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Author Topic: Murry Wilson And Snow  (Read 4462 times)
twentytwenty
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« Reply #25 on: December 17, 2019, 06:40:17 AM »

Yeah, Brians version blows this out of the water
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« Reply #26 on: December 17, 2019, 06:52:54 AM »

Good God - this sounds like a horrible parody, specifically designed to sound horrible! IMHO
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Peadar 'Big Dinner' O'Driscoll
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« Reply #27 on: December 17, 2019, 06:59:38 AM »

I like it even though it's actually missing some of my favourite parts from the Beach Boys version like...oh boy you jump for joy or the the way the verses end. It's certainly not better but interesting nonetheless.
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« Reply #28 on: December 17, 2019, 07:17:54 AM »

Eek, that bombastic arrangement! Murry's surrogate son just didn't have it.
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« Reply #29 on: December 17, 2019, 07:28:24 AM »

This is the textbook definition of "curio." I can't claim this stuff sounds good in any way. Very interesting though. 

I know a few people have fetishized Murry material and this sort of era off-shoot material. I certainly find the *story* of it fascinating. Sort of like reading about Jan & Dean; the story is tantalizing and often far more interesting than the actual music.

This version of "Break Away" is a mess; I certainly hope that *isn't* the type of ending Al Jardine was clamoring for when he indicated disappointment with the BB arrangement. I'll take the ending of the BBs version of "Break Away" any day over this. I'll take the BB version with everything mixed out but drums and bass.

"Break Away" is a good song; it doesn't need to be all mucked up like this.

But, I'm all for stuff like this making it out for release.

I'd say this is perhaps a model they could use to put that Don Goldberg stuff out, which while not A+ quality, is a million times more enjoyable than this "Snow" stuff.
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« Reply #30 on: December 17, 2019, 08:41:29 AM »

Even though the vocals are inferior and the overall production doesn't cohere in the way that the BB version does, I think I prefer the Snow version myself. Breakaway has never been a particular favorite of mine, and this version has some chord changes that I find more interesting... I don't have any of the common hangups about the soft pop scene either. It's one of my favorite genres.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2019, 08:43:31 AM by Mr. Tiger » Logged
krabklaw
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« Reply #31 on: December 17, 2019, 09:36:39 AM »

This does not flow as a song; very disjointed. It's very pleasant sounding though quite bizarre.
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« Reply #32 on: December 17, 2019, 10:09:47 AM »

Yes, there is a weird sub-genre of "soft" yet somewhat bizarrely arranged vocal pop that can have a kind of appeal for some... The first LP by a group called the Inner Dialogue is probably a good example of this.
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Don Malcolm
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« Reply #33 on: December 17, 2019, 03:51:47 PM »

Sounds like this incarnation of Snow was the one with the female vocalist, a move that someone at Epic imposed on the band in the final stages of their LP project when the record company felt that the "Billy Jones" tune was the best bet for a hit but that none of the guys in the band could sing in a "suitable" style.

There were a couple dozen bands like Snow in 1967-68, all coiled up and ready to conquer the world with post-Pepper psychedelia and/or harmony pop: they usually didn't try to combine the two on a single record (or a single song). Most of them wound up aligned with the SF strain, with one or two (think The Wizards From Kansas) actually outdoing the folks they were imitating.

Snow's '68 LP shows that you can be 100% schizoid while simultaneously being eclectic. They weren't quite good enough at either genre to put any of them over, though they made some valiant efforts. On the LP, three songs stand out. First, "Golden Oldie Show," with a bit of BB harmony tossed into a flower power melody that wafts over a pretty kickass guitar track--with one couplet that presciently summed up the way of things then and now: "The newsman just came on at four/To tell about a brand new war." Second: "Song of the Siren", which doesn't quite wed together BBs harmony with grunge-ass psychedelica. Third: the unclassifiable "Caterpillar," which is probably the closest channeling of Brian Wilson and Syd Barrett in their wild, weird and fragile 1967 states. Snow's harder-edged material seems to come from baked-in listening to "The Piper at the Gates of Dawn," particularly the "space guitar tracks...but the lyrics to "Caterpillar" stem from Syd's "acid folk" tunes on that same LP.

'Tis strange, to be sure. But those were strange times, to be sure. I can hear what Henn might have heard in their voices, though he took it the wrong way. It would've been a helluva lot more interesting if Snow had collided with Brian instead, but people were pretty uptight at that point about letting Brian work with other bands.
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CenturyDeprived
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« Reply #34 on: December 17, 2019, 08:07:21 PM »

Sounds like this incarnation of Snow was the one with the female vocalist, a move that someone at Epic imposed on the band in the final stages of their LP project when the record company felt that the "Billy Jones" tune was the best bet for a hit but that none of the guys in the band could sing in a "suitable" style.

There were a couple dozen bands like Snow in 1967-68, all coiled up and ready to conquer the world with post-Pepper psychedelia and/or harmony pop: they usually didn't try to combine the two on a single record (or a single song). Most of them wound up aligned with the SF strain, with one or two (think The Wizards From Kansas) actually outdoing the folks they were imitating.

Snow's '68 LP shows that you can be 100% schizoid while simultaneously being eclectic. They weren't quite good enough at either genre to put any of them over, though they made some valiant efforts. On the LP, three songs stand out. First, "Golden Oldie Show," with a bit of BB harmony tossed into a flower power melody that wafts over a pretty kickass guitar track--with one couplet that presciently summed up the way of things then and now: "The newsman just came on at four/To tell about a brand new war." Second: "Song of the Siren", which doesn't quite wed together BBs harmony with grunge-ass psychedelica. Third: the unclassifiable "Caterpillar," which is probably the closest channeling of Brian Wilson and Syd Barrett in their wild, weird and fragile 1967 states. Snow's harder-edged material seems to come from baked-in listening to "The Piper at the Gates of Dawn," particularly the "space guitar tracks...but the lyrics to "Caterpillar" stem from Syd's "acid folk" tunes on that same LP.

'Tis strange, to be sure. But those were strange times, to be sure. I can hear what Henn might have heard in their voices, though he took it the wrong way. It would've been a helluva lot more interesting if Snow had collided with Brian instead, but people were pretty uptight at that point about letting Brian work with other bands.

That's some fascinating history, I really appreciate that post!

Interesting to think of this version of the song as a surrogate Brian directing yet another surrogate Brian to collaborate with a different band. It's kind a like the movie Multiplicity - each copy of a copy isn't as good as the one that came before. Still I dig this version because it's pretty fascinating and also interestingly good in its own way.
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« Reply #35 on: December 17, 2019, 08:21:37 PM »

Syd Barrett talk sounds a bit fanciful from what I'm hearing (which admittedly isn't all of it). I suggest the principal influence here is Hair (as in the musical).

ETA: I'm just going off the Murry Wilson stuff here, so perhaps the material cited by Don Malcolm is a different story.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2019, 08:24:20 PM by William Bowe » Logged
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« Reply #36 on: December 18, 2019, 11:11:43 AM »

here're 4 recent facebook comments about Snow, made by Rick Henn:

"Murry and the BBs manager put us together. One of the BBs who shall remain nameless, tried to block Souful from ever being released...Alan Boyd and Mark Linett made it happen."

and

"….after the Sunrays disbanded I went back to music school in the later part of the late 60's. Every time Murry got the urge to write songs and get back into the studio, he would graciously call me to refine the tunes and write the charts. There were a lot of sessions at Gold Star and Sunset Sound all the way up until his death. He could have hired anyone he wanted (if they'd work with him), but he stayed loyal to me knowing the arranging skills I was learning could be experimented with and gave me the opportunity to write and work with the best studio players in LA."

and

"No, this Snow was from Omaha, Nebraska. I wrote the arrangements on my tunes and used Wrecking Crew players and then we did vocals if I remember correctly, at Sunset Sound and Brian Wilson's Bellagio home studio. We also recorded a track at Goldstar on a tune called Run River Run..."

and

"thanks for the post. I hadn't heard about this EP. When I went to the Omnivore Recordings website, http://omnivorerecordings.com/shop/break-away-ep/ I did see that two of my songs, "Wilderness" and "Bless Me" are part of it. The copy on the site describing the EP has a few mistakes regarding the group Snow, but it's still great that someone cared enough to release it so many years later."
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Mr. Tiger
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« Reply #37 on: December 18, 2019, 02:19:11 PM »

here're 4 recent facebook comments about Snow, made by Rick Henn:
"Murry and the BBs manager put us together. One of the BBs who shall remain nameless, tried to block Souful from ever being released...Alan Boyd and Mark Linett made it happen."

I recall hearing somewhere that this was Carl, because of the vocal flub he made toward the end of the song (shunshine).


« Last Edit: December 18, 2019, 02:22:11 PM by Mr. Tiger » Logged
Don Malcolm
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« Reply #38 on: December 18, 2019, 02:42:10 PM »

Syd Barrett talk sounds a bit fanciful from what I'm hearing (which admittedly isn't all of it). I suggest the principal influence here is Hair (as in the musical).

ETA: I'm just going off the Murry Wilson stuff here, so perhaps the material cited by Don Malcolm is a different story.

William--yes, I'm talking about the material specific to the SNOW Epic LP released in '68, and NOT their version of "Break Away." I think it's possible that Rick Henn never heard that LP: the material I was describing in that manner very likely would have put him off. It's more likely he heard the "Billy Jones" track, which was sort like Spanky and Our Gang meets the Mamas & Papas with C-grade material. That's clearly the direction that the Henn-Murry-Snow sessions took.

Here's a YouTube link to Snow's "Caterpillar," from their eponymous LP. It was also (IIRC) the B-side to "Billy Jones," which makes for the type of 45 release that could only happen in those times. See if you get the Syd vibe from this song...a truly odd "artyfact" of its time!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9cgAXd9zRM
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« Reply #39 on: December 18, 2019, 03:52:20 PM »

And now Goldmine premieres Snow’s take on “We’re Together Again”… https://www.goldminemag.com/news/goldmine-premieres-music-from-murry-wilson-snows-breakaway-ep
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« Reply #40 on: December 18, 2019, 03:59:30 PM »

And now Goldmine premieres Snow’s take on “We’re Together Again”… https://www.goldminemag.com/news/goldmine-premieres-music-from-murry-wilson-snows-breakaway-ep

Well, that's about 100x more enjoyable than "Break Away". Nice version.
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« Reply #41 on: December 18, 2019, 07:04:38 PM »

I just remembered a Sunshine Pop album I downloaded many years ago from someone's blog (remember those?) by Snow on  the Epic label. It was apparently released in 1968.
Yes, I make sure to frequent blogs with downloadable music. Me & you both. Smiley They STILL exist. Wink

But, I downloaded this Snow band 1968 album at really random in music file-sharing site in 2012-13. Who knew Murry will be associated with this precise band I randomly discovered & people will discuss this obscure band few years later! Isn't it fantastic? I could've typed the other band name but I typed Snow back then! & actually, the results with "snow" brought several such band names, with country origin info in brackets & I clicked "Snow (US)"! Wow, right? 3D Talk about freaky coincidence. I've been ahead of time. 3D

It's indeed saying "1968", as krabklaw mentioned. It's good album. It's in Mamas & Papas, Spanky/Gang vein, as Don Malcolm stated but I shall disagree - it's miles better than either. I like - very - Cass' voice but otherwise find M&P pedestrian dull band with dull music. Ditto Spanky/Gang.

People here say they didn't like this "Break Away" but did anybody see it's short? 53 seconds, i.e. it's preview. Is it possible to definitively say it's nothing special when we didn't yet hear the full song? It can't be just 53 seconds, can it? Don't you think it's best to wait with final judgment till you hear the full song?

HeyJude, Don Goldberg stuff maybe thousand times better but you surely don't mean the "Out In The Country" with Don's lead, do you? The guy, obviously, can't sing, he's mediocre at best.
At least in "Break Away", we hear A quality vocals.

Yes, Don Malcolm, I knew waaay before the "Billy Jones Gone" song (as per above paragraphs); the female singer sounds *precisely* like female singer in BA preview snippet. I'd bet Murry collab'ed with *this precise* Snow band. She's got very good voice & harmonies sound very professional. Definitely not inferior than Mamas & Papas & similar sunshine pop vocal bands.
I liked the preview, can't wait to hear the full song! :D
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« Reply #42 on: December 18, 2019, 11:16:05 PM »

Something tells me that if The Beach Boys had never released Breakaway, this version would have been a big hit. Not that I like it that much, but it has that "sunshine pop" sound that seemed to be big for a while, like Spanky And Our Gang, or The Seekers("Georgie Girl").
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« Reply #43 on: December 19, 2019, 02:04:48 AM »

Was Rick Henn ever interviewed in depth about how Murry worked? That woud be quite interesting to compare with what we know about his sons.
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« Reply #44 on: December 19, 2019, 05:20:32 AM »

If the BBs version has the better verse, this has the better chorus
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« Reply #45 on: December 19, 2019, 05:31:00 AM »

And now Goldmine premieres Snow’s take on “We’re Together Again”… https://www.goldminemag.com/news/goldmine-premieres-music-from-murry-wilson-snows-breakaway-ep

What did Ron Wilson contribute to We're Together Again? Words? Music? Both?
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« Reply #46 on: December 19, 2019, 08:04:10 AM »

And now Goldmine premieres Snow’s take on “We’re Together Again”… https://www.goldminemag.com/news/goldmine-premieres-music-from-murry-wilson-snows-breakaway-ep

Thanks for posting that link. Too bad this song is repetitive to the point of self-parody, half-baked and tedious. Breakaway was weird and kind of cool in it's way, but this song has none of that. It goes to show that the Beach Boys magic voices could turn even a nothing song like this into something worth listening to.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2019, 08:12:22 AM by krabklaw » Logged

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« Reply #47 on: December 19, 2019, 09:04:51 AM »

And now Goldmine premieres Snow’s take on “We’re Together Again”… https://www.goldminemag.com/news/goldmine-premieres-music-from-murry-wilson-snows-breakaway-ep

Thanks for posting that link. Too bad this song is repetitive to the point of self-parody, half-baked and tedious. Breakaway was weird and kind of cool in it's way, but this song has none of that. It goes to show that the Beach Boys magic voices could turn even a nothing song like this into something worth listening to.

I agree The BBs' version somehow keeps the listener more engaged and less aware of the repetitious vocals, probably just because The BBs' vocals are better than Snow's. And I guess us nerds get an extra level of enjoyment listening to the little details in the vocals. Brian's slightly broken, longingly-sung vocals elevate the song tremendously.

I suppose "Were Together Again" might have a set of words (the title) that is sung the most most repetitious amount of times for the run time of the song, in the entire band's catalog, at least in terms of consecutively-sung lyrics sun repeatedly in a row. Or maybe it's neck and neck with "I Get Around", "Help Me, Rhonda" and "Barbara Ann". Maybe this one seems a bit unintentionally funnier because it keeps changing key over and over again near the end, almost like they're trying to up the ante one more time, then one more time, then one more time... I kinda feel a similar way about the bridge (?) of Adult/Child's "I'm Trying to Say" with the "baseball's on" lyric.

Even though I like the song, it almost feels like they're going for a "Too Many Cooks" theme song type of thing, where the idea is hammered into the head of the viewer a comically large number of times.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrGrOK8oZG8

I wonder if this Ron Wilson fellow was buddies with Snow, and if they brought him into the BBs' fold. Has that story ever been known, or is Ron Wilson's association with the band still a mystery?


« Last Edit: December 19, 2019, 09:19:43 AM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
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« Reply #48 on: December 19, 2019, 11:01:43 AM »

Presumably, that Ron Wilson is the same Ron Wilson for whom Brian produced a single (the original "I'll Keep On Loving You" b/w a version of "As Tears Go By") in '68.
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« Reply #49 on: December 19, 2019, 11:58:40 AM »

Presumably, that Ron Wilson is the same Ron Wilson for whom Brian produced a single (the original "I'll Keep On Loving You" b/w a version of "As Tears Go By") in '68.

Interesting, c-man. I did not know that.

I have to think there must've been some Wilson name jokes told at the time between those guys.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2019, 11:59:17 AM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
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