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Author Topic: Mike Love wanted the Beach Boys to finish SMiLE  (Read 22086 times)
GoogaMooga
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« on: January 08, 2011, 10:10:01 PM »

From an interview in 2007. What do you think, would it have been better than Brian Wilson Presents SMiLE?

from http://www.concertlivewire.com/interviews/beachint.htm

Livewire: I'm curious what your take is on Brian Wilson's release of Smile as a solo record rather than linking up with the rest of the living Beach Boys?

Love: It's historically become one of the most famous unreleased albums and I wasn't in favor of [Brian re-recording and releasing it]. I heard him quoted as saying his new group was better than the Beach Boys and I think that's impossible because we all had pretty darn good vocals together! Smile was sort of the follow-up to Pet Sounds that Brian shelved for many years, but it was re-done without those of us who are still around to accomplish the manifestation of it. I would've preferred it to be a Beach Boys project than a Brian solo album, but if people like it, great.
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Mahalo
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« Reply #1 on: January 08, 2011, 10:21:51 PM »

Yes...it would've been...(if Brian was as involved as the perception was given 4 BWPS)....
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Jason
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« Reply #2 on: January 08, 2011, 10:22:03 PM »

Brian's band will never replace the Beach Boys' vocal blend. The bootlegs and released bits we have now with Beach Boys vocals are infinitely better than any of the BWPS recordings. Just my opinion, of course.
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Mahalo
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« Reply #3 on: January 08, 2011, 10:25:58 PM »

Brian's band will never replace the Beach Boys' vocal blend. The bootlegs and released bits we have now with Beach Boys vocals are infinitely better than any of the BWPS recordings. Just my opinion, of course.

Opinion? No, Fact...that blend is a color that is yet to be invented...(till the 7 disc SMiLE boxset comes out his summer)....
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« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2011, 10:27:01 PM »

....same goes for the instrumental versions of those tunes...
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GoogaMooga
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« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2011, 10:27:37 PM »

I'm just wondering if Mike had in mind to start from scratch - would the blend have worked without Carl?
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« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2011, 10:36:30 PM »

No. Obviously Brian's voice has been lost from 1967, and Carl's loss is too painful to talk much about. Regardless, any of the survivng BB's would've contributed greatly to the timbre of BWPS...but Carl's voice adds so much dimension to anything in ever....sigh.

Mike probably is too distracted to start from a creative scratch...
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Jason
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« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2011, 10:44:11 PM »

Brian's band will never replace the Beach Boys' vocal blend. The bootlegs and released bits we have now with Beach Boys vocals are infinitely better than any of the BWPS recordings. Just my opinion, of course.

Opinion? No, Fact...that blend is a color that is yet to be invented...(till the 7 disc SMiLE boxset comes out his summer)....

I can't say my opinions are "facts"...they tend to lead to an exodus or two. Horses for courses and all that, right mate?
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XY
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« Reply #8 on: January 08, 2011, 10:50:32 PM »

No. Obviously Brian's voice has been lost from 1967, and Carl's loss is too painful to talk much about. Regardless, any of the survivng BB's would've contributed greatly to the timbre of BWPS...but Carl's voice adds so much dimension to anything in ever....sigh.

Comparing "Wind Chimes", I prefer the BWPS SMiLE version to the BB recording. One of Brian's best vocal performances since ages.
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Runaways
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« Reply #9 on: January 08, 2011, 11:37:04 PM »

i've thought about this and it would have been really cool.  The guys together sounded better, no doubt.  but carl and dennis were pretty key i think. 
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A Million Units In Jan!
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« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2011, 04:13:58 AM »

I don't prefer any of the BWPS tracks to the ones laid down back in '66-'67. Even the snippets done back then  are better than the full songs on BWPS.
As far as the vocals go, aside from H&V, and 'Who Ran The Iron Horse', how many of the original tracks have full blown BB's vocals on them?
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rab2591
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« Reply #11 on: January 09, 2011, 06:56:34 AM »

No. Obviously Brian's voice has been lost from 1967, and Carl's loss is too painful to talk much about. Regardless, any of the survivng BB's would've contributed greatly to the timbre of BWPS...but Carl's voice adds so much dimension to anything in ever....sigh.

Comparing "Wind Chimes", I prefer the BWPS SMiLE version to the BB recording. One of Brian's best vocal performances since ages.

Totally agree! I've listened the hell out of that track...that and 'On A Holiday' - FAR more brilliant sounding than the 66/67 tapes.

Surf's Up from BWPS sounds just amazing....especially Brian's vocal in the coda.

So, MANY of the 66/67 SMiLE boots sound TERRIBLE (Holidays anyone?). (this may be a really stupid/obvious question) when/if they release a boxset, will the instrumentals sound as good as the instrumentals on the Pet Sounds Session box?

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Bill Tobelman's SMiLE site

The Beach Boys legacy is still being mortared to this day...it has a solid and unbreakable foundation of incredible songs that tower above most bands, yet some bricks are more brittle and ugly than others (even some bricks put down more recently)...thus is the nature of any entity that continues to exist. You are not defined solely by your good achievements in life, you're also defined by those unpleasant moments too. This law of life, thankfully, helps keep us all in check.
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« Reply #12 on: January 09, 2011, 09:05:03 AM »

No. Obviously Brian's voice has been lost from 1967, and Carl's loss is too painful to talk much about. Regardless, any of the survivng BB's would've contributed greatly to the timbre of BWPS...but Carl's voice adds so much dimension to anything in ever....sigh.

Comparing "Wind Chimes", I prefer the BWPS SMiLE version to the BB recording. One of Brian's best vocal performances since ages.

Totally agree! I've listened the hell out of that track...that and 'On A Holiday' - FAR more brilliant sounding than the 66/67 tapes.

Surf's Up from BWPS sounds just amazing....especially Brian's vocal in the coda.

So, MANY of the 66/67 SMiLE boots sound TERRIBLE (Holidays anyone?). (this may be a really stupid/obvious question) when/if they release a boxset, will the instrumentals sound as good as the instrumentals on the Pet Sounds Session box?


I suppose it depends on how many of the original tapes still exist in the vaults.  If they have to use 10th generation tape copies and acetates to fill in any gaps, then don't bet on it.
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A Million Units In Jan!
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« Reply #13 on: January 09, 2011, 09:20:12 AM »



Totally agree! I've listened the hell out of that track...that and 'On A Holiday' - FAR more brilliant sounding than the 66/67 tapes.

Surf's Up from BWPS sounds just amazing....especially Brian's vocal in the coda.

So, MANY of the 66/67 SMiLE boots sound TERRIBLE (Holidays anyone?). (this may be a really stupid/obvious question) when/if they release a boxset, will the instrumentals sound as good as the instrumentals on the Pet Sounds Session box?



Do you mean 'Terrible' as in sound quality, or in just overall quality? I can't think of one piece of BWPS that is better than the originals. Not one snippet. I like BWPS, and in fact parts of it are really good. Compared to the original stuff, though, it isn't even close. My opinion, of course.
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sockittome
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« Reply #14 on: January 09, 2011, 12:11:42 PM »



Totally agree! I've listened the hell out of that track...that and 'On A Holiday' - FAR more brilliant sounding than the 66/67 tapes.

Surf's Up from BWPS sounds just amazing....especially Brian's vocal in the coda.

So, MANY of the 66/67 SMiLE boots sound TERRIBLE (Holidays anyone?). (this may be a really stupid/obvious question) when/if they release a boxset, will the instrumentals sound as good as the instrumentals on the Pet Sounds Session box?



Do you mean 'Terrible' as in sound quality, or in just overall quality? I can't think of one piece of BWPS that is better than the originals. Not one snippet. I like BWPS, and in fact parts of it are really good. Compared to the original stuff, though, it isn't even close. My opinion, of course.

My interpretation is that the TERRIBLE reference was to sound quality.  I don't see how anyone could knock the performances on the originals.  I also like BWPS, but it's a different animal in some ways.  It's strongest point, IMO, is the fact that it's complete.
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Don_Zabu
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« Reply #15 on: January 09, 2011, 12:22:41 PM »

-cough-PurpleChickmix-cough-
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rab2591
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« Reply #16 on: January 09, 2011, 12:51:17 PM »



Totally agree! I've listened the hell out of that track...that and 'On A Holiday' - FAR more brilliant sounding than the 66/67 tapes.

Surf's Up from BWPS sounds just amazing....especially Brian's vocal in the coda.

So, MANY of the 66/67 SMiLE boots sound TERRIBLE (Holidays anyone?). (this may be a really stupid/obvious question) when/if they release a boxset, will the instrumentals sound as good as the instrumentals on the Pet Sounds Session box?



Do you mean 'Terrible' as in sound quality, or in just overall quality? I can't think of one piece of BWPS that is better than the originals. Not one snippet. I like BWPS, and in fact parts of it are really good. Compared to the original stuff, though, it isn't even close. My opinion, of course.

My interpretation is that the TERRIBLE reference was to sound quality.  I don't see how anyone could knock the performances on the originals.  I also like BWPS, but it's a different animal in some ways.  It's strongest point, IMO, is the fact that it's complete.

I was referring to the sound quality....not the performance.

-cough-PurpleChickmix-cough-

Most boots I've heard have lacked in quality....'Do You Like Worms' from the 1993 boxset was somewhat lacking in quality too....but then again, compared to the latest stereo and mono remasters, many songs on that boxset don't sound that good (to my ears anyway).
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Bill Tobelman's SMiLE site

The Beach Boys legacy is still being mortared to this day...it has a solid and unbreakable foundation of incredible songs that tower above most bands, yet some bricks are more brittle and ugly than others (even some bricks put down more recently)...thus is the nature of any entity that continues to exist. You are not defined solely by your good achievements in life, you're also defined by those unpleasant moments too. This law of life, thankfully, helps keep us all in check.
A Million Units In Jan!
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« Reply #17 on: January 09, 2011, 01:16:03 PM »

Yeah, there are some versions of tracks that sound just terrible, sound-wise. Almost like it was being played through an AM station that wasn't coming in clearly.
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« Reply #18 on: January 09, 2011, 01:16:13 PM »

I'd guess it pisses Mike off everyday smile never got completed
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According to someone who would know.

Seriously, there was a Beach Boys Love You condom?!  Amazing.
Peter Reum
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« Reply #19 on: January 09, 2011, 02:17:29 PM »

I am certain that Smile would never have been completed with BB involvement. Brian simply needed to do it with new people. He had excellent support from Darian, who balanced past work and present possibilities when it was in process. It is, like Rhapsody in Blue, a tone poem created for live performance. Smile in the 60s was a record.

Smile`s premier in 2004 was an incredibly moving experience. One I could never get from a record. Records are sonic reproductions of a performance. Music is first and foremost a live art. The thrill of making it is for me in live performance. Brian used his 60s work as a starting point for the finished Smile. It is timeless music, at times haunting in its beauty.

Darian helped VDP by using his knowledge of past Smile to help facilitate Smile as Brian and VDP completed it for live work. The beauty of Smile live is imcoparable to any record--60s or from the 04 sessions. The first movement is deeply disturbing and saddening as it reviews the movement of the Europeans across the North American continent to Hawaii, destroying Native American culture. The second movement to me is my favorite, reflecting as it does from life`s beginning to old age and beyond. There is a profund scope of emotions within. Movement 3 mixes humor and pathos as it runs through several vignettes of human consciousness. Good Vibrations follows a closing reprise of Prayer, invoking the idea of Love being the binding element of our spirituality.

I think that comparing Smile 67 to the completed work is unfair to both pieces of work. Records are records, but live performance is irreplaceable. It is how humans have expressed their music throughout time, and always will be. Brian now writes for live performance. That is probably how he will create for the rest of his creative life. His recorded work in the studio from the 60s is a different  type of creative process, and in my opinion, needs to be regarded as such.

« Last Edit: January 09, 2011, 02:30:47 PM by Peter Reum » Logged

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« Reply #20 on: January 09, 2011, 02:52:34 PM »

Well said, Peter...and I might I add that "That Lucky Old Sun" seemed to work better live than on record, too (judging from the live recordings I've heard, and comparing those to the finished album).
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A Million Units In Jan!
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« Reply #21 on: January 09, 2011, 03:06:04 PM »

I think what Peter so eloquently said is what a lot of people feel; that BWPS and the original SMiLE, are almost 2 separate entities. The tracks may be the 'same', however they come from 2 different places.
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adamghost
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« Reply #22 on: January 09, 2011, 03:46:12 PM »

I was stunned, hearing SMiLE finished, that it came across as a totally different piece of work to me.  Strung together it has a different kind of power and you realize, yes, there WAS an overarching theme to the record, not just a bunch of random thoughts of the moment.  That was the biggest revelation to me.

I hadn't thought of the live angle, but I agree that SMiLE as a finished work hit me in a totally different way than the fragments had.
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« Reply #23 on: January 09, 2011, 09:18:42 PM »

 The original material is untouchable.  Nobody will ever beat Brian's 1967 vocal of Surf's Up.  When I listen to BWPS, I honestly miss the vocals from the other Beach Boys.   It's Brian's masterpiece, but their vocals add life to it.
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« Reply #24 on: January 09, 2011, 09:22:57 PM »

I'd guess it pisses Mike off everyday smile never got completed


Mike and I have that in common...
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