Previously released material on The Smile Sessions?

[Jim V.]

Hey, so I was thinking about The SMiLE Sessions and what they might do with disc 1 and all, and what they will put in there. So I'm gonna go thru a few songs and see what we get...

"Our Prayer": Likely the '66 version, without the '68 vocals. Do we have the version without the '68 overdubs officially?

"Heroes And Villains": They will probably put the "cantina" version somewhere in the set; wonder what we'll get on disc; hopefully an awesome mix that we haven't heard yet.

"Do You Like Worms": We probably will get a new mix, as the song apparently wasn't supposed to include that one slow part after the first chorus, right?

"Barnyard": N/A

"Old Master Painter/You Are My Sunshine": N/A

"Cabin Essence": Most likely we get the finished 20/20 version, but maybe they will only give us what they finished in '66. Or who knows? Maybe they found a lead from then? Most likely the 20/20 version I'm guessing.

"Wonderful": I'd guess we most likely get the box set version, right?

"Look": N/A

"Child Is Father of the Man": N/A (note: I hope we get that 3+ minute mix with the chorus vocals nicely overlaid)

"Surf's Up": Looks like we'll get an official Brian led version on both the first and section section? However, will they use the '71 "Child" tag? And you'd also probably have to think they put the solo version somewhere on the set too.

"I'm in Great Shape": N/A (note: wonder if there will be a version of "IIGS" within "H&V")

"I Wanna Be Around/Friday Night": N/A (note: wonder if they'll combine "IIGS" with "IWBA/FN")

"Vega-Tables": Probably a different version from the box-set, as the "hey baba ruba" part wasn't supposed to be part of it, right?

"Holidays": N/A

"Wind Chimes": I'd think probably the box-set version probably?

"Mrs. O'Leary's Cow": N/A

"I Love to Say Da Da": Box-set version probably?

"Good Vibrations": Would make the most sense to put the classic version, if its even on there at all.

Anyways I hope to hear some you guys, your opinions and what not. Obviously its not up to us, but I'm wondering what you guys think they will do.

[juggler]

"Good Vibrations": Would make the most sense to put the classic version, if its even on there at all.

Oh, it'll be on there.  I can't imagine them excluding it.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Important caveat - this is purely my personal opinion and not based on an inside track that some folk here seem convinced I have, OK ? 

"Our Prayer": Likely the '66 version, without the '68 vocals. Do we have the version without the '68 overdubs officially?

- 1966 original is on the 1993 box set

"Cabin Essence": Most likely we get the finished 20/20 version, but maybe they will only give us what they finished in '66. Or who knows? Maybe they found a lead from then? Most likely the 20/20 version I'm guessing.

- 20/20 version collapsed/remixed into mono

"Surf's Up": Looks like we'll get an official Brian led version on both the first and section section? However, will they use the '71 "Child" tag? And you'd also probably have to think they put the solo version somewhere on the set too.

1st part: Brian's 1966 vocal flown into 1966 track... rest: the 12/15/66 recording.

"Good Vibrations": Would make the most sense to put the classic version, if its even on there at all.

- given that BWPS is the template, I'm thinking the version with Asher's lyric.

[Iron Horse-Apples]

I've been wondering the same, but in respect to Smiley Smile material. If the intention is to use BWPS as a blueprint as stated, then will they be incorporating the "whispering winds" fade from the Smiley version of Wind Chimes?. Will they be using the acapella part of Vegetables (which I think is a SMiLE era recording anyway) And will they be lifting off the "Fall Breaks" vocals and adding them to "Fire"? (if they're in the same key, I'll have to check) Personally I'd love to hear "Fire" circa 67 with the vocals

 The Smiley version of  Vegatables fade though, I've always thought that sounded like a near finished mix of the SMiLE version anyway, what with that instrument (is it a marimba?) dubbed onto the SMiLE track. The session on SOT, where that instrument is being dubbed onto the mono mixdown, sounds like a SMiLE mix to me. I hope it sees the light of day on the boxset.

With "Prayer", I've always loved the 68 version which ends in laughter. They've sung it with a bit of vibrato, to really get that choral effect. The vibrato isn't on Brian voice though, so he obviously wasn't participating.

[Andrew G. Doe]

And will they be lifting off the "Fall Breaks" vocals and adding them to "Fire"? (if they're in the same key, I'll have to check) Personally I'd love to hear "Fire" circa 67 with the vocals

Well, if there's proof that that's what Brian wanted but never got around to doing - and of course, assuming anything like this happens - then fine. But, and it's a big but, if anything like this is going to be done purely because that's what happened on BWPS, then the criticism will be considerable, intemperate  and entirely justified, and will detract from the historical integrity of the project. I can't believe Mark & Alan would do any such thing without good reason. I'm sure I'm protesting about something that isn't going to happen, but even so, the thought is a sobering one.

[Iron Horse-Apples]

Well, if there's proof that that's what Brian wanted but never got around to doing - and of course, assuming anything like this happens - then fine. But, and it's a big but, if anything like this is going to be done purely because that's what happened on BWPS, then the criticism will be considerable, intemperate  and entirely justified, and will detract from the historical integrity of the project. I can't believe Mark & Alan would do any such thing without good reason. I'm sure I'm protesting about something that isn't going to happen, but even so, the thought is a sobering one

For me, the fact it works so well, and sounds so right, is evidence that it is what Brian intended. Evidence, but not, as you say, proof.

[desmondo]

And will they be lifting off the "Fall Breaks" vocals and adding them to "Fire"? (if they're in the same key, I'll have to check) Personally I'd love to hear "Fire" circa 67 with the vocals

Well, if there's proof that that's what Brian wanted but never got around to doing - and of course, assuming anything like this happens - then fine. But, and it's a big but, if anything like this is going to be done purely because that's what happened on BWPS, then the criticism will be considerable, intemperate  and entirely justified, and will detract from the historical integrity of the project. I can't believe Mark & Alan would do any such thing without good reason. I'm sure I'm protesting about something that isn't going to happen, but even so, the thought is a sobering one.

Even if they use BWPS as the 'template' I can't believe they are going to mix and match stuff unless there's proof that it was intended in 66/67 - I hope not - as you say it would ruin any historical integrity and that is key to the success of this project

As you say AGD, the project is in good hands

[buddhahat]

And will they be lifting off the "Fall Breaks" vocals and adding them to "Fire"? (if they're in the same key, I'll have to check) Personally I'd love to hear "Fire" circa 67 with the vocals

Well, if there's proof that that's what Brian wanted but never got around to doing - and of course, assuming anything like this happens - then fine. But, and it's a big but, if anything like this is going to be done purely because that's what happened on BWPS, then the criticism will be considerable, intemperate  and entirely justified, and will detract from the historical integrity of the project. I can't believe Mark & Alan would do any such thing without good reason. I'm sure I'm protesting about something that isn't going to happen, but even so, the thought is a sobering one.

I think they're between a rock and a hard place. My ideal is that they use BWPS as a loose map of the sequence but allow the original 'implied' song structures to breathe within that framework. I can't help but think the temptation (and pressure) to match BWPS as closely as possible may push it more in that direction. Of course in creating BWPS, Brian et al had the luxury of being able to add to and mould the pieces to create a finished composition. This is not so true with the original sessions. Whichever route they choose I'm sure Mark and Alan have the skills and integrity to do a good job but it's not as if they're just trying to please themselves with this - There's The Beach Boys to start with, commercial pressure from Capitol and finally the nightmare that is the hardcore Smile fan - an unenviable task in many ways!

[Emdeeh]

- given that BWPS is the template, I'm thinking the version with Asher's lyric.

Which should have never been used on BWPS, in my opinion -- they sound just like the scratch lyrics they are.

[Andrew G. Doe]

- given that BWPS is the template, I'm thinking the version with Asher's lyric.

Which should have never been used on BWPS, in my opinion -- they sound just like the scratch lyrics they are.

There was a reason. An agenda, if you will.

[Chocolate Shake Man]

If the intention is to use BWPS as a blueprint as stated, then will they be incorporating the "whispering winds" fade from the Smiley version of Wind Chimes?.

Sorry, but was that stated? I keep seeing this again and again, and for me, it doesn't jive with what Linett actually says in the interview. He says:

If you take Brian's 2004 version as a blueprint, [it will have] all of that music, all of the significant parts and even the little segue ways

What this seems to be suggesting is that instead of saying that we're going to replicate the structure of BWPS, he seems to be saying instead that if you look at BWPS, you will find music that exists from The Smile Sessions and that will all be on the boxset. Now this can mean two things - he is misusing the word "blueprint" or the sentence as a whole isn't coherent. This doesn't necessarily mean that the tracklisting for Disc 1 of the Smile Sessions won't be modelled on BWPS, but I don't think I see good solid evidence of that in what Linett says in this quotation.

[Les P]

"Good Vibrations": Would make the most sense to put the classic version, if its even on there at all.

- given that BWPS is the template, I'm thinking the version with Asher's lyric.

I can't see THAT getting approval from a certain group member.  Not for the general public-friendly Disk 1.

[tansen]

- given that BWPS is the template, I'm thinking the version with Asher's lyric.

Which should have never been used on BWPS, in my opinion -- they sound just like the scratch lyrics they are.

I'm with you there. The final version Good Vibrations is pure genius. It's perfect. I really hope they will use that one on Disc 1 (or whatever we wanna call the cd that has the 'as-close-to-as-it-gets' version of Smile).

[donald]

The final version was the original beach boys version.  Why change that?  There will be enough unfinished bits on the release as it is.


I'm wondering what in the world could be new on this thing.   I know there is the off chance of lost or previously well guarded unreleased tracks, but my understanding is that Darian had all of the existing smile material on his computer for Brian to sort through in making BWPS.  If not, why not?

[A Million Units In Jan!]

I imagine that the majority of the 'new' material we'll get is going to be H&V sections. Which would be neat, but not at all what most people want when they talk about 'never before heard' material.

[JohnMill]

I wouldn't be surprised if their choices weren't fairly obvious.  I will be surprised if they are anything radically out of the box:

Our Prayer": GV box-set

"Heroes And Villains": - 50/50 - Cantina vs. new mix...maybe a bit of both (a new mix containing the cantina section?) - The fact that "cantina" was issued as part of the GV/H&V single recently leads me to believe those compiling the set still hold this particular mix in high regard.

"Do You Like Worms": New mix for the reason the original poster mentioned.  The mix on the GV box probably could be improved upon either way

"Barnyard": Unless they found the multi-track tapes for this, it's probably going to be sourced from the same acetate we've known for years.  I doubt they do a hybrid with "Humble Harv"

"Old Master Painter/You Are My Sunshine": The same mix found on the Linett 1988 tape and on the VigOtone boot.

"Cabin Essence": 20/20 version no doubt.  I will literally fall off my chair if it's anything else.

"Wonderful": GV box set.  Again will literally fall off my chair if it's anything else although honestly a new mix (perhaps incorporating "Rock With Me Henry") would leave room for a modern STEREO mix of the harpsichord version elsewhere which would be nice.

"Look": Again there is a version of this on the 1988 Linett tape.  I doubt it will be found in much different form here.

"Child Is Father of the Man": See above...you could actually recast this song a bit better than Linett did in 1988 but...

"Surf's Up": Think Anne Wallace or something like Anne Wallace and you'll get the picture.  The jury is out personally on the 71' "Child" overdubs for me.  I guess it depends on how faithful they are being to not including stuff post-66 and how they are casting the entire album.  It's been said that BWPS is being used as a template so that leads me to think that the overdubs will be included.

"I'm in Great Shape": This will be interesting to see what they do with this.  A couple different possibilities from including it in a fresh mix of H&V, to a stand-alone track without vocals.  Much like "Barnyard", I feel a hybrid with "Humble Harv" is unlikely however...

"I Wanna Be Around/Friday Night": As known...

"Vega-Tables": Much like the original poster, I hope they recast this as the mix on the GV box contains material not germane to "Vega-Tables".  Since they are using BWPS as a template I wouldn't be surprised if craft a mix in line with how Brian performed the song.

"Holidays": See the 1988 Linett tape.

"Wind Chimes": See the GV box set.

"Mrs. O'Leary's Cow": See the 1988 Linett tape.

"I Love to Say Da Da": "Water" intro merged with "I Love To Say Da-Da" as found on SOT 16.

"Good Vibrations": I'm trying not to inject my own personal feelings into what I feel is appropriate for an official release of "SMiLE" but GV was already a complete piece of music months before Brian junked "SMiLE".  If they include anything here except the classic version there will be grumbles from this end of the yard especially because the only reason to do such a thing that I can see would be to put Mike's nose out of joint.  

[OneEar/OneEye]

I wish Brian were going to be involved beyond simply "yes" or "no" to the final thing.  Though he maybe can't recall what he wanted in 66/67 and maybe never knew, I'd still rather have him saying "okay, let's do this sequence"  now, as opposed to simply using BWS as a template.  BWPS was a "reimagining" (if you will) of the project for a live performance, which they then decided they'd record in the studio, no?   So using it as a template isn't what was intended in 66/67, if there ever was a final intention which had been decided upon at any point back in 66/67, yes? 
And, uh....crap, now I'm just confused! 

[JohnMill]

I wish Brian were going to be involved beyond simply "yes" or "no" to the final thing.  Though he maybe can't recall what he wanted in 66/67 and maybe never knew, I'd still rather have him saying "okay, let's do this sequence"  now, as opposed to simply using BWS as a template.  BWPS was a "reimagining" (if you will) of the project for a live performance, which they then decided they'd record in the studio, no?   So using it as a template isn't what was intended in 66/67, if there ever was a final intention which had been decided upon at any point back in 66/67, yes? 
And, uh....crap, now I'm just confused! 

Brian has already given us his vision for "SMiLE".  Granted it probably wasn't in line with how he thought of the project in 1966 (depending on what day in 1966 you happened to ask him about it after all) but it's his vision of the project nonetheless.  If Linett wants to use that then fine although except for the unique mixes he'll likely craft for several of the songs (H&V, Surf's Up, Worms, Vega-Tables) you can go pick up the "Purple Chick" mix of "SMiLE" and hear the "SMiLE" session tapes sequenced just like they were for BWPS.

[OneEar/OneEye]

Yes, quite right, never mind.  I guess I am guilty of wishing for something that never was and cannot be.  Whatever way they do it/sequence it, etc.  will be great.   I just wish the thing was out already. 

[Mr. Cohen]

Hate to say it, but Disc 1 of The Smile Sessions is just going to be  42 minute recording of Brian Wilson burning tapes. "A completed part 2 of 'Surf's Up'? The fire could use some more fuel, I guess."

[Chris Brown]

I think JohnMill has pretty much got it right - I'm not expecting anything particularly earth-shattering on the first disc, save for perhaps a new mix of "Heroes" (which seems like a pretty good possibility to me).  Said mix may very well contain "Barnyard," "I'm In Great Shape," or both, and with any luck, both would have completed lead vocals.

I hope they stick with vintage mixes as much as possible, with the exception of Carl's "Cabinessence" lead vocal (I'd be ok leaving it out to be honest, but I can't imagine them doing that).  Keep the original '66 "Prayer," no "Child" vocals at the end of whatever they do with "Surf's Up."

[Curtis Leon]

"Our Prayer": Almost definitely the mix on the box set.

"Heroes And Villains": I'm hoping for a clearer mastering of the Cantina mix, myself. Along with a whole smörgåsbord of various sessions.

"Do You Like Worms": Probably just a remix of what we already have. I doubt they've found any lead vocals for it, judging by what comments on the subject people have already made.

"Barnyard": I think this'll be one of the real treats on the boxset. I have a strong feeling they've found the multitracks for this, based on the inner groove to the H&V/GV single, and, again, from several comments made on this forum by people in the know.

"Old Master Painter/You Are My Sunshine": Probably the exact same version we've always had, unless a miracle happens and they find Denny's Old Master Painter vocals.

"Cabin Essence": I'd have to agree with the 20/20 version, mixed/folded down to mono, of course. Again, unless a miracle happens.

"Wonderful": Boxset version, unless they decide to include the Rock With Me Henry section for some odd reason.

"Look": Maybe there's a way to restore the clarinet from the multitracks? Who knows.

"Child Is Father of the Man": Again, same as we've always had before in clearer sound. I'd cry of joy if they found a proper lead for this.

"Surf's Up": Probably very similar to the Purple Chick version, considering BWPS is the template for this.

"I'm in Great Shape": If they've found an early acetate of H&V with IIGS in it, sure. As for how the song itself'll sound on the set, haven't got a clue.

"I Wanna Be Around/Friday Night": If BWPS is the template, they'll definitely combine it with IIGS.

"Vega-Tables": Complete mystery to me.  Every Smile bootleg has a different mix of this song and there's never been a clear, concise order of what this is supposed to be.

"Holidays": Another highlight, if only because it'll be properly mastered in full clarity.

"Wind Chimes": Box set version.

"Mrs. O'Leary's Cow": With the box set intro, in much clearer sound.

"I Love to Say Da Da": Unless they've found leads, I'll agree with you.

"Good Vibrations": I'm secretly hoping they'll extract stereo vocals from the mono master tape for a full stereo mix.

[OneEar/OneEye]

Oh, so now I see how they get around the issue of including things recorded post 67.  According to Dom (link to interview below), apparently the compilers of this box feel the Smile Sessions didn't end in 67, but went on til about 71/72 - hence they can include the tag to Surff's Up, The lead vocals on Cabin Essence, etc. 
"Pretty sneaky, sis."   

http://www.examiner.com/vintage-rock-n-roll-in-national/author-beach-boys-smile-release-will-tell-story-bootleg-releases-couldn-t

[Chris Brown]

Oh, so now I see how they get around the issue of including things recorded post 67.  According to Dom (link to interview below), apparently the compilers of this box feel the Smile Sessions didn't end in 67, but went on til about 71/72 - hence they can include the tag to Surff's Up, The lead vocals on Cabin Essence, etc. 
"Pretty sneaky, sis."   

http://www.examiner.com/vintage-rock-n-roll-in-national/author-beach-boys-smile-release-will-tell-story-bootleg-releases-couldn-t

I don't really agree with the approach (I don't give much legitimacy to any work done by the Beach Boys on Smile without Brian's consent/guidance/participation), but aside from that, the article still leaves me with a good feeling about what we're going to hear. 

I still hope we get the original "Prayer" and a Brian lead on "Surf's Up," but for sake of cohesiveness I don't have much of a problem with keeping Carl's "Cabinessence" lead or the "Child" vocals at the end of "Surf's Up."

[Andrew G. Doe]

Oh, so now I see how they get around the issue of including things recorded post 67.  According to Dom (link to interview below), apparently the compilers of this box feel the Smile Sessions didn't end in 67, but went on til about 71/72 - hence they can include the tag to Surff's Up, The lead vocals on Cabin Essence, etc.  
"Pretty sneaky, sis."  

http://www.examiner.com/vintage-rock-n-roll-in-national/author-beach-boys-smile-release-will-tell-story-bootleg-releases-couldn-t

... and folk wonder why sometimes I get a mite tetchy. NOWHERE in that article is the word "compilers" so much as mentioned. The part about the 'sessions' extending to 1971-2 is purely Dom's opinion. He wrote the essay, he did photo/memorabilia research (like it says in the piece), but he's had nothing to do with the compilation or sequencing of the project beyond the not-inconsiderable influence of what he did with DAG #2. The only person who's said "apparently the compilers of this box feel the Smile Sessions didn't end in 67, but went on til about 71/72" is you - not Dom. And you're wrong.

Re-read the article.