Who's Idea was it to put Sloop John B on PS--Brian's or Capitol's?

[I. Spaceman]

You trivia-pwned him.

[Reverend Joshua Sloane]

This guy isn't a troll.

[Jason]

You trivia-pwned him.

With an easy question, no less.

[Aegir]

Brian could have left caroline no off of Pet Sounds and it wouldn't of bothered me one bit.

 

My original CDR that I burned of Pet Sounds that supposedly had all the songs on one soundfile doesn't even have Caroline No! Took me almost two years to notice!

[Jeff Mason]

(must..resist...comment...can't...resist....aaagghhh....)

Why download the album when you can buy the bloody thing?  Download unreleased stuff, but when you pirate, you ruin it for everyone

[Aegir]

I'm sorry, I have no excuse. I admit it; I'm a song-stealer.

I buy lots of albums, but the ones I think I can easily find through other means, I do.

[Dan Lega]

I just want to chime in and say this has turned into a very good thread! I love the fact that the SJB bashers are, for once, in the minority. It fits it's spot on PS to a T!!! Fact!!!

Alright, let me try to get it the other way, then!   

I love "Sloop John B", but it doesn't work at all on the Pet Sounds album for me.  It feels totally out of place and one of these days I'm going to finally burn me a copy that doesn't have "Sloop John B" and has the speed corrected version of "Caroline, No", then I'll have my perfect version of "Pet Sounds".   

Love and merci,   Dan Lega

[SMiLEY]

Dan, it's your option to do so. But -- it'll be pretty darn short AND you'll lose the upward key-changes that are built into the structure of the album.

(Now that the key thing has been made apparent, I wonder if THAT is the actual reason for speeding up Caroline no?)

I still don't understand why it feels so out of place for some -- the travelogue-themed tunes began two cuts earlier, and the sentiments in GOK certainly seem to be 'arrived at'. By that I mean the character/narrator of PS had to get out and have some experiences, some very bad, before getting to that place where he truly appreciates what she means to him in real terms rather the fantasyland notions that started everything in Wouldn't It Be Nice. This in turn makes the bittersweet ending, where SHE has grown, changed, and in fact moved on all the more poignant, IMO.

[donald]

I love SJB.  It sounds great on Pet Sounds.  It fits with that youthful angst and searching theme of the album in a whimsical sort of way.



It was the TITLE TRACK that was thrown in and doesn't particularly fit one way or the other.

I've been watching the James bond festival on cable and I think that Run James Run not being used in a Bond movie was a great loss to our nation and to 60's pop culture

[37!ws]

Okay, I just want to put in my three cents on "Sloop John B."

I really doubt that Al was THE reason that Brian even recorded it. I really think it was probably on his radar screen for a long time, but that maybe it was Jardine's suggestion that basically made Brian decide "Okay, if one of my bandmates thinks we should, then let's do it." Brian is known for wanting to do things but not actually doing them without support from other band members. [Cases in point: Smile, and a couple of on-the-road decisions in recent years that he was afraid to make without his other band members assuring him his ideas were okay.]

Dig...."Sloop John B" was a popular tune anyway. If you read Carlin, you'll see that BRIAN HIMSELF sang it before with friends. Also, didn't they record it during the Recorded "Live" at a...Beach Boys' Party! sessions? Which of course were September 1965; SJB was, what?, November?

Let's check something else out, too...

On Surfin' USA, the Beach Boys covered "Let's Go Trippin'" and "Misirlou," both of which were popularized by Dick Dale, and both are on Surfer's Choice, which can be argued to be Dick Dale's most popular album by far. (BTW - those of you who haven't heard the album, it's a different version of "Misirlou" from what we're all familiar with -- it's got the same double-picking twangy guitar and everything, but it also has a string section; and it's called "Misirlou Twist" on the album.)

And you know that "Fanny Mae" riff that David Leaf mentioned in the Today!/Summer Days... liner notes in the description for the original "Help Me, Ronda"? Well, "Fanny Mae" is also covered on Surfer's Choice, complete with the harmonica riffs. That means there are THREE things the Beach Boys did that were on Surfer's Choice.

Guess what song is ALSO on Surfer's Choice, including vocals.

[Rocker]

@37: Very interesting idea. Though I don't agree with all your thoughts, I think this is quite realistc. But I don't know if Brian really listened to Dick Dale very much. It was Carl who was into that I think.

[Aegir]

Also, didn't they record it during the Recorded "Live" at a...Beach Boys' Party! sessions? Which of course were September 1965; SJB was, what?, November?

Did they? Is this on any bootlegs?

[Andrew G. Doe]

Also, didn't they record it during the Recorded "Live" at a...Beach Boys' Party! sessions? Which of course were September 1965; SJB was, what?, November?

I've never heard of them doing "Sloop" during the Party ! sessions, and it's not on the SOT boot. Anyone ?

[Carrie Marks]

@37: Very interesting idea. Though I don't agree with all your thoughts, I think this is quite realistc. But I don't know if Brian really listened to Dick Dale very much. It was Carl who was into that I think.

Sloop John B was part of the Beach Boys live repertoire from the start...a staple in their '62-'63 shows and that's because David and Carl wanted to add it to the set after hearing Dick Dale's version.  Maybe Al or Capitol suggested Brian record it...but the band had adopted that song long before Pet Sounds.

[Rocker]

@37: Very interesting idea. Though I don't agree with all your thoughts, I think this is quite realistc. But I don't know if Brian really listened to Dick Dale very much. It was Carl who was into that I think.

Sloop John B was part of the Beach Boys live repertoire from the start...a staple in their '62-'63 shows and that's because David and Carl wanted to add it to the set after hearing Dick Dale's version.  Maybe Al or Capitol suggested Brian record it...but the band had adopted that song long before Pet Sounds.

Now that's good to know. Thank you !

[richardsnow]

Mabe I should start a new thread for this one , but I'll mention it here as it was mentioned on a post or previously on this thread.
Re; Caroline No speed changing.

I don't like the slow version, Brian's vocal sounds.....well.. slowed down on it.
I've heard how Murray suggested that Brian Speed it up etc. But it sounds to me that Murray may have made this suggestion after the track was cut and PRIOR to the vocal being cut.
 What I'm suggesting is that brian cut the track , murray tells him to speed it up, brian does so and mixes it to one track of another multitrack at the new speed. He then overdubs the vocal.
I'm only suggesting this because to me the vocal on the slow version sounds like brian slowed down.
Of course I'm perfectly willing to be told I'm wrong 
Mark L will know. if the vocal multitrack sounds like the album when played at 15ips then I'm right.  If not......I guess I'm dumb.

[37!ws]

richard --

I have a similar theory about "It's Over Now." On most of the bootlegs, the song plays a bit faster than it does on disc 3 of Good Vibrations. Mark Linett [sp??] swore up and down that the song was mastered at the correct speed. However:
- Carl's voice sounds more natural and less...drunk...on the faster version.
- Marilyn actually sounds like a woman on the faster version. In fact, I didn't even KNOW that was a woman until I heard the bootleg!

On the other hand, as it is on disc 3, it's in the same key as Brian's demo.

My thinking is that Brian recorded the song in F#, but when Carl and Marilyn overdubbed their vocals, the playback was in G, so their voices are lowered when the tape is played back at original speed.