Love and Mercy - News and Reviews - First clip is out.

[guitarfool2002]

It's not like the fact that Brian's movie got good to great reviews gave me this urge to crap on its thread. I think every post in this forum is worthy, no matter if you're a dumbass who doesn't know how many singles were released from the Surf's Up LP or if you're an insider. I like Ray's posts, but they're often greeted with (paraphrasing) "Finally someone who knows what hes talking about! You read it folks, this crap about Brian having handlers is total bullshit!". You know, if someone wants to believe that Brian's a manipulated vegetable, so be it. This person doesn't have to be shushed and convinced to cut the crap. Now Debbie Keil enters and leaves in a huff, just like she intended to, and there's this crisis about how we should have nurtured her affiliation. I don't know.

I take offense at being accused of repeatedly mentioning Brian's mental illness. That's not the case at all, but it doesn't matter. I apologize for my first post and will only post in this thread again after I watch the movie, no matter what the replies are. Estou gordo como uma vaca, como eu fui ficar assim?

Your opinion is not welcomed here. Pay attention! Certain posters will tell you what you should think and say. If you want to think and say something that is critical of Brian Wilson...don't. It's not welcomed here, unless you can find an honored guest to come on to back you up. Good luck with that. The studio janitors might have some interesting things to say, though.

That is ridiculous.

If I'm a "certain poster", I'll address this.

First, what is the end game exactly? What is the desired result from a reply like this? Spell it out, we'll talk it out. As it appears now, it seems I and others are being accused of not welcoming opinions, and it's getting away from the discussion...distraction? Let's tackle the "something that is critical of Brian Wilson" remark.

Reminding people reading a thread based on a film *about Brian Wilson's battle with mental health issues* that Brian "still is mentally ill" is not only redundant, but it was unnecessary and in the context of this discussion it struck me as insensitive bordering on insulting, at least I took it as insulting in this context. So I called it out.

Again, what is the motivation for doing that? Help me understand it, let me know the motivation or the desired end result in reminding everyone who is a Beach Boys fan about this.

Opinions are fine, right? I'll take the fact over opinion any time and every time, especially in cases where the facts of the story are set in stone and describe exactly what may or may not have happened.

No one is here to shut out opinions. However, if I'm eating a ham and swiss on rye and you come up to me and tell me you think I'm eating a tuna salad wrap, I'll push back on that "opinion", since it is total nonsense. Some things just are what they are.

And beyond that, I'd ask why would this guy try to tell me I'm eating a tuna salad wrap when he sees and I know that I'm eating a ham and swiss on rye?

What is the motivation, what is the desired result. Simple.

In my case, I was not giving an opinion, I was giving an example. Second, you bring up redundancy. This place is nothing but redundancy. We regurgitate every Beach Boy nuance 20 fold and more. This place is the epitome of redundancy. You know, I apologized, I emailed Billy privately, he spoke with Debbie, we both are good about how things worked out. Can we just leave it? I wouldn't even mind if you take down my posts. Actually, I wish you would. Seriously, this needs to end and editing this thread may be the answer. Thanks!

I was absolutely *not* referring to you or anything you wrote, nor was I addressing or even thinking about anything you wrote when I wrote my post quoted above.

[drbeachboy]

Some people are making a bigger deal than it was with Debbie Keil!! Her intention from the beginning was to post and run! NOBODY RAN HER OFF!

Again. After reviewing 3-4 times how Dr. Beachboy, Pixeltwin, and others responded to her posts soon afterwards, I really don't see anything wrong or out of the ordinary. And evidently neither did Debbie. Do we have to show respect? Of course! Walk on thin ice, concerned with what we post may be misconstrued or worded slightly off-kilter? Maybe. But my God, understand going in that if you're ultra sensitive with a very thin skin and can't welcome questions, comments or debate (if necessary)  - forget it! Don't bother! Somebody is going to get their feelings hurt. It's a MESSAGE BOARD, not a wamby pamby kiss-butt nicey-nice forum for little girls. I'm sure Ray understands that and he knows we have his back. And like someone said - we're adults here. We know how to act. And we do! We have 3 mods here to remind us of that and we also police our own, ya know? So relax and have fun!

Thank you Mikey.

It's "Mikie". Geez, how long have you been on this board? EVERYBODY knows that! What's the matter with you, Dr. Beachboy? And please quit posting as a doctor. You sound more like a quack to me! 56 years old and I'd think you'd know how to spell by now!

I never claimed to be a doctor, Mikie. Thems just my initials, is all. I'm telling you, this thread has me so shook up that I can't even type straight. Sorry for the misspell, Mikie!

[Joel Goldenberg]

I'm not going to pretend to know what the last thing translates to in English, so I'll leave it alone.

It's a key line from Games Two Can Play:

Bing translator says: I'm as fat as a cow, how did I get like this?"
Actual lyric: I'm fat as a cow oh how'd I ever get this way

[Mikie]

Some people are making a bigger deal than it was with Debbie Keil!! Her intention from the beginning was to post and run! NOBODY RAN HER OFF!

Again. After reviewing 3-4 times how Dr. Beachboy, Pixeltwin, and others responded to her posts soon afterwards, I really don't see anything wrong or out of the ordinary. And evidently neither did Debbie. Do we have to show respect? Of course! Walk on thin ice, concerned with what we post may be misconstrued or worded slightly off-kilter? Maybe. But my God, understand going in that if you're ultra sensitive with a very thin skin and can't welcome questions, comments or debate (if necessary)  - forget it! Don't bother! Somebody is going to get their feelings hurt. It's a MESSAGE BOARD, not a wamby pamby kiss-butt nicey-nice forum for little girls. I'm sure Ray understands that and he knows we have his back. And like someone said - we're adults here. We know how to act. And we do! We have 3 mods here to remind us of that and we also police our own, ya know? So relax and have fun!

Thank you Mikey.

It's "Mikie". Geez, how long have you been on this board? EVERYBODY knows that! What's the matter with you, Dr. Beachboy? And please quit posting as a doctor. You sound more like a quack to me! 56 years old and I'd think you'd know how to spell by now!

I never claimed to be a doctor, Mikie. Thems just my initials, is all. I'm telling you, this thread has me so shook up that I can't even type straight. Sorry for the misspell, Mikie!

Doc, let it roll off your back. GF and Billy and all of us are with ya, man. VERY small apples. Actually, NO apples. You're starting to fall into that "ultra sensitive" category and we have enough of that already! Sail on.

[joshferrell]

Another review:
http://www.biography.com/news/love-and-mercy-brian-wilson-review

A passage from that review that stood out: Giamatti plays him as a crazed martinet with a Beatles haircut. While Giamatti insists that he sought to avoid portraying Landy as a cardboard villain, it’s difficult to view this hipster analyst as much more than a sinister, if intermittently comic, impediment to Brian’s eventual triumph over adversity.

The use of the word "comic" is something to consider. Obviously what actually happened and even worse what could have happened to Brian had actions not been taken as they were is far from a comedic situation. I'm curious to see how the portrayal plays out on screen, because again the entirety of the situation seems so far removed from any notion of comedy that it's tough to see how this reviewer got comedy out of it unless it was done deliberately to lessen the blow of the reality for audiences. Maybe it's that fine line between absurdity and comedy which is being hinted at, where some things in retrospect seem so ridiculous, so absurd, that they become laughable in that absurdity. But is that necessarily "comic"? I'm curious to see.

maybe a "Hero's and Villain" type theme with Giamatti? that's the first thing that popped into my head with the mustache and a cardboard villain concept.. just a thought.. heck maybe there are more of these cool hidden song references in the movie...lol

[drbeachboy]

Some people are making a bigger deal than it was with Debbie Keil!! Her intention from the beginning was to post and run! NOBODY RAN HER OFF!

Again. After reviewing 3-4 times how Dr. Beachboy, Pixeltwin, and others responded to her posts soon afterwards, I really don't see anything wrong or out of the ordinary. And evidently neither did Debbie. Do we have to show respect? Of course! Walk on thin ice, concerned with what we post may be misconstrued or worded slightly off-kilter? Maybe. But my God, understand going in that if you're ultra sensitive with a very thin skin and can't welcome questions, comments or debate (if necessary)  - forget it! Don't bother! Somebody is going to get their feelings hurt. It's a MESSAGE BOARD, not a wamby pamby kiss-butt nicey-nice forum for little girls. I'm sure Ray understands that and he knows we have his back. And like someone said - we're adults here. We know how to act. And we do! We have 3 mods here to remind us of that and we also police our own, ya know? So relax and have fun!

Thank you Mikey.

It's "Mikie". Geez, how long have you been on this board? EVERYBODY knows that! What's the matter with you, Dr. Beachboy? And please quit posting as a doctor. You sound more like a quack to me! 56 years old and I'd think you'd know how to spell by now!

I never claimed to be a doctor, Mikie. Thems just my initials, is all. I'm telling you, this thread has me so shook up that I can't even type straight. Sorry for the misspell, Mikie!

Doc, let it roll off your back. GF and Billy and all of us are with ya, man. VERY small apples. Actually, NO apples. You're starting to fall into that "ultra sensitive" category and we have enough of that already! Sail on.

Thanks for the pep talk. I'm toughening up again as I write this.

[Mikie]

 

[DonnyL]

I have been reading this thread, but rarely post to the board anymore because I would describe the general vibe to be somewhat hostile. Perhaps this is due to an admittedly small group of very active users displaying a general disrespectful tone. I've seen a lot of very interesting new posters 'chased away' ... I think some people get used to the 'locker room' style of conversing ... 'outsiders' can see it very plainly, but the posters who are 'in it' cannot recognize it, or don't see it as a problem. A little bit of groupthink or something maybe.

That said, I do feel that most people here are respectful and pleasant. It just seems that the ones who are not are the loudest and post the most often.

I think the board would be better served to treat others here the way they would treat them in person.

Considering that is not likely to happen, I think a heavily moderated approach would actually work well, with a non-moderated adjacent board. The brash posters would probably get moved (or banned or whatever) quickly, and/or lose interest in posting so often or change their tone.

Aside from that, most of the threads going on these days are just plain boring in my opinion (not this one)! I suspect the reasons for the lack of real content are related to the hostile environment.

Just my 2 cents.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

I'm not going to pretend to know what the last thing translates to in English, so I'll leave it alone.

It's a key line from Games Two Can Play:

Bing translator says: I'm as fat as a cow, how did I get like this?"
Actual lyric: I'm fat as a cow oh how'd I ever get this way

Ahh cool...appreciate it. I only speak two languages, English and Music, so it kind of went over my head

[John Manning]

 

I'm at the bar…

[Mikie]

I have been reading this thread, but rarely post to the board anymore because I would describe the general vibe to be somewhat hostile. Perhaps this is due to an admittedly small group of very active users displaying a general disrespectful tone. I've seen a lot of very interesting new posters 'chased away' ... I think some people get used to the 'locker room' style of conversing ... 'outsiders' can see it very plainly, but the posters who are 'in it' cannot recognize it, or don't see it as a problem. A little bit of groupthink or something maybe.

That said, I do feel that most people here are respectful and pleasant. It just seems that the ones who are not are the loudest and post the most often.

I think the board would be better served to treat others here the way they would treat them in person.

Considering that is not likely to happen, I think a heavily moderated approach would actually work well, with a non-moderated adjacent board. The brash posters would probably get moved (or banned or whatever) quickly, and/or lose interest in posting so often or change their tone.

Aside from that, most of the threads going on these days are just plain boring in my opinion (not this one)! I suspect the reasons for the lack of real content are related to the hostile environment.

Just my 2 cents.

Donny. At the risk of derailing this thread, but it's about the third time you've addressed this subject recently.

Please read my opinions on this subject above, especially concerning sensitive readers/posters, then please let me know what you think, OK?

My opinion: The board is just fine. The mods are just fine. Adjustments have already been made and it's for the better of everyone here. The world is not a nice place in some areas, but this board serves as somewhat of an escape - a sanctuary as it were. I see this board as a positive environment. I agree with your statement that most threads these days are somewhat boring for lack of real content. It's cyclic. The nature of the board. Soon there will be new stuff and opinions (positive and negative) will fly once more. If you don't like what a specific poster has to say, either skip over it or jump in and counter it with YOUR opinion, instead of hanging back for days/weeks and then whining and complaining about it on the board. Lively discussions are always welcome as far as I'm concerned, otherwise this, like you said, would be a pretty boring place.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

In the interest to distract people from the negativity, I present the following







Now what were we talking about again?

[pixletwin]

I love "Card Table Flipping Guy".

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

[DonnyL]

I have been reading this thread, but rarely post to the board anymore because I would describe the general vibe to be somewhat hostile. Perhaps this is due to an admittedly small group of very active users displaying a general disrespectful tone. I've seen a lot of very interesting new posters 'chased away' ... I think some people get used to the 'locker room' style of conversing ... 'outsiders' can see it very plainly, but the posters who are 'in it' cannot recognize it, or don't see it as a problem. A little bit of groupthink or something maybe.

That said, I do feel that most people here are respectful and pleasant. It just seems that the ones who are not are the loudest and post the most often.

I think the board would be better served to treat others here the way they would treat them in person.

Considering that is not likely to happen, I think a heavily moderated approach would actually work well, with a non-moderated adjacent board. The brash posters would probably get moved (or banned or whatever) quickly, and/or lose interest in posting so often or change their tone.

Aside from that, most of the threads going on these days are just plain boring in my opinion (not this one)! I suspect the reasons for the lack of real content are related to the hostile environment.

Just my 2 cents.

Donny. At the risk of derailing this thread, but it's about the third time you've addressed this subject recently.

Please read my opinions on this subject above, especially concerning sensitive readers/posters, then please let me know what you think, OK?

My opinion: The board is just fine. The mods are just fine. Adjustments have already been made and it's for the better of everyone here. The world is not a nice place in some areas, but this board serves as somewhat of an escape - a sanctuary as it were. I see this board as a positive environment. I agree with your statement that most threads these days are somewhat boring for lack of real content. It's cyclic. The nature of the board. Soon there will be new stuff and opinions (positive and negative) will fly once more. If you don't like what a specific poster has to say, either skip over it or jump in and counter it with YOUR opinion, instead of hanging back for days/weeks and then whining and complaining about it on the board. Lively discussions are always welcome as far as I'm concerned, otherwise this, like you said, would be a pretty boring place.

Sure man -- I'm with you to some degree. Yes, I've brought it up before ... probably the last posts I've made over the past few months. Because I think it's important.

Where we disagree is the idea that the board is in good shape -- I don't think it is. I don't really consider myself a 'sensitive poster' ... I can pretty much hang with the weird locker room $hit, though ultimately I don't really like that kind of atmosphere.

Every time I've brought it up is when I see something going on as an observer, not as a participant. I've seen it happen so many times now, that you're right -- it's probably pointless to bring it up again. It's not like I'm on some crusade to clean up the board. It's basically that I don't post unless I feel I have something of value to add. And in threads like these, I see something begin that could lead to wonderful content and information, only for it to be derailed into weirdness.

So maybe Debbie Keil just came to say a few words and leave. But I can't help but wonder if her experiences here (past or present) were different, she may have hung out a little longer.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

I asked her directly, and she wasn't going to be posting any more apart from that for entirely different reasons. Has nothing to do with any posts here...promise you guys this.

[Shady]

Happy days then..

Movies good, it's coming out soon

All is right in the world of BB's

[Mikie]

I have been reading this thread, but rarely post to the board anymore because I would describe the general vibe to be somewhat hostile. Perhaps this is due to an admittedly small group of very active users displaying a general disrespectful tone. I've seen a lot of very interesting new posters 'chased away' ... I think some people get used to the 'locker room' style of conversing ... 'outsiders' can see it very plainly, but the posters who are 'in it' cannot recognize it, or don't see it as a problem. A little bit of groupthink or something maybe.

That said, I do feel that most people here are respectful and pleasant. It just seems that the ones who are not are the loudest and post the most often.

I think the board would be better served to treat others here the way they would treat them in person.

Considering that is not likely to happen, I think a heavily moderated approach would actually work well, with a non-moderated adjacent board. The brash posters would probably get moved (or banned or whatever) quickly, and/or lose interest in posting so often or change their tone.

Aside from that, most of the threads going on these days are just plain boring in my opinion (not this one)! I suspect the reasons for the lack of real content are related to the hostile environment.

Just my 2 cents.

Donny. At the risk of derailing this thread, but it's about the third time you've addressed this subject recently.

Please read my opinions on this subject above, especially concerning sensitive readers/posters, then please let me know what you think, OK?

My opinion: The board is just fine. The mods are just fine. Adjustments have already been made and it's for the better of everyone here. The world is not a nice place in some areas, but this board serves as somewhat of an escape - a sanctuary as it were. I see this board as a positive environment. I agree with your statement that most threads these days are somewhat boring for lack of real content. It's cyclic. The nature of the board. Soon there will be new stuff and opinions (positive and negative) will fly once more. If you don't like what a specific poster has to say, either skip over it or jump in and counter it with YOUR opinion, instead of hanging back for days/weeks and then whining and complaining about it on the board. Lively discussions are always welcome as far as I'm concerned, otherwise this, like you said, would be a pretty boring place.

Sure man -- I'm with you to some degree. Yes, I've brought it up before ... probably the last posts I've made over the past few months. Because I think it's important.

Where we disagree is the idea that the board is in good shape -- I don't think it is. I don't really consider myself a 'sensitive poster' ... I can pretty much hang with the weird locker room $hit, though ultimately I don't really like that kind of atmosphere.

Every time I've brought it up is when I see something going on as an observer, not as a participant. I've seen it happen so many times now, that you're right -- it's probably pointless to bring it up again. It's not like I'm on some crusade to clean up the board. It's basically that I don't post unless I feel I have something of value to add. And in threads like these, I see something begin that could lead to wonderful content and information, only for it to be derailed into weirdness.

So maybe Debbie Keil just came to say a few words and leave. But I can't help but wonder if her experiences here (past or present) were different, she may have hung out a little longer.

I'm with ya, Donny.  You know, The Bay Area contingent should be on the same wavelength, and I think we are in agreement for the most part.

Only a handful (or less) of you guys here have the extensive knowledge of recording equipment (especially analog) and the recording process, and how Brian and Chuck Britz and Larry Levine tracked and mixed records. Maybe you can start a new thread or rejuvenate an old one on the subject. I, for one, enjoy the hell out of reading that stuff. Have somewhat limited knowledge, but would like to know more! Use to enjoy Josh's contributions on the subject, but unfortunately it looks like he bailed. I don't think you'd see much arguing going on on a thread like that! c

[Andrew G. Doe]

It's basically that I don't post unless I feel I have something of value to add.

Would that some other posters would adopt such a credo...

So maybe Debbie Keil just came to say a few words and leave. But I can't help but wonder if her experiences here (past or present) were different, she may have hung out a little longer.

I think she may well have. But now, we'll never know. I may be as abrasive at times, usually more so, but only to those who deserve it by what they post: thankfully the three prime offenders have either been banned or have left. This board's getting a rep as a place to avoid, and I can completely understand that.

[John Manning]

Mikie, Donny, Andrew, ♯♫♩♬, Pixeltwin, DRBeachBoy, Shady, everyone… this round's on me, watcha having?

[Mikie]

Mikie, Donny, Andrew, ♯♫♩♬, Pixeltwin, DRBeachBoy, Shady, everyone… this round's on me, watcha having?

As long as you're footing the bill, whatia recommend, John? Today, I'll have a Mendocino Red Tail or Blue Heron Pale Ale.  There's a lotta IPA's out there right now, but I'll stick with Sierra, Mendocino, or a Blue Moon for now.  I also like a Tsingtao or Sapporo one in awhile with some good Thai food on the side.

[rab2591]

Next round is on me! I snuck into Club Kokomo last night and picked up some real beer for us to enjoy.

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

I don't drink, but raise a glass in my honor!

[pixletwin]

What do you recommend goes with Chicken McNuggets? 

[alf wiedersehen]

What do you recommend goes with Chicken McNuggets? 

A warm Bud Light.