SPOILER!!- Heroes and Villains and Good Vibrations from TSS

[hypehat]

The vege-table one is in the lyric "Cart off and sell, my vege-tables". Kartoffel is the German word for Potato. Not sure how intentional that one is, but I like it 

[Micha]

The vege-table one is in the lyric "Cart off and sell, my vege-tables". Kartoffel is the German word for Potato. Not sure how intentional that one is, but I like it 

I don't think that's intentional. They don't sing "Kartoffel", they sing "Kartoffendsell", which is - er - not German for potato. Actually a week ago I did an unintentional pun of the sort too which made people laugh - plain happenstance. Does VDP even know German?

And now could you point out the water/vater pun please? That didn't strike me yet. Thanks!

[rab2591]

I would bet money it's intentional. It may not be the exact word for potato in German, but is 'holocaustly' A word? No, but we know what the pun is.

[ghost]

don't you mean, the music hall a costly bow?

hollow costly vow = marriage, lol

[The Demon]

Remember the day  Remember the night
Wahala Lu Lei  Wahala Lu La
All Day Long
Keeni Waka Pula

I think it changes a bit but it's definitely in that same melodic feel. By the way I don't for one moment think this nullifies Whistle In or any song based on Smile feels. Brian wrote like this, one thing could become another thing, the feel - like Shortnin Bread - was a tool, a basis for a song, that you return to and work from, ever perfecting a fundamental feel you enjoy.

Exactly.  I think "Whistle In" has less syllables, but the feel is basically the same.  It's clear one song was derived from the other.

Never heard about this. Could you be more specific? Water/Vater, German potato pun?

I just meant that "vater" is German for father, but it obviously sounds like "water."  It's something Van Dyke was probably aware of, considering the musical similarities between "Child" and "Dada," not to mention "Child" showing up in "Surf's Up" (water, again).  Water is the source, or father, of life.

The "Vega-Tables" line is the one I was referring to.  I'd seen someone point that out and they said that "kartoffen" was the word, so maybe it's a stretch since it should be "kartoffel" (though the other issue is that a potato isn't even a vegatable).  Still, a weird coincidence.  I guess we'd have to ask Van Dyke.  "Kartoffensell" could be a phonetic portmanteau of the German words "kartoffel" (potato) and "insel" (island).  Perhaps a subtle reference to America's German and Irish ("potato island") immigrants.

[rab2591]

don't you mean, the music hall a costly bow?

Yes, I know what the lyrics are, I was merely pointing out wordplay.

[ghost]

don't you mean, the music hall a costly bow?

Yes, I know what the lyrics are, I was merely pointing out wordplay.

You kids and your acid alliteration. 

[monicker]

I was just listening to the H&V mix on Hawthorne, CA and the edits are better than on this new box set mix. From an engineering/mixing/producing standpoint, how can that even be? It's a decade later, man. Does anyone ever think that perhaps Mark Linett is "too close" to the project? He's been working on Smile stuff on and off since 1988. That's a very long time. I wonder if it's just such a part of him at this point that he has completely lost any ability to be objective about the music and approach the project with fresh, discerning ears. For those of you here who make music, you ever work on something for so long that you no longer know what you're doing or what you're hearing, and you need to step back and away from it for a while to gain a fresh perspective and be able to really *listen* to it again? Brian himself even kind of mentions something along the lines of this in, i think it was, a late 70s interview. He follows it by saying that's why Smile was junked. And if you've ever been in this situation, you may recall that sometimes it takes fresh ears, an outside opinion, a friend, etc. to help point out something to you that you no longer can hear, that you've overlooked, because you are so inside of the thing. 

[Iron Horse-Apples]

And if you've ever been in this situation, you may recall that sometimes it takes fresh ears, an outside opinion, a friend, etc. to help point out something to you that you no longer can hear, that you've overlooked, because you are so inside of the thing. 

He did! He got Brian round to listen and Brian said yeah great. Then they invited a complete stranger off the street in, and this time even he liked H&V.

[sockittome]

I noticed the abrupt edits right off, and I'm guessing that either they are Brians original vintage edits, or Mr. Linett was trying to make them sound like vintage edits to appease the absolute historians.

[ghost]

Uhh the edits in this new mix are nothing like vintage BW edits.

[monicker]

I noticed the abrupt edits right off, and I'm guessing that either they are Brians original vintage edits, or Mr. Linett was trying to make them sound like vintage edits to appease the absolute historians.

Well, the Smiley '67 edits are better too, though. This version is seriously the worst official version that exists, i think. It's just sloppy and unprofessional and not as nuanced. And there's nothing wrong with abrupt. The quality of being abrupt (or not abrupt) is a matter of playing with silence, the space between two sections (as well as total silence or the decay of a sound). I don't think that the transitions have been done as well on this mix and they have in the past, whether it was in 2001 or 1967. Abruptness is actually one of the things that may be lacking in this new mix. This mix, i think, could afford to have more abrupt edits. But that doesn't mean that a sound should be cut off. But that's what we indeed have--the beginning of the first "la" actually getting cut off (which doesn't sound intentional). And then there's that damn "pop" in the "I've been in this town so long" transition. Do people not hear that?? It's terrible. How can anyone miss that? Is that a glitch that's only on my copy? Can someone please confirm whether they hear this on their copy or not? Maybe it's just an error that occurred when i was downloading the mp3? I really hope so.

[monicker]

And if you've ever been in this situation, you may recall that sometimes it takes fresh ears, an outside opinion, a friend, etc. to help point out something to you that you no longer can hear, that you've overlooked, because you are so inside of the thing. 

He did! He got Brian round to listen and Brian said yeah great. Then they invited a complete stranger off the street in, and this time even he liked H&V.

Say what? Mark Linett in 2011, 2010, or whenever it was at some recent point, got a stranger to come in to listen to H&V? Uhhh? Who? And where did you get this from? And, sorry, but i don't think that Brian in his late 60s is going to catch little details like this. I mean, you really think that when he was called in to approve of the final mix that he was sitting their intently with dog ears scrutinizing every second? 

[BiNNS]

--the beginning of the first "la" actually getting cut off (which doesn't sound intentional). And then there's that damn "pop" in the "I've been in this town so long" transition. Do people not hear that?? It's terrible. How can anyone miss that? Is that a glitch that's only on my copy? Can someone please confirm whether they hear this on their copy or not? Maybe it's just an error that occurred when i was downloading the mp3? I really hope so.

It's on my mp3 version as well. It can also be heard on the youtube video.
As far as the "la la la la" part, it doesn't seem so obvious when i listen to it without headphones.

[monicker]

--the beginning of the first "la" actually getting cut off (which doesn't sound intentional). And then there's that damn "pop" in the "I've been in this town so long" transition. Do people not hear that?? It's terrible. How can anyone miss that? Is that a glitch that's only on my copy? Can someone please confirm whether they hear this on their copy or not? Maybe it's just an error that occurred when i was downloading the mp3? I really hope so.

It's on my mp3 version as well. It can also be heard on the youtube video.
As far as the "la la la la" part, it doesn't seem so obvious when i listen to it without headphones.

That's weird, i was just going to say that i just listened to the youtube link and i did not hear it on there. But i downloaded the mp3 again from the video contest site just to see it there was an error the first time i downloaded, but it's still there.

[BiNNS]

That's weird, i was just going to say that i just listened to the youtube link and i did not hear it on there.

I hear it at 3:04 on the youtube video. I hate being so picky, but it bugs me every time.

[BiNNS]

Wait, i admit confusion. Sorry. I was talking about the brief sound during the "My children were raised" section. Damn song has so many sections! Which audio pop are you talking about exactly?

[monicker]

Wait, i admit confusion. I was talking about the brief sound during the "My children were raised" section. Damn song has so many sections! Which audio pop are you talking about exactly?

Oh, i see what you'e talking about--that's more like a low frequency rumble type of thing. I was talking about at 3:11, when "I've been in this town so long" comes in, there's a little digital "pop" sound, in between the word "I've" and "been." But i don't hear it on the youtube video. Like i said though, i did download the mp3 twice to make sure it wasn't a one time glitch that occurred while downloading, but it's there on both of the mp3s that i downloaded.

[buddhahat]

Is it really possible that Linnet unintentionally clipped the start of the la la la part? I'm an absolute novice, and use audacity to do Smile edits. It's pretty easy to see where a section begins and ends from the waveforms, right? Surely it would be a colossal gaff for Linett to accidentally chop the start of a section out? He'd have to be editing blindfolded, or drunk or both.

[thebaron]

Is it really possible that Linnet unintentionally clipped the start of the la la la part? I'm an absolute novice, and use audacity to do Smile edits. It's pretty easy to see where a section begins and ends from the waveforms, right? Surely it would be a colossal gaff for Linett to accidentally chop the start of a section out? He'd have to be editing blindfolded, or drunk or both.

It possibly is a planned defect in this "free" version of the song.

[monicker]

Is it really possible that Linnet unintentionally clipped the start of the la la la part? I'm an absolute novice, and use audacity to do Smile edits. It's pretty easy to see where a section begins and ends from the waveforms, right? Surely it would be a colossal gaff for Linett to accidentally chop the start of a section out? He'd have to be editing blindfolded, or drunk or both.

Exactly. Editing, in general, is pretty easy. You just need to rely mostly on good ears.

And this wouldn't be the first colossal f*ck up. Beginning of BWPS Our Prayer anyone?  

[ghost]

It finally happened. Mark Linnet lost it. He got too close to the flames on Fire. The man has cracked. Shine on you crazy diamond necklase.

[Aegir]

The vege-table one is in the lyric "Cart off and sell, my vege-tables". Kartoffel is the German word for Potato. Not sure how intentional that one is, but I like it 

I don't think that's intentional. They don't sing "Kartoffel", they sing "Kartoffendsell", which is - er - not German for potato. Actually a week ago I did an unintentional pun of the sort too which made people laugh - plain happenstance. Does VDP even know German?

And now could you point out the water/vater pun please? That didn't strike me yet. Thanks!

"cart off and" = Kartoffeln = potatoes

[buddhahat]

Is it really possible that Linnet unintentionally clipped the start of the la la la part? I'm an absolute novice, and use audacity to do Smile edits. It's pretty easy to see where a section begins and ends from the waveforms, right? Surely it would be a colossal gaff for Linett to accidentally chop the start of a section out? He'd have to be editing blindfolded, or drunk or both.

Exactly. Editing, in general, is pretty easy. You just need to rely mostly on good ears.

And this wouldn't be the first colossal f*ck up. Beginning of BWPS Our Prayer anyone?  

What's wrong with our prayer?! Damn I vowed to stay out of this thread!

[ghost]

Is it really possible that Linnet unintentionally clipped the start of the la la la part? I'm an absolute novice, and use audacity to do Smile edits. It's pretty easy to see where a section begins and ends from the waveforms, right? Surely it would be a colossal gaff for Linett to accidentally chop the start of a section out? He'd have to be editing blindfolded, or drunk or both.

Exactly. Editing, in general, is pretty easy. You just need to rely mostly on good ears.

And this wouldn't be the first colossal f*ck up. Beginning of BWPS Our Prayer anyone?  

What's wrong with our prayer?! Damn I vowed to stay out of this thread!

HUGE UGLY PROTOOLS GLITCH RIGHT AT THE BEGINNING UGHHHHH