Love and Mercy - News and Reviews - First clip is out.

[Ebb and Flow]

I'm really not sure what your point is, then. I thought you were suggesting that a Beatles biopic wouldn't contain errors but now you're suggesting that's not the case? It's not as if Love & Mercy was a movie sanctioned by Brian Wilson or BriMel or whatever.

I think whether or not it was "sanctioned" by them, Brian was a producer and was clearly involved in the production.  It has his blessing.  The use of actual masters in the soundtrack for instance?  "Backbeat" primarily told the story of two dead men and the only Beatles recording used in the soundtrack was "My Bonnie" by Tony Sheridan.  Apples and Oranges.

[Amy B.]

I'm really not sure what your point is, then. I thought you were suggesting that a Beatles biopic wouldn't contain errors but now you're suggesting that's not the case? It's not as if Love & Mercy was a movie sanctioned by Brian Wilson or BriMel or whatever.

I think whether or not it was "sanctioned" by them, Brian was a producer and was clearly involved in the production.  It has his blessing.  The use of actual masters in the soundtrack for instance?  "Backbeat" primarily told the story of two dead men and the only Beatles recording used in the soundtrack was "My Bonnie" by Tony Sheridan.  Apples and Oranges.

But there's a difference between "Hey, John never sang 'Long Tall Sally'," which is a pretty glaring error, and "Hey, VDP's hair looks a little too modern in this scene," which could just be that the wind blew it that way. Boy band hair usually requires a blow dryer and a brush. The guy playing VDP probably just had his combed wrong.

BTW, I will admit I have trouble watching old episodes of MASH because no one had their hair like that in the 50s!

[Chocolate Shake Man]

I'm really not sure what your point is, then. I thought you were suggesting that a Beatles biopic wouldn't contain errors but now you're suggesting that's not the case? It's not as if Love & Mercy was a movie sanctioned by Brian Wilson or BriMel or whatever.

I think whether or not it was "sanctioned" by them, Brian was a producer

No he wasn't.

and was clearly involved in the production.

Was he really? I'm really not sure - could you point to a source on that?

It has his blessing.  The use of actual masters in the soundtrack for instance?  "Backbeat" primarily told the story of two dead men and the only Beatles recording used in the soundtrack was "My Bonnie" by Tony Sheridan.  Apples and Oranges.

Yes, they are different movies. No one is arguing against that. However, you are shifting the goal posts. Your original point was that a Beatles biopic would not contain an error. You never added any caveat about how no Beatles biopic that had the Beatles "blessing" would contain an error. And my hunch is that the reason why you didn't say that is because at that point, that's not what you meant. You're throwing this in now because the second I produced an example that countered your argument you looked for a way to de-legitimize it. The fact is that you can't name a biopic on anyone, blessing or not, that doesn't have some kind of error in it. Are the errors in the Summer Dream movie some how more acceptable or understandable to you because the movie didn't have anyone's blessing?

[Andrew G. Doe]

I'm really not sure what your point is, then. I thought you were suggesting that a Beatles biopic wouldn't contain errors but now you're suggesting that's not the case? It's not as if Love & Mercy was a movie sanctioned by Brian Wilson or BriMel or whatever.

I think whether or not it was "sanctioned" by them, Brian was a producer

No he wasn't.

I'll wager you... oh, the entire US and UK National Debts combined that Brian is listed as a producer of the movie by at least one highly reputable online database.

That's $20,069,241,928 you owe me. 

Piece of serious advice: before making ill-informed statements like that you really should check that you know WTF you're talking about. It'll save you looking like an idiot. Oh, and $20,069,241,928. I'll take it in hundreds.

[Chocolate Shake Man]

Piece of serious advice: before making ill-informed statements like that you really should check that you know WTF you're talking about. It'll save you looking like an idiot. Oh, and $20,069,241,928. I'll take it in hundreds.

Much like when you claimed that Mike Love was the sole vocalist on the Vegetables demo verse. Fortunately, I'm quite aware that I am as likely to make a mistake as you are or anyone else for that matter.

Yes, after checking IMDB, Brian is listed as a producer. By the same token, Backbeat had both Astrid Kirchherr and Klaus Voormann as assistants.

[The Cincinnati Kid]

I could have sworn I read something a while back that said Brian was no longer going to be listed as a producer.  Maybe they changed their minds. 

[rab2591]

I'm really not sure what your point is, then. I thought you were suggesting that a Beatles biopic wouldn't contain errors but now you're suggesting that's not the case? It's not as if Love & Mercy was a movie sanctioned by Brian Wilson or BriMel or whatever.

I think whether or not it was "sanctioned" by them, Brian was a producer

No he wasn't.

I'll wager you... oh, the entire US and UK National Debts combined that Brian is listed as a producer of the movie by at least one highly reputable online database.

That's $20,069,241,928 you owe me.  

Piece of serious advice: before making ill-informed statements like that you really should check that you know WTF you're talking about. It'll save you looking like an idiot. Oh, and $20,069,241,928. I'll take it in hundreds.

He may be listed on IMDB (which as I understand works like Wikipedia where anyone can edit the data), but on the Love and Mercy page on the Toronto International Film Festival website Brian Wilson is not listed as a producer of the film. I'd wager that the TIFF website has more reliable info than IMDB, at this point in time.

http://www.tiff.net/festivals/thefestival/programmes/specialpresentations/love-mercy

[ontor pertawst]

A Brian Wilson producer credit would look pretty ludicrous on a film about him as well... the words "vanity project" would be mentioned in reviews instead of praise for Paul Dano. Even if he did have points in it or something or worked out some deal in exchange for cheaper music clearances, it would be much wiser not to have an onscreen credit.

[Andrew G. Doe]

I somehow doubt Brian was a hands-on producer... but of course, given my recent track record in these matters he probably was.  

[ontor pertawst]

Hahahah! Yup, chomping a cigar, hiring and firing people. Barking orders, interviewing starlets.

Brian Wilson: hands on producer!

[SMiLE Brian]

Like father like son!

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

The image of Brian with a cigar is downright hilarious to me for some reason.

[Ebb and Flow]

No he wasn't.

Whether it's no longer the case or not, he was at one point.

Was he really? I'm really not sure - could you point to a source on that?

I've read at least one interview with Dano where he discussed speaking with Brian personally before acting, receiving his blessing not to mention Brian and his band being involved in the wrap party for the film, presumably while still a producer.

Yes, they are different movies. No one is arguing against that. However, you are shifting the goal posts. Your original point was that a Beatles biopic would not contain an error.

What I meant was a high caliber Beatles biopic with the Beatles having some tacit involvement, which has obviously yet to be made (despite your insistence that "Backbeat" is such a film).  Which is what Love and Mercy is to an extent with Brian Wilson/the Beach Boys.  It's a high profile, decent budgetish movie and comes with a lot more expectations.

The fact is that you can't name a biopic on anyone, blessing or not, that doesn't have some kind of error in it.

Again, re-read my posts.  I'm not against any sort of revisionism.  I realize films often have to dramatize aspects of real life.  I enjoy the Buddy Holly story even though much is changed or left out.  I'm actually looking forward to how Smile is depicted in this, even though I know the real story is more complicated.

However I do think changing the iconography of something like an album cover IS slightly egregious and is usually NOT something these sorts of movies deviate from.  We're talking about changing the visual identity of something because of budgetary concerns or whatever excuse there was.

Are the errors in the Summer Dream movie some how more acceptable or understandable to you because the movie didn't have anyone's blessing?

Seriously, are we now using the Summer Dreams TV movie of the week (based on Brian's "autobiography") as some sort of example now? Gimme a break.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Seriously, are we now using the Summer Dreams TV movie of the week (based on Brian's "autobiography") as some sort of example now? Gimme a break.

[koff] Summer Dreams was based on the Gaines book. Being released in 1990 kinda mitigates against it being based on something published in 1991. 

[mtaber]

Andrew - I think the figure you quoted needs a few more zero's... US debt is around 19 TRILLION

[Mendota Heights]

I am really glad this movie has been made and I don't give a truck about the truck.

[rab2591]

I am really glad this movie has been made and I don't give a truck about the truck.

Indeed. At best it'll be a 10 second shot during the intro montage. I'd rather them spend the budget on, ya know, actors and props that will be used extensively throughout the film. If people can't connect the dots when it comes to this truck/woodie, then it won't matter anyway. This scene will most likely have no strict bearing on the plot whatsoever.

[PS]

Scene 4

EXT. BEACH - EARLY 1960s (MAY INCLUDE ARCHIVAL)

THE BEACH BOYS (singing)

If everybody had an ocean,
across the U.S.A.
Then everybody'd be surfin'
Like Californ-I-A

The Beach Boys' classic "SURFIN' U.S.A. bursts on and continues as MAIN CREDITS APPEAR over classic early 1960's beach and surfing footage INTERCUT with Beach Boys promotional films showing the boys on the beach, in their hot rods, and in the studio

Scene 6

EXT. BEACH  - EARLY 1960's DAY

The Beach Boys, wearing heavy Pendleton shirts, are bunched together, holding a surfboard under their arms while posing for cameras. Behind them REAL SURFERS polish boards and take to the waves. Brian-Past smiles toward the PHOTOGRAPHERS as he checks out the scene, wide-eyed and ill-at-ease with the attention of the CAMERAMEN.

THE BEACH BOYS (OVER)
(singing)

All over Manhattan
And down Doheny way
Everybody's gone surfin'
Surfin' U.S.A....

Scene 7

INT. SMALL VENUE - EARLY 1960's - DAY
CREDITS CONTINUE...

[guitarfool2002]

Scene 4

EXT. BEACH - EARLY 1960s (MAY INCLUDE ARCHIVAL)

THE BEACH BOYS (singing)

If everybody had an ocean,
across the U.S.A.
Then everybody'd be surfin'
Like Californ-I-A

The Beach Boys' classic "SURFIN' U.S.A. bursts on and continues as MAIN CREDITS APPEAR over classic early 1960's beach and surfing footage INTERCUT with Beach Boys promotional films showing the boys on the beach, in their hot rods, and in the studio

Scene 6

EXT. BEACH  - EARLY 1960's DAY

The Beach Boys, wearing heavy Pendleton shirts, are bunched together, holding a surfboard under their arms while posing for cameras. Behind them REAL SURFERS polish boards and take to the waves. Brian-Past smiles toward the PHOTOGRAPHERS as he checks out the scene, wide-eyed and ill-at-ease with the attention of the CAMERAMEN.

THE BEACH BOYS (OVER)
(singing)

All over Manhattan
And down Doheny way
Everybody's gone surfin'
Surfin' U.S.A....

Scene 7

INT. SMALL VENUE - EARLY 1960's - DAY
CREDITS CONTINUE...

[Ebb and Flow]

Seriously, are we now using the Summer Dreams TV movie of the week (based on Brian's "autobiography") as some sort of example now? Gimme a break.

[koff] Summer Dreams was based on the Gaines book. Being released in 1990 kinda mitigates against it being based on something published in 1991. 

Yeah, I remembered that like 5 minutes after I posted that. 

[Cyncie]

Scene 4

EXT. BEACH - EARLY 1960s (MAY INCLUDE ARCHIVAL)

THE BEACH BOYS (singing)

If everybody had an ocean,
across the U.S.A.
Then everybody'd be surfin'
Like Californ-I-A

The Beach Boys' classic "SURFIN' U.S.A. bursts on and continues as MAIN CREDITS APPEAR over classic early 1960's beach and surfing footage INTERCUT with Beach Boys promotional films showing the boys on the beach, in their hot rods, and in the studio

Scene 6

EXT. BEACH  - EARLY 1960's DAY

The Beach Boys, wearing heavy Pendleton shirts, are bunched together, holding a surfboard under their arms while posing for cameras. Behind them REAL SURFERS polish boards and take to the waves. Brian-Past smiles toward the PHOTOGRAPHERS as he checks out the scene, wide-eyed and ill-at-ease with the attention of the CAMERAMEN.

THE BEACH BOYS (OVER)
(singing)

All over Manhattan
And down Doheny way
Everybody's gone surfin'
Surfin' U.S.A....

Scene 7

INT. SMALL VENUE - EARLY 1960's - DAY
CREDITS CONTINUE...

PS posted before the premiere that they had a reading copy of the script. I'm guessing they're using this excerpt to point out the role of the truck.

[PS]

Yes.

According to the script, the entire beach promo scene in question is indeed, as rab2591 suggests, just part of the opening credit montage sequence - and will likely be on screen - max - during the time it takes to sing that verse and while we're reading the cast and crew names, etc. Scene 5 is at a press conference, Scene 7 is at a screaming girls gig with Murry and Audree present, all with credits still rolling...

So during the first few minutes alone we get excerpts from:

Don't Worry Baby (studio scene)

OPENING CREDIT montage
Surfin' USA
Surfer Girl ("live" at small venue)
and Fun Fun fun ("live" at small venue)

Goes right to

Scene 10

INT. CADILLAC DEALERSHIP. LOS ANGELES. 1986. DAY
Kenny G's "SONGBIRD" is playing on the showroom amps.

Now that collision of music in the time/space continuum tells you a lot about what they'll be doing with the soundtrack and the sound montage as the 60's transitions into/gets ruptured by the 80's - and vice versa.

[beacharg]

3rd bad review (2 and 1/2 stars):

http://www.filmfreakcentral.net/ffc/2014/09/tiff-14-seymour-an-introduction-love-mercy-whiplash.html


70% on RT:

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/love_and_mercy/

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

That reviewer has no credibility with me with lines like:

As an aside, I resented the movie's use of “Wouldn't It Be Nice”--over the final fade-out, no less: Wilson's entitlement to it or not, that song now and forever belongs to the ending of Shampoo.

[wantsomecorn]

3rd bad review (2 and 1/2 stars):

http://www.filmfreakcentral.net/ffc/2014/09/tiff-14-seymour-an-introduction-love-mercy-whiplash.html


70% on RT:

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/love_and_mercy/

For only 10 reviews, that's pretty good.