Runaway Dancer available for purchase on itunes

[HeyJude]

I think Mike Love's issue wasn't so much the chart placement of that record but the fact that the record didn't pin at that position.  It was there one minute, gone the next.  But that is just the way the charts work these days with vintage artists.  Sustained success is a rare thing and that is something that just needs to be accepted at this point.  That way when you do see a vintage act with sustained success on the charts, it makes it that much sweeter.

Exactly. It isn't like the old days when Beatles singles entered the charts at #87 and climbed their way to #1. These days, they can monitor sales much more closely, and there's a huge first week rush where you get the bulk of sales from the fanbase. Unless something breaks huge and then gets a bunch of Grammies much later, it debuts at or near its peak position and then quickly falls. As you say, this is especially true of older acts.

As I mentioned, Mike's comments about TWGMTR show either a specific attempt to minimize the album's success in light of him not having participated to the degree he wanted, or huge confusion over how chart action happens these days. While I mentioned that my guess is that it's both, I think it's mostly the former, and I would guess it's informed not only by his frustration with songwriting input, but also just general sour grapes after the tour. At the C50 show I attended, Mike went on about how TWGMTR was #1 on the Amazon sales chart as a pre-order. He was touting the album's success before it had even come out.

Did anyone think a #3 chart placement for a band with zero presence even on *classic rock* radio, who hadn't released an album in 20 years, whose previous album didn't hit the top 200, was nothing but pretty impressive? We all know albums can hit high on the charts without selling hundreds of thousands. But that was good, and VERY GOOD PR/press, to tout a #3 album, their highest album chart placement in eons.

I'm sure Brian would love a #1 album or single. But I also think his continued work despite limited chart success as a solo artist is good, because the point is to keep creating. How often has Brian even commented on chart placement in interviews in the last couple decades?

[donald]

Love the live version.   Not the 80's schlock I was expecting after reading some of this thread.    Sweet, catchy, hooky, and melodic.   Hope the studio version is as good.

[The LEGENDARY OSD]

It's dependent on how someone reads the meaning of the word pandering, where it can just as easily be taken as suggesting something was done specifically to target or latch onto a specific goal, removing the notion of that artist doing exactly what they wanted to do with whomever they chose to work with. Of course musicians who work in the music business always have an eye toward reaching a bigger audience, and those that claim they do not in terms of "art" or "integrity" could ostensibly stage a show where they appear on stage and press play on a Mac laptop and begin destroying a guitar with a hammer, and call the results the performance. I guess that could be valid too if they get people to pay to see such a thing happen on stage repeatedly. But realistically, at some point even those performance artists would probably feel the need to mix things up a bit to attract more attention to their art, and might try smashing a trombone with a mallet to "mix things up" and attract a wider audience.  

Getting back to this collaboration in particular, I detect hints of some of the sentiments from last summer when some of the news of the collaborators started to leak out, and there were some claims that went so far as to suggest these collaborations were somehow "forced" onto Brian or onto both parties free of choice.

What if - just consider - Brian himself had heard something one of the future collaborators who will appear on the new album had recorded, really liked it or connected with it, and took the lead in reaching out to that musician with an eye toward a collaboration? There were ridiculous claims about him not being aware of some of the artists, then it came out from Brian directly that his children had a hand in suggesting he work with some current artists...don't you think through them he would have heard something, and possibly liked it enough to suggest trying to arrange a working session with that artist?

Since so much is assumed already without knowing the exact way things went down, let's consider Capital Cities. When Brian was deep in the process of writing, demo'ing, planning, etc some tracks for the upcoming album, "Safe And Sound" was getting massive airplay on commercial radio and was a pretty ubiquitous hit song that you'd hear regularly. Let's assume there was a possibility that on a random drive somewhere with the family, or on a random weekend afternoon when the kids were home and listening to music, he heard that record and simply dug the sounds and the groove? "Hey, who's that?" "Oh, that's Capital Cities, Dad!".  Maybe the trumpet hook caught Brian's attention, maybe it was the analog synth rhythm bed of that track, or maybe it had nothing to do with anything like that, but it's a possibility.

So Brian being a musician of note starts asking around and getting more info, getting the ball rolling, and it turns out there is a chance to meet up with Sebu from Capital Cities. Sebu may also have been a personal fan of Brian's work, maybe even as far as considering the way Brian used analog synths and Mini-Moogs and ARP's in the 70's to create Love You and others. So they connected, and what Brian was curious about as a producer and musician was what he heard in Sebu's work and wanted to see what it was all about, like the experienced magician getting a few new tricks from the next generation. And Sebu in return gets to do what many, many musicians have wanted to experience firsthand by working on a recording in the studio with Brian Wilson, to try to catch a glimpse of what it is that creates some of that magic that many have tried to analyze and experience from afar.

Isn't that scenario as a possibility just as valid as suggesting the two artists were crammed together to sell records and appeal to other demographics and fan bases? It's not discounting at all wanting to sell records and reach bigger audiences, but it's a different angle to view how it all came together and what could have happened to lead up to a collaboration being released as a single.

At some point, the most simple explanation - whether some want to believe it or not - of an artist like Brian hearing something new that he likes through whatever means (his family, a friend sharing a link, randomly hearing something on TV, etc)  then reaching out to the artist who created that work might have been what led to some of these collaborations.

It's just a different spin on it rather than suggesting something or anything was "forced" into happening for reasons other than choice or wanting to work with someone where there is mutual admiration for their works.

One thing to consider, for those who are bummed about Brian having newer artists doing vocals on new Brian material: IMHO... It's plainly obvious this could have been a Beach Boys album, and if Mike had just relented and not made his ego-driven writing demands, we probably would have a new Beach Boys album featuring only original Beach Boy members singing, with the added bonus of the absence of 1960s Beach Boy song title/lyric references in the lyrics. Most likely.

So, if one is in the camp of wanting to complain about Brian having other non BB-related vocalists on NPP, ultimately then, this is one more reason to be bummed at Mike. I don't see how the two can be mutually exclusive.

I'll choose to enjoy what we have with NPP, and I hope it kicks ass. I for one would rather have Brian getting to release more of his artful and sad songs without having to deal with a bandmate mock firing a gun to his head to mock the sad songs, even if that means some newer artists' vocals and less original Beach Boy member vocals.

Pretty much spot on.  From reading the interview Brian Wilson did a few weeks back where he talked about the new record, the upcoming film and The Beach Boys, it seems to me that Mike Love is the definition of persona non grata in the Wilson world.  Everything I read communicated to me that Brian Wilson just doesn't want to do business with his cousin anymore...washed his hands of him if you will.  As far as Mike Love's take on the situation, any time he's ready I'm sure many folks will be all ears.

I'm really anticipating this new record.  Unlike OSD however, I would've taken Mike Love and Bruce Johnston contributing to this record over any of the guest stars.  Mike still has one of the best bass voices in the business and I always regarded Bruce Johnston as underrated as well.  The problem lies in the idea that if Mike Love was involved with this record, would it have taken it's current form?  If Mike Love was willing to go along with Brian Wilson's musical direction for this project then I would have no problem with him being a part of it.  By his participation alone he would've made it better.  On the other hand if Mike Love's involvement would've mutated the record into a less desirable form, then it's probably best he sat out.  

So it's really a double edged sword.  Mike Love can still contribute mightily to any project based on his talents alone.  The alleged conflicts that seem to arise however from a Wilson/Love collaborative effort though well you would have to ask yourself if the ends would suit the means.

Mike can contribute mightily to any project? I'm trying to understand, from what I've heard of NPP, exactly how he could. "Daybreak Over The Ocean"?? "Picese Brothers"?? "Goin' To The Beach"??. To think that kind of drivel would be any part of any contribution to Brian's music, then I and everyone else should be extremely gratified that luHv either stayed home or was on the road singing "Rah, rah, rah sis boom bah" for the 2,456th time. Puleeeeezeeee. Thank god Brian is moving further and further away from the past.

[SMiLE Brian]

Can we have OSD introduce the BW band live as the MC!

[The LEGENDARY OSD]

Can we have OSD introduce the BW band live as the MC!

I always try to leave my calendar open for those kind of events. They'd like my fee as well-absolutely free! Anytime.

[JohnMill]

It's dependent on how someone reads the meaning of the word pandering, where it can just as easily be taken as suggesting something was done specifically to target or latch onto a specific goal, removing the notion of that artist doing exactly what they wanted to do with whomever they chose to work with. Of course musicians who work in the music business always have an eye toward reaching a bigger audience, and those that claim they do not in terms of "art" or "integrity" could ostensibly stage a show where they appear on stage and press play on a Mac laptop and begin destroying a guitar with a hammer, and call the results the performance. I guess that could be valid too if they get people to pay to see such a thing happen on stage repeatedly. But realistically, at some point even those performance artists would probably feel the need to mix things up a bit to attract more attention to their art, and might try smashing a trombone with a mallet to "mix things up" and attract a wider audience.  

Getting back to this collaboration in particular, I detect hints of some of the sentiments from last summer when some of the news of the collaborators started to leak out, and there were some claims that went so far as to suggest these collaborations were somehow "forced" onto Brian or onto both parties free of choice.

What if - just consider - Brian himself had heard something one of the future collaborators who will appear on the new album had recorded, really liked it or connected with it, and took the lead in reaching out to that musician with an eye toward a collaboration? There were ridiculous claims about him not being aware of some of the artists, then it came out from Brian directly that his children had a hand in suggesting he work with some current artists...don't you think through them he would have heard something, and possibly liked it enough to suggest trying to arrange a working session with that artist?

Since so much is assumed already without knowing the exact way things went down, let's consider Capital Cities. When Brian was deep in the process of writing, demo'ing, planning, etc some tracks for the upcoming album, "Safe And Sound" was getting massive airplay on commercial radio and was a pretty ubiquitous hit song that you'd hear regularly. Let's assume there was a possibility that on a random drive somewhere with the family, or on a random weekend afternoon when the kids were home and listening to music, he heard that record and simply dug the sounds and the groove? "Hey, who's that?" "Oh, that's Capital Cities, Dad!".  Maybe the trumpet hook caught Brian's attention, maybe it was the analog synth rhythm bed of that track, or maybe it had nothing to do with anything like that, but it's a possibility.

So Brian being a musician of note starts asking around and getting more info, getting the ball rolling, and it turns out there is a chance to meet up with Sebu from Capital Cities. Sebu may also have been a personal fan of Brian's work, maybe even as far as considering the way Brian used analog synths and Mini-Moogs and ARP's in the 70's to create Love You and others. So they connected, and what Brian was curious about as a producer and musician was what he heard in Sebu's work and wanted to see what it was all about, like the experienced magician getting a few new tricks from the next generation. And Sebu in return gets to do what many, many musicians have wanted to experience firsthand by working on a recording in the studio with Brian Wilson, to try to catch a glimpse of what it is that creates some of that magic that many have tried to analyze and experience from afar.

Isn't that scenario as a possibility just as valid as suggesting the two artists were crammed together to sell records and appeal to other demographics and fan bases? It's not discounting at all wanting to sell records and reach bigger audiences, but it's a different angle to view how it all came together and what could have happened to lead up to a collaboration being released as a single.

At some point, the most simple explanation - whether some want to believe it or not - of an artist like Brian hearing something new that he likes through whatever means (his family, a friend sharing a link, randomly hearing something on TV, etc)  then reaching out to the artist who created that work might have been what led to some of these collaborations.

It's just a different spin on it rather than suggesting something or anything was "forced" into happening for reasons other than choice or wanting to work with someone where there is mutual admiration for their works.

One thing to consider, for those who are bummed about Brian having newer artists doing vocals on new Brian material: IMHO... It's plainly obvious this could have been a Beach Boys album, and if Mike had just relented and not made his ego-driven writing demands, we probably would have a new Beach Boys album featuring only original Beach Boy members singing, with the added bonus of the absence of 1960s Beach Boy song title/lyric references in the lyrics. Most likely.

So, if one is in the camp of wanting to complain about Brian having other non BB-related vocalists on NPP, ultimately then, this is one more reason to be bummed at Mike. I don't see how the two can be mutually exclusive.

I'll choose to enjoy what we have with NPP, and I hope it kicks ass. I for one would rather have Brian getting to release more of his artful and sad songs without having to deal with a bandmate mock firing a gun to his head to mock the sad songs, even if that means some newer artists' vocals and less original Beach Boy member vocals.

Pretty much spot on.  From reading the interview Brian Wilson did a few weeks back where he talked about the new record, the upcoming film and The Beach Boys, it seems to me that Mike Love is the definition of persona non grata in the Wilson world.  Everything I read communicated to me that Brian Wilson just doesn't want to do business with his cousin anymore...washed his hands of him if you will.  As far as Mike Love's take on the situation, any time he's ready I'm sure many folks will be all ears.

I'm really anticipating this new record.  Unlike OSD however, I would've taken Mike Love and Bruce Johnston contributing to this record over any of the guest stars.  Mike still has one of the best bass voices in the business and I always regarded Bruce Johnston as underrated as well.  The problem lies in the idea that if Mike Love was involved with this record, would it have taken it's current form?  If Mike Love was willing to go along with Brian Wilson's musical direction for this project then I would have no problem with him being a part of it.  By his participation alone he would've made it better.  On the other hand if Mike Love's involvement would've mutated the record into a less desirable form, then it's probably best he sat out.  

So it's really a double edged sword.  Mike Love can still contribute mightily to any project based on his talents alone.  The alleged conflicts that seem to arise however from a Wilson/Love collaborative effort though well you would have to ask yourself if the ends would suit the means.

Mike can contribute mightily to any project? I'm trying to understand, from what I've heard of NPP, exactly how he could. "Daybreak Over The Ocean"?? "Picese Brothers"?? "Goin' To The Beach"??. To think that kind of drivel would be any part of any contribution to Brian's music, then I and everyone else should be extremely gratified that luHv either stayed home or was on the road singing "Rah, rah, rah sis boom bah" for the 2,456th time. Puleeeeezeeee. Thank god Brian is moving further and further away from the past.

Mountain = 365 days (+ same song) + one more day = now it's day 366...will you be there on day 367?

As far as speaking for "everyone else", I find Mike Love to be an excellent bass vocalist and a pretty darn good showman/master of ceremonies as well.  From where I stand he can still contribute mightily to any project he so chooses.  That being said as I detailed above from where I stand it is creative matters that probably should dictate Mike Love and Brian Wilson toiling in separate vineyards going forward.  

For the record I mentioned from the onset that I was going to give NPP the benefit of the doubt and I do find it to be very pleasing to the ear.  If Mike Love ever endeavors to release a new album's worth of music (as has been rumored about) I'd be willing to give him the benefit of the doubt until I hear it.

[The LEGENDARY OSD]

"Summer In Paradise Vol. 2" anyone?? ...Anyone...?  crickets.  

[the professor]

I find it pointless to pit The Beach Boys against one another in competition based on historical examples. Rather, consider what the beachboys could accomplish together if their hearts were open to shared creativity and accomplishment. but all such accomplishment is contingent upon both cooperation and also inspiration. If the Beach Boys were to reunite I would only hope that they would be inspired to transcend any of their individual or collective weaknesses or failed creations of the past. while the reunion  is only theoretical it is impossible to judge what they would potentially accomplish in that imaginary future.

[The LEGENDARY OSD]

I find it pointless to pit The Beach Boys against one another in competition based on historical examples. Rather, consider what the beachboys could accomplish together if their hearts were open to shared creativity and accomplishment. but all such accomplishment is contingent upon both cooperation and also inspiration. If the Beach Boys were to reunite I would only hope that they would be inspired to transcend any of their individual or collective weaknesses or failed creations of the past. while the reunion  is only theoretical it is impossible to judge what they would potentially accomplish in that imaginary future.

They gave "togetherness" a shot back in 2012, but since luHv couldn't get things his way, he made a beeline for his warped version of The Beach Boys  before any "positivity" could gather momentum.

[Jim V.]

I find it pointless to pit The Beach Boys against one another in competition based on historical examples. Rather, consider what the beachboys could accomplish together if their hearts were open to shared creativity and accomplishment. but all such accomplishment is contingent upon both cooperation and also inspiration. If the Beach Boys were to reunite I would only hope that they would be inspired to transcend any of their individual or collective weaknesses or failed creations of the past. while the reunion  is only theoretical it is impossible to judge what they would potentially accomplish in that imaginary future.

They gave "togetherness" a shot back in 2012, but since luHv couldn't get things his way, he made a beeline for his warped version of The Beach Boys  before any "positivity" could gather momentum.

That is the sad truth professor. The group was back together, things were happening the way they should be (hit album, huge tour, lots of press, Brian planning new album) and Mike pulled the plug. Is he allowed to have his gripes about how things are done? Yes. But he alone chose not to continue. As far as I understand it, the rest were good to go (and I don't count Bruce, because really, who cares?).

[Wirestone]

Anyway, let's talk about the track.

I'm increasingly impressed. It's so tight; every element is exactly in the right place. I'm especially fond of how the intro is repeated as the bridge. (That also happened in How Can We Still be Dancing, IIRC.)

Brian sounds terrific -- not overly processed, which is kind of odd, given that it's the one genre where you'd expect it!

[the professor]

Perhaps it's the visual excitement, but I am enjoying the live version much more than the record. I tried to put it in circulation with the Right Time and Our Special Love, but it did not fit. Perhaps it will in the whole album. The live performance is so much more tangible.  Brian sounds good, and all in all the play across various genres and with various artists and styles in the album is a major artistic accomplishment that really only Brian could pull off.

Anyway, let's talk about the track.

I'm increasingly impressed. It's so tight; every element is exactly in the right place. I'm especially fond of how the intro is repeated as the bridge. (That also happened in How Can We Still be Dancing, IIRC.)

Brian sounds terrific -- not overly processed, which is kind of odd, given that it's the one genre where you'd expect it!

[Awesoman]

it's not on Rhapsody yet. Please lets have some detailed analysis and scholarly critique. I do not have i-tunes--it crashed my computer. Is it a good song or a bad song? Disco? Here comes the night?

The song is pretty good.  What kind of computer you using that can't play iTunes?  An Amiga?

[MrRobinsonsFather]

Thanks for the info Ray

This song reminds me of some of the tracks from Paul's New album. For me the drum beats are too prominent. I'm not a fan of that techno sound. Other than that ,song wise I like it.

Can't wait for the album, particularly Tell Me Why

[Yorick]

The name Brian Wilson has never been commercially successful on it's own and I doubt that this album will change it. Runaway Dancer alienates Brian's and the Beach Boys' audience and won't attract a new one. A miscalculation.

[Zesterz]

Once again, I find Ray Lawlor' s comments and explanations the best and most fascinating I have ever read on the subject of B W. Should have been a writer !!!

[MarcellaHasDirtyFeet]

The name Brian Wilson has never been commercially successful on it's own and I doubt that this album will change it. Runaway Dancer alienates Brian's and the Beach Boys' audience and won't attract a new one. A miscalculation.

Miscalculation?! How the hell is it a miscalculation if I'm enjoying it so damn much?!

[Mendota Heights]

The name Brian Wilson has never been commercially successful on it's own and I doubt that this album will change it. Runaway Dancer alienates Brian's and the Beach Boys' audience and won't attract a new one. A miscalculation.

Can you give ample examples of Brian's fanbase turning away from Brian after the release of Runaway Dancer?

How big was his fanbase before the release and how big is it now?

[JohnMill]

The name Brian Wilson has never been commercially successful on it's own and I doubt that this album will change it. Runaway Dancer alienates Brian's and the Beach Boys' audience and won't attract a new one. A miscalculation.

Can you give ample examples of Brian's fanbase turning away from Brian after the release of Runaway Dancer?

How big was his fanbase before the release and how big is it now?

He makes a valid point regarding Brian Wilson's marketability as a solo artist* and backs it up with a reasonable prediction that his new record won't bring in a new audience.  But then he nosedives off a cliff when he claims that some of the more adventurous tracks on NPP will alienate Brian's fanbase.  He overestimates the number of fans in this category which are likely very small and confined to the selection of people who think they know what is better for Brian than Brian himself.

* I think Brian Wilson's profile as a solo artist may get a bit of a bump this year thanks to the upcoming film.  Ray Charles' film did wonders for him in terms of introducing him to a new audience as did Johnny Cash's.  The same possibility/opportunity is there for Brian Wilson enabling him to get a bit of a profile bump in terms of name recognition.  That being said I think if anything the upcoming film will result in a spike in sales of Beach Boys records rather than his solo catalog as the music Brian Wilson created in the sixties is still the main attraction.  Still I expect Brian Wilson to get a bit of a bump this year.  Exciting times.

[Shady]

I'm clocking up a ridiculous amount of listens to this song, It's so addictive.

Inspired choice to open the album

[The Cincinnati Kid]

Someone should update the No Pier Pressure Wiki page.  Especially adding what Ray said as it goes against the "review" that was posted on the page.

[rab2591]

I'm clocking up a ridiculous amount of listens to this song, It's so addictive.

Inspired choice to open the album

Agreed! I can't see this song being placed anywhere else. The rest of the songs, besides Saturday Night, seem far more chill and relaxed...put this in the middle of those and it would kinda break the flow.

[Rich E P]

Just wanted to express my thanks to Ray Lawlor for coming in and sharing his great insight.  I love to know how songs are birthed.  I always enjoying hearing stories of demos and how songs morph into their final versions.  A great look into an artist's process.  Thanks again, Ray, for helping to make this board a great place to visit.

[Ron]

Hopefully somebody can answer this:

The instrumentation... has Brian got an entirely new band on this new album? 

It sounds to me like he started working with a lot of new musicians, and because of his generally collaborative way of coming up with music in the studio, they've led him in new directions.


Personally, I like the song, but all I've heard is the live version on youtube.

[guitarfool2002]

Hopefully somebody can answer this:

The instrumentation... has Brian got an entirely new band on this new album? 

It sounds to me like he started working with a lot of new musicians, and because of his generally collaborative way of coming up with music in the studio, they've led him in new directions.


Personally, I like the song, but all I've heard is the live version on youtube.

Just from what's been seen and heard so far, he has a combination of some real heavy-hitter session players, and some familiar names and faces from his bands of the past 15 years. For the session players, how about Jim Keltner and Kenny Aronoff (drums), Dean Parks (gtr), and Don Was (bass)? Right there alone that's one hell of a rhythm section, among the best in the business on those instruments in the studio, and I think you may be hearing what players like that could bring to the table in the way of different sounds and feels. Even if strictly reading a part, drummers like Keltner and Aronoff bring a style and sound to the table that's their own. It will come through in the groove.