were that bright...  This is the first time I've ever noticed those #'s; I'd probably have been forever blissfully ignorant of them, but now I may well dwell on posting for number effect.
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« Reply #806 on: February 25, 2011, 02:11:36 PM »

I believe the reason that India continued pressing 78s til the late 60s was down to the erratic nature of their electricity infrastructure. 78s could be played anywhere on wind-up equipment requiring no external power.

Can you imagine how great it would be to hear Heroes & Villains emerging from a gramophone horn? On 16th April, your dreams will come true...

(ps: I recommend using a wooden "needle" over metallic ones; they're quieter & have a shorter life, but have a much warmer tone).
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« Reply #807 on: February 25, 2011, 02:23:45 PM »

I have one other Beach Boys 78 (a pressing of Fun Fun Fun b/w Little Honda from India, where 78s were pressed until the late 60s).


Wow, a Beach Boys 78 rpm from India, pressed on shellac.  I hadn't known any officially released BB 78's existed.  Are you aware of any other BB 78's from India?  Interesting that they were still pressing 78's at that time, and even more so that they were still using shellac.

I do have a 78 rpm record of Fun Fun Fun (b/w 409) pressed on vinyl.  It's a bootleg on Prime Records from around 30 years ago, and has been a staple on my 1946-47 vintage Wurlitzer 1015 jukebox.  The forthcoming release of Good Vibrations on 78 rpm will be a really cool addition to the tunes on the jukebox.

The late 1940's introduction of the 45 rpm single and the 33 1/3 rpm Long Play album caused 78's to basically disappear from the market in the US by the end of the 50's.  For anyone planning to play a 78, it's important to note that a stylus designed for a 78 rpm record has a tip diameter around 4 times larger (about 2.5 to 3 mils) than one designed to play LPs and 45's (about 0.7 mils).  If you play a 78 with a standard LP stylus, the stylus will not have proper contact with the groove side walls, instead riding at the bottom of the groove, resulting in lots of surface noise (especially with shellac records) and a thin, tinny sound.  Some old record players, typically low end ones and those designed for school use, have a flip over stylus, with one side designed for LPs and 45s, and the other for 78s.  



Are the 78's on Prime boots?  I was told they were licensed for 78 jukeboxes; never really gave it much thought as to whether that was fact.
I have one, in horrible condition, with LDC on one side, and Lesley Gore singing "Sunshine Lollipops and Roses" on tother.


My recollection is that when the 78 rpm's from Prime Records were first released around 30 years ago the story from the distributors selling them was that they had been told the records had been officially licensed for use on vintage 78 rpm jukeboxes, (production of which had basically stopped in the early 50's with new jukeboxes playing 45's).  

It soon came to light that the Prime Records were not authorized, causing the legitimate jukebox suppliers to stop carrying them.  A couple of clues to their bootleg status are the really inexpensive looking Prime Records logo, and the fact that the publisher is listed as B.B. Music.  On the up side, as vinyl records they are far less susceptible to wear and breakage compared to the old shellac 78 rpm records.

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« Reply #808 on: February 25, 2011, 02:30:27 PM »

I believe the reason that India continued pressing 78s til the late 60s was down to the erratic nature of their electricity infrastructure. 78s could be played anywhere on wind-up equipment requiring no external power.

Can you imagine how great it would be to hear Heroes & Villains emerging from a gramophone horn? On 16th April, your dreams will come true...

(ps: I recommend using a wooden "needle" over metallic ones; they're quieter & have a shorter life, but have a much warmer tone).

I've heard of wooden needles, but never seen one in action.  Do you use it on a wind-up non-electrically amplified gramophone with horn?  Are they still available for purchase?  This will definitely be a cool way to play Good Vibrations.
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« Reply #809 on: February 25, 2011, 02:37:04 PM »

Anyone care to take an educated guess at what the price will be for the 78?

The most recent batch of Record Store Day singles went for US $7 or so.
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« Reply #810 on: February 25, 2011, 03:54:42 PM »


Are the 78's on Prime boots?  I was told they were licensed for 78 jukeboxes; never really gave it much thought as to whether that was fact.
I have one, in horrible condition, with LDC on one side, and Lesley Gore singing "Sunshine Lollipops and Roses" on tother.


My recollection is that when the 78 rpm's from Prime Records were first released around 30 years ago the story from the distributors selling them was that they had been told the records had been officially licensed for use on vintage 78 rpm jukeboxes, (production of which had basically stopped in the early 50's with new jukeboxes playing 45's).  

It soon came to light that the Prime Records were not authorized, causing the legitimate jukebox suppliers to stop carrying them.  A couple of clues to their bootleg status are the really inexpensive looking Prime Records logo, and the fact that the publisher is listed as B.B. Music.  On the up side, as vinyl records they are far less susceptible to wear and breakage compared to the old shellac 78 rpm records.



Hmmm.. as I said, mine isn't in very good condition, but I've seen cheap looking logos on real labels too, so I'm not certain that's a good barometer.  Plus, on mine, the publisher is listed as Irving Music, BMI: 



So while I can't speak definitively on the bootleg question, since I don't know for sure, there are definitely some different pressings out there. 

There's a seller on Ebay trying to sell 24 vinyl reproduction 78's for $450; one of which is the one I have.
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« Reply #811 on: February 25, 2011, 06:07:22 PM »

Interesting.  Yes, your record does say Irving Music, rather than B.B. Music. 

Also usually found on legit record releases but lacking on the Prime Records label is record company info in small curved letters along the bottom.  Plus, if these aren't bootlegs, Prime Records was the only US record company, after 1965, to  successfully license a couple of Capitol/Apple Records tracks by The Beatles, with I Saw Her Standing There b/w Twist and Shout also a Prime Records 78 on my jukebox.  Of course, those two songs were initially released on Vee-Jay and Tollie in the US, after Capitol records, apparently thinking that they had the teen market sewed up with The Beach Boys under contract, initially passed on the rights to release Beatles records in the US. 
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« Reply #812 on: February 25, 2011, 07:54:10 PM »

Interesting.  Yes, your record does say Irving Music, rather than B.B. Music. 

Also usually found on legit record releases but lacking on the Prime Records label is record company info in small curved letters along the bottom.  Plus, if these aren't bootlegs, Prime Records was the only US record company, after 1965, to  successfully license a couple of Capitol/Apple Records tracks by The Beatles, with I Saw Her Standing There b/w Twist and Shout also a Prime Records 78 on my jukebox.  Of course, those two songs were initially released on Vee-Jay and Tollie in the US, after Capitol records, apparently thinking that they had the teen market sewed up with The Beach Boys under contract, initially passed on the rights to release Beatles records in the US. 


Oh, you're probably correct about them being boots.
I'm not certain, tho, that they might not have had some sort of licensing deal, presuming they were only for 78 jukeboxes; by the late 60's, when you say these were issued, how many 78 jukeboxes were there still likely to have been, Worldwide?       
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« Reply #813 on: February 25, 2011, 08:58:27 PM »

All I have to say is, at least were not getting that damn 'Then I Kissed Her' single
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« Reply #814 on: February 25, 2011, 11:15:58 PM »

Interesting.  Yes, your record does say Irving Music, rather than B.B. Music. 

Also usually found on legit record releases but lacking on the Prime Records label is record company info in small curved letters along the bottom.  Plus, if these aren't bootlegs, Prime Records was the only US record company, after 1965, to  successfully license a couple of Capitol/Apple Records tracks by The Beatles, with I Saw Her Standing There b/w Twist and Shout also a Prime Records 78 on my jukebox.  Of course, those two songs were initially released on Vee-Jay and Tollie in the US, after Capitol records, apparently thinking that they had the teen market sewed up with The Beach Boys under contract, initially passed on the rights to release Beatles records in the US. 


Oh, you're probably correct about them being boots.
I'm not certain, tho, that they might not have had some sort of licensing deal, presuming they were only for 78 jukeboxes; by the late 60's, when you say these were issued, how many 78 jukeboxes were there still likely to have been, Worldwide?       

The Prime Records 78 rpms were released around the very late 70's to the early 80's, with my recollection being the early 80's.  By then 78 rpm jukeboxes were basically the exclusive provence of collectors using them in their homes (and a few restaurants). It's doubtful there were any 78 rpm jukeboxes in commercial service anywhere at that time, unless they were being used to play vintage records in a nostalgic retro commercial setting. 

By the late 50's in the US, and later in other markets, 45 rpm singles had completely supplanted 78's.  Old 78 rpm jukeboxes were considered antiquated, as they could no longer feature current hits.  This resulted in huge numbers of them being hauled to the dump, as they were practically worthless from a commercial standpoint. 

But, starting in the late 60's in the US, appreciation for those classic machines, especially those designed by Paul Fuller for Wurlitzer, began to materialize, and by the late 70's demand for these old machines became intense, and grew into the 80's and beyond.  Old 78 rpm jukeboxes that had sold for $50 around the time of Fun Fun Fun were going for up to 100 to 200 times and more that price twenty years later.  And, many of the purchasers of such machines were baby boomers who wanted rock n roll records they had grown up with, many of which had never been produced as 78's, at least not in the US, UK, etc.  Hence a perfect "business opportunity" for Prime Records, and Rhino Records (with officially licensed 78's) after that.

Getting back to The Beach Boys, in 1966 and 67, Brian Wilson, fixated on the number 45, as it represented the number of revolutions per minute of single records, had a vision that he should produce two avant-garde 45 rpm singles that were so cutting edge that they would still be considered relevant 45 years later.  Thus were born Good Vibrations and Heroes and Villains, both of which will soon see release, as per Brian's instructions 45 years ago, on his father's favorite format, the 78 rpm record.

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« Reply #815 on: February 26, 2011, 03:37:43 AM »

Hmmm.. as I said, mine isn't in very good condition, but I've seen cheap looking logos on real labels too, so I'm not certain that's a good barometer.  Plus, on mine, the publisher is listed as Irving Music, BMI: 



So while I can't speak definitively on the bootleg question, since I don't know for sure, there are definitely some different pressings out there. 

There's a seller on Ebay trying to sell 24 vinyl reproduction 78's for $450; one of which is the one I have.

Looking at the font (of the group name and title), it reminds me of the Capitol LA-pressing font type.

Very nice collectable, bgas. Thanks for showing.
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« Reply #816 on: February 26, 2011, 08:13:46 AM »

All I have to say is, at least were not getting that damn 'Then I Kissed Her' single


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« Reply #817 on: February 26, 2011, 01:36:30 PM »

Back to the topic at hand.  I find it amazing that there is no 'official' confirmation of Smile.

If it was legit, you'd think they'd want a big buzz building on this (though based on my marketing skills, I'm a idiot).

To those doubters,it sounds like AGD feels strongly that this is happening; so I'd bet on it.
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« Reply #818 on: February 26, 2011, 01:38:31 PM »

Back to the topic at hand.  I find it amazing that there is no 'official' confirmation of Smile.

If it was legit, you'd think they'd want a big buzz building on this (though based on my marketing skills, I'm a idiot).

To those doubters,it sounds like AGD feels strongly that this is happening; so I'd bet on it.

i don't think so.  I don't think they'd announce anything till it was done. 
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« Reply #819 on: February 26, 2011, 01:42:48 PM »

Back to the topic at hand.  I find it amazing that there is no 'official' confirmation of Smile.

If it was legit, you'd think they'd want a big buzz building on this (though based on my marketing skills, I'm a idiot).

To those doubters,it sounds like AGD feels strongly that this is happening; so I'd bet on it.

Probably no official confirmation yet because (1) it's too far in advance of the release, and (2) they're probably still working on the details and timetable for the 50th anniversary campaign.
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« Reply #820 on: February 26, 2011, 02:49:45 PM »

Back to the topic at hand.  I find it amazing that there is no 'official' confirmation of Smile.

If it was legit, you'd think they'd want a big buzz building on this (though based on my marketing skills, I'm a idiot).

To those doubters,it sounds like AGD feels strongly that this is happening; so I'd bet on it.

i don't think so.  I don't think they'd announce anything till it was done. 

Is it ever REALLY gonna be done?  Bottoms to buttons there will be 1000's of posts on here about stuff that wasn't included Cheesy
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« Reply #821 on: February 26, 2011, 04:32:40 PM »

I get the jukebox collector element, I somewhat get the novelty element of pressing a 78 of the Beach Boys in 2011, but what still doesn't fit is how the 78 format was a dead format when the original single was mixed and released! The original Good Vibrations was mixed originally to sound good on AM radio via the 45rpm record. Any number of vintage aircheck recordings from the heyday of AM radio proves how great certain records sound when heard as they were intended to be heard: a tape I have of KHJ in Los Angeles playing the song "San Francisco" by Scott McKenzie makes the song come alive - pumping bass, the guitars jump through the mix, the vocal sits perfectly in the mono mix...yet when it's played on oldies FM radio in a stereo mix, it sounds much less forceful and much more separated.

My point is, why choose these songs to put on 78? I can't imagine the experience of hearing those songs on 78rpm adding anything beyond what playing the songs on 45 rpm already delivers the listener. You're hearing a different format than what the original was mixed for all its optimum listening experience. If they did this for, say, a record like Lover by Les Paul or even In The Mood by Glen Miller, the format would jive with the original intent of the mix. Just thinking out loud.
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« Reply #822 on: February 26, 2011, 05:55:41 PM »

Compared to many of you, I just became a Beach Boys fan a heartbeat ago. It may be a stupid waste of money, but to me the 78 will serve as a collectable memento to remind me of my early years of being a Beach Boys fan.

That, and it's a gimmick for the official release of the Beach Boys SMiLE....it will look good framed on my wall.
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« Reply #823 on: February 26, 2011, 06:35:06 PM »

So, we know for sure this isn't some sort of Interweb joke?
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« Reply #824 on: February 27, 2011, 12:01:17 AM »

So, we know for sure this isn't some sort of Interweb joke?

I guess not. This smile themed record store day release does make the prospect more likely imo.
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