Carl & The Passions "So Tough" / Pet Sounds

[OneEar/OneEye]

I am wondering about the decision to pair "So Tough" with Pet Sounds.  Whose decision was it?  And why Pet Sounds?  Why not something else?  Was it a random pairing, or was there some specific reasoning behind it?  We're they attempting to compare the two?  Did they think people would want to purchase Pet Sounds and that this would help sales of "So Tough"? 
Thanks.

[Jason]

I've heard it was either the band or Warners who wanted it that way as the band retained the rights to the 1966-69 LPs. Note that Warners later reissued the 1967-69 LPs as two-fers in 1974.

And if anyone thought Pet Sounds paired with So Tough would help sales of the latter, it's doubtful, as all the reviews for the album basically praised Pet Sounds at the expense of the featured LP.

[Roger Ryan]

Given the success of SURF'S UP the previous year, I'm sure Warners viewed CATP as a relatively weak follow-up in need of an added push. At the same time, those who just wanted to buy PET SOUNDS again would get a new Beach Boys album as a bonus! PET SOUNDS, of course, was reissued on it's own by Warners around the time of the SMILEY SMILE / FRIENDS & WILD HONEY / 20-20 twofers (yep, that's how they were issued).

[Mr. Cohen]

I always liked Carl & the Passions. It was an inspiration to Elton John, which counts for something. I always felt like "Honky Cat" was the spiritual brother of "You Need a Mess of Help". Elton was probably in that funky château snorting cocaine off of a renaissance inspired ornate end table writing "Funky Cat" at the same time Brian was in his Bel Air mansion snorting cocaine off of a rubber ducky as he perfected "You Need a Mess of Help". Too troubled souls at a piano, and unfortunately the charts could handle only one.

[Jason]

The band also brought the rights to Smile with them as well, and it was assumed that it would either be released as a separate LP or as a two-fer with Holland in 1973 - note that Warners had a stipulation in their contract saying that if a Smile master wasn't delivered by January 1, 1973, $50,000 would be deducted from the next album's advance.

[Mike's Beard]

I thought it was a strange pairing in the sense that realistically the 2 lps were done by two nearly completely different sets of people.  PS was predominately BW and the Wrecking Crew  with the other BB's as vocal guests, while ST was the Flame era line up with not much input by Brian.  I mean he's physically present on what?  3-4 songs? Purely a sales ploy which was doomed and must have knocked the groups confidence  somewhat.

[OneEar/OneEye]

So Warners plan was to pair Holland with Smile?   Was perhaps pairing PS with ST a way of getting the public ready for that?   
ST is a great album, some weird flow issues maybe, but beautiful songs.   

[Andrew G. Doe]

The band also brought the rights to Smile with them as well, and it was assumed that it would either be released as a separate LP or as a two-fer with Holland in 1973 - note that Warners had a stipulation in their contract saying that if a Smile master wasn't delivered by January 1, 1973, $50,000 would be deducted from the next album's advance.

May 1st, not January 1st.

And it wasn't... and they did. 

[Jason]

http://www.esquarterly.com/bellagio/unreleased.html

"...nonetheless, when the master wasn't delivered to Reprise by January 1st, 1973, $50,000 was deducted from the band's next advance, as per the contract signed in 1970." - Andrew G. Doe

Update, perhaps?

[Andrew G. Doe]

http://www.esquarterly.com/bellagio/unreleased.html

"...nonetheless, when the master wasn't delivered to Reprise by January 1st, 1973, $50,000 was deducted from the band's next advance, as per the contract signed in 1970." - Andrew G. Doe

Update, perhaps?

Not an update - a correction. 

FWIW, the memo sent by Steve Love to the rest of the band re: this very topic was dated march 8, 1973.

[Mr. Cohen]

Seeing as how this question doesn't deserve it's own topic, but it kind of fits here, I'm going to ask everyone: what's your favorite song off of Pet Sounds? Not favorites, but favorite. I'll have to go with "Caroline No".

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

"That's Not Me" is my fave! My fave Mike vocal, fave lyrics, and it doesn't hurt that actual Beach Boys (Brian included) are playing on the track. Gives it something special in the "feel" catagory.

I LOVE Carl And The Passions!

To me it sounds like the debut album by some kick-ass band who just happened to have Carl as a singer/guitarist, Dennis as a singer/musician and none other than Brian Wilson contributing songs and singing (somewhere on there) and Mike Love/Al Jardine making guest appearances!! I think this is why it stills sounds so fresh! I mean, what's wrong with a really loose shambolic Beach Boys album existing anyway? These guys were touring hard at this time, right? Lots of bands toss albums together while touring. Think of it as The Beach Boys "New Adventures In Hi-Fi" or something!

[OneEar/OneEye]

Seeing as how this question doesn't deserve it's own topic, but it kind of fits here, I'm going to ask everyone: what's your favorite song off of Pet Sounds? Not favorites, but favorite. I'll have to go with "Caroline No".

It's a tough choice, but I'd pick You Still believe In Me.

[OneEar/OneEye]

I LOVE Carl And The Passions!

To me it sounds like the debut album by some kick-ass band who just happened to have Carl as a singer/guitarist, Dennis as a singer/musician and none other than Brian Wilson contributing songs and singing (somewhere on there) and Mike Love/Al Jardine making guest appearances!!

Might this album be the most "Wilson brothers" of all?

[phirnis]

Seeing as how this question doesn't deserve it's own topic, but it kind of fits here, I'm going to ask everyone: what's your favorite song off of Pet Sounds? Not favorites, but favorite. I'll have to go with "Caroline No".

That would have to be "I Know There's an Answer". I love each and every single note on this album, yet this is the song I find myself coming back to most frequently. The overall sound of the backing track is just outstanding, I think the arrangement might be among BW's most successfull ever. Gotta love that mesmerizing bass harmonica sound.

[adamghost]

I gotta ask if Carl wasn't primarily a keyboard player in the CATP/Holland era.....not a statement, just a question.  What did he play guitar on CATP?  I'd say "Marcella" for sure, "Mess" very probably.  Not sure if there is guitar on "All This Is That."

For keyboards, "This Is That" for sure.  "Mess" is a likely candidate for Carl on piano.  I think the SOP for the Ricky-Blondie tracks was for them to cut as a three piece: Ricky on drums and Carl/Blondie on piano/bass.  I don't think it's Carl on piano for "Here She Comes" but it could definitely be him on "Brother."  It wouldn't surprise me if some of the keyboards on "He Come Down" are Carl...the organ countermelody about midway through the song doesn't sound like Brian to me. 

Thoughts?

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Elton was probably in that funky château snorting cocaine off of a renaissance inspired ornate end table writing "Funky Cat" at the same time Brian was in his Bel Air mansion snorting cocaine off of a rubber ducky as he perfected "You Need a Mess of Help".

Epic.

[TheLazenby]

I love "Here She Comes", because it's a fun contender for a 'guess which band this is' game.  You'd have no idea it came from a BB's album.

[Loaf]

I always thought Here She Comes sounds like something The Band would have done at that time.

The drums are mixed a bit too prominent for my taste, but they are good drums.

[Nicko]

I LOVE Carl And The Passions!

To me it sounds like the debut album by some kick-ass band who just happened to have Carl as a singer/guitarist, Dennis as a singer/musician and none other than Brian Wilson contributing songs and singing (somewhere on there) and Mike Love/Al Jardine making guest appearances!!

Might this album be the most "Wilson brothers" of all?

No. There are two Flame songs so it is as much Ricky and Blondie's as it is Dennis's. There are also a couple of TM songs so I would say that credit (or blame) should go to all 7 band members pretty much equally.

[Dr. Tim]

Another reason to own the vinyl original is this two-fer has the best vinyl mastering of Pet Sounds, better than the hastily-pressed Capitol original, made while the master tape was still fairly young.  (And they still had it!)  As we know the post-2000 vinyls all come from digital copies of one sort or another.  There is something to be said for some of these original (or somewhat original in this case) pressings, which (properly cared for) will always sound closest to what the brand-new masters sounded like.   A true vinylphile can tell when a supposedly "audiophile" LP reissue was made from a digital safety, i.e., the recent Rolling Stones vinyl reissues.

[Jason]

The 1972 press of Pet Sounds with CATP is good except for one major hiccup.

Listen to Wouldn't It Be Nice. Mono, mono, mono, until the bridge, then lovely duophonic!

[Mike's Beard]

I LOVE Carl And The Passions!

To me it sounds like the debut album by some kick-ass band who just happened to have Carl as a singer/guitarist, Dennis as a singer/musician and none other than Brian Wilson contributing songs and singing (somewhere on there) and Mike Love/Al Jardine making guest appearances!!

Code:

Might this album be the most "Wilson brothers" of all?

I'm sure I have read on here from AGD no less that Brian was very heavily involved in "He came Down".  That shocked me to read the first time but a couple of listens to it and you can see (or should that read hear?) his fingerprints all over the track.  The complex vocal arrangement screams "BW" and we know even now he sings quite alot on it too!  I imagine the gospel organ and piano was his doing as well.  Great song.  Dodgy lyrics but great song!

I think "So Tough" may just be the most underrated album "the boys" ever made.

[Sheriff John Stone]

I think "So Tough" may just be the most underrated album "the boys" ever made.

Gets my vote.

[OneEar/OneEye]

I think "So Tough" may just be the most underrated album "the boys" ever made.

Gets my vote.

Mine as well.  This one has really grown on me over time.