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Author Topic: Brian August 1967 interview  (Read 21499 times)
Jim V.
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« Reply #75 on: April 24, 2015, 09:04:12 AM »

Third, some of it seems to be speculation of Marilyn (and Brian as told by Marilyn). She "thinks" some of these things.

So you know more than Brian's ex-wife, the person who laid next to him at the end of the day nearly every night from probably 1964 through 1977. The person he probably spoke unfiltered with the most in that time period. Nah, she don't know sh*t. Some person on the internet knows better because they spoke with Jim Lockert once.

You're so cute when you get all "Hey, Mr. Cruz!". Whoops, your obsession is showing.

I'm glad you enjoy it! You are just so interesting I can't help myself.

Fourth, do moderators ever read your posts?

Whoops, apparently it is bothering you after all. Seems like you're probably contacting the mods because you can't handle it. Sorry to see this. Feel better soon bud!

Not attempting to answer on Cam's behalf but Brian using pop and country stars on NPP hasn't seem to done him any harm, saleswise.

Brian also brought in *new material* which is something Mike's seemed incapable of recently. And while we're at it, yeah, Brian bringing in flavor of the months for any reason but artistic ones would be just as lame as Mike crassly trying to round up today's stars to in a pathetic attempt at becoming relevant again. So if indeed Brian and his team brought those people in for that reason, shame on them. But I will say it takes more guts to have the new big thing sing on something new rather than trying to rope in Toby Keith to sing "Be True to Your School."
« Last Edit: April 24, 2015, 09:30:50 AM by sweetdudejim » Logged
Mr. Verlander
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« Reply #76 on: April 24, 2015, 09:57:34 AM »

I think that it'd be nice if you guys would just sort of, you know, grow up a little bit.
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« Reply #77 on: April 24, 2015, 10:18:13 AM »

I guess they do.

Ted Cruz
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Autotune
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« Reply #78 on: April 24, 2015, 12:18:34 PM »

Cam may be relentless, granted, but he is respectful. He doesn't deserve to be chased by another poster. It'd be nice if the same energy and tone utilized a few days ago to defend certain opinions regarding voice processing on an album were used now to defend posters from being bullied.
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ontor pertawst
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« Reply #79 on: April 24, 2015, 12:45:04 PM »

Bullied? That's supposed to be bullying?
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« Reply #80 on: April 24, 2015, 12:48:49 PM »

Bullied? That's supposed to be bullying?

"Chasing" would work for you, Ontor? Let me know and I'll change the wording.
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« Reply #81 on: April 24, 2015, 12:51:37 PM »

No. What with the lack of chasing going on. It's two guys posting on a discussion board and butting heads, neither of whom have a drop of respect for the other.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2015, 12:53:30 PM by ontor pertawst » Logged
Cam Mott
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« Reply #82 on: April 24, 2015, 12:56:55 PM »

Third, some of it seems to be speculation of Marilyn (and Brian as told by Marilyn). She "thinks" some of these things.

So you know more than Brian's ex-wife, the person who laid next to him at the end of the day nearly every night from probably 1964 through 1977. The person he probably spoke unfiltered with the most in that time period. Nah, she don't know sh*t. Some person on the internet knows better because they spoke with Jim Lockert once.

You're so cute when you get all "Hey, Mr. Cruz!". Whoops, your obsession is showing.

I'm glad you enjoy it! You are just so interesting I can't help myself.

Fourth, do moderators ever read your posts?

Whoops, apparently it is bothering you after all. Seems like you're probably contacting the mods because you can't handle it. Sorry to see this. Feel better soon bud!

Not attempting to answer on Cam's behalf but Brian using pop and country stars on NPP hasn't seem to done him any harm, saleswise.

Brian also brought in *new material* which is something Mike's seemed incapable of recently. And while we're at it, yeah, Brian bringing in flavor of the months for any reason but artistic ones would be just as lame as Mike crassly trying to round up today's stars to in a pathetic attempt at becoming relevant again. So if indeed Brian and his team brought those people in for that reason, shame on them. But I will say it takes more guts to have the new big thing sing on something new rather than trying to rope in Toby Keith to sing "Be True to Your School."

I don't "know" better than "Marilyn", I just "know" that on many points she said she "thinks" instead of "knows".
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« Reply #83 on: April 24, 2015, 01:05:06 PM »

No. What with the lack of chasing going on. It's two guys posting on a discussion board and butting heads, neither of whom have a drop of respect for the other.

Exactly. This isn't new between them, either.  The moment either one of them gets put of hand, it will be handled.
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Jim V.
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« Reply #84 on: April 24, 2015, 01:09:38 PM »

No. What with the lack of chasing going on. It's two guys posting on a discussion board and butting heads.

And calling out bullshit when it's being thrown around as being as a "sensible" reading of events.

I don't "know" better than "Marilyn", I just "know" that on many points she said she "thinks" instead of "knows".

So, you're still saying that what you "think" is worth more than what she "thinks". I'd have to put more weight on the side of the woman who is the mother of both of Brian's biological children, who likely was the closest confidant of Brian's during the period in question. For some reason I take her opinions on how her husband was feeling over some guy who contacts companies about original SMiLE cover slicks. I listen to what she has to say and take that into others account of this period, instead of dismissing it because it doesn't fit my preconceived notion of how things happened back then. But then again, I'm not an ideologue. I'm just a fan on a message board trying to wade through the sh*t be propagated by some.
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Cam Mott
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« Reply #85 on: April 24, 2015, 01:14:21 PM »

So, you're still saying that what you "think" is worth more than what she "thinks".

Marilyn said "think" instead of "know", not me.
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« Reply #86 on: April 24, 2015, 01:18:26 PM »

So, you're still saying that what you "think" is worth more than what she "thinks".

Marilyn said "think" instead of "know", not me.

Soooooooo are you saying that Marilyn is mistaken? 
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CenturyDeprived
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« Reply #87 on: April 24, 2015, 01:21:47 PM »

So, you're still saying that what you "think" is worth more than what she "thinks".

Marilyn said "think" instead of "know", not me.

At what point can anything be considered "known"? If there was high-definition video of every single BB member's daily actions from 1961-present, would that constitute that certain events are "known", and in the absence of that, everything else is just interpretation with no person's statements more valuable than others?

We're getting into Flat Earth Society territory here.

If Marilyn said "know" and didn't say "think", you'd say she'd still be mistaken, right?  
« Last Edit: April 24, 2015, 01:46:24 PM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
Jim V.
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« Reply #88 on: April 24, 2015, 01:27:16 PM »

So, you're still saying that what you "think" is worth more than what she "thinks".

Marilyn said "think" instead of "know", not me.

You didn't answer though. Are you saying that what you "think" about this topic is worth more than what she thinks? Because you spoke once or twice with people she probably had numerous conversations with? Or because you've read books about people she saw day-in, day-out for around a decade and a half?
« Last Edit: April 24, 2015, 01:33:53 PM by sweetdudejim » Logged
Robbie Mac
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« Reply #89 on: April 24, 2015, 01:37:55 PM »

So, you're still saying that what you "think" is worth more than what she "thinks".

Marilyn said "think" instead of "know", not me.

At what point can anything be considered "known"? If there was high-definition video of every single BB member's daily actions from 1961-present, would that constitute that certain events are "known", and in the absence of that, everything else is just interpretation with no person's statements more valuable than others?

We're getting into Flat Earth Society territory here.

http://youtu.be/GiPe1OiKQuk

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Autotune
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« Reply #90 on: April 24, 2015, 01:40:09 PM »

So, you're still saying that what you "think" is worth more than what she "thinks".

Marilyn said "think" instead of "know", not me.

You didn't answer though. Are you saying that what you "think" about this topic is worth more than what she thinks? Because you spoke once or twice with people she probably had numerous conversations with? Or because you've read books about people she saw day-in, day-out for around a decade and a half?

Do you take at face value everything people associated with the BB organization say? Why should C Mott?
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CenturyDeprived
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« Reply #91 on: April 24, 2015, 01:46:38 PM »

So, you're still saying that what you "think" is worth more than what she "thinks".

Marilyn said "think" instead of "know", not me.

You didn't answer though. Are you saying that what you "think" about this topic is worth more than what she thinks? Because you spoke once or twice with people she probably had numerous conversations with? Or because you've read books about people she saw day-in, day-out for around a decade and a half?

Do you take at face value everything people associated with the BB organization say? Why should C Mott?

If Brian says that Murry hurt his feelings, do we really "know" this? Or is it ok to accept what he says in that specific circumstance, but not others?
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Jim V.
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« Reply #92 on: April 24, 2015, 02:08:31 PM »

So, you're still saying that what you "think" is worth more than what she "thinks".

Marilyn said "think" instead of "know", not me.

You didn't answer though. Are you saying that what you "think" about this topic is worth more than what she thinks? Because you spoke once or twice with people she probably had numerous conversations with? Or because you've read books about people she saw day-in, day-out for around a decade and a half?

Do you take at face value everything people associated with the BB organization say? Why should C Mott?

I surely don't. But I do take the differing words of all involved into account. For instance, like many I thought it was big, bad Mike Love who was the ringleader of the bullies who killed SMiLE. Then after more and more information came to light, my mind changed and now I see it as a combination of things....Brian being burnt out doing the big production things and keeping up in that "race", chasing the new "vibe" he was after (Smiley Smile, Wild Honey) and sure, as Brian said in the documentary, a little bit of trouble from Mike, which probably just put him in a not-so-great head space. So my mind changed. I realized that unlike what David Leaf wrote, The Beach Boys were five (or six....or even nine) guys who all brought something important to the table that made the music great. My mind changed due to both research by scholars, the words from those who were actually there, and yes, good discussion on this here board and it's predecessor, The Smile Shop.

So yeah, unlike certain others, I'm willing to admit I'm wrong to better understand the group and their history.
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Cam Mott
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« Reply #93 on: April 24, 2015, 04:44:21 PM »

So, you're still saying that what you "think" is worth more than what she "thinks".

Marilyn said "think" instead of "know", not me.

Soooooooo are you saying that Marilyn is mistaken? 

The first half she says as a fact.

I am saying that in the last half when she says * she thought they * or * she thought that he thought that they thought * that she means it the way I presume most of us do. It is informed but to some extent a perception, or presumption, or opinion, or guess which might be true or untrue or a mix of both.
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Jim V.
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« Reply #94 on: April 24, 2015, 04:49:58 PM »

So, you're still saying that what you "think" is worth more than what she "thinks".

Marilyn said "think" instead of "know", not me.

Soooooooo are you saying that Marilyn is mistaken? 

The first half she says as a fact.

I am saying that in the last half when she says * she thought they * or * she thought that he thought that they thought * that she means it the way I presume most of us do. It is informed but to some extent a perception, or presumption, or opinion, or guess which might be true or untrue or a mix of both.

Wow.  Thud

So you think she misunderstood the situation that she was basically right in the middle of for around a decade and a half? Interesting that it's hard for you to take what she has to say as much more than opinion, but if a certain bald, paunchy old man says something it's gospel.
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CenturyDeprived
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« Reply #95 on: April 24, 2015, 05:10:44 PM »

So, you're still saying that what you "think" is worth more than what she "thinks".

Marilyn said "think" instead of "know", not me.

Soooooooo are you saying that Marilyn is mistaken?  

The first half she says as a fact.

I am saying that in the last half when she says * she thought they * or * she thought that he thought that they thought * that she means it the way I presume most of us do. It is informed but to some extent a perception, or presumption, or opinion, or guess which might be true or untrue or a mix of both.

Cam - Would you question Brian for Brian saying that Murry hurt his feelings? Would this be subject for debate?

I'd like to know what reasoning would make you either question or not question such a statement that I'm sure Brian's made over the years. I'm trying to understand where and why the line is drawn.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2015, 07:12:56 PM by CenturyDeprived » Logged
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« Reply #96 on: April 24, 2015, 05:28:03 PM »

So, you're still saying that what you "think" is worth more than what she "thinks".

Marilyn said "think" instead of "know", not me.

Soooooooo are you saying that Marilyn is mistaken? 

The first half she says as a fact.

I am saying that in the last half when she says * she thought they * or * she thought that he thought that they thought * that she means it the way I presume most of us do. It is informed but to some extent a perception, or presumption, or opinion, or guess which might be true or untrue or a mix of both.

Wow.  Thud

So you think she misunderstood the situation that she was basically right in the middle of for around a decade and a half? Interesting that it's hard for you to take what she has to say as much more than opinion, but if a certain bald, paunchy old man says something it's gospel.

Been trying to stay neutral,  but this is a valid statement,  and I am interested in the answer.
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« Reply #97 on: April 24, 2015, 06:00:43 PM »

I'm running out of ways to say it.

She is saying what she thinks people think and even what she thinks people think other people think and she says "she thinks" (when she does) because it is to some degree speculative. Think as in have an opinion about what people think about what other people think.  No one else means it this way when they are discussing what they think other people are thinking?
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Jim V.
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« Reply #98 on: April 24, 2015, 06:58:36 PM »

I'm running out of ways to say it.

She is saying what she thinks people think and even what she thinks people think other people think and she says "she thinks" (when she does) because it is to some degree speculative. Think as in have an opinion about what people think about what other people think.  No one else means it this way when they are discussing what they think other people are thinking?

You are quite good at not answering. Perhaps politics really is your profession?

She is saying what she thinks "people" think? No, not quite. She was saying what her HUSBAND thought. The guy who probably confided a whole heck of a lot to her in their time together.

It astounds me that you're minimizing Marilyn's take on the subject. Why is that? Maybe because she was "only" his wife? I don't see why her opinion on this would be any less valid that Mr. Desper or anybody else who's spoken on the subject.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2015, 08:05:01 AM by sweetdudejim » Logged
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« Reply #99 on: April 25, 2015, 03:07:51 AM »

For whatever it is worth, this is how I see Marilyn's meaning; when she is reporting what she means as fact and what she is qualifying as her opinion.

Fact: He would slowly just stay in the bedroom, and let the guys record in the studio, since The Beach Boys paid for the studio, and it became more and more he would stay in bed – let them do their thing. He had a real hard time with the guys, after Pet Sounds and after Smile, because he felt guilty that he got all the attention, he was the one who was called the genius, and he felt the guys really resented that,

Opinion: and I think they did. I think it was very hard for them to understand ‘why is Brian Wilson singled out?’. But anyone with a brain would know why.

Fact: And it was very tough for him because he thought that they all hated him…

Opinion: I think it was like ‘OK you assholes, you think you can do as good as me or whatever – go ahead – YOU do it. You think it’s so easy? You do it’.

Maybe Marilyn will drop by here and correct or clarify.
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