Thread for various insignificant questions that don't deserve their own thread!

[HeyJude]

Why was "Christmas Time is Here Again" -- and only "Christmas Time is Here Again" -- deleted from Ultimate Christmas when it was reissued in 2004 as Christmas with the Beach Boys?

It seems like every year EMI and its licensees put out a new cheap version of the Christmas album, but this was different -- the 2004 release was clearly meant to be a "serious" archival release of that material, just as Ultimate Christmas was. So why did they fail to include that one track, and just that one track? Rights issues involving "Peggy Sue"?

I always saw it more like "Christmas with the Beach Boys" was the budget cheapie version of "Ultimate Christamas", and they just happened to, for once, carry almost all those tracks over.

I'm guessing, because there's pretty much just a flat royalty cost to pay per song in terms of publishing, they just budgeted the thing out and it was decided to cut one song. Not sure why *that* one was cut instead of something else. But I'm guessing it was pretty random.

I remember talking to someone in/around Capitol in the late 90s who mentioned that Capitol had a general limit set on the number of songs they would pay for on a compilation. This could sometimes be stretched past whatever that number was, and sometimes multiple versions of the same song would count as one. So that might explain how that 2004 CD had more songs than the typical budget CD (e.g. multiple versions of "Little Saint Nick", etc.), but still ended up capped just south of being able to include all the songs.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

I would imagine it was a rights issue.

[HeyJude]

BRI would have owned the recording itself. Someone (probably McCartney's MPL) owns the Holly publishing on the underlying song "Peggy Sue", but again, anyone can cover any song and they just have to pay a flat royalty rate.

I would guess it was either down to a slashed budget, or someone at BRI or Capitol just decided they didn't like that track anymore. If someone came to BRI members and said they had to slash one song, they'd probably pick a song they'd receive less or no songwriting royalties on. But it's all just guesses.

If this were a DVD, then I'd say it's for sure a song clearance cost issue. But with CDs, its the same rate for any songs as far as I know.

The only thing that makes me think it wasn't a cost issue is that, if they were looking to slash the budget, why not drop like 5 or 7 songs or something instead of one?

[jiggy22]

I would imagine it was a rights issue.

I would guess that as well. It might be why I can't even find the song on youtube or other music-sharing websites. I don't think I've ever even heard it!

[HeyJude]

The "digital" download version of "Ultimate Christmas" remained in print up until fairly recently, at least the last couple years, well after the CD version went out of print. But it indeed looks like it's not available anymore.

A used CD copy of "Ultimate Christmas" can still be found for a very cheap price, though.

[maggie]

BRI would have owned the recording itself. Someone (probably McCartney's MPL) owns the Holly publishing on the underlying song "Peggy Sue", but again, anyone can cover any song and they just have to pay a flat royalty rate.

I would guess it was either down to a slashed budget, or someone at BRI or Capitol just decided they didn't like that track anymore. If someone came to BRI members and said they had to slash one song, they'd probably pick a song they'd receive less or no songwriting royalties on. But it's all just guesses.

If this were a DVD, then I'd say it's for sure a song clearance cost issue. But with CDs, its the same rate for any songs as far as I know.

The only thing that makes me think it wasn't a cost issue is that, if they were looking to slash the budget, why not drop like 5 or 7 songs or something instead of one?

I thought the answer to my question would be pretty cut-and-dried, just a fact I didn't know -- but it turns out it really is a little mystery! The potential royalties explanation makes some sense (it's the only cover among the '70s tracks) if there really was an ultimatum to cut one song. Your theory about the maximum number of cuts per compilation policy possibly being in effect here makes sense, but it seems odd to cut just one track if budget was the concern. And it's not like the package cheaps out in other regards -- the fairly detailed liner notes from UC are carried over, aren't they? The same production team (Pawelski, Elliott, Sandoval, etc.) are credited on both CDs, I believe.

I'm inclined to wonder if the "somebody at BRI just hates the song" explanation is the most reasonable. Maybe someone considered it incomplete or subpar or otherwise embarrassing and objected to it being available?

[Juice Brohnston]

Did Chachi Arcola suffer some sort of Beach Boys 'curse'? Sometime around '63, he snuck off to Chicago to see a show (maybe Aug 11/63 Auditorium Theatre??) and his car broke down, forcing him to spend a night in a hotel with Joanie.

Then sometime around '65 I think, he was invited by the band to open some shows for them. Unfortunately he was diagnosed with diabetes, and had to cancel.

[Needleinthehay]

Just want to make sure I have this right....the BWPS version of "Good Vibrations" is all original words written by tony asher correct?  Or are some of those lyrics also Mike Loves? If those are all tony ashers original lyrics, a lot of them were left in and Mike really only changed a few lines for the finished version it seems like...or are a lot of the BWPS lyrics actually Mikes?

[JK]

Just want to make sure I have this right....the BWPS version of "Good Vibrations" is all original words written by VDP, correct?  Or are some of those lyrics also Mike Loves? If those are all VDP's original lyrics, a lot of them were left in and Mike really only changed a few lines it seems like...am i wrong?

Those are Tony Asher's original lyrics. Someone (Emdeeh?) described them as placeholders for permanent lyrics. Most likely, but they have their own charm...

This is the first, Pet Sounds-era take of "GV" with Tony's lyrics:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qz2SabvaOjQ




     

[Marty Castillo]

I was watching the Good Timin': Live at Knebworth England 1980 DVD last night while handing out candy to trick or treaters and it struck me that there were a number of song dedications to specific people that night. Two questions:

1. Was that typical for that era of the touring band?
2. Any info on those who got name checked?

[MarcellaHasDirtyFeet]

I was watching the Good Timin': Live at Knebworth England 1980 DVD last night while handing out candy to trick or treaters and it struck me that there were a number of song dedications to specific people that night. Two questions:

1. Was that typical for that era of the touring band?
2. Any info on those who got name checked?

I was under the impression they were fan club members. Can't speak as to whether or not it was a regular thing.

[astroray]

Watching Carly Simon on AXS TV being interviewed by Dan Rather, when asked about song writing, said she did it bit by bit. She just found a piece of a song she had written for the Beach Boys. Insignificant for sure!

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

She wrote a song for the Beach Boys?

[Marty Castillo]

I was watching the Good Timin': Live at Knebworth England 1980 DVD last night while handing out candy to trick or treaters and it struck me that there were a number of song dedications to specific people that night. Two questions:

1. Was that typical for that era of the touring band?
2. Any info on those who got name checked?

I was under the impression they were fan club members. Can't speak as to whether or not it was a regular thing.

Thanks!

[Robbie Mac]

I was watching the Good Timin': Live at Knebworth England 1980 DVD last night while handing out candy to trick or treaters and it struck me that there were a number of song dedications to specific people that night. Two questions:

1. Was that typical for that era of the touring band?
2. Any info on those who got name checked?

I was under the impression they were fan club members. Can't speak as to whether or not it was a regular thing.

Thanks!

Andrew Bainbridge (sp?), who Carl dedicated Help Me Rhonda to, was the founder of BEACH BOYS STOMP.  Bruce dedicated I Write The Songs to, of all people, Dave Edmunds.

[William Bowe]

Did Chachi Arcola suffer some sort of Beach Boys 'curse'? Sometime around '63, he snuck off to Chicago to see a show (maybe Aug 11/63 Auditorium Theatre??) and his car broke down, forcing him to spend a night in a hotel with Joanie.

Then sometime around '65 I think, he was invited by the band to open some shows for them. Unfortunately he was diagnosed with diabetes, and had to cancel.

Now he's out spruiking for Trump. Make of that what you will.

[NOLA BB Fan]

The Soundbreaking series is being shown on the PBS network this week.
On tonight's show BBs/BW will be mentioned in the context of production and multi-tracking.

[Surfer]

Not to go off topic but I am watching Supernatural but Brian Wilson's  song Good Vibrations came on first .   

[RangeRoverA1]

4 yrs ago in this thread http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,13118.0.html  nobody knew anything as regards "Lonely Days"songwriting credits. Did any info appear by now? I used to think it's the case of "who sang it [Carl/Al/Bruce] contributed to writing it" but now am not sure.

[Rick5150]

I read something a while ago about some possibly risque background lyrics in Pom Pom Playgirl, but cannot remember what they were. Can someone help me out? Thanks!

[Rocky Raccoon]

I was watching the Good Timin': Live at Knebworth England 1980 DVD last night while handing out candy to trick or treaters and it struck me that there were a number of song dedications to specific people that night. Two questions:

1. Was that typical for that era of the touring band?
2. Any info on those who got name checked?

I was under the impression they were fan club members. Can't speak as to whether or not it was a regular thing.

Thanks!

Andrew Bainbridge (sp?), who Carl dedicated Help Me Rhonda to, was the founder of BEACH BOYS STOMP.  Bruce dedicated I Write The Songs to, of all people, Dave Edmunds.

Dave Edmunds is a big Beach Boys fan.  What's interesting is that I Write the Songs was cut from the DVD, placing the dedication after I think Surfer Girl.

[pdas1996]

I love seeing how many times Surfin' Safari gets released through sketchy labels as compilations.

One came through today: "Fantastic Music for Christmas (All the Greatest Tracks)" on the Classic Mood Experience label.

1. Heads You Win, Tails I Lose
2. Ten Little Indians
3. 409
4. Little Girl (You're My Miss America)
5. Moon Dawg
6. Surfin'
7. Cuckoo Clock
8. Summertime Blues
9. Chug-A-Lug
10. Surfin' Safari
11. County Fair

I've never understood how this happens, and why it's always Surfin' Safari.

[JK]

Not to go off topic but I am watching Supernatural but Brian Wilson's  song Good Vibrations came on first .   

Hi Surfer. I gather from a comment I read (see link) that it was the version from BWPS and not the 1966 single...

http://www.tunefind.com/show/supernatural/season-11/30008#song-127263

[KDS]

The BWPS version was also used during the ending of Wild Hogs. 

[Rocky Raccoon]

I love seeing how many times Surfin' Safari gets released through sketchy labels as compilations.

One came through today: "Fantastic Music for Christmas (All the Greatest Tracks)" on the Classic Mood Experience label.

1. Heads You Win, Tails I Lose
2. Ten Little Indians
3. 409
4. Little Girl (You're My Miss America)
5. Moon Dawg
6. Surfin'
7. Cuckoo Clock
8. Summertime Blues
9. Chug-A-Lug
10. Surfin' Safari
11. County Fair

I've never understood how this happens, and why it's always Surfin' Safari.

I think Surfin' Safari fell into the public domain in Europe so these are all European labels repackaging the songs without having to pay copyright fees.