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640728 Posts in 25593 Topics by 3639 Members - Latest Member: treblephone December 09, 2018, 08:09:21 PM
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Poll
Question: Which do you think did better in 1964?
The Beach Boys
The Beatles

Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 Go Down Print
Author Topic: 1964: The Beach Boys vs. The Beatles  (Read 4605 times)
HeyJude
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« Reply #25 on: January 10, 2018, 10:10:30 AM »

Otherwise, what's the point of asking a *BEACH BOYS* message board which band they like more?

There's a point at which saying every year that "the Beach Boys spoke to my soul and the Beatles didn't" is going to get a bit redundant.
You didn't see that people in BBs message boards genuinely like Beatles & choose them to BBs?

If people say the phrase in quotes, what, they should lie & say Beatles' music spoke to soul to not be redundant? Doesn't make sense.


Yes, of course, some BB fans on this board have "voted" for the Beatles.

Of course I'm not suggesting someone lie about their preference. What I'm talking about is more the *worth* of this discussion itself.

If you just gather a bunch of fans of a given band and ask them if they like that band more or less than any other, the results are going to be *very* predictable. The 1963 vote was nearly 2-to-1 in favor the BBs. That kind of result would only take place on a BBs message board. Obviously.

If you get at least *a bit* outside of pure, 100% "what speaks to my soul" personal preference, then a discussion of the two bands can progress a bit.
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« Reply #26 on: January 10, 2018, 10:12:18 AM »

Itís nice to hear both sides, and considering this is a Beach Boys forum its interesting to see the Beatles are winning the poll.
Yep, despite HeyJude advising to be little objective or else Beach Boys board wouldn't pick Beatles, 8 posters did. F.ex., Add Some who chose Beatles this year by doing simple math - 13 favorite Beatles vs. 12 favorite BBs. I shall reiterate - it's the best & easiest way.

I don't think it's too far out of the realm of possibility for fans on a BB forum to cast votes for The Beatles.  After all, there wouldn't be a General Music subforum if the posters here only preferred to listen to Beach Boys related material. 
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« Reply #27 on: January 10, 2018, 10:17:48 AM »

2HeyJude: I like discussing & esp. comparing 2 music bands. It's fun! But, 2 can go hand in hand, right? You can be repetitive in choosing BBs every single year AND then discuss, muse about both bands etc. I don't see any problem there. It doesn't get in the way of discussing - till, of course, these people choose to keep silent.

2KDS: You agreed with me, then, actually.
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« Reply #28 on: January 10, 2018, 10:18:57 AM »

My point is that I think some fans' judgement are so clouded by the fact that The Beatles are more revered than The Beach Boys that they refuse to give The Beatles any credit. 

It would be like if you went on a Beatles page, and saw every other comment about The Beach Boys say throwaway surf music, or songs about hotrods, etc. 
Don't you think BBs fan's refusal to give credit to Beatles is due to genuine dislike of their material? It's possible & it exists. It can be like this - they read praises about Beatles, think hey should I check them, play music &...bam, they're absolutely clueless why Beatles got universal praise & reverence as s/he isn't impressed.

It's interesting, because if someone just *LOVES* the BBs but sees *nothing* of merit about the Beatles, I would question whether they're just rooting for their own team and are being pretty close-minded musically. (I'd say the same thing about Beatles fans disliking all of the BB's output).

I think few folks have this stark of a contrast between their enjoyment of the two bands.

But yes, while it's a small minority, KDS's point is valid; occasionally I have seen BB fans who seem to have a "my team was robbed" sort of attitude towards the Beatles.

*Occasionally*, the Beatles' popularity is weirdly used against them when comparing the two bands.
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« Reply #29 on: January 10, 2018, 10:23:46 AM »

2HeyJude: I like discussing & esp. comparing 2 music bands. It's fun! But, 2 can go hand in hand, right? You can be repetitive in choosing BBs every single year AND then discuss, muse about both bands etc. I don't see any problem there. It doesn't get in the way of discussing - till, of course, these people choose to keep silent.

2KDS: You agreed with me, then, actually.
\

I do agree that there may some some fans who've listened to the entire Beatles catalog who might not be into them.  Anything's possible.  I've seen people say that the TV show Seinfeld isn't funny.

But, I tend to see less comments to that effect on BB forums and more of the "I'm rooting for my team" concept that HJ alludes to. 
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« Reply #30 on: January 10, 2018, 10:26:49 AM »

Sorry, but if the Beatles had quit at the end of 1963 there would be little to sonically distinguish them (going by their albums only) fromtheir Mersey-side peers.

However, 1964 is different. I voted Beatles for 1964.
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« Reply #31 on: January 10, 2018, 10:30:22 AM »

I've seen people say that the TV show Seinfeld isn't funny.

Shocked *grabs pitchfork*
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« Reply #32 on: January 10, 2018, 10:33:05 AM »

Just to let you know, if we continue this poll for subsequent years, there will be years that I would vote for the Beatles.

Don't know how I can be totally objective. I am a singer who sang for over 40 years in various groups. The vocal tracks of songs such as When I Grow Up or She Knows Me Too Well never cease to amaze me.
If I was more of a musician I might feel differently, perhaps.

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« Reply #33 on: January 10, 2018, 10:34:33 AM »

I've seen people say that the TV show Seinfeld isn't funny.

Shocked *grabs pitchfork*

Crazy right?  But, much like tastes in music, it seems like tastes in comedy are ever changing.  I've had 20 somethings try to tell me that Rick & Morty, Bob's Burgers, Broad City, etc are the funniest shows on TV.  Meanwhile, I'm watching 20+ year old Seinfeld episodes on TBS.
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« Reply #34 on: January 10, 2018, 10:50:43 AM »

I've seen people say that the TV show Seinfeld isn't funny.

Shocked *grabs pitchfork*

Crazy right?  But, much like tastes in music, it seems like tastes in comedy are ever changing.  I've had 20 somethings try to tell me that Rick & Morty, Bob's Burgers, Broad City, etc are the funniest shows on TV.  Meanwhile, I'm watching 20+ year old Seinfeld episodes on TBS.

Yep! People have tried to get me into Bobís Burgers and I just donít get it. Give me Cheers or Seinfeld any day over that.

@HeyJude, might I suggest you be the one to kickstart the conversation you want to see? I think I and one other person mentioned the spiritual aspect (which is important to me, so Iím gonna mention it regardless of what people think of those opinions), which consisted of 2 or 3 posts, that leaves over 30-40 some posts in the thread wide open for discussion on individual Beatles tracks, their more cohesive albums, etc.

Frankly, I think thereís room for both personal outlooks and unbiased objectivity. Yes, the former doesnít yield much hard information on the Beatles, but it does give us a real human perspective on why we love The Beach Boys. Is it redundant? Yeah, but sometimes that redundancy sparks enjoyable and/or enlightening anecdotes from people. But I also value the informative posts that do change the way I look at certain bands/songs/etc. I think we benefit from it all here.
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« Reply #35 on: January 10, 2018, 10:57:56 AM »

I've seen people say that the TV show Seinfeld isn't funny.

Shocked *grabs pitchfork*

Crazy right?  But, much like tastes in music, it seems like tastes in comedy are ever changing.  I've had 20 somethings try to tell me that Rick & Morty, Bob's Burgers, Broad City, etc are the funniest shows on TV.  Meanwhile, I'm watching 20+ year old Seinfeld episodes on TBS.

Yep! People have tried to get me into Bobís Burgers and I just donít get it. Give me Cheers or Seinfeld any day over that.



I've tried I think 3-4 episodes of Bob's Burgers.   But, maybe chuckled a few times.  I think the modern Simpsons, which is now in it's Summer in Paradise phase, is funnier. 
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« Reply #36 on: January 10, 2018, 10:59:18 AM »

I Get Around on it's own  outweighs the entire Beatles catalogue.  Wink
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« Reply #37 on: January 10, 2018, 11:01:31 AM »

I've seen people say that the TV show Seinfeld isn't funny.

Shocked *grabs pitchfork*
Serenity Now!
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« Reply #38 on: January 10, 2018, 11:08:07 AM »

... After that?  The Beach Boys win every year BY DEFAULT ...

Not if we match up all Beach Boys related projects vs all Beatles related projects! The Beach Boys would win '77, probably '72, and possibly '78 and '79. The rest of the 70s and 1980 would be ALL Beatles!

By the way, I'm not suggesting we attempt this  LOL


Okay, 1964... this is tough, again. The Beach Boys were more productive in 1964. Ignoring their #1 live album (which included many songs that hadn't been otherwise released by the group), the Beach Boys released approx. 39 songs to the Beatles 33. Not a fan of the filler? Ignore them. The Beach Boys released that many extra tracks in 1964.

Some of my favorite '64 Beach Boys songs: Fun Fun Fun, I Get Around, Don't Worry Baby, She Knows Me Too Well, All Summer Long, Girls On The Beach, We'll Run Away, The Warmth of the Sun, Keep An Eye On Summer, Hushabye, Pom Pom Play Girl, Don't Back Down, Wendy, We Three Kings Of Orient Are. I could really go on, there are at least another dozen that I'm a fan of, but the word 'favorites' really loses meaning when you include all the songs  LOL

Some of my favorite '64 Beatles songs: If I Fell, I Should Have Known Better, And I Love Her, Tell Me Why, When I Get Home, You Can't Do That, I'll Be Back, No Reply, I'm A Loser, I Feel Fine, Baby's In Black, Long Tall Sally, Eight Days A Week, Every Little Thing, I Don't Want To Spoil The Party, I'll Follow The Sun. And I dig all the others as well.

Gosh, I love them both, equally, for different reasons!!! Brian and John were incredible in '64  Bow

It's honestly a TIE for me. Since that is not an option... WallThe Beatles Wall

I think Pet Sounds, Smile, and early album filler overshadow Brian's best work from '63, '64, and '65. It's just as great, if not greater at times.

As an aside, I didn't realize that When I Grow Up / She Knows Me Too Well was released 7 months prior to Today!, then they released Dance Dance Dance, and then they released Do You Wanna Dance / Please Let Me Wonder leading up to the release of Today!.
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« Reply #39 on: January 10, 2018, 11:13:29 AM »

I've seen people say that the TV show Seinfeld isn't funny.

Shocked *grabs pitchfork*
Serenity Now!



My reaction to hearing DIA Ď17

@B.E. Great post!! I gotta say that Eight Days A Week, in my mind, nearly rivals that of The Beach Boys best work in this year...those chords and harmonies are outstanding.
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« Reply #40 on: January 10, 2018, 11:15:22 AM »

... After that?  The Beach Boys win every year BY DEFAULT ...

Not if we match up all Beach Boys related projects vs all Beatles related projects! The Beach Boys would win '77, probably '72, and possibly '78 and '79. The rest of the 70s and 1980 would be ALL Beatles!

By the way, I'm not suggesting we attempt this  LOL


Okay, 1964... this is tough, again. The Beach Boys were more productive in 1964. Ignoring their #1 live album (which included many songs that hadn't been otherwise released by the group), the Beach Boys released approx. 39 songs to the Beatles 33. Not a fan of the filler? Ignore them. The Beach Boys released that many extra tracks in 1964.

Some of my favorite '64 Beach Boys songs: Fun Fun Fun, I Get Around, Don't Worry Baby, She Knows Me Too Well, All Summer Long, Girls On The Beach, We'll Run Away, The Warmth of the Sun, Keep An Eye On Summer, Hushabye, Pom Pom Play Girl, Don't Back Down, Wendy, We Three Kings Of Orient Are. I could really go on, there are at least another dozen that I'm a fan of, but the word 'favorites' really loses meaning when you include all the songs  LOL

Some of my favorite '64 Beatles songs: If I Fell, I Should Have Known Better, And I Love Her, Tell Me Why, When I Get Home, You Can't Do That, I'll Be Back, No Reply, I'm A Loser, I Feel Fine, Baby's In Black, Long Tall Sally, Eight Days A Week, Every Little Thing, I Don't Want To Spoil The Party, I'll Follow The Sun. And I dig all the others as well.

Gosh, I love them both, equally, for different reasons!!! Brian and John were incredible in '64  Bow

It's honestly a TIE for me. Since that is not an option... WallThe Beatles Wall

I think Pet Sounds, Smile, and early album filler overshadow Brian's best work from '63, '64, and '65. It's just as great, if not greater at times.

As an aside, I didn't realize that When I Grow Up / She Knows Me Too Well was released 7 months prior to Today!, then they released Dance Dance Dance, and then they released Do You Wanna Dance / Please Let Me Wonder leading up to the release of Today!.

Personally, I'd probably rate Brian's material from 63-65 higher than most of Smile (with the exception of GV and Surf's Up). 
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« Reply #41 on: January 10, 2018, 11:21:45 AM »

I've seen people say that the TV show Seinfeld isn't funny.

Shocked *grabs pitchfork*
Serenity Now!



My reaction to hearing DIA Ď17

@B.E. Great post!! I gotta say that Eight Days A Week, in my mind, nearly rivals that of The Beach Boys best work in this year...those chords and harmonies are outstanding.
Looks like Kramer stole Mikeís cabana wear....
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« Reply #42 on: January 10, 2018, 11:40:02 AM »

Sorry, but if the Beatles had quit at the end of 1963 there would be little to sonically distinguish them (going by their albums only) fromtheir Mersey-side peers.

However, 1964 is different. I voted Beatles for 1964.

I'm not sure why your comparison of the Beatles to other UK peers has to be confined only to albums. "She Loves You" is groundbreaking stylistically, and is far beyond other Merseyside/beat groups of that era. "I Want to Hold Your Hand" as well. I also tend to think other bands weren't often doing something as melodic nor as introspective as "There's a Place."

Sorry, even '63 Beatles are magic. They even made all the covers their own.
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« Reply #43 on: January 10, 2018, 11:57:46 AM »

... After that?  The Beach Boys win every year BY DEFAULT ...

Not if we match up all Beach Boys related projects vs all Beatles related projects! The Beach Boys would win '77, probably '72, and possibly '78 and '79. The rest of the 70s and 1980 would be ALL Beatles!

By the way, I'm not suggesting we attempt this  LOL


Okay, 1964... this is tough, again. The Beach Boys were more productive in 1964. Ignoring their #1 live album (which included many songs that hadn't been otherwise released by the group), the Beach Boys released approx. 39 songs to the Beatles 33. Not a fan of the filler? Ignore them. The Beach Boys released that many extra tracks in 1964.

Some of my favorite '64 Beach Boys songs: Fun Fun Fun, I Get Around, Don't Worry Baby, She Knows Me Too Well, All Summer Long, Girls On The Beach, We'll Run Away, The Warmth of the Sun, Keep An Eye On Summer, Hushabye, Pom Pom Play Girl, Don't Back Down, Wendy, We Three Kings Of Orient Are. I could really go on, there are at least another dozen that I'm a fan of, but the word 'favorites' really loses meaning when you include all the songs  LOL

Some of my favorite '64 Beatles songs: If I Fell, I Should Have Known Better, And I Love Her, Tell Me Why, When I Get Home, You Can't Do That, I'll Be Back, No Reply, I'm A Loser, I Feel Fine, Baby's In Black, Long Tall Sally, Eight Days A Week, Every Little Thing, I Don't Want To Spoil The Party, I'll Follow The Sun. And I dig all the others as well.

Gosh, I love them both, equally, for different reasons!!! Brian and John were incredible in '64  Bow

It's honestly a TIE for me. Since that is not an option... WallThe Beatles Wall

I think Pet Sounds, Smile, and early album filler overshadow Brian's best work from '63, '64, and '65. It's just as great, if not greater at times.

As an aside, I didn't realize that When I Grow Up / She Knows Me Too Well was released 7 months prior to Today!, then they released Dance Dance Dance, and then they released Do You Wanna Dance / Please Let Me Wonder leading up to the release of Today!.

Not to jump ahead, but I'd say "London Town" betters "MIU Album" (and I like both albums), and I'll throw in Ringo's "Heart on my Sleeve" against any of the lot.

As far as '79 both McCartney's "Back to the Egg" and Harrison's self-titled album better "LA (Light Album)", which I also adore.

But yes, I'll attempt to stay onto 1964.

While total number of "good" or "great" songs, regardless of filler, is one solid measure (though obviously still hugely subjective), I do think putting out *great albums* is a very, very important part of measuring the greatness of a band.

A huge hunk of, say, the "Surf's Up" album is among the BB's greatest work. But it also has one awful track ("Student Demonstration Time"), a sometimes enjoyable but very slight track ("Take a Load Off Your Feet"), and so on.

So the filler tracks from the BBs do bring down the sort of cumulative average. I'll even cut the BBs some slack in the regard because Capitol liked to thin out album but then put *more* albums out than in the UK. But if you look at the Beatles' thinned-out FIVE studio albums released in the US in 1964, culled in part from of course '63 material, there still isn't any filler.

There's no direct comparison, but if you stretched the BB's '64 output into another album or two and pulled some stuff from '63, there would *still* be some filler there.
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« Reply #44 on: January 10, 2018, 01:14:55 PM »

Yes, of course, some BB fans on this board have "voted" for the Beatles.
The 1963 vote was nearly 2-to-1 in favor the BBs. That kind of result would only take place on a BBs message board. Obviously.

If you get at least *a bit* outside of pure, 100% "what speaks to my soul" personal preference, then a discussion of the two bands can progress a bit.


I disagree to a point. ..A LOT.  Although the Beach Boys songs often mean more to me than those recorded by the Fabulous boys...it doesn't diminish the fact that the Liverpool Quartet spoke to more souls than just mine alone in 1964 and so, recognizing THAT, I felt compelled to give them the edge.  Holding down 5 of the top 5 positions on the 'hot 100' of the day as they did for a time in '64 suggests that I chose wisely.  None of that happened until after they arrived in New York in February 1964.

That the Beach Boys pounded the Beatles in '63 was the only outcome which made, or makes, sense to this very minute.  Paul's Group...sorry...John's Group. as of Jan 1st, 1964, were still weeks away from appearing on Ed Sullivan...I Want to Hold Your Gland and I Saw All 17 years of Her Standing There..."and my heart went BOOM!!!"...the double sided hit which introduced Beatles wigs into the vernacular...had yet to really see the light of American loafers as opposed to Beatle Boots.

No...in North America...The Beach Boys scored hit after hit after hit after hit.  They scaled the album charts with 3...count 'em 3 TOP l.p.s including Surfin USA, which was on the charts close to forever THAT year, along with Surfer Girl and Little Deuce Coupe.  Surfin' USA AND ShutDown, Surfer Girl AND Little Deuce Coupe, Be True to Your School and perhaps less obviously In My Room,  and a BETTER Christmas song than any seasonal offering the Beatles ever had a try at coupled with VERY impressive album sales to totally dominate 1963.  The only band which gave the Beach Boys a run for their money in '63 were the 4 Seasons.  [who sometimes shared the Vee-Jay label with that group from 'over 'ome/across the foam.']  All the Beatles could manage on this side of the Atlantic in 1963 was She Loves You ...ya ya ya...and in some spots Roll Over Beethoven.  The Beach Boys pounded the living daylights outta The Beetles-'with an A' in 1963.  It was, in fact, NO contest.  I was there...listening to the radio, buyin' the records and watching TV.  Wikipedia's info is not accurate or solid.

And when the Beatles did get the ball rolling...and  R O L L  it did...the 1 American band that stood up and accepted the challenge...in February...simultaneously...was the Fun Fun Fun/I Get Around/Don't Worry Baby/When I Grow Up/Dance Dance Dance...L.p. after L.p.  Beach Boys.  The fact that they would  go on to regain the TOP SPOT/Top Band accolades in 1966 is a testament to their talents and 'sticktoit-ness'.  I don't give a flyin' rat turd what board a person 'frequents'.  Dem's da facts.  In 1963 the Beach Boys owned the top spot...and then some.  Ya ya ya...YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I totally forgot about the Beach Boys Concert album in '64...one of the biggest selling albums of the year...in spite of faking I Get Around onto the tail end there...which I must say pissed me off a ton...and I was only 12...  Still gotta give the Beatles an edge.  To be honest...after all the practice the Beatles had in Germany and England...particularly Liverpool...in terms of performing live and gettin' TIGHT...when they hit America's shores in '64...they were better up on stage.  More show-biz...better rehearsed, tighter...and cooler clothes. [and hair].  All the Beach Boys could do was OUT SING 'em.  [and, at least, hold their own with the musical composition side of things]

Oh and as for pitting single solo Beatles up against the Beach Boys who, some say, are still touring to this very era...in fact 3 of them...Brian, Al and Blondie are heading out again this year...the Beatles fell off the grid in 1970.  So spin your spin in a different thread.  THIS ONE is all about The Beach Boys versus The Beatles...Band vs. Band.  Nice try. Razz
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« Reply #45 on: January 10, 2018, 01:18:48 PM »

Yes, of course, some BB fans on this board have "voted" for the Beatles.
The 1963 vote was nearly 2-to-1 in favor the BBs. That kind of result would only take place on a BBs message board. Obviously.

If you get at least *a bit* outside of pure, 100% "what speaks to my soul" personal preference, then a discussion of the two bands can progress a bit.


  and a BETTER Christmas song than any seasonal offering the Beatles ever had a try at coupled with VERY impressive album sales to totally dominate 1963. 

I'll say that's one thing that The Beach Boys can always say they bested The Beatles at, Christmas Music.  Even the Auld Lang Syne with the stumbling spoken word bit by Denny is better than The Beatles tone attempt at a Yuletide song "Christmas Time is Here Again." 

Although, to be fair, John later wrote what is IMO the greatest Christmas song of the popular music era.   
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« Reply #46 on: January 10, 2018, 01:29:00 PM »

But let's remember that "Christmas Time (Is Here Again)" was never intended to be released as a single or on an album. It was recorded as essentially background/interstitial music for a freebie fan club record.

Worth noting is that the Beatles never felt the need to cut an XMas album, nor did any of the solo Beatles apart from Ringo in the late 90s, who has chosen for whatever reason to churn out about 37 albums in the last 20 years.

Also, for whatever it's worth, Billboard's "Holiday 100" for the end of 2017 listed Lennon's "Happy XMas (War is Over)" at #20, McCartney's "Wonderful Christmastime" at #23, and the BB's "Little Saint Nick" at #35. All quite solid positions for such old songs, especially as the list becomes more and more inundated with stuff from the 80s, 90s, and 2000s.
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« Reply #47 on: January 10, 2018, 01:33:04 PM »

The thing with 1963 Beatles is that, yes, if you're going to measure impact in the US, then the Beatles were a non-issue until 1964.

But if we're going to look at popularity relative to native region, and/or just look at the quality of the released/recorded material, I think the Beatles still take it. If we go first album-to-first album, "Please Please Me" is immensely stronger than "Surfin' Safari." If we're going album-to-album in 1963, any one of "Please Please Me" or "With the Beatles" outdoes any '63 BB album front-to-back.
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« Reply #48 on: January 10, 2018, 01:33:26 PM »

But let's remember that "Christmas Time (Is Here Again)" was never intended to be released as a single or on an album. It was recorded as essentially background/interstitial music for a freebie fan club record.

Worth noting is that the Beatles never felt the need to cut an XMas album, nor did any of the solo Beatles apart from Ringo in the late 90s, who has chosen for whatever reason to churn out about 37 albums in the last 20 years.

Also, for whatever it's worth, Billboard's "Holiday 100" for the end of 2017 listed Lennon's "Happy XMas (War is Over)" at #20, McCartney's "Wonderful Christmastime" at #23, and the BB's "Little Saint Nick" at #35. All quite solid positions for such old songs, especially as the list becomes more and more inundated with stuff from the 80s, 90s, and 2000s.

That's true, but Christmas Time Again was reedited as a single and released along with Free As a Bird, so it's there.   And, I might as well give The Beach Boys an edge in something, right?  

I'm a little surprised Billboard rated McCartney's Xmas song so highly.  It seems like I see it on a ton of "Worst Xmas Song" lists (I 100% disagree).  
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« Reply #49 on: January 10, 2018, 01:36:59 PM »

McCartney's "Wonderful Christmastime" at #23, and the BB's "Little Saint Nick" at #35.

God that makes me sad. Replace McCartneyís name on that single with Joe Shmoe and it would get zero air-time.
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