Postcard From California

[Pretty Funky]

Hmmm...'Best Behavior'.  Sounds like a perfect album title.

[phirnis]

Good ideas Luther!  Time to bring back my "A New Beach Boys Album? Call it 'Solo Sampler'" thread.

"They can't do it as a unit but, as individual parts making the whole, an interesting new album is possible.
...

It probably is indeed. That said, I can't help but feel that a project like that might end up as some kind of Songs From Here And Back Vol. 2.

[Sheriff John Stone]

Fact is Brian isn't up for it, so he won't give Mike his songs at an early stage. And that is entirely his decision.

But is Brian not up for it? You can't tell by his interviews because he doesn't tell the truth all the time. I'm too lazy to look up the thread, but, at the reunion on the Capitol Records rooftop, didn't Brian tell Mike that he (Brian) had some songs that he wanted Mike to hear? But, again, maybe he had none.

As far as it being ENTIRELY Brian's decision...With all due respect, carl r, aren't we being a little naive there. I don't think Brian makes many, if any, decisions that are entirely his.

Somebody previously posted that since Brian resigned with Capitol Records, they might get involved in something Beach Boys related. Now, that wouldn't surprise me. I'm not sure they pursued Brian entirely for his solo output; there might've been some ulterior motive(s). I mean, it's not too far-reaching for some executive at Capitol Records, who is a fan, to look down the road a bit. I'd be surprised if they DIDN'T.

[Sheriff John Stone]

Good ideas Luther!  Time to bring back my "A New Beach Boys Album? Call it 'Solo Sampler'" thread.

"They can't do it as a unit but, as individual parts making the whole, an interesting new album is possible.
...

It probably is indeed. That said, I can't help but feel that a project like that might end up as some kind of Songs From Here And Back Vol. 2.

There is a way to avoid this. It would be similar to the recording of MIU and Keepin' The Summer Alive, though, Now don't cringe, hear me out.

Maybe the group could retreat to Al's barn/studio and work on the tracks TOGETHER, like a real band. Brian and Mike always worked fast, so it wouldn't have to be a marathon. Those kind of situations (including the Holland debacle) didn't always work well in the past, but there were a lot of substance abuse issues during that time.

[Alex]

Good ideas Luther!  Time to bring back my "A New Beach Boys Album? Call it 'Solo Sampler'" thread.

"They can't do it as a unit but, as individual parts making the whole, an interesting new album is possible.
...

It probably is indeed. That said, I can't help but feel that a project like that might end up as some kind of Songs From Here And Back Vol. 2.

There is a way to avoid this. It would be similar to the recording of MIU and Keepin' The Summer Alive, though, Now don't cringe, hear me out.

Maybe the group could retreat to Al's barn/studio and work on the tracks TOGETHER, like a real band. Brian and Mike always worked fast, so it wouldn't have to be a marathon. Those kind of situations (including the Holland debacle) didn't always work well in the past, but there were a lot of substance abuse issues during that time.

Unfortunately, the substance abuse was replaced by big egos and addictions to lawsuits.

It seems that Brian has worked better outside the group at least since the 80s.

[Dancing Bear]

It seems that Brian has worked better outside the group at least since the 80s.

It seems that Brian has worked outside the group since KTSA period.

Ascrodin, if Brian's wife and manager decided that a Beach Boys reunion is the next step in Brian's career (aka the last ace up their sleeves), would you be still against it?

[phirnis]

Good ideas Luther!  Time to bring back my "A New Beach Boys Album? Call it 'Solo Sampler'" thread.

"They can't do it as a unit but, as individual parts making the whole, an interesting new album is possible.
...

It probably is indeed. That said, I can't help but feel that a project like that might end up as some kind of Songs From Here And Back Vol. 2.

There is a way to avoid this. It would be similar to the recording of MIU and Keepin' The Summer Alive, though, Now don't cringe, hear me out.

Maybe the group could retreat to Al's barn/studio and work on the tracks TOGETHER, like a real band. Brian and Mike always worked fast, so it wouldn't have to be a marathon. Those kind of situations (including the Holland debacle) didn't always work well in the past, but there were a lot of substance abuse issues during that time.

How much of a role did substance abuse play during the Holland sessions? I reckon Brian used to be pretty fried during this time, but other than that? Never heard too much about what Dennis was up to around '72. Was he already into drinking heavily around then? I've heard he wasn't even around for most of the sessions. Just wish there was a book or even a documentary film about that whole project... (But then, I'd even buy a book about KTSA in a heartbeat. Come to think of it, now THAT could be quite illuminating.)

[Alex]

It seems that Brian has worked better outside the group at least since the 80s.

It seems that Brian has worked outside the group since KTSA period.

What about BB85?

ascrodin, if Brian's wife and manager decided that a Beach Boys reunion is the next step in Brian's career (aka the last ace up their sleeves), would you be still against it?

If it means Brian sitting in a back corner of the stage at a piano and being trotted out like a circus bear, then yes.

[Dancing Bear]

It seems that Brian has worked better outside the group at least since the 80s.

It seems that Brian has worked outside the group since KTSA period.

What about BB85?

Damn, I always try to forget about the 1985 album. 

Yah, what about it? "Crack at Your Love", "I'm So Lonely", "It's Just a Matter of Time" and "Male Ego". Good question. Why are those songs below Brian's standards? (I believe California Calling is mainly Alan)

ascrodin, if Brian's wife and manager decided that a Beach Boys reunion is the next step in Brian's career (aka the last ace up their sleeves), would you be still against it?

If it means Brian sitting in a back corner of the stage at a piano and being trotted out like a circus bear, then yes.

Hmm, what are the odds of that happening in 2009? What were the odds that if Brian remarried, he'd suggest Melinda a threesome with Tandyn Almer, give Daria cocaine and have an affair with his sister in law?

People change. Not only Brian.

[Alex]

It seems that Brian has worked better outside the group at least since the 80s.

It seems that Brian has worked outside the group since KTSA period.

What about BB85?

Damn, I always try to forget about the 1985 album. 

Yah, what about it? "Crack at Your Love", "I'm So Lonely", "It's Just a Matter of Time" and "Male Ego". Good question. Why are those songs below Brian's standards? (I believe California Calling is mainly Alan)

ascrodin, if Brian's wife and manager decided that a Beach Boys reunion is the next step in Brian's career (aka the last ace up their sleeves), would you be still against it?

If it means Brian sitting in a back corner of the stage at a piano and being trotted out like a circus bear, then yes.

Hmm, what are the odds of that happening in 2009? What were the odds that if Brian remarried, he'd suggest Melinda a threesome with Tandyn Almer, give Daria cocaine and have an affair with his sister in law?

People change. Not only Brian.

These days it would probably be a 3-way with David Leaf.

[carl r]

From what I have read about the aborted 95 sessions, Brian was giving as good as he got from Mike.

However, the fact that Brian appears to be pushed into defensive mode around Mike would affect him, not necessarily resulting in bad outcomes -  he might, however, simply think "I can't be bothered."

Families can be hard work ... and I think Brian finds Mike hard work, and possibly has trouble forgetting the many things that have gone on.

Whether you think Brian now makes his decisions about writing partners autonomously depends on how you view his health. We don't know, but there's no indication that anyone pushed Brian into his car to work with VDP, or Scott, or Andy Paley. Perhaps the Joe Thomas link was prompted by outside factors. It certainly seems Brian needs both people around him who are patient and supportive (much as I rate them, do Mike, Bruce and Al fall automatically into that category?) and the ability to work with new collaborators. And with the history of it all, it's unlikely, in my opinion, that Melinda would push Brian beyond his support structure. I'd rather have Brian with a more-than-half-decent solo career than struggle for months with former colleagues, none of whom have been prolific, on a project which would possibly become a real pain in the arse.

[smile-holland]

How much of a role did substance abuse play during the Holland sessions? I reckon Brian used to be pretty fried during this time, but other than that? Never heard too much about what Dennis was up to around '72. Was he already into drinking heavily around then? I've heard he wasn't even around for most of the sessions. Just wish there was a book or even a documentary film about that whole project... (But then, I'd even buy a book about KTSA in a heartbeat. Come to think of it, now THAT could be quite illuminating.)

I know that there were plans for a Dutch documentary on the 25th anniversary of Holland. Several people involved recording overhere were asked to participate. But the whole project was shelved when it became clear that virtually no Beach Boy involved at the time was interested to cooperate on such a documentary. And when you think of it, 1997/98 maybe wasn't the best moment to get in contact with the group; Carl's illness and passing, Al thrown out of the band, etc (although I do remember that Al might've been the only one at the time that gave it a thought). I think no particular interest from Blondie/Ricky either.
But too bad anyway, as it would've been very interesting.

I've seen several interviews in which BB-members recollect their memories on being in The Netherlands. Pretty superficial perhaps, but always positive. I particularly remember a part of a Dutch "Story of the Beach Boys"-docu from the early 80ies in which Carl recollects his fond memories on living here. And a couple of years ago there was a short docu on the group with memories of some Dutch fans (a few local celebrities and a then-neighbour of Carl in Hilversum). Last year (or was it 2006?) with Brian et al performing in Amsterdam, during the concert Billy Hinsche - the special guest that replaced Al Jardine - also shared his memories on his stay in Holland with the audience.

So - in all - enough people who could fill up easily a very interesting documentary. Again, too bad it never happened.

[Dancing Bear]

I'd rather have Brian with a more-than-half-decent solo career than struggle for months (...) on a project which would possibly become a real pain in the arse.

Do you think that 'Brian Wilson Presents Smile' was a bad idea, then?

[carl r]

I'd rather have Brian with a more-than-half-decent solo career than struggle for months (...) on a project which would possibly become a real pain in the arse.

Do you think that 'Brian Wilson Presents Smile' was a bad idea, then?

No, a great idea... and Smile was originally his idea, with a trusted collaborator, and part of his asserting his right to create on his own terms. Just the release of Smile itself made the reunion less likely I reckon, as it is usually thought of as his project... and he got a big confidence boost from finishing. No internal squabbles this time. I think if we want good new music out of ex-Beach Boys members, solo Brian releases remain the best bet by a long way, with no disrespect to anyone. If I'm wrong, and there's a reunion with a great new album and candid songs with no rehashing, I'll be delighted, and very surprised.

[Dancing Bear]

I'd rather have Brian with a more-than-half-decent solo career than struggle for months (...) on a project which would possibly become a real pain in the arse.

Do you think that 'Brian Wilson Presents Smile' was a bad idea, then?

No, a great idea...

I don't know, BWPS seems to be more important for David Leaf than Brian. Ok, so a reunion would also be more important for the fans who want it to happen.... But Brian will never be healed or anything like that. At least Sheriff John Stone will be happy, damn it. 

I think if we want good new music out of ex-Beach Boys members, solo Brian releases remain the best bet by a long way, with no disrespect to anyone.

No arguments about that. But the best songs in "Unleash the Love" and "Postcards" are better than the worst in TLOS, so there's always a balance that could be made.

[Aegir]

I think if the rest of the Beach Boys agree to be Brian's dutiful servants and everyone has their hearts in the right place, we'll have at least an OK album. Even something like Gettin' in Over My Head with Mike, Al, Bruce and Dave on it would be that much better.

[Jon Stebbins]

Carl R wrote "I think if we want good new music out of ex-Beach Boys members, solo Brian releases remain the best bet by a long way."
No. There's unreleased Dennis Wilson music left in the can that's better than anything coming out of Brian's camp. And don't say that isn't new...because Brian's "new music" often isn't new either.

[Alex]

Carl R wrote "I think if we want good new music out of ex-Beach Boys members, solo Brian releases remain the best bet by a long way."
No. There's unreleased Dennis Wilson music left in the can that's better than anything coming out of Brian's camp. And don't say that isn't new...because Brian's "new music" often isn't new either.

Goin' Home, SMiLE, half of GIOMH, 4 songs from Imagination, for starters.

[carl r]

I absolutely see the point people are making. It depends what you like, but Brian's solo career...

Love and Mercy, Melt Away, Theres So Many, This Song Wants To Sleep, Rio Grande, Must be a Miracle, My Mary Anne, I'm Broke, Lay Down Burden, Getting In Over My Head, Live Let Live, Oxygen to the Brain, Midnight's Another Day ...

theres a lot of tunes there which I think are great. He can and has produced the goods as a solo artist. Once again, I hear what people are saying... there are no consistently brilliant albums, just a splattering of brilliance to a greater or lesser extent.  IMO it beats most of Dennis' work (what I've heard so far, POB mainly) - and that's saying quite a lot.

[Alex]

IMO it beats most of Dennis' work (what I've heard so far, POB mainly) - and that's saying quite a lot.

Close, but no cigar. With the exception of Midnight's Another Day, Brian hasn't been able to capture raw emotion with his voice like Denny could since the SMiLE days. I do like most of Brian's solo stuff (BW88 is an enjoyable listen), but it just doesn't hit me with the same kind of wallop that Dennis' stuff does.

[Dancing Bear]

I think if the rest of the Beach Boys agree to be Brian's dutiful servants (...)

Solo Brian is surrounded by folks who are paid to be his dutiful servants, and yet... Pretending that Brian is the same hands-on guy from 1965 (or 1976) doesn't make it true. It doesn't work, as Leaf'n'Melinda have painfully learned by trial and error.

[Howie Edelson]

Obviously it's a case of apples and oranges, but in MY OPINION to think that Brian's post 1980s work is on par with the best (or even not-quite best) of Dennis Wilson's is just ill-informed.

That said, I rather have Mike Love write new lyrics to 'Sunflower'-era outtakes than anyone else.

Everybody sing along...

"My folks have a friend who knows a little old lady..."

[Dancing Bear]

Obviously it's a case of apples and oranges, but in MY OPINION to think that Brian's post 1980s work is on par with the best (or even not-quite best) of Dennis Wilson's is just ill-informed.

It's even unfair to Brian. Just "River Song" destroys any song Brian wrote in the last 30 years.

A better deal could be:

- compare their works from the same year, Brian'77 vs Dennis'77
- compare Brian's first decade as a songwriter ('61-'71) with Dennis' ('68-'78)

[♩♬🐸 Billy C ♯♫♩🐇]

Carl R wrote "I think if we want good new music out of ex-Beach Boys members, solo Brian releases remain the best bet by a long way."
No. There's unreleased Dennis Wilson music left in the can that's better than anything coming out of Brian's camp. And don't say that isn't new...because Brian's "new music" often isn't new either.

Goin' Home, SMiLE, half of GIOMH, 4 songs from Imagination, for starters.

More like ALL of GIOMH save A Friend Like you.  HCWSBD is an Imagination Outtake. Soul Searchin, GIOMH, and SMITC are Paley tracks. Fairy Tale (formerly Save The Day aka The Power of Love), You Touched Me (aka So Long), Rainbow Eyes, The Waltz (aka Let's Stick Together) &DLHKSAA are  from Sweet Insanity (and was actually written a few years earlier), and City Blues dates from the hamburger sessions.

[SurfRiderHawaii]

Carl R wrote "I think if we want good new music out of ex-Beach Boys members, solo Brian releases remain the best bet by a long way."
No. There's unreleased Dennis Wilson music left in the can that's better than anything coming out of Brian's camp. And don't say that isn't new...because Brian's "new music" often isn't new either.

Jon - What are the latest sales figures on POB/Bambu?  Is there any movement/talk from BRI/Capitol for a Beach Boys "Dennis" collection yet?  Alan Boyd posted about the 'thought' some months back.