Love and Mercy - News and Reviews - First clip is out.

[Matt H]

Now that Lions Gate is going to be the distributor, does anyone know how long it usually takes to set a release date?

[buddhahat]

Just woken up, and caught up, and I have this to say: what is wrong with some of us ? We get people here who were involved, really do know what happened (as opposed to the likes of me spinning whole cloth out of woefully incomplete thread) and take the time and trouble to post... and they get grief. Frankly I'm surprised no-one's taken a pop at Ray, Matt or Scotty T yet. Debra has a unique insight into Brian's life, but I for one will be astonished if she ever posts here again, and that's a great loss. I shudder to think what might transpire if Alan, Mike or Brian decided to drop by. Actually, I think I do know exactly what the response would be - "yeah, right, of course you are, get the **** outta here".

I don't know about any other boards devoted to bands, but here we have some pivotal people posting, and now and then we take it for granted and don't afford them their due respect. Madness.

Yes this also left me scratching my head. I don't get what was so offensive about the "leave it to the grown ups" comment anyway, nor the desperate rush to call her out on it.

[Sheriff John Stone]

It's not like the fact that Brian's movie got good to great reviews gave me this urge to crap on its thread. I think every post in this forum is worthy, no matter if you're a dumbass who doesn't know how many singles were released from the Surf's Up LP or if you're an insider. I like Ray's posts, but they're often greeted with (paraphrasing) "Finally someone who knows what hes talking about! You read it folks, this crap about Brian having handlers is total bullshit!". You know, if someone wants to believe that Brian's a manipulated vegetable, so be it. This person doesn't have to be shushed and convinced to cut the crap. Now Debbie Keil enters and leaves in a huff, just like she intended to, and there's this crisis about how we should have nurtured her affiliation. I don't know.

I take offense at being accused of repeatedly mentioning Brian's mental illness. That's not the case at all, but it doesn't matter. I apologize for my first post and will only post in this thread again after I watch the movie, no matter what the replies are. Estou gordo como uma vaca, como eu fui ficar assim?

Your opinion is not welcomed here. Pay attention! Certain posters will tell you what you should think and say. If you want to think and say something that is critical of Brian Wilson...don't. It's not welcomed here, unless you can find an honored guest to come on to back you up. Good luck with that. The studio janitors might have some interesting things to say, though.

[Amy B.]

Thank you, Ray. I remember Melinda talking about this in an interview (maybe it was Larry King?). She said Brian had used her phone to call a family member and that's how she got the family member's number. She subsequently tried to call the family member in an attempt to get help for Brian.

Melinda, when she was posting on the Blueboard also recounted this story. She said the only way she could get the family involved was when they realized the will had been changed. Can anyone else remember this? Did you see that particular post Amy?

Quick edit: Thanks to Ray and Debbie for their efforts in getting the truth out there. I loved reading every word...

I'm not sure where I read/saw it, but yes, Melinda has explained (probably more than once) her involvement and how she helped get the family involved. I believe you're right-- she did point out that the will was kind of the final straw.

[kwan_dk]

Now that Lions Gate is going to be the distributor, does anyone know how long it usually takes to set a release date?

Don't know but hear this: 'Once' director John Carney's current movie 'Begin Again' was picked up for distribution immidiatedly after its screening at last year's festival. (back then it was called 'Could a Song save your Life?')

As I remember it, it took about half a year before a release date was set. (sometime in June, I think it was) And not that long after stating a release date, trailers began to circulate.

So perhaps we're all the wiser around January / February?

Really, REALLY looking forward to this movie!!!

[Robbie Mac]

Just woken up, and caught up, and I have this to say: what is wrong with some of us ? We get people here who were involved, really do know what happened (as opposed to the likes of me spinning whole cloth out of woefully incomplete thread) and take the time and trouble to post... and they get grief. Frankly I'm surprised no-one's taken a pop at Ray, Matt or Scotty T yet. Debra has a unique insight into Brian's life, but I for one will be astonished if she ever posts here again, and that's a great loss. I shudder to think what might transpire if Alan, Mike or Brian decided to drop by. Actually, I think I do know exactly what the response would be - "yeah, right, of course you are, get the **** outta here".

I don't know about any other boards devoted to bands, but here we have some pivotal people posting, and now and then we take it for granted and don't afford them their due respect. Madness.

This x 1000.

[beacharg]

Ok, now yes, first bad review:

grantland.com/hollywood-prospectus/toronto-film-festival-2014-john-cusack-jon-stewart-chris-rock/

It's the first "rotten" review:

www.rottentomatoes.com/m/love_and_mercy/

 

[Rocket]

Reading reviews, I'm seeing that in Dano's scenes Pet Sounds is the main focus.

Does anyone know how much Smile is shown in the film?

[Mikie]

Some people are making a bigger deal than it was with Debbie Keil!! Her intention from the beginning was to post and run! NOBODY RAN HER OFF!

Again. After reviewing 3-4 times how Dr. Beachboy, Pixeltwin, and others responded to her posts soon afterwards, I really don't see anything wrong or out of the ordinary. And evidently neither did Debbie. Do we have to show respect? Of course! Walk on thin ice, concerned with what we post may be misconstrued or worded slightly off-kilter? Maybe. But my God, understand going in that if you're ultra sensitive with a very thin skin and can't welcome questions, comments or debate (if necessary)  - forget it! Don't bother! Somebody is going to get their feelings hurt. It's a MESSAGE BOARD, not a wamby pamby kiss-butt nicey-nice forum for little girls. I'm sure Ray understands that and he knows we have his back. And like someone said - we're adults here. We know how to act. And we do! We have 3 mods here to remind us of that and we also police our own, ya know? So relax and have fun!

[Paul J B]

I have to say I'm more than a little impressed that this film sounds like a winner. Any review in and of itself means nothing to me.....however, taking in all of the information that has come out since the debut I don't see how I am not going to at least like the film. After those two television debacles......what a great thing this might be.

[pixletwin]

Some people are making a bigger deal than it was with Debbie Keil!! Her intention from the beginning was to post and run! NOBODY RAN HER OFF!

Again. Reviewing 3-4 times how Dr. Beachboy, Pixeltwin and others responded to her posts soon afterwards. I really don't see anything wrong or out of the ordinary. And evidently neither did Debbie. Do we have to show respect? Of course! Walk on needles and pins concerned with what is posted may be misconstrued or worded slightly off-kilter? Maybe. But my God, understand going in that if you have a very thin skin and can't welcome questions, comments or debate (if necessary)  - forget it! Somebody is going to get their feelings hurt. It's a MESSAGE BOARD, not a wamby pamby kiss-butt nicey-nice forum for little girls. I'm sure Ray understands that and he knows we have his back. But like someone said - we're adults here. We know how to act. And we do! We have 3 mods here to remind us of that and we also police our own, ya know? So relax and have fun!

Bravo and thanks.

[guitarfool2002]

It's not like the fact that Brian's movie got good to great reviews gave me this urge to crap on its thread. I think every post in this forum is worthy, no matter if you're a dumbass who doesn't know how many singles were released from the Surf's Up LP or if you're an insider. I like Ray's posts, but they're often greeted with (paraphrasing) "Finally someone who knows what hes talking about! You read it folks, this crap about Brian having handlers is total bullshit!". You know, if someone wants to believe that Brian's a manipulated vegetable, so be it. This person doesn't have to be shushed and convinced to cut the crap. Now Debbie Keil enters and leaves in a huff, just like she intended to, and there's this crisis about how we should have nurtured her affiliation. I don't know.

I take offense at being accused of repeatedly mentioning Brian's mental illness. That's not the case at all, but it doesn't matter. I apologize for my first post and will only post in this thread again after I watch the movie, no matter what the replies are. Estou gordo como uma vaca, como eu fui ficar assim?

Your opinion is not welcomed here. Pay attention! Certain posters will tell you what you should think and say. If you want to think and say something that is critical of Brian Wilson...don't. It's not welcomed here, unless you can find an honored guest to come on to back you up. Good luck with that. The studio janitors might have some interesting things to say, though.

That is ridiculous.

If I'm a "certain poster", I'll address this.

First, what is the end game exactly? What is the desired result from a reply like this? Spell it out, we'll talk it out. As it appears now, it seems I and others are being accused of not welcoming opinions, and it's getting away from the discussion...distraction? Let's tackle the "something that is critical of Brian Wilson" remark.

Reminding people reading a thread based on a film *about Brian Wilson's battle with mental health issues* that Brian "still is mentally ill" is not only redundant, but it was unnecessary and in the context of this discussion it struck me as insensitive bordering on insulting, at least I took it as insulting in this context. So I called it out.

Again, what is the motivation for doing that? Help me understand it, let me know the motivation or the desired end result in reminding everyone who is a Beach Boys fan about this.

Opinions are fine, right? I'll take the fact over opinion any time and every time, especially in cases where the facts of the story are set in stone and describe exactly what may or may not have happened.

No one is here to shut out opinions. However, if I'm eating a ham and swiss on rye and you come up to me and tell me you think I'm eating a tuna salad wrap, I'll push back on that "opinion", since it is total nonsense. Some things just are what they are.

And beyond that, I'd ask why would this guy try to tell me I'm eating a tuna salad wrap when he sees and I know that I'm eating a ham and swiss on rye?

What is the motivation, what is the desired result. Simple.

[puni puni]

The reason why sunny-down-snuff replaces over-the-cornfield was to surprise fans and make the biopic less predictable, and it's not that historically inaccurate in the first place, since it's reported that the crow incident was only one of numerous lyric-related altercations between Love and Parks during Smile.

[Chocolate Shake Man]

The reason why sunny-down-snuff replaces over-the-cornfield was to surprise fans and make the biopic less predictable, and it's not that historically inaccurate in the first place, since it's reported that the crow incident was only one of numerous lyric-related altercations between Love and Parks during Smile.

I would have preferred that they kept consistent and made the line "Geronimo leaps and bounds for glory over the dust bowl."

[SMiLE Brian]

The reason why sunny-down-snuff replaces over-the-cornfield was to surprise fans and make the biopic less predictable, and it's not that historically inaccurate in the first place, since it's reported that the crow incident was only one of numerous lyric-related altercations between Love and Parks during Smile.

I would have preferred that they kept consistent and made the line "Geronimo leaps and bounds for glory over the dust bowl."

Plus making the BBs stare at a doll.

[guitarfool2002]

The reason why sunny-down-snuff replaces over-the-cornfield was to surprise fans and make the biopic less predictable, and it's not that historically inaccurate in the first place, since it's reported that the crow incident was only one of numerous lyric-related altercations between Love and Parks during Smile.

I would have preferred that they kept consistent and made the line "Geronimo leaps and bounds for glory over the dust bowl."

Plus making the BBs stare at a doll.

Ahh yes, mustn't forget the "official" version of the Smile sessions as acted out in the "official" TV movie bio. THAT'S the way it all went down. Can't challenge that, it's an opinion after all and is more than welcome to replace fact any day.

That's the ticket.
 

[Chocolate Shake Man]

The reason why sunny-down-snuff replaces over-the-cornfield was to surprise fans and make the biopic less predictable, and it's not that historically inaccurate in the first place, since it's reported that the crow incident was only one of numerous lyric-related altercations between Love and Parks during Smile.

I would have preferred that they kept consistent and made the line "Geronimo leaps and bounds for glory over the dust bowl."

Plus making the BBs stare at a doll.

Exactly. No better example of how Brian humiliated the other guys in the studio. Just imagine having to stare at that doll and sing...it bums me out.

[Emdeeh]

Another review:
http://www.biography.com/news/love-and-mercy-brian-wilson-review

[drbeachboy]

Some people are making a bigger deal than it was with Debbie Keil!! Her intention from the beginning was to post and run! NOBODY RAN HER OFF!

Again. After reviewing 3-4 times how Dr. Beachboy, Pixeltwin, and others responded to her posts soon afterwards, I really don't see anything wrong or out of the ordinary. And evidently neither did Debbie. Do we have to show respect? Of course! Walk on thin ice, concerned with what we post may be misconstrued or worded slightly off-kilter? Maybe. But my God, understand going in that if you're ultra sensitive with a very thin skin and can't welcome questions, comments or debate (if necessary)  - forget it! Don't bother! Somebody is going to get their feelings hurt. It's a MESSAGE BOARD, not a wamby pamby kiss-butt nicey-nice forum for little girls. I'm sure Ray understands that and he knows we have his back. And like someone said - we're adults here. We know how to act. And we do! We have 3 mods here to remind us of that and we also police our own, ya know? So relax and have fun!

Thank you Mikey.

[guitarfool2002]

Another review:
http://www.biography.com/news/love-and-mercy-brian-wilson-review

A passage from that review that stood out: Giamatti plays him as a crazed martinet with a Beatles haircut. While Giamatti insists that he sought to avoid portraying Landy as a cardboard villain, it’s difficult to view this hipster analyst as much more than a sinister, if intermittently comic, impediment to Brian’s eventual triumph over adversity.

The use of the word "comic" is something to consider. Obviously what actually happened and even worse what could have happened to Brian had actions not been taken as they were is far from a comedic situation. I'm curious to see how the portrayal plays out on screen, because again the entirety of the situation seems so far removed from any notion of comedy that it's tough to see how this reviewer got comedy out of it unless it was done deliberately to lessen the blow of the reality for audiences. Maybe it's that fine line between absurdity and comedy which is being hinted at, where some things in retrospect seem so ridiculous, so absurd, that they become laughable in that absurdity. But is that necessarily "comic"? I'm curious to see.

[SMiLE Brian]

The reason why sunny-down-snuff replaces over-the-cornfield was to surprise fans and make the biopic less predictable, and it's not that historically inaccurate in the first place, since it's reported that the crow incident was only one of numerous lyric-related altercations between Love and Parks during Smile.

I would have preferred that they kept consistent and made the line "Geronimo leaps and bounds for glory over the dust bowl."

Plus making the BBs stare at a doll.

Exactly. No better example of how Brian humiliated the other guys in the studio. Just imagine having to stare at that doll and sing...it bums me out.

Plus the random sound effects BW made while VDP was mean to Mike Love.

[drbeachboy]

It's not like the fact that Brian's movie got good to great reviews gave me this urge to crap on its thread. I think every post in this forum is worthy, no matter if you're a dumbass who doesn't know how many singles were released from the Surf's Up LP or if you're an insider. I like Ray's posts, but they're often greeted with (paraphrasing) "Finally someone who knows what hes talking about! You read it folks, this crap about Brian having handlers is total bullshit!". You know, if someone wants to believe that Brian's a manipulated vegetable, so be it. This person doesn't have to be shushed and convinced to cut the crap. Now Debbie Keil enters and leaves in a huff, just like she intended to, and there's this crisis about how we should have nurtured her affiliation. I don't know.

I take offense at being accused of repeatedly mentioning Brian's mental illness. That's not the case at all, but it doesn't matter. I apologize for my first post and will only post in this thread again after I watch the movie, no matter what the replies are. Estou gordo como uma vaca, como eu fui ficar assim?

Your opinion is not welcomed here. Pay attention! Certain posters will tell you what you should think and say. If you want to think and say something that is critical of Brian Wilson...don't. It's not welcomed here, unless you can find an honored guest to come on to back you up. Good luck with that. The studio janitors might have some interesting things to say, though.

That is ridiculous.

If I'm a "certain poster", I'll address this.

First, what is the end game exactly? What is the desired result from a reply like this? Spell it out, we'll talk it out. As it appears now, it seems I and others are being accused of not welcoming opinions, and it's getting away from the discussion...distraction? Let's tackle the "something that is critical of Brian Wilson" remark.

Reminding people reading a thread based on a film *about Brian Wilson's battle with mental health issues* that Brian "still is mentally ill" is not only redundant, but it was unnecessary and in the context of this discussion it struck me as insensitive bordering on insulting, at least I took it as insulting in this context. So I called it out.

Again, what is the motivation for doing that? Help me understand it, let me know the motivation or the desired end result in reminding everyone who is a Beach Boys fan about this.

Opinions are fine, right? I'll take the fact over opinion any time and every time, especially in cases where the facts of the story are set in stone and describe exactly what may or may not have happened.

No one is here to shut out opinions. However, if I'm eating a ham and swiss on rye and you come up to me and tell me you think I'm eating a tuna salad wrap, I'll push back on that "opinion", since it is total nonsense. Some things just are what they are.

And beyond that, I'd ask why would this guy try to tell me I'm eating a tuna salad wrap when he sees and I know that I'm eating a ham and swiss on rye?

What is the motivation, what is the desired result. Simple.

In my case, I was not giving an opinion, I was giving an example. Second, you bring up redundancy. This place is nothing but redundancy. We regurgitate every Beach Boy nuance 20 fold and more. This place is the epitome of redundancy. You know, I apologized, I emailed Billy privately, he spoke with Debbie, we both are good about how things worked out. Can we just leave it? I wouldn't even mind if you take down my posts. Actually, I wish you would. Seriously, this needs to end and editing this thread may be the answer. Thanks!

[puni puni]

It's really interesting how the real life Landy rationalized his actions in a sort of, "Well, blame Brian, not me. He's not keeping me away after all, and if he did, you can bet he wouldn't make it without me." Whereas in current historical accounts, most simplify his motives never beyond "he was a crazy quack". If he's villanous for the sake of being villanous, which nobody is in real life, it does hurt a character in a story. And it seems that may be the case in this film.

[Chocolate Shake Man]

Another review:
http://www.biography.com/news/love-and-mercy-brian-wilson-review

A passage from that review that stood out: Giamatti plays him as a crazed martinet with a Beatles haircut. While Giamatti insists that he sought to avoid portraying Landy as a cardboard villain, it’s difficult to view this hipster analyst as much more than a sinister, if intermittently comic, impediment to Brian’s eventual triumph over adversity.

The use of the word "comic" is something to consider. Obviously what actually happened and even worse what could have happened to Brian had actions not been taken as they were is far from a comedic situation. I'm curious to see how the portrayal plays out on screen, because again the entirety of the situation seems so far removed from any notion of comedy that it's tough to see how this reviewer got comedy out of it unless it was done deliberately to lessen the blow of the reality for audiences. Maybe it's that fine line between absurdity and comedy which is being hinted at, where some things in retrospect seem so ridiculous, so absurd, that they become laughable in that absurdity. But is that necessarily "comic"? I'm curious to see.

Good point but the overarching argument that reviewer seems to make is that Giamatti plays Landy "as a cardboard villain" and cardboard villains do have a tendency having a slightly comic edge to them - think, for example, the Joker in Batman as the ultimate of this. Sure there is no question that what the Joker is doing is positively heinous yet at the same time, the character is so over-the-top villainous that there is a, perhaps, comic edge. Obviously, the Joker is a special example since he comes right out of comic books, but I do think the point does generalize somewhat.

[Mikie]

Some people are making a bigger deal than it was with Debbie Keil!! Her intention from the beginning was to post and run! NOBODY RAN HER OFF!

Again. After reviewing 3-4 times how Dr. Beachboy, Pixeltwin, and others responded to her posts soon afterwards, I really don't see anything wrong or out of the ordinary. And evidently neither did Debbie. Do we have to show respect? Of course! Walk on thin ice, concerned with what we post may be misconstrued or worded slightly off-kilter? Maybe. But my God, understand going in that if you're ultra sensitive with a very thin skin and can't welcome questions, comments or debate (if necessary)  - forget it! Don't bother! Somebody is going to get their feelings hurt. It's a MESSAGE BOARD, not a wamby pamby kiss-butt nicey-nice forum for little girls. I'm sure Ray understands that and he knows we have his back. And like someone said - we're adults here. We know how to act. And we do! We have 3 mods here to remind us of that and we also police our own, ya know? So relax and have fun!

Thank you Mikey.

It's "Mikie". Geez, how long have you been on this board? EVERYBODY knows that! What's the matter with you, Dr. Beachboy? And please quit posting as a doctor. You sound more like a quack to me! 56 years old and I'd think you'd know how to spell by now!