gfxgfx
 
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
logo
 
gfx gfx
gfx
633421 Posts in 25354 Topics by 3609 Members - Latest Member: fox67 June 25, 2018, 12:59:56 AM
*
gfx*HomeHelpSearchCalendarLoginRegistergfx
gfxgfx
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.       « previous next »
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 6 7 ... 22 Go Down Print
Author Topic: The Alan Boyd Thread  (Read 131011 times)
aeijtzsche
Honored Guest
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 2366



View Profile
« Reply #25 on: January 27, 2006, 07:50:50 PM »

I think I remembered hearing that DWB and W of the S were lost.  Too bad.  That makes sense...maybe Brian would have recorded the track, his lead and the group, then doubled the group, mixed tracks 3 and 4 down to one track on a new tape, then he'd have a free track for the doubled lead.

I don't know why I didn't think of that.

Probably too much home recording on my computer where, if I had the processing power (which believe me, I don't...), I could have an infinite number of tracks.  With my ancient technology, it's more like...one track.
Logged
c-man
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 3948


View Profile WWW
« Reply #26 on: January 28, 2006, 08:44:23 AM »

Alan, if you haven't already, please check out my essay on the recording of the "Today!" album, where I listened to all available sources (available to me, that is) and see if you agree on what I came up with.  I welcome any corrections or comments from your perspective.

www.beachboysarchives.com
Logged
c-man
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 3948


View Profile WWW
« Reply #27 on: January 28, 2006, 08:50:05 AM »

Oh and Alan, while you're at it...do you happen to know the identity of the man who engineered the vocal session for "In The Back Of My Mind"?† He has a very distinctive voice...he also pops up on a few other sessions, like "Ballad Of Ole Betsy" and I think "I Do".† It's definitely not Chuck Britz.† I identify him simply as "Unknown Western Engineer" in my writings.

Thanks a lot,
C-Man
Logged
aeijtzsche
Honored Guest
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 2366



View Profile
« Reply #28 on: January 28, 2006, 12:30:30 PM »

Craig, have you investigated the possibility of that voice belonging to H Bowen David?
Logged
c-man
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 3948


View Profile WWW
« Reply #29 on: January 28, 2006, 12:51:19 PM »

Yep...a few years ago, I got in contact with Mr. David's daughter, who was kind enough to send me a photocopy of a United/Western newsletter from 1967 or so with a photo of her dad!

I sent her a CD with excerpts from a few sessions, including those, so she could ID her dad's voice.  She recognized him right away on the "organ bridge" Good Vibrations session from September '66, but indicated that the "mystery man" engineer was not Bo.
Logged
aeijtzsche
Honored Guest
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 2366



View Profile
« Reply #30 on: January 28, 2006, 01:50:21 PM »

Wow, you truly are the (c-)man.  That's neat that you were able to do that.

How many different Engineers have you identified now?  Britz, David, Levine, Botnick...what about Lanky Linstrott, Cal Harris, did Jimmy Lockert's voice ever actually appear on a Beach Boys tape?  Not much by way of talkback going on in what we have of the sessions Jim co-ordinated.

I know it's not his voice that's a mystery Craig, but have you been able to find anything out about Ralph Balantin?  I've turned up zero for him, despite the fact that he engineered what might be considered the Boys best vocal work...
Logged
c-man
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 3948


View Profile WWW
« Reply #31 on: January 28, 2006, 05:44:38 PM »

Wow...who's Lanky?  Must've missed that one!

Desper's voice turns up in a couple of places.  Maybe Lockert's.

Is that Balantin in the 1966 control room pics (short balding guy with the short-sleeved shirt & tie, and black frame glasses)?  Like in the "Pet Sounds" box booklet (the long one) and 1996 EQ cover story?
Logged
guitarfool2002
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 8100


"Barba non facit aliam historici"


View Profile WWW
« Reply #32 on: January 28, 2006, 06:28:14 PM »

Wow...who's Lanky?† Must've missed that one!

Desper's voice turns up in a couple of places.† Maybe Lockert's.

Is that Balantin in the 1966 control room pics (short balding guy with the short-sleeved shirt & tie, and black frame glasses)?† Like in the "Pet Sounds" box booklet (the long one) and 1996 EQ cover story?

The man with the glasses is United/Western engineer Winston Wong, and I think he was often in the role some would call the "assistant" (which explains him sitting behind Britz in that photo). I have another photo of him in yet another Western newsletter as he's setting up a microphone for a session - another assistant role.
Logged

ďSome people think you have to knock somebody down in order to build yourself up, I donít look at it that way. To the mentality that likes to disparage other people, I say perhaps you should get a life. Itís just wrong thinking in my opinion and I donít mind saying that.Ē - Mike Love

"Every single person who criticized Brian for having She & Him, Kacey Musgraves, Sebu and Nate Ruess guesting on his solo album can now officially go heartily f*** themselves." - Wirestone
guitarfool2002
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 8100


"Barba non facit aliam historici"


View Profile WWW
« Reply #33 on: January 28, 2006, 06:30:39 PM »

I just thought of something...are you talking about the *other* control room shot at (what looks like) Columbia, with yet another guy in a white short-sleeve shirt? The guy with Britz is definitely Winston Wong - the other guy at Columbia, I don't know.
Logged

ďSome people think you have to knock somebody down in order to build yourself up, I donít look at it that way. To the mentality that likes to disparage other people, I say perhaps you should get a life. Itís just wrong thinking in my opinion and I donít mind saying that.Ē - Mike Love

"Every single person who criticized Brian for having She & Him, Kacey Musgraves, Sebu and Nate Ruess guesting on his solo album can now officially go heartily f*** themselves." - Wirestone
guitarfool2002
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 8100


"Barba non facit aliam historici"


View Profile WWW
« Reply #34 on: January 28, 2006, 06:42:23 PM »

Speaking of mystery engineers - I'd like to bring back a question/discussion that has probably since been lost in the old Smile Shop board archives.

I thought this mystery engineer voice might have been a man named Jerry Ferree, who at the time of this session was the chief engineer at United/Western. Yet I'm not certain "In The Cantina" was tracked at Western...This is from one of Brian and Van Dyke's "In The Cantina" piano sessions, and it went down something like this as Brian was trying to track his piano part:

Brian: How does this sound?
Engineer: I don't like that. There's uh, there's no, no presence at all. That's not for recording.
Van Dyke: Let me go listen.
Brian: What do you mean, it's not...hey, man?
Engineer: You got more of one end of the piano than you do the other end of the piano, man!
Brian: (garbled)...here.
Engineer: Just put it over the center, up a little higher if you want to.
Brian: Hey Jerry, man, listen, you know, maybe I want some kind of (garbled) there, man!
Engineer: (overlaps Brian) Yeah, but I'm tellin' you it don't sound good.
Anonymous: You're listening to it out there...
Brian: Van? Van, would you play the thing I was doing?
Engineer: Yeah, well, that's right, but you don't...
Van: ...which isn't gonna...
Brian: Second, let's just...
Anonymous: Bruce, coffee.
Engineer: Take 12.


What a fun clip. Ring a bell? Does anyone have a record of who engineered that session and had the back-and-forth with Brian about the piano sound?


Logged

ďSome people think you have to knock somebody down in order to build yourself up, I donít look at it that way. To the mentality that likes to disparage other people, I say perhaps you should get a life. Itís just wrong thinking in my opinion and I donít mind saying that.Ē - Mike Love

"Every single person who criticized Brian for having She & Him, Kacey Musgraves, Sebu and Nate Ruess guesting on his solo album can now officially go heartily f*** themselves." - Wirestone
c-man
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 3948


View Profile WWW
« Reply #35 on: January 28, 2006, 06:46:29 PM »

Yep, I remember that session (well, I mean I remember the tape of that session...of course, I wasn't there!), and I've wondered who that Jerry is, too.

And yes, I was referring to the "other" (Columbia) control room shot, featured in color in the long box set booklet and also in EQ.  I suspect that's Mr. Ballatin.
Logged
Cam Mott
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 4171


View Profile
« Reply #36 on: January 28, 2006, 08:57:06 PM »

Isn't "Jerry" called out and heard on some vocal session too?† I've had the impression he must have been a Columbia engineer but maybe I had a wrong impression.
Logged

"Bring me the head of Carmen Sandiego" Lynne "The Chief" Thigpen
Charles LePage @ ComicList
Chairman Of The Board
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 977


Hit me with your pet shark.


View Profile WWW
« Reply #37 on: January 29, 2006, 06:43:47 PM »

Inside Pop: Scene Descriptions, and The Hunt For The Reels

Durrie Parks' Acetates

Any new news on either of these?
Logged

"quiet here, no one got crap to say?" - bringahorseinhere
Andrew G. Doe
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 17767


The triumph of The Hickey Script !


View Profile WWW
« Reply #38 on: January 30, 2006, 03:50:55 AM »

Nope, but that would be a fine name for a Smile cover band.  Wink
Logged

The four sweetest words in my vocabulary: "This poster is ignored".
Mark A. Moore
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 368



View Profile WWW
« Reply #39 on: February 07, 2006, 12:34:48 PM »

Wow...who's Lanky?† Must've missed that one!


Lanky Linstrot tag-teamed many of the Jan & Dean sessions with Bones Howe . . . that is, from an engineering standpoint. Chuck Britz also did some engineering for J&D (as did others) . . . but mostly it was Bones & Lanky.

M.

Logged

aeijtzsche
Honored Guest
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 2366



View Profile
« Reply #40 on: February 08, 2006, 12:21:59 PM »

Alan, on another thread you mention:

Quote
On the track sheets for the 2" masters for Til I Die and Fallin' In Love, there's a listing for "RHYTHM KING"

And in doing so opened up a small can of worms, because I'd like to know the entire contents of the track sheet for "'Til I Die" if you have extra time that you're not sure how to spend.  I promise I won't ask you the contents of every track sheet in the Beach Boys catalog.

I think the Til I Die one would be an interesting companion to the Desper Mix on the soundtrack to your fantastic film, since there's so much exposed in that mix.

Logged
Alan Boyd
Honored Guest
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 274


View Profile
« Reply #41 on: February 08, 2006, 02:34:22 PM »

Here ya go:

TIL I DIE:
1 - Rythm King
2 - Lo vox
3 - bass
4 - RMI
5 - Organ
6 - Organ
7 - Gtr/drm
8 - Vox (different lyrics)
9 - Hi vox/vibes
10 - vibes
11 - bkg vox
12 - bkg vox
13 - more vox
14 - ore vox
15 - org/vox
16 - org/vox

Looks like this one had some dubdowns on the way to the final 16 track master.
Logged
Andrew G. Doe
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 17767


The triumph of The Hickey Script !


View Profile WWW
« Reply #42 on: February 08, 2006, 02:42:51 PM »

RMI ?

Wot dat ?

Really marvellous instrumental ?
Logged

The four sweetest words in my vocabulary: "This poster is ignored".
aeijtzsche
Honored Guest
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 2366



View Profile
« Reply #43 on: February 08, 2006, 02:44:19 PM »

You're the best.  That also clears up a question I've had in the back of my mind about the electric harpsichord used in some songs of that era.  RMI electra-piano, it was!

Interesting how many shared tracks there are.  Must have been a tricky mixdown.
Logged
aeijtzsche
Honored Guest
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 2366



View Profile
« Reply #44 on: February 08, 2006, 02:45:11 PM »

Logged
LaurieBiagini
Smiley Smile Newbie

Offline Offline

Posts: 7

Songwriter/Singer


View Profile WWW
« Reply #45 on: February 08, 2006, 03:17:16 PM »

Cool! (love lookin' at vintage keyboards)  :D
Logged

Check out my music on my website: http://www.myspace.com/lauriebiaginimusic
Alan Boyd
Honored Guest
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 274


View Profile
« Reply #46 on: February 08, 2006, 03:57:45 PM »

On SUNFLOWER the 16 track masters had so much shared information - snatches of vocals on a track that's mostly guitar, for instance - that Steve placed swatches of colored adhesive tape on the back of the 2" tape, in order to provide visual cues for the mixdown.  Mixdown automation was still years away, so all eyes would be on the 2" machine, and they'd see a red rectangle coming off the reel and heading towards the machine heads, and this would be a cue for a particular fader adjustment or a level change, etc.... Pretty resourceful, eh? 

The only drawback is the fact that after 30 years, the adhesive from the masking tape has "bled out" and caused massive dropouts, big clear sections on the tape where the oxide has come in contact with the adhesive tape and peeled right off.  Thankfully, these huge, rather scary-looking droupouts aren't as noticeable as one might imagine.  The A capella mix of "Add Some Music" came out OK despite this problem.

Those songs are so very rich sonically that some of them might have filled 48 tracks if not for all of the dubdowns and shared tracks.  Steve and The Beach Boys were way ahead of their time.  Honestly, I noticed this when I got the "Sunflower" LP when it was released in 1970 - and I was only 8 at the time!  I listened to that album with headphones the day I got it, and even then I could tell it was something very new and special.  I'd never experienced an audio "landscape" like that.  I suppose, in a way, I've spent a good portion of my life since then trying to figure out how they did it...

Alan
Logged
aeijtzsche
Honored Guest
******
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
Posts: 2366



View Profile
« Reply #47 on: February 08, 2006, 04:15:17 PM »

I don't know if anybody has caught up with what was done on Sunflower and Surf's Up.  I can't think of any modern record that has the depth of those recordings and mixes.  I'm trying to catch up, and Steve has been so helpful in explaining how to make recordings better.  But it's still a battle (particularly with my undesirable recording set-up which limits me to somewhere between 4-12 tracks, depending on how my hard drive is feeling that day) and always an inspiration.
Logged
guitarfool2002
Global Moderator
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 8100


"Barba non facit aliam historici"


View Profile WWW
« Reply #48 on: February 08, 2006, 08:01:21 PM »

RMI ?

Wot dat ?

Really marvellous instrumental ?


Rocky Mount Instruments, Inc.

They did other instruments besides the one shown in that photo - I have a somewhat rare demonstration LP record from RMI where they play  through the sounds and features of their "Harmonic Synthesizer" and "Keyboard Computer". The unusual feature on these was they were controlled by a punch card system, like banks and offices everywhere used for years on those primitive computers. To program the sounds into the "computer", you had a series of punch cards to insert into this keyboard, with each card hloding different instruments and sounds which you'd use to build your own. And there was a bank of pedals for pitch bends, and other modulation effects and controls.

RMI had offices in Pennsylvania, sales offices in Macungie to be exact. "Chris D" for one should be familiar with Macungie, PA. So I'm happy to have found this album in Pennsylvania, with some very interesting (and useable) sounds that are pretty desirable today in some music circles. I seriously doubt you'd find a working example of the RMI "Keyboard Computer" with enough of those punch cards to have it work 100% with access to all the sounds, so albums like these are a great resource for samplers and sound designers.

I'm going to check if any famous albums or tunes used one of these punch card synths...

As far as the RMI rig shown in the photo - I'm more of a Wurlitzer, Clavinet, and Pianet kind of guy.  Cool sound, though! Wink
Logged

ďSome people think you have to knock somebody down in order to build yourself up, I donít look at it that way. To the mentality that likes to disparage other people, I say perhaps you should get a life. Itís just wrong thinking in my opinion and I donít mind saying that.Ē - Mike Love

"Every single person who criticized Brian for having She & Him, Kacey Musgraves, Sebu and Nate Ruess guesting on his solo album can now officially go heartily f*** themselves." - Wirestone
Bean Bag
Smiley Smile Associate
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1177


Right?


View Profile
« Reply #49 on: February 09, 2006, 06:41:08 PM »

I'd never experienced an audio "landscape" like that.

Perfect.  Well said.

Yeah, its dense...I always get the feeling it's a juggling act with so many overdubs like that.† I mean sonically you're really treading water when things start to pile on like that....which makes me think they HAD to have had that all planned from the get go.† Otherwise it would have been a pile.† You know?

All I Wanna Do, especially...it teeters on the edge of that big time...which lends it it's otherworldly vib.  It's soooo frickin' amazing...
Logged

409.
gfx
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 6 7 ... 22 Go Up Print 
gfx
Jump to:  
gfx
Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines Page created in 0.213 seconds with 22 queries.
Helios Multi design by Bloc
gfx
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!