The Definitive Vocal Credits Thread...

[adamghost]

Adam, can you please lend that harmony-defining ear of yours to the accapellas and confirm who's on 'em? Thanks!

A Young Man Is Gone
The Lord's Prayer
Auld Lang Syne
And Your Dream Comes True
Mama Says

I'll give it a shot, though I'm wishing I had better headphones here at work now that I'm under pressure!

And Your Dream Comes True
four parts to my ears
Mike on bottom
Carl's next, although he might cross over someone around :43
Brian's on top on the right channel, but what's weird is, particularly in left channel of the stereo version there's someone the next part down who's a bit pitchy who also sounds like Brian. 

I went back the recording snippet from Hawthorne where Bruce is calling the takes and there's clearly four people there and someone other than Brian is singing that part, but even in that context, it still sounds like Brian to me.  If not Brian, it sounds most like Bruce, but it's obviously not him, since he's directing the session from the booth.  The person who asks "is there going to be four sections?" sounds like Al, but not conclusively so.  Having isolated the part, it really sounds only a little like Al at the "in" and not like Dennis at all.

I went to c-man's exhaustive exhumation of the Summer Days sessions at http://www.beachboysarchives.com/ to see what he said.  According to him, it's Al.  And I agree the guy speaking in the studio tape sounds like Al.  So it just goes to show you how much those guys sound alike, even in an a cappella mode, and particularly how much Al could sound like Brian in the falsetto range, because I would have said it was Brian.  (or did Al "miss the boat" for this session and it's really an unidentified fourth person?  Hmm....)


Mama Said
Mike on bottom
Al next
Carl next (he's always quiet in the mix, damn him)
Brian on top

I only hear four parts...I'd have to go to a piano to be absolutely sure.

Auld Lang Syne
starts out with Mike and Brian as the dominant voices, although I think Al is doubling Mike and Carl (and Dennis?) doubling Brian in the initial two part section.

main part:
After listening quite a bit, I would say it's all five of them.  You can hear Dennis clearly at :29 singing "Syne my dear" (he also seems to count in the track on the alternate version without the voice over) and once again Al sounding very like Brian in the second highest part, although it sounds like they're all swapping registers throughout...early on it sounds like Dennis is the second lowest and later it sounds like Carl.  I wouldn't swear to it being five parts without a piano in front of me but I'm pretty sure it is.  What a great arrangement.

What's interesting, on further listening, is until the obvious edit at :27 I only hear four voices distinctly.  It seems to go to five after the edit.  Was Dennis absent for the first section?

I don't seem to have the other two on my IPod...what albums are they on?  I can look for 'em when I get home.

[pixletwin]

And Your Dreams Come True

Brian
Carl
Dennis
Mike

To my ears.

[adamghost]

OK, I have to admit this started to really bug me -- I can totally hear how "dream comes" would make one think of Dennis -- and I went back and listened some more.  But hearing the part over and over I am starting to hear Al's timbre sticking out a bit. If you listen to the Hawthorne session excerpt and pick out that particular part, you can hear a nasal tonality (particularly on "that") that Dennis just didn't use.

There's also a bit of a smoking gun on the session tape in that at :03 you can hear Carl say:  "Two...Al, it's just two..."  So Al is definitely there.

Now there is one codicil to this and that is that the Hawthorne excerpt only has them rehearsing the first two lines of the song and it's clear that they were doing it in "four sections."  So it is conceivable that somewhere mid-recording Al had to leave for some reason and Dennis took over his part, which would explain the pitchiness at the end (or the difference in the timbre if by chance Dennis doubled Al's part).

My personal feeling is that it's Al all the way, albeit not sounding very like himself, but on the basis of those final two lines I can see why others would be convinced Dennis is there.  It seems pretty certain that it's at least partly Al based on the session tapes.

[adamghost]

All right...I realize I'm getting totally obsessive over this...but...

What if Bruce doubled Al's part?  That would explain the softer tonality that didn't sound like any one of the BBs individually, the coming apart of the vocal at the end, and, if Bruce and Al doubled in real time, why that part is so heavily weighted in the left channel.  Bruce couldn't have been part of the original stack because he was in the control room -- but not for the overdub.  He could have easily come out and joined the band for the double-tracking and either traded places with Al OR sang Al's part with him if Brian felt that the part needed reinforcing on the double-track (it's nowhere near as prominent in the Hawthorne single track mix as it is in the final version, which indicates that the left channel track was the overdub...in fact, you can barely hear Brian in the left channel). 

There's slight evidence that this might have happened at :51, because it sounds like that vocal line splits, with one note being held and another moving upward in counterpoint.  Or it could be that Brian added Bruce to the harmony at this point to achieve this splitting effect (making it five parts at that one section, necessitating an extra singer).

OK, I know, I'm nuts.  But that would explain the effect I feel like I'm hearing.  Anyway, there's a lot of voices and a lot of reverb, so who knows.

One more bit of evidence that it's not Dennis would be that Dennis is not heard on the session tape, and he's not exactly a shrinking violet in the studio...although I don't have the whole SOT series to confirm this.

p.s.  A further thought -- If there are two voices on Al's part in the left channel, perhaps to reinforce a weak harmony part in the overall mix and to add that little extra part at :51, is it because Brian actually overdubbed himself separately, doubling (or actually tripling) Al's part?  With only two tracks used for vocals (which is what I assume), it would not have been a problem.  That would explain why it sounds more like Brian to me than anyone else.  OK I'll let it go now...step away from the IPod...

[John 2]

I don't seem to have the other two on my IPod...what albums are they on?  I can look for 'em when I get home.

Wow, thanks!

A Young Man is Gone is on Little Deuce Coupe and the Lord's Prayer is on Hawthorne or (I think) the 1990 Christmas album CD.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Do we know what the recording date for "Noble Surfer" was and if it's the same day as "Surfin' USA"?  Or perhaps that they were done on 3-track and the others on 4?

"SUSA" was recorded January 5th at Western, "NS" recorded February 11th at Capitol.

[adamghost]

Well that shoots a big hole in that theory.  Were any other vocal tracks cut on the same day as either of those two, Andrew?  (I suppose I should just go to the Bellagio site and look for myself)

[adamghost]

OK, I looked...judging by Andrew's site, "Noble Surfer" was cut on the same day as three instrumentals, and if it's in order, it was the last thing cut.   That could well mean that Mike wasn't even at that session and if so, it's conceivable that at the end of the day they went ahead and did the backup vocals without him.  The only problem with this idea is it would mean that they did the backup vocals in advance of the lead vocal...which is a little unusual, but there's no reason they couldn't have done it that way, particularly a band as harmony-centric as the BBs.  There's no aural indication that they were cut at the same time (e.g. Mike's lead is on another track and there's no bleed-through of the other guys singing that I could hear).

The next day they did "Finder's Keepers," "Surf Jam," and "Stoked."  I don't have the IPod handy to check but isn't Mike Love audible in some way (either spoken voice and/or sax) on these latter two instrumental tracks?  I guess it doesn't matter either way but if you can hear Mike on those two tracks and not the first three instrumentals, it would add slightly more weight to the idea that we wasn't there for the earlier session.  Which also doesn't prove anything, since just because he wasn't there for "Noble Surfer" doesn't mean they necessarily cut all the vocals that day...or does it?  Andrew, how does that work?  Could Mike have worked on the "Noble Surfer" vocal at the same time they cut the vocals for "Finder's Keepers", the following day?  Would that be reflected on the union log for the next day or would they bother?

If everything on Andrew's site is in recording order, you could construct a scenario where, under the gun to complete the album, Brian, Denny, Carl and Dave cut the three instrumentals and the fourth track for "Noble Surfer" and Brian goes ahead and cuts the backup track with Dave doubling Denny to get ahead on the next day's work.  First thing the next day they go to work on the remainder of the tracks, cutting Mike's vocal on "Surfer" in the process.

Hell, it's all speculation, but it fits the facts and the sound of the track.  And it's fun.  Now back to shell pleadings...

[adamghost]

THE LORD'S PRAYER

OK, this one was a bitch, and because I suspect it's going to be controversial, I'm going to go through the listening process.

At first listen, I would have said five parts, they're all there, for sure Brian, Carl, Mike and Al, with Al appearing to dominate the harmony stack at "give us this day our daily bread," and Dennis' participation being the X factor.  Then I listened more closely and I could not find more than four parts at any point in the song.  It definitely ends on only four parts.  Also, every time the band got into close harmony, it was when Mike left the bass range.  Thus it pretty much has to be just four parts.  The four voices are thus:

Brian's falsetto
A higher "rounder" tonality that's the lowest in the mix (vocal "A")
A lower, grainier tonality that's further up in the mix (vocal "B")
Mike's bass line

It's easiest to tease these apart on the very last line, and that's where the troubles began.  Vocal A was definitely a Wilson and if I had to guess I would have said Dennis.  No way it's Al...the tone is too "round".  Vocal B could be either Carl or Alan, but not Dennis.  Likewise, too grainy/nasal.

From a default standpoint, I would have then said (in this order) Mike, Al, Carl, Brian.  Vocal A is high, it's tricky, and unusually for Dennis, he never sticks out in the mix, so it's obvious to ascribe it to Carl.  Also, Al clearly dominates the stack at the "daily bread" line.  Yet, Vocal B sounded a little soft and round for Carl, and there were parts I felt I heard Carl clearly at Vocal A.  Plus, Carl's default position was below Al in the stack, although that doesn't seem to have always been the case.

So I went back to the "daily bread" line and listened more carefully.  Even though the phrasing of that sounds exactly like Al's, if you listen around that line where the doubling comes apart slightly (it's most pronounced at "evil") and you can hear the individual vocals on that part, suddenly you hear Carl.  Then listen to "power" and "glory".  Vocal B is the one that's moving more, Vocal A is the one that has lest movement.  "Power" is much more Carl-like but more importantly, "glory" is unmistakably Dennis (listen to the way he hits the "ry"...he scoops up to the note).  Also listen to Vocal B at the closing "amen" where it comes apart slightly.  You can hear the individual voices and it's clearly Carl.  So Al's presence on the song, seemingly obvious, would appear to be an aural illusion created by Carl's voice being doubletracked in that range, which would make him sound grainier in spots and more Al-like.

The Lord's Prayer:
Mike - bottom
Carl - next (except in a couple of spots where I think he crosses into the upper register)
Dennis - next
Brian - top

[Andrew G. Doe]

Which also doesn't prove anything, since just because he wasn't there for "Noble Surfer" doesn't mean they necessarily cut all the vocals that day...or does it?  Andrew, how does that work?  Could Mike have worked on the "Noble Surfer" vocal at the same time they cut the vocals for "Finder's Keepers", the following day?  Would that be reflected on the union log for the next day or would they bother?

If everything on Andrew's site is in recording order, you could construct a scenario where, under the gun to complete the album, Brian, Denny, Carl and Dave cut the three instrumentals and the fourth track for "Noble Surfer" and Brian goes ahead and cuts the backup track with Dave doubling Denny to get ahead on the next day's work.  First thing the next day they go to work on the remainder of the tracks, cutting Mike's vocal on "Surfer" in the process.

Hell, it's all speculation, but it fits the facts and the sound of the track.  And it's fun.  Now back to shell pleadings...

Mike says "Stooooked" on, well, "Stoked".

Thing to remember is that while it's highly likely that the band cut the complete track in one session on these early albums, the AFM sheets don't yea or nay this. Because AFM stands for "American Federation of Musicians", not singers.. 

As for the song order on my listing - don't invest it with too much significance. I have no idea what order they were recorded in.

[adamghost]

Thanks Andrew...I'd bet then that Mike wasn't at the first session.  If so, that might explain Dave's presence (if he is indeed there) on the background vocal track.

Re:  "A Young Man's Gone":  I couldn't find a copy of that at home last night.  I did just listen to a 30 second sample of an mp3 online in not very good fidelity, but even going just by that, it sounds like four parts: Mike-Carl-Al-Brian bottom to top to me, which is exactly what one would expect.  For sure on the Mike, Carl and Brian and about 80% sure on the Al.  Did someone think they heard Dennis in there?  Granted, it wasn't a good fidelity mp3, but I don't hear any trace of him.  And I've never seen or heard any version of it that he sang on.

[adamghost]

Auld Lang Syne - correction

After the in-depth listening to "Lord's Prayer" and the "Jardine illusion" I started to question my own ears on "Auld Lang Syne" and went back and dissected it part by part on better headphones and I think I blew it...I don't think Al is on there.  The reason I thought "Al sounded like Brian" is that it was Carl.  There's a spot around :19 where Carl sounds like Al, but there are other places in the song where you can tell there are only four voices, and there's no question Dennis and Carl are both there, both from the voices in the pre-song chatter and throughout the song:  at :35 where Dennis' voice sticks out, you can hear Carl crossing over to sing parallel above him, Mike comes up under and Brian comes down, and there's just no fifth part there.  Ditto at :44, where Brian pedals, Carl moves down, and Mike and Dennis move down more sharply in parallel.  Again, no fifth part.  Finally, the last flourish, Mike and Brian pedal in octaves (mostly) and Carl and Dennis move around in rough parallel in the middle.  No other part that I can discern.  I should have listened more carefully.

Auld Lang Syne, then:
Mike - bottom
Carl and Dennis in the middle - they seem to swap registers, although Carl seems to be higher than Denny for most of it.
Brian - top

What's interesting is that although Carl usually had the anchor position at the bottom of the main stack, just above Mike, it doesn't seem to have been a hard and fast rule.  The sense I'm getting from listening to these is that all other things (range, etc.) being equal, Brian would give Carl the most demanding part.  Which makes sense.

[tpesky]

I always thought Al would be on those ballads just because they were recorded after he returned to the group, correct? and that was his major asset to the group, singing. I can't believe they would record those intricate ballads with Dennis and not Al whose voice was more suited to singing in the harmony and blending

[cerro azul]

Thanks Andrew...I'd bet then that Mike wasn't at the first session.  If so, that might explain Dave's presence (if he is indeed there) on the background vocal track.

Re:  "A Young Man's Gone":  I couldn't find a copy of that at home last night.  I did just listen to a 30 second sample of an mp3 online in not very good fidelity, but even going just by that, it sounds like four parts: Mike-Carl-Al-Brian bottom to top to me, which is exactly what one would expect.  For sure on the Mike, Carl and Brian and about 80% sure on the Al.  Did someone think they heard Dennis in there?  Granted, it wasn't a good fidelity mp3, but I don't hear any trace of him.  And I've never seen or heard any version of it that he sang on.

I do not hear even a trace of Dennis here (listening to the "LDC" CD version with headphones on) -- especially when contrasted with the "Lord's Prayer" where his "rasp" is clearly evident.

[pixletwin]

On the line at the end of AYDCT where they sing "... and your dreams come true" I think Dennis is quite prominent. I don't understand how anyone can think otherwise.

[John 2]

I just want to intterupt and thank everyone, especially adamghost, for their work so far. This thread needs to become the standard reference!

[Dancing Bear]

I'm not contributing but I'm surely saving all the results. Keep up the good work!

[No. Fourteen]

And thank you John for launching the vessel, and keeping it on course!  Kudos!

[pixletwin]

And thank you John for launching the vessel, and keeping it on course!  Kudos!

Yeah. This is my favorite thread here! 

[adamghost]

On the line at the end of AYDCT where they sing "... and your dreams come true" I think Dennis is quite prominent. I don't understand how anyone can think otherwise.

As I said, I totally hear what you're hearing...but going through the rest of the song, I just don't hear any other evidence that he's there, the studio tapes don't indicate he's there, and double tracking and the double being off-key...particularly if there's more than one voice on that part...could make it sound just like Dennis.  I was sure that Al was on Auld Lang Syne until I broke every part down and realized that it was just an illusion.  As I said, you could construct a scenario that his him taking over from Al mid-session or redoubling his part -- there's just no other indication that that's what happened.

[adamghost]

I always thought Al would be on those ballads just because they were recorded after he returned to the group, correct? and that was his major asset to the group, singing. I can't believe they would record those intricate ballads with Dennis and not Al whose voice was more suited to singing in the harmony and blending

What can I tell you?  I would have thought the same thing.  I've been trying to listen without any preconceptions and just go by the evidence of what's on the recording -- that's part of what makes the exercise interesting for me.  I was very surprised that Al apparently isn't on these...especially on "The Lord's Prayer" where what I perceive to be Dennis' part is just about flawless (albeit low in the mix).  And, y'know, I'm not infallible.  But I did listen to this stuff pretty carefully.  And, actually, "Auld Lang Syne" is not that tight of a track.  Some of the harmonies are pretty uneven and there are a lot of sloppy edits...which may be why they decided to do the voice over!

With respect to blend though...keep in mind that Brian, Carl and Dennis had been singing together for years, and as family members they had a natural blend, and Al had been away from the group for awhile in '64.  Tonally, Carl said of Al at the time "his voice really cuts" and that's part of what made him sound so much like Brian...but Dennis' voice with its softer, grainier texture actually made for more of a "blend" than Al's voice.  On a ballad, you're actually going to get a smoother overall tone with Dennis than Al -- you just might not get as spot-on a performance.  I think Dennis' issue was more the ability to navigate difficult vocal cadences and such like that, and also evenness of his delivery.  I haven't broken it down line by line but my impression listening to these is that the really hairy movement in the vocal lines went to Carl (and Mike in the bass range), and that Dennis' part would be more fixed.

There's also the possibility that Al just wasn't available that day for some reason.

Also...wasn't "The Lord's Prayer" actually cut earlier, like in '63, and Capitol wouldn't let Brian put it out?  I seem to remember hearing that somewhere.  I could be on drugs though.

Btw, I'm totally open to being corrected...if someone wants to go through these line by line with a piano (which I haven't done, I've just gone by intense listening) or get other primary session information that contradicts this, I'd learn from that. 

[cerro azul]

"The Lord's Prayer" was released Christmastime, 1963, the "B" side to the "Little Saint Nick" single.  I do not know precisely when it was recorded.

[adamghost]

"The Lord's Prayer" was released Christmastime, 1963, the "B" side to the "Little Saint Nick" single.  I do not know precisely when it was recorded.

That explains why Al wasn't on it.  Referring now to Andrew's site, I see it was cut on October 20, 1963, and given the high level of polish and the difficulty of the arrangement, there's a good likelihood that they'd been practicing it for some time prior.  Dave Marks' last show was October 5.  Al was back in the group full-time by then, but only barely.

Stebbins (or c-man, or anyone), getting back to something you'd mentioned earlier, is there any evidence that Al did any on-record singing with the band (other than the initial sessions) prior to rejoining the band in Oct. '63?  I remember that there were some '63 sessions where all six of them were playing, with Al on bass, but did he sing at all?

[adamghost]

Well, scratch Al not being around for the "Auld Lang Syne" session...according to Andrew's website, it was cut the same day as "Christmas Day."  Maybe Al was so stressed out by his first lead vocal that he went home early!

(Although there was a second session for "Christmas Day" two days later, a good chance that's when the lead vocal was done.  But who knows)

Just for the heck of it, I gave the other tracks cut on that day a quick listen to see if I can confirm Al is on the backgrounds.   I definitely hear Dennis (along with Carl and Mike) on "Santa's Beard" but I can't tell if it's 4 or 5 parts.  If it's 4, then Al's not on that one.   On the others, I can't honestly tell on one listen.  Of course, we don't know that all the vocals were cut the same day (and since they had to do four instrumental tracks that day plus "Auld Lang Syne", they probably weren't), so it's not really relevant anyway.  But it's fun!

Does anyone have the Sea of Tunes boots for these sessions?  That would settle a lot of these controversies pretty conclusively; you could hear more clearly who was there and singing what and also if anyone had to leave or sat something out or what have you.  C-Man has dissected them thoroughly and the guy has awesome ears.  He's added a lot of new information to the mix in so doing.  He's only officially published the results of that listening for SUMMER DAYS and ALL SUMMER LONG, though.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Well, scratch Al not being around for the "Auld Lang Syne" session...according to Andrew's website, it was cut the same day as "Christmas Day."  Maybe Al was so stressed out by his first lead vocal that he went home early!

(Although there was a second session for "Christmas Day" two days later, a good chance that's when the lead vocal was done.  But who knows)

Chances are the 2nd session was for overdubs and vocals. Can't prove it but that's my semi-informed opinion.