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Author Topic: Thread for various insignificant questions that don't deserve their own thread!  (Read 1219101 times)
nts and the drum
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« Reply #7075 on: April 09, 2022, 11:41:57 AM »

Say whaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

And Carl is on acoustic guitar on that track right?
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sloopjohnb72
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« Reply #7076 on: April 09, 2022, 04:11:29 PM »

Say whaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

And Carl is on acoustic guitar on that track right?

Nope, but he's on electric. Al Vescovo plays the acoustic, and the banjo.

For the record, Little Bird is completely a Brian Wilson arrangement and production, just like everything else on the album. He also wrote more than half of the song, but didn't take any credit, in order to encourage Dennis to write more. Dennis was watching and learning during the session. Most of the backing vocals were done without him, too.
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All Summer Long
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« Reply #7077 on: April 09, 2022, 04:21:04 PM »

One thing Iíve been curious about is if there ever was a song Dennis wrote that he didnít actually play an instrument on (Itís About Time is the first thing that comes to my mind).
Little Bird and Be Still, for one.

Dennis plays harmonium on Little Bird.
The harmonium was played by Brian, at first on the basic track, and later, as an overdub.

Really? Oh I didnít know that.
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Rebel
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« Reply #7078 on: April 23, 2022, 04:57:07 AM »

Who is singing on the end vocal harmony stack of donít go near the water? Was this Brianís idea and arrangement? I have always loved that ending so much
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Emdeeh
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« Reply #7079 on: April 23, 2022, 06:05:44 AM »

Itís always sounded more like a Bruce arrangement to me.
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sloopjohnb72
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« Reply #7080 on: April 24, 2022, 03:19:56 PM »

The ending harmonies are all the guys, minus Dennis. 5 part harmony sung by 5 Beach Boys.
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Rebel
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« Reply #7081 on: May 04, 2022, 08:22:22 PM »

What are the castanets sounds on all The Beach Boys records? Like San Miguel for example. Can anyone link to some examples that sound like The Beach Boys / Hal used? I have bought some LP castanets and they sound nothing like their records.
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Rebel
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« Reply #7082 on: June 10, 2022, 08:31:22 PM »

What is the muted clicky wood block sound at the beginning of Sloop John B?
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Joshilyn Hoisington
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« Reply #7083 on: July 29, 2022, 11:37:48 AM »

There are different types of castanets that are played in different ways.  Traditional castanets are sort of idiom unto themselves, but as far as practical instruments, there are castanets on sticks, and machine castanets.  You can get the right sound on either of those, but it's a matter of knowing how to play it.

Incidentally, I believe that the clicky wood sound on Sloop IS actually castanets.
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Joshilyn Hoisington
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« Reply #7084 on: July 29, 2022, 11:38:56 AM »

I'll also add that a lot of percussion instruments record a lot sharper sounding than they do acoustically in a room, something about the transients.  Castanets in particular are prone to sounding much thinner and clickier on record than they do in a room.
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Rebel
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« Reply #7085 on: July 29, 2022, 08:51:21 PM »

I'll also add that a lot of percussion instruments record a lot sharper sounding than they do acoustically in a room, something about the transients.  Castanets in particular are prone to sounding much thinner and clickier on record than they do in a room.

Yeah but that the Sloop John B intro sounds vastly different than San Miguel intro. I have some LP Castanets, which are meant to emulate the old sound. They do sound like the San Miguel sound, but not Sloop. That was one reason why I asked if Hal's castanets are over-dubbed / multi-tracked or if he intentional plays them a little off on an over-dub to give them more 'space'... Or if some delay/echo is applied after one tracking to give it a fuller sound. I think Sloop's intro uses something totally different than castanets. Doesn't sound close to that sound. I'm guessing a muted temple block.


Another question - does anyone know why 'Things We Did Last Summer' was left unreleased for so long? I think it's a great sounding record, albeit a little different than other tracks at the time. Perhaps it didn't fit? Has there ever been a definitive reasoning?
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Joshilyn Hoisington
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« Reply #7086 on: July 30, 2022, 10:58:20 AM »

Are your castanets machine castanets or hand-held-on-a-stick??  There's these:



Or these:



My belief is that, for stuff like "Then I kissed her" or "san miguel," the percussionist in question would use the machine castanets to tick out the same rhythm with both hands, so it almost sounds double tracked.  They probably got a little bit closer miking, as well.  The castanets on Sloop John could have been either type of the above, and are just tapped as single strokes, a little more distantly miked.  I'm 99% they are castanets -- it actually does sound like it, if you don't believe me wait till I do my Sloop John B video, and Brian had a little bit of an unconventional use of castanets thing going Sloop and That's Not Me.  Definitely not a temple block in any state.  Even muted, they still have a more defined pitch and fuller body than the Sloop sound.
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« Reply #7087 on: July 30, 2022, 08:28:23 PM »

Are your castanets machine castanets or hand-held-on-a-stick??  There's these:

My belief is that, for stuff like "Then I kissed her" or "san miguel," the percussionist in question would use the machine castanets to tick out the same rhythm with both hands, so it almost sounds double tracked.  They probably got a little bit closer miking, as well.  The castanets on Sloop John could have been either type of the above, and are just tapped as single strokes, a little more distantly miked.  I'm 99% they are castanets -- it actually does sound like it, if you don't believe me wait till I do my Sloop John B video, and Brian had a little bit of an unconventional use of castanets thing going Sloop and That's Not Me.  Definitely not a temple block in any state.  Even muted, they still have a more defined pitch and fuller body than the Sloop sound.

Joshilyn, thank you for the great reply. I love your videos and I devour each one numerous times. You are a real treasure to this community. As a musician myself, I especially appreciate your videos and feedback. Are you saying that the 'clip-clop' sound in 'That's Not Me' is indeed a type of castanet? I am not denying this claim, but I am certainly intrigued. It sounds unlike any type of castanet. You do know Brian Wilson was asked this question directly, right? I would imagine Brian is well aware of castanets, but he did not say it was castanets. Something I think he would be familiar with - and something I think he would remember if Hal was playing something as simple and identifiable as castanets. But it's also Brian, so...

What do you think in regards to the castanets being over dubbed? For something like San Miguel - do you think it's simply one take of Hal and then effects are applied? Or do you think it's multiple takes and him playing it slightly off to give it a fuller sound?

Another reason I doubted Sloop was castanets is because of the Fendertones version on Youtube. A dude uses a single temple block held and that sounds much closer to the intro than castanets would. mic-ing them at different spots may yield different frequencies and tonality peaks that I admittedly have not explored in my own recordings as I typically close-mic castanets and woodblocks. Check out the Fendertones version if you haven't.

Also, this is slightly off-topic Joshilyn, but have you heard the fantastic 1964 album 'The Marketts - Out of Limits'? Great drumming by Hal. (and of course numerous fellow Wrecking Crew stalwarts). Some songs feature some castanets mixed way up in some songs, like 'Hyper-Space'. This is what brought me down the rabbit hole of: 'is it just Hal doing one take with some effects applied, is it multi over-dubs played slightly off, or is it multi takes and some effects applied'?

To answer your question: The castanets I have are the 'LP castanet machine' mounted to my drums. They can be played with a stick or with your hands. Both are the exact same note/frequency.
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wjcrerar
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« Reply #7088 on: July 31, 2022, 06:50:57 AM »

Are your castanets machine castanets or hand-held-on-a-stick??  There's these:

My belief is that, for stuff like "Then I kissed her" or "san miguel," the percussionist in question would use the machine castanets to tick out the same rhythm with both hands, so it almost sounds double tracked.  They probably got a little bit closer miking, as well.  The castanets on Sloop John could have been either type of the above, and are just tapped as single strokes, a little more distantly miked.  I'm 99% they are castanets -- it actually does sound like it, if you don't believe me wait till I do my Sloop John B video, and Brian had a little bit of an unconventional use of castanets thing going Sloop and That's Not Me.  Definitely not a temple block in any state.  Even muted, they still have a more defined pitch and fuller body than the Sloop sound.

Joshilyn, thank you for the great reply. I love your videos and I devour each one numerous times. You are a real treasure to this community. As a musician myself, I especially appreciate your videos and feedback. Are you saying that the 'clip-clop' sound in 'That's Not Me' is indeed a type of castanet? I am not denying this claim, but I am certainly intrigued. It sounds unlike any type of castanet. You do know Brian Wilson was asked this question directly, right? I would imagine Brian is well aware of castanets, but he did not say it was castanets. Something I think he would be familiar with - and something I think he would remember if Hal was playing something as simple and identifiable as castanets. But it's also Brian, so...

What do you think in regards to the castanets being over dubbed? For something like San Miguel - do you think it's simply one take of Hal and then effects are applied? Or do you think it's multiple takes and him playing it slightly off to give it a fuller sound?

Another reason I doubted Sloop was castanets is because of the Fendertones version on Youtube. A dude uses a single temple block held and that sounds much closer to the intro than castanets would. mic-ing them at different spots may yield different frequencies and tonality peaks that I admittedly have not explored in my own recordings as I typically close-mic castanets and woodblocks. Check out the Fendertones version if you haven't.

Also, this is slightly off-topic Joshilyn, but have you heard the fantastic 1964 album 'The Marketts - Out of Limits'? Great drumming by Hal. (and of course numerous fellow Wrecking Crew stalwarts). Some songs feature some castanets mixed way up in some songs, like 'Hyper-Space'. This is what brought me down the rabbit hole of: 'is it just Hal doing one take with some effects applied, is it multi over-dubs played slightly off, or is it multi takes and some effects applied'?

To answer your question: The castanets I have are the 'LP castanet machine' mounted to my drums. They can be played with a stick or with your hands. Both are the exact same note/frequency.

We're pretty sure the clackedy percussion on That's Not Me is castanets through a Leslie speaker, sort of taking a note from the Pet Sounds bongos. It's evident from some talking on the track that it's Brian and one other Beach Boy (probably Carl or Dennis), despite Brian saying it was Hal one time.

Personally, that Fendertones cover got me behind the case that it isn't a wood/temple block - that's a much more resonant sound than what's on Sloop. It's not identical, more snappy, but there's a similarly thin sounding castanet on The Surfer Moon.

The San Miguel sound basically owes to lots and lots of castanets. Hal played them on two overdub tracks, and then to thicken the sound even more (and add the intro) both Dennis and Hal stood there playing some while the song was mixed to stereo.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2022, 06:53:47 AM by wjcrerar » Logged
Joshilyn Hoisington
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« Reply #7089 on: July 31, 2022, 09:07:57 AM »

Personally, that Fendertones cover got me behind the case that it isn't a wood/temple block - that's a much more resonant sound than what's on Sloop.

Yeah, I similarly feel like Fendertones version is, like, exhibit A that it wasn't a more resonant block of wood.  There is no body to the original Sloop sound, and when you think about it, a single castanet is essentially a form of a woodblock, just with no resonance since it's a small, solid piece of wood, which I think is what gives it the sound of wood that you're hearing. 

Skepticism is welcome, but I think I can make a pretty good case for it with some convincing audio examples. 
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Pet Sounder
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« Reply #7090 on: August 01, 2022, 09:55:06 AM »

Does anyone know why We're Together Again went unreleased for so many years?
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Pretty Funky
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« Reply #7091 on: October 02, 2022, 10:10:32 PM »


So I may be behind the times, but was the fact Mike can officiate weddings, and did so for John Stamos make the message boards?

(7:09)
https://youtu.be/2dBNs9YPrHg
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Bedroom Tapes
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« Reply #7092 on: November 13, 2022, 03:22:53 PM »

An early Christmas gift from the Beach Boys for those unaware.  It's called the Christmas Instrumentals EP and includes Little Saint Nick, Merry Christmas Baby and Frosty the Snowman.  What a treat!
https://youtu.be/L1rnM_Ai05I
https://youtu.be/LvQoxnslWOg
https://youtu.be/lPsbsOdBOqM
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