Steve Hoffman to remaster "Pet Sounds" again

[AKA]

http://stevehoffman.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=164308

The Beach Boys-Pet Sounds.
And of course it was the worst kept secret that Pet Sounds will be issued in the original Brian Wilson/Chuck Britz monaural mix from 1966. For those of you who missed out on the DCC version here will be your chance to grab one. No need to pay the big bucks anymore on eBay for this title.

[brother john]

Jesus, what's the feck!ng point? I've already got about a thousand different version of Pet Sounds AND I'M NOT BUYING ANY MORE.

[phirnis]

Right.

What about releasing that Surf's Up DVD-A instead?

[Bicyclerider]

The point is that if you don't have the DCC mono Pet sounds - the best CD version of it to date - now you won't have to pay $75 to $125 for it.  Just get the new Audio Fidelity release. 

[donald]

I have an original pressing of the original Pet Sounds vinyl lp on Capitol Records that is in excellent condition.

I have 2 good turntables connected to a nice amplifier and some excellent old book shelf speakers.


Or I can listen to the box set and a couple of other releases.  That is quite a bit of variety.


I just wish I could get some improved mixes from the Beatles!!!

[Exapno Mapcase]

Wow, I can see the fanboys on the Hoffman board drizzling over the graphic representaions of the sound waves already...

[sockittome]

What's the point indeed!  I've been happy with my Linett stereo mix since I first bought it nearly 10 years ago ( I somehow missed out on the boxed set).   And I may go to audiophile hell for saying so, but I am not impressed with every single mastering that Mr. Hoffman has put out.  That's just me, and I don't mean any disrespect to SH.

Pass...

[Steve Mayo]

( I somehow missed out on the boxed set).   

i for one like that box set. kinda fond of it, esp the credits in long book that comes with the set..... 

[sockittome]

You gotta excuse me for going on somewhat of a rant, but I'm a little tired of reading over and over that the DCC edition of Pet Sounds is the ultimate version.  No it's not!  It's not in stereo!  And if mono is your preference, then what is wrong with Brian's original mastering?

Arg!

[c-man]

( I somehow missed out on the boxed set).   

i for one like that box set. kinda fond of it, esp the credits in long book that comes with the set..... 

As long as you realize there's a few mistakes in it...for instance, it's Dennis playing drums on "That's Not Me" (not Hal), and there's no proof that it's Glen Campbell on 12-string & Carol on bass on that cut, other than Carol's very suspect memory.  But yeah, it was the first full accounting of musicians for those sessions that hit the public domain, and it was very welcome.  Nice packaging design, too.

[Steve Mayo]

( I somehow missed out on the boxed set).   

i for one like that box set. kinda fond of it, esp the credits in long book that comes with the set..... 

As long as you realize there's a few mistakes in it...for instance, it's Dennis playing drums on "That's Not Me" (not Hal), and there's no proof that it's Glen Campbell on 12-string & Carol on bass on that cut, other than Carol's very suspect memory.  But yeah, it was the first full accounting of musicians for those sessions that hit the public domain, and it was very welcome.  Nice packaging design, too.

was kinda meaning the "non musicians" section...... 

[king of anglia]

You gotta excuse me for going on somewhat of a rant, but I'm a little tired of reading over and over that the DCC edition of Pet Sounds is the ultimate version.  No it's not!  It's not in stereo!  And if mono is your preference, then what is wrong with Brian's original mastering?

Arg!

First of all IT IS the ultimate CD version. The mastering is the best of all the mono CDversions.
Secondly, it is the ultimate CD version because it is in its' original 1966 mono mix. The stereo version is not how the album was meant to be heard.
Finally, Brian Wilson never actually mastered any of his albums, I think you'll find no music artist masters their own music.

[Bicyclerider]

The cool thing about the DCC (and this upcoming release) is that it is as close to the master tape prepared by Chuck and Brian as you can get - NO EQ was applied, this is how the Pet Sounds master would sound if you were in the control room listening to the final mix on the master with Brian.  And were using the same studio speakers.  And the master tape is now gone, so there won't be another mastering of the tape.

[Dr. Tim]

I don't see what's wrong with the HDCD mono version in the box set or the stereo-mono single CD version.

Plus, isn't the problem that the original mono master tape has gone missing (though did I hear that an east-coast based "safety" remains?), so that the most recent 40th anniversary mono set had to be done off the last best known digital copy they had?   Again, no knock on Mr. Hoffman, but why would this be any better?

[?]

You gotta excuse me for going on somewhat of a rant, but I'm a little tired of reading over and over that the DCC edition of Pet Sounds is the ultimate version.  No it's not!  It's not in stereo!  And if mono is your preference, then what is wrong with Brian's original mastering?

Arg!

First of all IT IS the ultimate CD version. The mastering is the best of all the mono CDversions.
Secondly, it is the ultimate CD version because it is in its' original 1966 mono mix. The stereo version is not how the album was meant to be heard.
Finally, Brian Wilson never actually mastered any of his albums, I think you'll find no music artist masters their own music.

+1  The DCC is the ultimate vinyl release too.

Honestly, if you're not hearing that, I strongly suspect it's because your system isn't good enough.  I have an awful old Technics direct drive turntable and the DCC sounds dark and muddy on it while the CATP version sounds fine.  But what happens when I play them on my nice VPI?  The DCC comes alive and is far and away the better sounding record.  I hate to play that card, but it is the truth.   

[Custom Machine]

  And the master tape is now gone, so there won't be another mastering of the tape.

What happened to the Pet Sounds master tape?

[Custom Machine]

You gotta excuse me for going on somewhat of a rant, but I'm a little tired of reading over and over that the DCC edition of Pet Sounds is the ultimate version.  No it's not!  It's not in stereo!  And if mono is your preference, then what is wrong with Brian's original mastering?

Arg!

First of all IT IS the ultimate CD version. The mastering is the best of all the mono CDversions.
Secondly, it is the ultimate CD version because it is in its' original 1966 mono mix. The stereo version is not how the album was meant to be heard.
Finally, Brian Wilson never actually mastered any of his albums, I think you'll find no music artist masters their own music.

+1  The DCC is the ultimate vinyl release too.

Honestly, if you're not hearing that, I strongly suspect it's because your system isn't good enough.  I have an awful old Technics direct drive turntable and the DCC sounds dark and muddy on it while the CATP version sounds fine.  But what happens when I play them on my nice VPI?  The DCC comes alive and is far and away the better sounding record.  I hate to play that card, but it is the truth.   

Are you using the exact same cartridge in both turntables?  In my experience, the cartridge used can make a very significantly larger difference in playback sound than the turntable.

[Bicyclerider]

  And the master tape is now gone, so there won't be another mastering of the tape.

What happened to the Pet Sounds master tape?

No one knows.  Here's a brief history of the Pet Sounds master tape:

Brian and Chuck assemble the master tape April 1966. Brian sends the master to Capitol's LA office. There a copy is made and sent to New York for use in East Coast vinyl pressings. The Brian LA master is used for West Coast vinyl pressings. When the rights to Pet Sounds and the post PS albums goes to Reprise, the LA master goes to Reprise where it is used for the So Tough/Pet Sounds 2fer (Mark Linett believes a copy was sent to Reprise, but Steve Hoffman has said the original master was at Reprise).  According to Steve, at Reprise Wouldn't It Be Nice suffers tape damage making it unusable - WIBN on the Reprise albums may be from the LA tape, and the damage occurred subsequent or concurrent with mastering the LP, or it's possible that Reprise damaged it before it could transfer the track and they had to use the NY tape as a source. When rights revert back to Capitol, the tape returns to Capitol, and WIBN is replaced by a copy of the New York tape WIBN (an aside – perhaps this WIBN IS the New York tape version, and a copy was substituted into the NY tape master?)

The LA master is used when Mark Linett makes the digital master in 1987 for the first Capitol CD release, except for WIBN. The 1990 release (as usual in Beach Boys world, a long delay) used No Noise heavily, re-EQ'd the master and in order to keep hiss down spliced in many of the intros from new mono mix downs of the multitracks.

The DCC release of PS used the same LA master in 1991 (“they lent it to us for about two hours, we made one digital and one analogue transfer and the tape was messenger-ed back to Capitol”), but used no noise reduction, and according to Steve Hoffman was a “flat” transfer with heavy bass intact. Steve: “I decided to do a flat transfer of Pet Sounds; disconnecting all of the mastering equipment, including the console. It would be the only flat mastering of the mono mix in recorded history. (Every other version of that darn album be it LP, domestic and foreign, 45, Juke Box, EP, Cassette, 8-Track, Open Reel, Compact Disc, Hi-Rez, stereo remix, mono remaster, WHATEVER, has been tweaked in some way or another). Really, on a great system, the original "fairy dust" mono mix doesn't need tweaking at all. It needs leaving alone. It is a little bass heavy, but so be it.”   Steve used “an ATR-100 electronic assembly modified with one Telefunken 12AX7 with a Studer A-80 transport.”

For the DCC the NY tape was used for WIBN (a new transfer) and the train & dogs bit.  Apparently the train and dogs ending was damaged or in some other way not as suitable as the NY tape version.  No splicing in from the multitracks. At the time a 30 ips flat transfer analogue copy of the reels was made and that was used to cut the DCC LP that came out a few years later. The DCC CD was released in 1993.

The master tape goes missing from the Capitol vault around 1992.

The 1993 Good Vibrations box set used the NY tape, without any noise reduction according to Mark Linett, in a 20 bit transfer.    Some intros mixed from the multitracks are spliced in.

Cut to the remaster for the Pet Sounds Sessions box set in Nov 1997 (done in Jan-Feb 1996 but release delayed by Mr. Love). Again, the NY tape, and possibly with some intros still spliced in although more hiss is evident on several of the intros (a good thing).  No noise reduction per Mark.  An ATR-100 was used and tube electronics. This was a 24 bit HDCD master. This was the master used for the subsequent stereo/mono combined releases. The first mono/stereo version used the same 24 bit HDCD master but according to Mark it was re-equalised (by Andrew Sandoval), thereby ruining the HDCD encoding, even though the disc would still trigger HDCD players.  This version was pulled at the request of Mark Linett and Brian & Melinda, and the 2001 version, with proper HDCD encoding was issued. This version replaced Brian on the bridge of the stereo WIBN with a flown in mock stereo version of the mono Mike Love sung bridge, done largely (according to Mark) because radio stations had been using the stereo version from the boxset with Brian in the bridge (I can only imagine how Mike Love reacted to that!).

For the DVD Pet Sounds, Mark went back to the mono NY tape and remastered it in 96K/24 bit.

For the 40th anniversary release, Mark used a 16 bit digital copy of the master tape made in 1987 in preparation for the first Pet Sounds CD.  I think this may be the worst sounding version of the mono Pet Sounds, whether it be the 1987 digital technology, the state of the digital tape, or the mastering of this version.  I much prefer the P S box set NY tape version, and, of course, the DCC.

Most audiophiles believe that the Carl and the Passions/Pet Sounds 2fer is the best sounding mono vinyl representation of the album - the original Capitol pressings were noisy and poorly EQ'd.  And the DCC vinyl, which I haven't heard.

[sockittome]

I'm confused with the logic here!   As far as I am concerned, the original Capitol vinyl release is how Pet Sounds was meant to be heard.  Period.  Any difference in mastering or changing of the format is messing with history.  So if you're gonna do that, then you might as well go full bore and have it in stereo.  I have no problem with keeping with the times. 

[?]

Are you using the exact same cartridge in both turntables?  In my experience, the cartridge used can make a very significantly larger difference in playback sound than the turntable.

No.  The cartridge in the VPI would be wasted on the Technics.  Lousy direct drive table, lousy arm, etc.  The different parts of a system have to be compatible and have to have synergy.  It all makes a difference, as does your preamp, amp, interconnects and even the size of the room.

[Custom Machine]

I'm confused with the logic here!   As far as I am concerned, the original Capitol vinyl release is how Pet Sounds was meant to be heard.  Period.  Any difference in mastering or changing of the format is messing with history.  So if you're gonna do that, then you might as well go full bore and have it in stereo.  I have no problem with keeping with the times. 

Concerning the Capitol Pet Sounds vinyl release being how the recording was meant to be heard, it's important to remember that Brian and Chuck Britz had no control over the vinyl mastering EQ decisions made by the Capitol engineers.  And, if you have ever heard vinyl pressings of the same record done at different pressing plants, you will discover that the EQ and mastering volume level applied by the engineers can sometimes differ from pressing plant to pressing plant, not to mention that fact the different pressing plants didn't always receive the same generational copy of a master tape.

And, back in 1966, while some copies of Pet Sounds were sold in mono, most were sold in Duophonic, Capitol's version of fake stereo.  In 1966, mono albums were quickly fading in popularity, and were basically gone from the market within two years.  (For those of you not around in 1966, most albums were released in both mono and stereo, with the stereo version commanding up to a dollar price premium, but with stereo significantly outselling mono.  45 rpm singles, on the other hand, were almost always only pressed in mono at that time.)

My original 1966 vinyl copy of Pet Sounds was pressed in Duophonic, whereby Capitol engineers mucked with the EQ and phase of the original mono recording to simulate stereo.  To quote the album's back cover:  "This Capitol Duophonic Record is deigned for stereo phonographs.  Duophonic is an exclusive electronic development designed to enrich irreplaceable monophonic high-fidelity recordings that have proven their lasting popularity.  It brings these classic performances a brilliant new two channel sound that takes full advantage of the reproduction characteristics of today's finest stereo phonographs."

Duophonic definitely added a sense of space and broader soundstage to mono recordings, and in some cases it could be argued that the listening experience was somewhat enhanced because of that.  But, the altered phasing created a sonic experience very different from the original mono master.  The Duophonic process also altered the EQ, with one channel carrying mostly the midrange and treble sounds, and the other carrying mostly the bass and very high treble sounds.  This does give a pseudo-stereo effect, but unless the listener is carefully centered between the two speakers, the resulting sound will be tilted toward the EQ of the speaker the listener is closest to.  (The worst  electronically simulated stereo was done by RCA's engineers, with tons of artificial reverb.) 

I personally didn't get the opportunity to hear Pet Sounds in true mono until 6 years after its release, when it appeared on the CATPST/PS Brother/Reprise vinyl two-fer, with the statement on the album, "This recording is pressed in monophonic sound, the way Brian cut it."  (However, I did have 7 of Pet Sound's 13 tracks on mono 45 rpm singles when CATPST/PS two-fer was released.)

But, to my ears anyway, much of Pet Sounds suffers by far from the worst recorded sound quality of all The Beach Boys albums, even worse than Wild Honey.  (Please note I'm talking about the sound quality of the much of the recording, not the quality of the recorded material!)  Overall, the album sounds very tinny to me, with way too much emphasis in the 2 to 4 KHz range (upper midrange and lower treble).  The modern day stereo remix has made significant improvements in this regard, but I've always been curious why much of Pet Sounds has what I consider to be a very irritating EQ - one found on no other Beach Boys recording.

[Custom Machine]

  And the master tape is now gone, so there won't be another mastering of the tape.

What happened to the Pet Sounds master tape?

No one knows.  Here's a brief history of the Pet Sounds master tape:

Brian and Chuck assemble the master tape April 1966. Brian sends the master to Capitol's LA office. There a copy is made and sent to New York for use in East Coast vinyl pressings. The Brian LA master is used for West Coast vinyl pressings. When the rights to Pet Sounds and the post PS albums goes to Reprise, the LA master goes to Reprise where it is used for the So Tough/Pet Sounds 2fer (Mark Linett believes a copy was sent to Reprise, but Steve Hoffman has said the original master was at Reprise).  According to Steve, at Reprise Wouldn't It Be Nice suffers tape damage making it unusable - WIBN on the Reprise albums may be from the LA tape, and the damage occurred subsequent or concurrent with mastering the LP, or it's possible that Reprise damaged it before it could transfer the track and they had to use the NY tape as a source. When rights revert back to Capitol, the tape returns to Capitol, and WIBN is replaced by a copy of the New York tape WIBN (an aside – perhaps this WIBN IS the New York tape version, and a copy was substituted into the NY tape master?)

The LA master is used when Mark Linett makes the digital master in 1987 for the first Capitol CD release, except for WIBN. The 1990 release (as usual in Beach Boys world, a long delay) used No Noise heavily, re-EQ'd the master and in order to keep hiss down spliced in many of the intros from new mono mix downs of the multitracks.

The DCC release of PS used the same LA master in 1991 (“they lent it to us for about two hours, we made one digital and one analogue transfer and the tape was messenger-ed back to Capitol”), but used no noise reduction, and according to Steve Hoffman was a “flat” transfer with heavy bass intact. Steve: “I decided to do a flat transfer of Pet Sounds; disconnecting all of the mastering equipment, including the console. It would be the only flat mastering of the mono mix in recorded history. (Every other version of that darn album be it LP, domestic and foreign, 45, Juke Box, EP, Cassette, 8-Track, Open Reel, Compact Disc, Hi-Rez, stereo remix, mono remaster, WHATEVER, has been tweaked in some way or another). Really, on a great system, the original "fairy dust" mono mix doesn't need tweaking at all. It needs leaving alone. It is a little bass heavy, but so be it.”   Steve used “an ATR-100 electronic assembly modified with one Telefunken 12AX7 with a Studer A-80 transport.”

For the DCC the NY tape was used for WIBN (a new transfer) and the train & dogs bit.  Apparently the train and dogs ending was damaged or in some other way not as suitable as the NY tape version.  No splicing in from the multitracks. At the time a 30 ips flat transfer analogue copy of the reels was made and that was used to cut the DCC LP that came out a few years later. The DCC CD was released in 1993.

The master tape goes missing from the Capitol vault around 1992.

The 1993 Good Vibrations box set used the NY tape, without any noise reduction according to Mark Linett, in a 20 bit transfer.    Some intros mixed from the multitracks are spliced in.

Cut to the remaster for the Pet Sounds Sessions box set in Nov 1997 (done in Jan-Feb 1996 but release delayed by Mr. Love). Again, the NY tape, and possibly with some intros still spliced in although more hiss is evident on several of the intros (a good thing).  No noise reduction per Mark.  An ATR-100 was used and tube electronics. This was a 24 bit HDCD master. This was the master used for the subsequent stereo/mono combined releases. The first mono/stereo version used the same 24 bit HDCD master but according to Mark it was re-equalised (by Andrew Sandoval), thereby ruining the HDCD encoding, even though the disc would still trigger HDCD players.  This version was pulled at the request of Mark Linett and Brian & Melinda, and the 2001 version, with proper HDCD encoding was issued. This version replaced Brian on the bridge of the stereo WIBN with a flown in mock stereo version of the mono Mike Love sung bridge, done largely (according to Mark) because radio stations had been using the stereo version from the boxset with Brian in the bridge (I can only imagine how Mike Love reacted to that!).

For the DVD Pet Sounds, Mark went back to the mono NY tape and remastered it in 96K/24 bit.

For the 40th anniversary release, Mark used a 16 bit digital copy of the master tape made in 1987 in preparation for the first Pet Sounds CD.  I think this may be the worst sounding version of the mono Pet Sounds, whether it be the 1987 digital technology, the state of the digital tape, or the mastering of this version.  I much prefer the P S box set NY tape version, and, of course, the DCC.

Most audiophiles believe that the Carl and the Passions/Pet Sounds 2fer is the best sounding mono vinyl representation of the album - the original Capitol pressings were noisy and poorly EQ'd.  And the DCC vinyl, which I haven't heard.

Bicyclerider - Wow!  Thanks for the very interesting and detailed info!

[chris.metcalfe]

The first mono/stereo version used the same 24 bit HDCD master but according to Mark it was re-equalised (by Andrew Sandoval), thereby ruining the HDCD encoding, even though the disc would still trigger HDCD players.  This version was pulled at the request of Mark Linett and Brian & Melinda,

1. Is that the Ron McMaster version from 1999 which was pulled?
2. Where do you THINK the master tape might be?
3. It is really interesting, but it wasn't necessary for the guy above to reproduce it in full!

[Andrew G. Doe]

Concerning the Capitol Pet Sounds vinyl release being how the recording was meant to be heard, it's important to remember that Brian and Chuck Britz had no control over the vinyl mastering EQ decisions made by the Capitol engineers. 

According to Fred Vail, he was with Brian when the album was mastered at Capitol, and Brian gave instructions to the mastering engineer on the fly.

[Bicyclerider]

1. Is that the Ron McMaster version from 1999 which was pulled?
2. Where do you THINK the master tape might be?
3. It is really interesting, but it wasn't necessary for the guy above to reproduce it in full!

Yes, that is the 1999 version which was pulled.

I have no idea where the master tape is - it disappeared in 1992 at a time when archival releases and remasterings of old recordings on CD were in full swing, so I'd have to think it was stored in a secure place.  I also think in 1992 it would be unlikely to have been mislabelled or put in the wrong tape box.  That would lead me to think that a Capitol insider made off with it - but that's purely speculation.