Questions Regarding The Radiant Radish....

[rab2591]

Did Brian work at the Radiant Radish from 9-5 every day? Or did he hire out the help? If he did work there sometimes was he happy working there? Has Marilyn ever talked about this business venture?

I've read one story about him behind the counter (from the Rolling Stone article)....that's it. This is one aspect of Brian Wilson's life that I've been utterly fascinated with, but yet I've read at most one paragraph on the subject - and every thread I've visited regarding it reiterates the same information.

I, like most, am floored when thinking about Brian Wilson owning a health-foods store - and being a terrible owner at that. It seems to me like this would be a goldmine of hilarious stories - yet there is virtually no information on the subject. Anyone know anything about this place?

[Andrew G. Doe]

The Radish was situated at 8700 West Melrose Avenue at San Vicente, and was co-owned by Brian, cousin Steve Korthof and Brian's gofer Arnie Geller. It opened in mid 1969 and was still open in spring 1971 (can't find an actual closing date but the photo of him there in the famous Rolling Stone article has him wearing the exact same clothing as in a band shot taken by Steve Desper during the Surf's Up sessions, which wrapped July 1971: given that all six are in the shot, I'd say it was a vocal session, so late July). I don't think Brian was there 9-5 Monday-Friday, rather he wandered down there when the urge struck.

[rab2591]

The Radish was situated at 8700 West Melrose Avenue at San Vicente, and was co-owned by Brian, cousin Steve Korthof and Brian's gofer Arnie Geller. It opened in mid 1969 and was still open in spring 1971 (can't find an actual closing date but the photo of him there in the famous Rolling Stone article has him wearing the exact same clothing as in a band shot taken by Steve Desper during the Surf's Up sessions, which wrapped July 1971: given that all six are in the shot, I'd say it was a vocal session, so late July). I don't think Brian was there 9-5 Monday-Friday, rather he wandered down there when the urge struck.

Thanks AGD! I wonder if Brian ever mentioned the Radish in any post-Surf's Up interviews? I can see a whole new scrapbook opportunity for Domenic Priore here!

I should've tried asking Brian about it during his BWRG facebook chat...hope he does the same chat for the Disney album.

[Andrew G. Doe]

The Radish was situated at 8700 West Melrose Avenue at San Vicente, and was co-owned by Brian, cousin Steve Korthof and Brian's gofer Arnie Geller. It opened in mid 1969 and was still open in spring 1971 (can't find an actual closing date but the photo of him there in the famous Rolling Stone article has him wearing the exact same clothing as in a band shot taken by Steve Desper during the Surf's Up sessions, which wrapped July 1971: given that all six are in the shot, I'd say it was a vocal session, so late July). I don't think Brian was there 9-5 Monday-Friday, rather he wandered down there when the urge struck.

Thanks AGD! I wonder if Brian ever mentioned the Radish in any post-Surf's Up interviews? I can see a whole new scrapbook opportunity for Domenic Priore here!

I should've tried asking Brian about it during his BWRG facebook chat...hope he does the same chat for the Disney album.

That would indeed be a good question to ask Brian... 

[guitarfool2002]

One of the things rich rock stars had to do is spend their money on various investments and the like in order to avoid paying as much in taxes as if they were to put all the earnings in the bank. A store could be a potential business write-off if it were not making a profit, and if it did make a profit it could still use operating costs to lessen the burden. And if something like a health food store tickled Brian's fancy, it was as simple as signing the papers. Whether he was involved personally or not wouldn't have as much to do with the decision as the investment, and there are many examples of athletes and stars investing in businesses like studios, car wash franchises, lube-and-oil garages, restaurants...and they don't even know in some cases where all the locations are unless they show up to cut a ribbon at the grand opening.

Remember too the debacle that was the Apple Boutique...musicians getting involved in a business they knew nothing about and were ill-equipped to run, yet that was what tickled their fancy at that time. "Hey, let's open a boutique!" is easier to say than to do after a few months in business. It's not surprising the Radiant Radish was a failure, and I doubt Brian's involvement affected much in the fate of that store.

[rab2591]

One of the things rich rock stars had to do is spend their money on various investments and the like in order to avoid paying as much in taxes as if they were to put all the earnings in the bank. A store could be a potential business write-off if it were not making a profit, and if it did make a profit it could still use operating costs to lessen the burden. And if something like a health food store tickled Brian's fancy, it was as simple as signing the papers. Whether he was involved personally or not wouldn't have as much to do with the decision as the investment, and there are many examples of athletes and stars investing in businesses like studios, car wash franchises, lube-and-oil garages, restaurants...and they don't even know in some cases where all the locations are unless they show up to cut a ribbon at the grand opening.

Remember too the debacle that was the Apple Boutique...musicians getting involved in a business they knew nothing about and were ill-equipped to run, yet that was what tickled their fancy at that time. "Hey, let's open a boutique!" is easier to say than to do after a few months in business. It's not surprising the Radiant Radish was a failure, and I doubt Brian's involvement affected much in the fate of that store.

Hmmm. Him opening it for tax reasons makes it somewhat less of an interesting story lol.

I've yet to read 'Heroes and Villains' - does that have any anecdotes about the Radish?

[guitarfool2002]

One of the things rich rock stars had to do is spend their money on various investments and the like in order to avoid paying as much in taxes as if they were to put all the earnings in the bank. A store could be a potential business write-off if it were not making a profit, and if it did make a profit it could still use operating costs to lessen the burden. And if something like a health food store tickled Brian's fancy, it was as simple as signing the papers. Whether he was involved personally or not wouldn't have as much to do with the decision as the investment, and there are many examples of athletes and stars investing in businesses like studios, car wash franchises, lube-and-oil garages, restaurants...and they don't even know in some cases where all the locations are unless they show up to cut a ribbon at the grand opening.

Remember too the debacle that was the Apple Boutique...musicians getting involved in a business they knew nothing about and were ill-equipped to run, yet that was what tickled their fancy at that time. "Hey, let's open a boutique!" is easier to say than to do after a few months in business. It's not surprising the Radiant Radish was a failure, and I doubt Brian's involvement affected much in the fate of that store.

Hmmm. Him opening it for tax reasons makes it somewhat less of an interesting story lol.

One of the more interesting stories from that time about rich rock stars spending money to avoid paying taxes comes from Mike Nesmith. At the end of 1967 he was about to get hit with a whopping tax bill after his success with The Monkees and other investments, so he decided to spend it in style. This was his "Wichita Train Whistle Sings" album project.

He hired the finest musicians in Los Angeles, and not only hired them but hired multiples of each instrument. The studio was packed with musicians, and he deliberately paid them double scale and let the clock run over time so they'd go into the even higher pay scale. Mike ordered gourmet food be brought to the studio from Chasens in LA, among the best, and the musicians feasted between takes on a gourmet banquet.

It was quite a gathering. At the end of one take, as part of the joke since they had just made a killing on the sessions, Tommy Tedesco threw one of his favorite guitars into the air and it crashed down, breaking into pieces, shocking everyone. And Tommy got a real laugh out of that.

Mike got his solo album, spent way too much money but didn't need to pay taxes on it, and the musicians loved him for it - the money and the gourmet food. I'd say that is a better way to blow money if you're a rock star than opening up a health food store!

[letsmakeit31]

I love the fact that Brian was serving in The Radiant Radish one evening, and he wouldn't sell some vitamins to a bloke without a note from his doctor!!
And if the day's till total didn't add up Brian would put in the differents himself .
Some of the many reasons we all love Brian

[guitarfool2002]

And if the day's till total didn't add up Brian would put in the differents himself .

This is not uncommon with small businesses or family-owned businesses, especially if you get people on board who are dedicated to running it and at the end of the day it just falls short...the "owner" or the elder family member may just add to the till to keep spirits up when they know it's a sinking ship.

BUT - In Brian's case, he seems to have done this in other ways too. Remember the land deal when Brian wrote the check for the bulk of the investment, in effect "covering" for his brothers and Mike with his own money even though it was a Brother enterprise? One thing Brian did is open the checkbook for his family and his bandmates, at least up to a point when they needed the money and he had the ability to do that.

[bgas]

BUT - In Brian's case, he seems to have done this in other ways too. Remember the land deal when Brian wrote the check for the bulk of the investment, in effect "covering" for his brothers and Mike with his own money even though it was a Brother enterprise? One thing Brian did is open the checkbook for his family and his bandmates, at least up to a point when they needed the money and he had the ability to do that.

Probably should keep in mind that Brian was , in effect, doing some of this with "Mike's $$", since he wasn't getting paid for his writing credits( no matter how Small some may  think they were).

[guitarfool2002]

BUT - In Brian's case, he seems to have done this in other ways too. Remember the land deal when Brian wrote the check for the bulk of the investment, in effect "covering" for his brothers and Mike with his own money even though it was a Brother enterprise? One thing Brian did is open the checkbook for his family and his bandmates, at least up to a point when they needed the money and he had the ability to do that.

Probably should keep in mind that Brian was , in effect, doing some of this with "Mike's $$", since he wasn't getting paid for his writing credits( no matter how Small some may  think they were).

But there were only *a few* songs in question under the Sea Of Tunes name where it was later determined Mike wasn't credited properly, it wasn't like he didn't see a dime from his hit 60's collaborations and Brian was swimming in cash that should have gone to Mike. Mike was getting paid for most of the credits he had but it was only on a few specific songs like "California Girls" where the income after "Endless Summer" in '74 and the Beach Boys image as America's Band added up to quite a sum of back-payment money Mike should have been paid all along.

So to say Brian was spending money that was Mike's from song credits when it was only a few songs out of a handful of hit records with Mike's name on the credit is a bit of an overstatement.

But at the time of the land deal, and the Radiant Radish and other late-60's/early 70's ventures under the Brother name, Brian was often carrying them financially on more than one deal or project.

[Andrew G. Doe]

But there were only *a few* songs in question under the Sea Of Tunes name where it was later determined Mike wasn't credited properly

Thirty-seven, actually... and in an interview before the court case, Mike mentioned a total of seventy-nine !  I can only assume his council managed to talk him into contesting only those claims that looked winnable.

The titles awarded to Mike were:

Chug-A-Lug
409 - #76 single B side
Farmer's Daughter
Shut Down - #23 single B side
Noble Surfer
Finders Keepers
Catch A Wave
Hawaii
Surfer's Rule
Be True To Your School - #6 single A side
I Get Around - #1 single A side
All Summer Long
Wendy - #44 EP track
Do You Remember ?
Drive-In
Don't Back Down
Little Saint Nick - #3 Xmas single A side
The Man With All The Toys - #3 Xmas single A side
Santa's Beard
Merry Christmas, Baby
Good To My Baby
Don't Hurt My Little Sister
When I Grow Up (To Be A Man) - #9 single A side
Help Me, Ronda
Dance, Dance, Dance - #8 single A side
Kiss Me Baby
She Knows Me Too Well
In The Back Of My Mind
The Girl From New York City
Amusement Parks USA
Salt Lake City
Help Me, Rhonda (45 version) - #1 single A side
California Girls - #3 single A side
Let Him Run Wild
You're So Good To Me
Wouldn't It Be Nice - #8 single A side
I Know There's An Answer

[The Heartical Don]

One of the things rich rock stars had to do is spend their money on various investments and the like in order to avoid paying as much in taxes as if they were to put all the earnings in the bank. A store could be a potential business write-off if it were not making a profit, and if it did make a profit it could still use operating costs to lessen the burden. And if something like a health food store tickled Brian's fancy, it was as simple as signing the papers. Whether he was involved personally or not wouldn't have as much to do with the decision as the investment, and there are many examples of athletes and stars investing in businesses like studios, car wash franchises, lube-and-oil garages, restaurants...and they don't even know in some cases where all the locations are unless they show up to cut a ribbon at the grand opening.

Remember too the debacle that was the Apple Boutique...musicians getting involved in a business they knew nothing about and were ill-equipped to run, yet that was what tickled their fancy at that time. "Hey, let's open a boutique!" is easier to say than to do after a few months in business. It's not surprising the Radiant Radish was a failure, and I doubt Brian's involvement affected much in the fate of that store.

Hmmm. Him opening it for tax reasons makes it somewhat less of an interesting story lol.

I always thought that the Radiant Radish served as some sort of 'guilt valve'. Brian may well have felt bad about his drug consumption. Well, if that is true, it may have soothed his mind to open a 'health shop'. To compensate. Does anyone know if there's info that substantiates my assumption?

I've yet to read 'Heroes and Villains' - does that have any anecdotes about the Radish?

[guitarfool2002]

But there were only *a few* songs in question under the Sea Of Tunes name where it was later determined Mike wasn't credited properly

Thirty-five, actually... and in an interview before the court case, Mike mentioned a total of seventy-nine !  I can only assume his council managed to talk him into contesting only those claims that looked winnable.

79 is a whopping number and it would seem just a bit exaggerated! But I am confused a bit - taking the number 35 into consideration I really only remember "California Girls" as the big one in question, and one which I think the press may have focused on because the song is an icon at this point (and which Mike stood to make the most money from if he won the case, which he did...).

I'll definitely look into the details more but in brief, Mike's name was listed as co-writer on many of the hits at least on the records themselves, and on some BMI forms as well which popped up: Did he win the case on all 35 of those songs, or did the judge go through song-by-song and decide individually which ones were not credited to Mike when they should have been? Again, I only remember "California Girls" so any info would be appreciated.

On a side note I wonder if Mike ever wrote a personal check to cover the Maharishi tour debacle which cost the band a boatload of money...

[Andrew G. Doe]

But there were only *a few* songs in question under the Sea Of Tunes name where it was later determined Mike wasn't credited properly

Thirty-five, actually... and in an interview before the court case, Mike mentioned a total of seventy-nine !  I can only assume his council managed to talk him into contesting only those claims that looked winnable.

79 is a whopping number and it would seem just a bit exaggerated! But I am confused a bit - taking the number 35 into consideration I really only remember "California Girls" as the big one in question, and one which I think the press may have focused on because the song is an icon at this point (and which Mike stood to make the most money from if he won the case, which he did...).

I'll definitely look into the details more but in brief, Mike's name was listed as co-writer on many of the hits at least on the records themselves, and on some BMI forms as well which popped up: Did he win the case on all 35 of those songs, or did the judge go through song-by-song and decide individually which ones were not credited to Mike when they should have been? Again, I only remember "California Girls" so any info would be appreciated.

On a side note I wonder if Mike ever wrote a personal check to cover the Maharishi tour debacle which cost the band a boatload of money...

Mike won retroactive credit on all 37 (my error) songs, future royalties (50% or 33% as applicable) and a lump sum settlement of $5,000,000. He was willing to settle out of court for $750,000, restored credits and future royalties, thus Brian's management's decision to fight the case cost Brian $4,250,000 and costs. It's possibly the single stupidest decision Brian's people ever made, and lord knows, they've made some pretty dumbass ones.

I'll work out how many hit singles he was credited on and get back later.

[Mikie]

I love the fact that Brian was serving in The Radiant Radish one evening, and he wouldn't sell some vitamins to a bloke without a note from his doctor!!

That was from the Tom Nolan "California Saga" article in Rolling Stone, 1971. To this day I can't figure out why he couldn't sell the guy Vitamin B12. It's readliy available right now off the shelf! Maybe back then you had to have a prescription for it?

I think Jack Rieley had something to say about the Radish - saw the interview recently I think....

[guitarfool2002]

I love the fact that Brian was serving in The Radiant Radish one evening, and he wouldn't sell some vitamins to a bloke without a note from his doctor!!

That was from the Tom Nolan "California Saga" article in Rolling Stone, 1971. To this day I can't figure out why he couldn't sell the guy Vitamin B12. It's readliy available right now off the shelf! Maybe back then you had to have a prescription for it?

There may be a little bit of hipster/underground reasoning to this: If you're having a bad acid trip one of the ways to dull the effects is to take Vitamin B. Brian would have known this, I'm sure, and if some guy walks in and asks for B12 and either acts or looks a certain way maybe it upset Brian in his healthy mindset and he knew what the guy was doing with it. Just a random, wild thought.

[Andrew G. Doe]

OK, Mike's US hit single credits during the same period as the court case covered (1962-66):

Surfin' -#75
Surfin' Safari - #14
Fun, Fun, Fun - #5
Little Honda (EP) - #65
Please Let Me Wonder - #52
Good Vibrations - #1

Six. Just six.

Post 1966, the US total is just nine, up to and including "Still Cruisin'". The majority of Mike's royalty income comes not from hit singles, but compilations.

[guitarfool2002]

OK, Mike's hit single credits during the same period as the court case covered (1962-66):

Surfin' -#75
Surfin' Safari - #14
Fun, Fun, Fun - #5
Little Honda (EP) - #65
Please Let Me Wonder - #52
Good Vibrations - #1

Six. Just six.

Thank you for that info, I was really off on my assumptions there and it's pretty surprising to see the actual numbers. I was also assuming the issue about credits was an issue with how Murry worked out the paperwork back in the day, so in my mind, too, Brian's fighting this issue to the point his group fought Mike's case seems very...odd.

[Andrew G. Doe]

OK, Mike's hit single credits during the same period as the court case covered (1962-66):

Surfin' -#75
Surfin' Safari - #14
Fun, Fun, Fun - #5
Little Honda (EP) - #65
Please Let Me Wonder - #52
Good Vibrations - #1

Six. Just six.

Thank you for that info, I was really off on my assumptions there and it's pretty surprising to see the actual numbers. I was also assuming the issue about credits was an issue with how Murry worked out the paperwork back in the day, so in my mind, too, Brian's fighting this issue to the point his group fought Mike's case seems very...odd.

I was astonished too, so much so that I double-checked the figures.

[OBLiO]

did the judge go through song-by-song and decide individually

A friend and band-mate of mine attended that court case as a spectator. I remember at rehearsal one night he said he went to the hearings and they were going over individual songs.... lyrics line by line I think in some instances. I am trying to remember what he said about it and this was 20 years ago, so...

[Chocolate Shake Man]

Thirty-seven, actually... and in an interview before the court case, Mike mentioned a total of seventy-nine !  I can only assume his council managed to talk him into contesting only those claims that looked winnable.

Good God. The 37 are suspicious enough. I can't imagine what the 79 would have looked like.

[juggler]

Recently ran across a Goldmine interview with ML in 1992....
http://troun.tripod.com/mikelove.html

Love makes a ton of interesting, provocative comments.   

Back to the lawsuit. What are some of the songs you co-wrote but didn't receive credit for?

Okay, "Little Saint Nick." Brian Wilson is credited with writing 100 percent of that. Well, guess who wrote the words? Mike Love, that's who wrote the words. "Don't Back Down." It's very well known that Brian Wilson did not surf. I wrote "Catch A Wave" and "Don't Back Down." He's credited 100 percent. He didn't give me any credit.

How did that happen?

Because he didn't put my name down. Murry Wilson was the publisher of Sea of Tunes and and put in for this stuff. The same thing with "The Man With All The Toys," "Santa's Beard," "Merry Christmas Baby." There's "Good To My Baby." Brian Wilson is listed as writing it completely, guess who wrote the words? Doctor Love, that's who. "When I Grow Up (To Be A Man)." I participated in that and didn't get a stitch of recognition. "Help Me Rhonda," I wrote, "Since you put me down I've been out doing in my head." That's my fucking line, thank you very much. Things like "Dance Dance Dance," I asked Carl if he wrote any lyrics for the song and he said no. He just came up with the guitar line.

It's a good guitar line.

It is a cool line. Brian Wilson and Carl Wilson split 50-50 on that. I was the one who wrote the Chuck Berry-styled alliteration lyrics. That's my scene.

Was this more Murry Wilson or Brian?

Either that or Brian didn't tell him because of his ego. It's a bloodbath. It's millions and millions of dollars' worth of damage. Other songs, he arbitrarily assigned me a percentage which was fairly nominal. Basically, when I wrote 100 percent of the words he'd give me like 30 percent of the tune, as opposed to a split.

Would you ever work again with Brian as a writer and producer?

Sure I would, But I want him to... "Be True To Your School," I wrote a lot of words to that and wasn't credited. Like I said, "Help Me Rhonda." It would have been nice if I was credited with "Catch A Wave." "South Bay Surfer." I wrote the words to "Hawaii." "Be True To Your School." The line [recites lyrics], "When some loud braggart tries to put you down and says his school is great, I tell him right away what's the matter buddy ain't you heard of my school it's number one in the state."

"I Get Around," he put in for 100 percent of it. I came up, Dr. Love, got witnesses, Al Jardine will testify in a court of law. I came up with "roud round get around," and if that's not a hook I don't know what the f*** is. That was a chickenshit move to credit himself with a hundred percent. Virtually all the songs that were chart records I had a hand in writing some if not all of the lyrics.

How about "All Summer Long"?

Yeah, I wrote, "Remember when you spilled Coke all over your blouse." I wrote that with him. To the best of my recollections I wrote 50 percent of of the words on that. In "I Get Around," Brian had "I get around from town to town, I'm a real cool head, I'm making real good bread." I wrote the verses through, and the "round round get around" part.

There's interesting things like "409" where I came up with "She's real fine my 409" and "giddy up, giddy up, 409," and was not credited, but Brian Wilson did give credit to Gary Usher for his contribution. So it was weird. It was like directly against me. He wouldn't f*** with anybody else but he screwed me over royally. I didn't know how badly I had been abused until I was deposed in Brian's pursuit of his claims against Irving Almo and Mitchell Silverburg and Nutt, which was the attorney representing the Beach Boys and Irving Almo. An inherent conflict of interest there.

At any rate, I didn't know to what degree I'd been taken advantage of until I got the deposition. I saw that and went, "Oh my goodness!" And I wasn't really even advised of my rights until recently. In the last few months I've consulted a good litigation attorney. He's done incredible research on the rights of a songwriter that I've never even heard of from anybody until he started advising me of these things. On the basis of these rights and the potential remedy that I have, I have a very, very good case against Brian Wilson. I hope we don't have to go to trial because it's going to destroy Brian. He's going to be destroyed in depositions, first of all, let alone getting him in court.

So what will you be doing with this?

Suing his ass to pieces because he's hiding behind his lawyers and all that kind of stuff.

Have you started the suit?

It's being prepared. It'll probably be pretty soon. You'll hear about it.

[Shady]

Man that was a really nasty time

[hypehat]

You're damn right there. I feel sorry for Mike, honestly. Guy felt wronged, but I'd bet your ass Brian didn't care what went on publishing contracts, just like he didn't care about letting his record company give him cash. Murry is probably more to blame...