Postcard From California

[Sheriff John Stone]

I really think it will eventually come to a negotiation between Mike and Melinda. There are certain conditions that Mike will insist on and the same for Melinda/Brian. Mike will probably insist on being the executive producer,  Brian's sole lyricist/collaborator, and will have a hand in choosing the co-producer. And there will be a co-producer. I would assume Melinda will take the position that "look at how well Brian did in his solo career without Mike Love, The Beach Boys, and the baggage that goes with it", and will make sure there is as much of Brian's current "team", including band members, in the picture. Then the ball will be back in Mike's court. There will have to be compromises. Mike knows it will be his last chance. Brian probably doesn't care nearly as much. It could get verrrrrry interesting.   

[the captain]

Not to be a pessimist, but it's most likely that it would get verrry uninteresting. So much negotiation, so much business, I just can't imagine anything remotely artistically noteworthy coming out of it.

[Sheriff John Stone]

Not to be a pessimist, but it's most likely that it would get verrry uninteresting. So much negotiation, so much business, I just can't imagine anything remotely artistically noteworthy coming out of it.

With the possible exception of one song, "Male Ego", I like everything that Brian Wilson and Mike Love ever did. Now, some more than others, but everything.

[Aegir]

Including Male Ego, I like everything that Brian and Mike ever did, together or separately. I'm one of those "die-hard fans".

[carl r]

I think I'd have to go back a long way to find a Love / Wilson composition that didn't stink. Many maybe would disagree with me, but I'd say Let Us Go On This Way was the last time that the collaboration didn't totally disgrace itself - and this despite the bit about Extra Sensory Perception that Mike apparently tacked on.  If that makes me a lightweight fan, apologies. I worship three-quarters of the BBs music and abhor the rest.

This isn't saying that all is currently good with Brian - as I really don't know about that - but I'm with people saying that there is no evidence for the Wilson/Love writing partnership forming a strong basis for a reunion and new material. If we're asking whether alternatives exist, then Al and a whole bunch of Brian's former and future writing partners may know...

[John]

Is Goin' On a Wilson/Love? I'd guess that's the last good one, before that it's Let Us Go On This Way, and before that, It's OK. It's probably the Sixties before that though. All I Wanna Do, probably, which was recorded in '69, I guess.

[the captain]

If a person likes everything, so be it. If not, so be it. As long as you really like what you like (as opposed to making yourself like it out of some kind of sick devotion), knock yourself out. Me, I'm fine not being "die-hard," defined by Merriam-Webster as "strongly or fanatically determined or devoted ... ; especially : strongly resisting change." I think plenty of Wilson/Love is great, but plenty is mediocre and some is dogshit. I don't feel the need to like the dogshit.

[Andrew G. Doe]

r. I would assume Melinda will take the position that "look at how well Brian did in his solo career without Mike Love, The Beach Boys, and the baggage that goes with it"

And the scary thing is, she believes this to be true, even in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary. Check out these US chart placings (and approximate sales, where possible):

1988 Brian Wilson - 54 (450,000)
1995 IJWMFTT - didn't chart
1998 Imagination - 88
2002 Pet Sounds Live - didn't chart
2004 GIOMH - 100 (100,000)
2004 BWPS - 13 (400,000)
2005 WIRWFC - 200
2008 TLOS - 21 (50,000)

And the biggest seller of those is either the 1988 album, or BWPS, neither of which has gone gold yet (officially). BWPS is of course a special case and should really be discounted, thus in a 20 year solo career, Brian has cracked the US Top 40 album charts with precisely one LP of new material. If he'd not had the BB back catalog & royalties to fund his solo outings, he'd be in deep financial trouble long before now. Yes, Brian has immense critical respect and engenders more unalloyed affection than any other figure of his era, but he is no more than a cult figure in terms of sales, and his live shows very rarely sell out.

[Pretty Funky]

AGD replied

Stable home-life. 15/16/17 dogs ?  Plus, always remember that from 1964-78, his home life was stable: it was Brian that was the disruptive element.

Point taken. I was thinking more of the weird coming and goings at all hours in the Wilson home of the 60s. Somehow I can't see Melinda letting Brian and Iggy Pop sing 'Shortnin Bread' at 3am.

[Dancing Bear]

Yeah, their last good one was written 28 years ago. How many ever since? One?  

I don't know if Brian's MUSIC will sound better or worse with Mike writing the lyrics. Does having the Lovester side by his side at a piano affect Brian so much? Bollocks. Unless we start giving Mike much more credit for the songs written between 1961 and 1980. I wonder if the reception to "Forever She'll be my surfer girl" would be way worse if it featured a Wilson/Love credit.

Anyway, it doesn't take a lot of effort to achieve the heights of Bennet's lyrics. I just googled Midnight's Another Day's lyrics, and they stink. I get it, Brian's been through a lot and now he's back, yeah, I know that since 1976. I'd rather have some lyrics about a senior citizen scoring with a 17 years old in a drive in and getting a nasty disease in the process. Some entertainment for a change. Bring back Doctor Love, I say. He's got the hooks.

[Sheriff John Stone]

r. I would assume Melinda will take the position that "look at how well Brian did in his solo career without Mike Love, The Beach Boys, and the baggage that goes with it"

And the scary thing is, she believes this to be true, even in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary. Check out these US chart placings (and approximate sales, where possible):

1988 Brian Wilson - 54 (450,000)
1995 IJWMFTT - didn't chart
1998 Imagination - 88
2002 Pet Sounds Live - didn't chart
2004 GIOMH - 100 (100,000)
2004 BWPS - 13 (400,000)
2005 WIRWFC - 200
2008 TLOS - 21 (50,000)

And the biggest seller of those is either the 1988 album, or BWPS, neither of which has gone gold yet (officially). BWPS is of course a special case and should really be discounted, thus in a 20 year solo career, Brian has cracked the US Top 40 album charts with precisely one LP of new material. If he'd not had the BB back catalog & royalties to fund his solo outings, he'd be in deep financial trouble long before now. Yes, Brian has immense critical respect and engenders more unalloyed affection than any other figure of his era, but he is no more than a cult figure in terms of sales, and his live shows very rarely sell out.

You're preaching to the choir, sometimes a choir of just a few, however.

Luther, addressing your point about being a "diehard"....I am a diehard, but I like the B. Wilson/M. Love compositions because I genuinely like the songs, not just because I blindly (or deafly) decide that I'm going to like anything they do. That applies to the post-1975 stuff, which obviously isn't as strong as the early days. Yes, Mike can write a few eye-rolling lyrics, but I do think they possess(ed) a certain chemistry, and, like I said, I enjoy it all. I really don't find any of it revolting.

[Aegir]

I don't force myself to like anything. In fact, I find it amusing that the songs I love are disliked my so many!

[the captain]

Re those last two posts, that's cool. I don't mean to insinuate that any particular person doesn't like what he likes, or shouldn't like what he likes.

[SurfRiderHawaii]

Every living member of the pre-1971 of the Beach Boys is open for a live reunion -- except for Brian. Mike told me that he wanted a two show reunion to be taped at the Hollywood Bowl and Wembley for PBS and released on DVD -- with special guests (e.g. McCartney and Clapton) -- to be done for the band's 50th.

Talk of any new BB album would be greatly premature. A live concert and DVD would be a great start.  See how all the egos meshed.  After all,  Brian and Al together didn't last very long.

[the captain]

^ Very true. I think to expect anything is premature, but if something were to happen, what you described is the most likely result: a couple of shows with a resulting live album/DVD. I can't imagine them actually spending the time it would take to make a truly new album of new material. A few songs, maybe. A hodge-podge of semi-solo stuff, maybe (possibly with group vocals added in to give it a more coherent feel). But a truly new project? Seems far off ... maybe unreachable.

[John]

Yeah, their last good one was written 28 years ago. How many ever since? One?  

I don't know if Brian's MUSIC will sound better or worse with Mike writing the lyrics. Does having the Lovester side by his side at a piano affect Brian so much? Bollocks. Unless we start giving Mike much more credit for the songs written between 1961 and 1980. I wonder if the reception to "Forever She'll be my surfer girl" would be way worse if it featured a Wilson/Love credit.

Anyway, it doesn't take a lot of effort to achieve the heights of Bennet's lyrics. I just googled Midnight's Another Day's lyrics, and they stink. I get it, Brian's been through a lot and now he's back, yeah, I know that since 1976. I'd rather have some lyrics about a senior citizen scoring with a 17 years old in a drive in and getting a nasty disease in the process. Some entertainment for a change. Bring back Doctor Love, I say. He's got the hooks.

Ha!

I've said it before, and I'll said it again - the one lyricist who would totally fit in with Brian's weird Americana vibe is Robert Hunter, who used to write with Jerry Garcia. Hunter's not doing anything that I can see at the moment, that's who he needs to get in contact with. He's like a slightly more straightforward version of Van Dyke; in the main you can understand his lyrics. Mike could add some hooks to the song after that still. Hunter's the same age, went through a lot of the same stuff with an infighting band, etc.

[Howie Edelson]

I think the best/most we could hope for would be an approach similar to 'Songs From Here And Back' capping off a 'Hawthorne"-type set (with a decent commercial cover, and an intelligent promo campaign.)

Totally doable.

That said; a live CD/DVD would make 19 times the amount a new studio project ever would. Studio tracks can also be included on live LPs.

I wonder what changes will occur at BRI if Dennis scores a Grammy (or two) and TLOS gets shut out? I'm curious, what are the numbers thus far on the Singles Box Set???

[Pretty Funky]

Funny thing is, in this day a new album would be the easier to do IMO. No two members need to be in the same city let alone the same studio! Compare to the preperation required of a concert or tour.

Of course the result would be hardly a 'group' album. I read somewhere that MIU was phoned in in part. True?

[Sheriff John Stone]

After all,  Brian and Al together didn't last very long.

Good point. That is the most recent history we have. And with The Beach Boys, I think it's safe to say, "The more things change, the more they stay the same".

Obviously, with any kind of (contractual) reunion, all the details have to be spelled out precisely, with all the t's crossed and i's dotted. And, even if they are, there's no guarantee things will go as planned; just read any Beach Boys book! Maybe if they treat it with the same attitude they had with Stars & Stripes. That appeared to be an honestly good reunion, if you can judge by the video, which you can't always do....

[the captain]

Funny thing is, in this day a new album would be the easier to do IMO. No two members need to be in the same city let alone the same studio! Compare to the preperation required of a concert or tour.

Of course the result would be hardly a 'group' album. I read somewhere that MIU was phoned in in part. True?

It would largely depend on how they go about it. In my post above I noted that they could do solo tracks with group vocals. They could do that, either all together in a short time frame (they always did prefer to do group backgrounds as an actual group, from what I understand) or even apart. But if they intended to write the new material, it would require a little more actual cooperation. But certainly BBs albums (like everyone else's, for the most part) hadn't consisted of a bunch of guys going into the same room at the same time and making music since the mid-60s, with exceptions here and there.

[Pretty Funky]

The other interesting possibility could be some new pairings. While comment both good and bad has been made about Al's writting ability, put him together with Dave for a few hours and anythings possible. How about Bruce and Dave? Also another Brian/ VDP tune  with band vocals isn't unrealistic is it?

One point not discussed. The roof-top reunion two years ago. Brian had a deal with Capitol for TLOS. It seems someone at the label has a soft spot for the band. They could say to Brian TLOS was ok but now they want a new Beach Boys album or nothing. Certain parties in Brians 'management' seem to like the spotlight Brian receives and it would be hard to say no I think.

Beach Boys Return To Capitol: New Album And SMiLE Boxset Soon has a ring to it that some folks on that roof-top in 06 may find hard to turn down.

[SurfRiderHawaii]

^ Very true. I think to expect anything is premature, but if something were to happen, what you described is the most likely result: a couple of shows with a resulting live album/DVD. I can't imagine them actually spending the time it would take to make a truly new album of new material. A few songs, maybe. A hodge-podge of semi-solo stuff, maybe (possibly with group vocals added in to give it a more coherent feel). But a truly new project? Seems far off ... maybe unreachable.

Good ideas Luther!  Time to bring back my "A New Beach Boys Album? Call it 'Solo Sampler'" thread.

"They can't do it as a unit but, as individual parts making the whole, an interesting new album is possible.

Mike has an album in the can, Bruce is putting one together (anyone have info on this - some has been on BB Britian), Al's "Postcard from California" is being recorded, and Brian has "The Lucky Old Sun" coming down next year.  Not sure where David is at on new music but I imagine he has something in the works.

Take two or three of the best tracks from each, plus maybe three from the vault (do I hear Dennis Wilson?) and bam, you have a very interesting new album!  Not only would it be a 'new' Beach Boys album but also an excellent sampler/promo for the solo albums."

http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,4721.0.html

I would still like to hear Mike sing 'Desert Drive"!

[Carrie Marks]

Not sure where David is at on new music but I imagine he has something in the works.

Yes he does.  Al  has already contributed vocals to one of his tracks and I know he'd like Mike to sing on another track, so maybe that will happen since collaboration seems to be in the air! 

[carl r]

Fact is Brian isn't up for it, so he won't give Mike his songs at an early stage. And that is entirely his decision. Brian is cool with Scott writing the lyrics. What we think doesn't matter (and yeah I would have preferred VDP for most of Lucky Old Sun, but there you go. I can't see that Mike would have improved it greatly.)

Having said this, if Mike and Brian did suddenly start writing upfront songs based on their real lives, the results would be great, like an Ian Dury album unhinged by sunstroke.

Yeah, their last good one was written 28 years ago. How many ever since? One? 

I don't know if Brian's MUSIC will sound better or worse with Mike writing the lyrics. Does having the Lovester side by his side at a piano affect Brian so much? Bollocks. Unless we start giving Mike much more credit for the songs written between 1961 and 1980. I wonder if the reception to "Forever She'll be my surfer girl" would be way worse if it featured a Wilson/Love credit.

Anyway, it doesn't take a lot of effort to achieve the heights of Bennet's lyrics. I just googled Midnight's Another Day's lyrics, and they stink. I get it, Brian's been through a lot and now he's back, yeah, I know that since 1976. I'd rather have some lyrics about a senior citizen scoring with a 17 years old in a drive in and getting a nasty disease in the process. Some entertainment for a change. Bring back Doctor Love, I say. He's got the hooks.

[SurfRiderHawaii]

Not sure where David is at on new music but I imagine he has something in the works.

Yes he does.  Al  has already contributed vocals to one of his tracks and I know he'd like Mike to sing on another track, so maybe that will happen since collaboration seems to be in the air! 

Very cool Carrie!  David's involvement in any new Beach Boys project(s) is essential!!!!

And maybe with David there, everybody would be on their best behavior.