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Author Topic: The Lorren Daro Thread  (Read 77111 times)
Mujan, 8@$+@Rc| of a Blue Wizard
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« Reply #675 on: January 30, 2015, 10:57:41 AM »

In the end, if I were hypothetically an invited "Honored guest" (or an already established one being asked to return) to the SS forum, I certainly would think twice about accepting such invite.

I'd say, as long as you're a decent person who's not out to make a name for himself, you're fine.
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Here are my SMiLE Mixes. All are 2 suite, but still vastly different in several ways. Be on the lookout for another, someday.

Aquarian SMiLE>HERE
Dumb Angel (Olorin Edition)>HERE
Dumb Angel [the Romestamo Cut]>HERE

& This is a new pet project Ive worked on, which combines Fritz Lang's classic film, Metropolis (1927) with The United States of America (1968) as a new soundtrack. More info is in the video description.
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« Reply #676 on: January 30, 2015, 11:02:16 AM »

I never blamed Lorren and his crew for putting Brian on the path to drug problems before he posted here and I still don't. Same as I don't blame the bartender who gave Dennis his first beer or the 7/11 guy who sold Carl his first pack of smokes. I held no opinion on the guy one way or another. However, since he posted here I've seen plenty of reasons to dislike the guy.
MURRY - OK Murry was an abusive dick, so Lorren gets a pass here.
MIKE - Oh heavens above, so Mike didn't agree with every creative whim that popped out of Brian's head, so what? NEWSFLASH LORREN! He was in the band with Brian, not you. Right or wrong, he was entitled to give his views on material presented. This may make him a pain in the ass but it does not make him Satan. Ultimately, Mike went along with just about every idea Brian had, singing take after take to Brian's satisfaction. Maybe if you hadn't found watching people working on songs 'boring' you might have noticed.
MARILYN - Your comments on her were just disgusting. I don't care if she was a total bitch to you back in the day, she stuck with Brian long after the party was over and had to try pick up the pieces. You on the other hand, f***ed off the second Brian stopped being fun to hang around with. I asked before if you knew the term 'fairweather friend'? Silly me! Of course you do, it's a phrase used in I Just Wasn't Made For These Times, the song Brian 'wrote' about you.  Roll Eyes
DENNIS & CARL - "Both kinda stupid" you said. They were both still in their teens! Forgive them for not jerking off to the works of Arthur Koestler between vocal takes, you pretentious old windbag.
ON YOUR OWN LAUGHABLY SELF IMPORTANT VIEW OF YOUR PLACE IN BB HISTORY - You seem to think that if not for you giving Brian his first trip and turning him 'hip' Brian would have never grown to be the artist he did. Brian's music had been growing more and more sophisticated from the Sufer Girl album onwards. Listen to All Summer Long, Today! or his work with other artists from 1963-64. Other than sharing a mutual friend of Tony Asher, you did jack for his creativity.
The last section, I find so true. Brian's early work was a preview of his great gift. And, yes, on All Summer Long, Today, Shut Down, vol. 2., the progression of his composing his own work and arranging of others' was coming along beautifully, nothing short of amazing...you hit the nail right on the head!    Wink
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« Reply #677 on: January 30, 2015, 11:05:37 AM »

(Double post)

Good place to say TGIF  Beer
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« Reply #678 on: January 30, 2015, 11:30:27 AM »

I never blamed Lorren and his crew for putting Brian on the path to drug problems before he posted here and I still don't. Same as I don't blame the bartender who gave Dennis his first beer or the 7/11 guy who sold Carl his first pack of smokes. I held no opinion on the guy one way or another. However, since he posted here I've seen plenty of reasons to dislike the guy.
MURRY - OK Murry was an abusive dick, so Lorren gets a pass here.
MIKE - Oh heavens above, so Mike didn't agree with every creative whim that popped out of Brian's head, so what? NEWSFLASH LORREN! He was in the band with Brian, not you. Right or wrong, he was entitled to give his views on material presented. This may make him a pain in the ass but it does not make him Satan. Ultimately, Mike went along with just about every idea Brian had, singing take after take to Brian's satisfaction. Maybe if you hadn't found watching people working on songs 'boring' you might have noticed.
MARILYN - Your comments on her were just disgusting. I don't care if she was a total bitch to you back in the day, she stuck with Brian long after the party was over and had to try pick up the pieces. You on the other hand, f***ed off the second Brian stopped being fun to hang around with. I asked before if you knew the term 'fairweather friend'? Silly me! Of course you do, it's a phrase used in I Just Wasn't Made For These Times, the song Brian 'wrote' about you.  Roll Eyes
DENNIS & CARL - "Both kinda stupid" you said. They were both still in their teens! Forgive them for not jerking off to the works of Arthur Koestler between vocal takes, you pretentious old windbag.
ON YOUR OWN LAUGHABLY SELF IMPORTANT VIEW OF YOUR PLACE IN BB HISTORY - You seem to think that if not for you giving Brian his first trip and turning him 'hip' Brian would have never grown to be the artist he did. Brian's music had been growing more and more sophisticated from the Sufer Girl album onwards. Listen to All Summer Long, Today! or his work with other artists from 1963-64. Other than sharing a mutual friend of Tony Asher, you did jack for his creativity.
The last section, I find so true. Brian's early work was a preview of his great gift. And, yes, on All Summer Long, Today, Shut Down, vol. 2., the progression of his composing his own work and arranging of others' was coming along beautifully, nothing short of amazing...you hit the nail right on the head!    Wink


To be fair, I do think psychedelics can provide powerful inspiration for a person's creativity. And ego death can be a wonderful tool for self-analysis and learning to respect others more.

But yes, while it may not have come along as quickly, I do think Brian would have made a Pet Sounds and SMiLE without acid. They'd be different albums, but probably just as good, and as someone else said, his creative peak probably would have lasted longer without acid.

Psychedelics take what's already in your mind and enhance it. And Brian was genetically prone to mental illness, with unbelievable stress, painful memories of abuse, and self-doubt to boot. He was not a person that should have been doing acid. It's NOT Daro's fault that he did it. As you all keep saying, he was an adult, responsible for his own choices. But still, I don't think Daro ought to whitewash the after-effects either. I don't think being the guy who gave Brian Wilson acid is anything to brag about. And for him to call Brian's growth *his* (Daro's) contribution to the world is just straight narcissicism bordering on megalomaniac.

Even ignoring the topic of acid, there's plenty of other reasons to dislike this Daro guy. Some of you going out of your way to praise him or excuse him really confound me. Again I ask, if murry were here as an "honored guest" (a title which was never bestowed upon Daro himself, anyway) would you all be sucking up to him too?
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Here are my SMiLE Mixes. All are 2 suite, but still vastly different in several ways. Be on the lookout for another, someday.

Aquarian SMiLE>HERE
Dumb Angel (Olorin Edition)>HERE
Dumb Angel [the Romestamo Cut]>HERE

& This is a new pet project Ive worked on, which combines Fritz Lang's classic film, Metropolis (1927) with The United States of America (1968) as a new soundtrack. More info is in the video description.
The American Metropolitan Circus>HERE
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« Reply #679 on: January 30, 2015, 12:00:59 PM »

Even ignoring the topic of acid, there's plenty of other reasons to dislike this Daro guy. Some of you going out of your way to praise him or excuse him really confound me.

And you making post after post crucifying the guy is equally as confounding.
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« Reply #680 on: January 30, 2015, 12:07:20 PM »

Even ignoring the topic of acid, there's plenty of other reasons to dislike this Daro guy. Some of you going out of your way to praise him or excuse him really confound me.

And you making post after post crucifying the guy is equally as confounding.

What can I say? The man struck a nerve with me. A visceral feeling of disgust I feel the need to express.

I think I gained a whole lot of respect for Marilyn and Mike Love tho, reading this thread. So at least something positive happened. I now understand why Mike was so distrustful of Brian's friends if they were all even a fraction as disrespectful and openly loathsome as Daro. And poor Marilyn's sufferings need no explanation. I can't imagine how much it must have hurt to have your husband choose a knob like him over you.

Very sad situation all around.
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Here are my SMiLE Mixes. All are 2 suite, but still vastly different in several ways. Be on the lookout for another, someday.

Aquarian SMiLE>HERE
Dumb Angel (Olorin Edition)>HERE
Dumb Angel [the Romestamo Cut]>HERE

& This is a new pet project Ive worked on, which combines Fritz Lang's classic film, Metropolis (1927) with The United States of America (1968) as a new soundtrack. More info is in the video description.
The American Metropolitan Circus>HERE
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« Reply #681 on: January 30, 2015, 12:24:26 PM »

In the end, if I were hypothetically an invited "Honored guest" (or an already established one being asked to return) to the SS forum, I certainly would think twice about accepting such invite.
He wasn't really an honored guest... I moved it here because it was basically a q&a session. He wasn't invited... he registered like all of us once did.
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« Reply #682 on: January 30, 2015, 12:33:42 PM »

Even ignoring the topic of acid, there's plenty of other reasons to dislike this Daro guy. Some of you going out of your way to praise him or excuse him really confound me.

And you making post after post crucifying the guy is equally as confounding.
And so is the vitrol he gets for voicing how he feels.

Just my two cents.
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« Reply #683 on: January 30, 2015, 01:12:19 PM »

Vitr(i)ol? Really? I'm not seeing it.

vit·ri·ol/ˈvitrēəl,ˈvitrēˌôl/
noun
1.cruel and bitter criticism.
2.sulfuric acid.

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« Reply #684 on: January 30, 2015, 01:24:16 PM »

Vitr(i)ol? Really? I'm not seeing it.

vit·ri·ol/ˈvitrēəl,ˈvitrēˌôl/
noun
1.cruel and bitter criticism.
2.sulfuric acid.



Not trying to whine about it, but buddhahat seems to take any criticism of Daro very personally for some reason. A lot of what he said was unnecessarirly personal and mean. I'm not upset about it, I'm a big boy and can handle myself, but it might fall under the definition of what you'd call "vitriol."

But who cares. I kept relatively civil while he was here so questions could be answered, but now that he's gone the time has come to appraise what was said while he was here. And considering the poor quality of his submissions, it baffles me how defensive some of you are getting on his behalf. All this bemoaning how "we could have learned something" is ludicrous. He said his say. Nothing revelatory or interesting came of it. All self serving lies, contradictions, slander about others and childish insults at anyone not completely on his side here. It should be obvious now that he had nothing substantial to tell us, so I don't understand why some of you are so keen to defend him.
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Here are my SMiLE Mixes. All are 2 suite, but still vastly different in several ways. Be on the lookout for another, someday.

Aquarian SMiLE>HERE
Dumb Angel (Olorin Edition)>HERE
Dumb Angel [the Romestamo Cut]>HERE

& This is a new pet project Ive worked on, which combines Fritz Lang's classic film, Metropolis (1927) with The United States of America (1968) as a new soundtrack. More info is in the video description.
The American Metropolitan Circus>HERE
[
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« Reply #685 on: January 30, 2015, 01:47:22 PM »

Vitr(i)ol? Really? I'm not seeing it.

vit·ri·ol/ˈvitrēəl,ˈvitrēˌôl/
noun
1.cruel and bitter criticism.
2.sulfuric acid.


http://i.word.com/idictionary/vitriol

And please forgive me for spelling it wrong at first...this phone is not that easy to type on
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« Reply #686 on: January 30, 2015, 01:55:36 PM »

I haven't see anyone praising Lorren in all this, so that's a crock.  All people were asking for was detachment and a chance to listen to him, whether he was right or wrong about things.  No-one had to like him or agree with what was said.  I don't get why people took what he said so personally.   He's a historical figure talking about other figures in the BB history.  That he feels so strongly, rightly or wrongly, was fascinating to witness in itself.  What we ended up with was just certain posters' desire to moralise taking precedence over the good of the board and putting their own feelings to the forefront.  It's putting themselves (mostly anonymous fans) at the same level of importance as Daro (a player in the history), as if their own feelings about it matter at all.  They don't matter.  It was pure egotism.
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« Reply #687 on: January 30, 2015, 01:59:40 PM »

I haven't see anyone praising Lorren in all this, so that's a crock.  All people were asking for was detachment and a chance to listen to him, whether he was right or wrong about things.  No-one had to like him or agree with what was said.  I don't get why people took what he said so personally.   He's a historical figure talking about other figures in the BB history.  That he feels so strongly, rightly or wrongly, was fascinating to witness in itself.  What we ended up with was just certain posters' desire to moralise taking precedence over the good of the board and putting their own feelings to the forefront.  It's putting themselves (mostly anonymous fans) at the same level of importance as Daro (a player in the history), as if their own feelings about it matter at all.  They don't matter.  It was pure egotism.

I keep swearing that I'm done posting in this thread...but....YA!!!  That about sums it up...

And the pissing contest trickles on.
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« Reply #688 on: January 30, 2015, 02:09:32 PM »

I haven't see anyone praising Lorren in all this, so that's a crock.  All people were asking for was detachment and a chance to listen to him, whether he was right or wrong about things.  No-one had to like him or agree with what was said.  I don't get why people took what he said so personally.   He's a historical figure talking about other figures in the BB history.  That he feels so strongly, rightly or wrongly, was fascinating to witness in itself.  What we ended up with was just certain posters' desire to moralise taking precedence over the good of the board and putting their own feelings to the forefront.  It's putting themselves (mostly anonymous fans) at the same level of importance as Daro (a player in the history), as if their own feelings about it matter at all.  They don't matter.  It was pure egotism.

I didn't say praise, I said defend. You had your chance and heard what he had to say. He left because his story was full of holes and AGD was calling him on it. He couldn't defend his own story, so he played the hounded victim card and fled. If you wanna cry about it, that's on you. What did you really learn from what he said? Not much, I reckon? Do you really think he had that many amusing anecdotes bottled up that he just forgot to tell us yet? Me neither. His role in the BB story is the guy who gave Brian acid and happened to throw parties where he met some future collaborators. That's it.

The fact that he's also trying to plug himself as the guy who tried to save Brian from everyone else--including that *awful* Marilyn, who had the audacity to love him and worry about him--actually makes him look worse. And it doesn't even hold up, considering he bailed when the going got tough. It's not moralizing, it's just refusing to suck up to a despicable person for useless info.

The only one guilty of egotism is Daro.
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Here are my SMiLE Mixes. All are 2 suite, but still vastly different in several ways. Be on the lookout for another, someday.

Aquarian SMiLE>HERE
Dumb Angel (Olorin Edition)>HERE
Dumb Angel [the Romestamo Cut]>HERE

& This is a new pet project Ive worked on, which combines Fritz Lang's classic film, Metropolis (1927) with The United States of America (1968) as a new soundtrack. More info is in the video description.
The American Metropolitan Circus>HERE
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« Reply #689 on: January 30, 2015, 02:24:16 PM »

Vitr(i)ol? Really? I'm not seeing it.

vit·ri·ol/ˈvitrēəl,ˈvitrēˌôl/
noun
1.cruel and bitter criticism.
2.sulfuric acid.


http://i.word.com/idictionary/vitriol

And please forgive me for spelling it wrong at first...this phone is not that easy to type on


I wasn't pointing out your misspelling, just the lack of vitriol in response to this endless rehashing of Daro's perceived transgressions. If Mujan wants to keep flogging this corpse, then have at it.

I think Fire Wind (and others) have stated it perfectly.
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« Reply #690 on: January 30, 2015, 02:30:40 PM »



I didn't say praise, I said defend. You had your chance and heard what he had to say. He left because his story was full of holes and AGD was calling him on it. He couldn't defend his own story, so he played the hounded victim card and fled. If you wanna cry about it, that's on you. What did you really learn from what he said? Not much, I reckon? Do you really think he had that many amusing anecdotes bottled up that he just forgot to tell us yet? Me neither. His role in the BB story is the guy who gave Brian acid and happened to throw parties where he met some future collaborators. That's it.

The fact that he's also trying to plug himself as the guy who tried to save Brian from everyone else--including that *awful* Marilyn, who had the audacity to love him and worry about him--actually makes him look worse. And it doesn't even hold up, considering he bailed when the going got tough. It's not moralizing, it's just refusing to suck up to a despicable person for useless info.

The only one guilty of egotism is Daro.

You said 'praise' up above.

"Some of you going out of your way to praise him or excuse him really confound me."

But anyway, Daro made the point that we were asking the wrong questions.  Perhaps he didn't have more to say, but perhaps more to imply, to intimate, to lead us to thoughts ourselves that he couldn't say out loud.  It seemed to me he wanted it to be a collaborative affair.  I could be wrong, but, as it's over, it can't be drawn out to that level and I guess we'll never know (no, I'm not personally interested enough to email him for more).

I'm not crying about anything, just mildly irritated.  And again, just as I don't think anyone was praising him, no-one was sucking up to him, at least not for anything he's said or done.  That is the key point I was trying to make, which you seem unable to grasp.  People just didn't want this extremely delicate scenario ruined, but I guess it never really had a chance.

Anyway, it's over and I think we're pretty much done in what we can say.
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« Reply #691 on: January 30, 2015, 02:42:50 PM »

I haven't see anyone praising Lorren in all this, so that's a crock.  All people were asking for was detachment and a chance to listen to him, whether he was right or wrong about things.  No-one had to like him or agree with what was said.  I don't get why people took what he said so personally.   He's a historical figure talking about other figures in the BB history.  That he feels so strongly, rightly or wrongly, was fascinating to witness in itself.  What we ended up with was just certain posters' desire to moralise taking precedence over the good of the board and putting their own feelings to the forefront.  It's putting themselves (mostly anonymous fans) at the same level of importance as Daro (a player in the history), as if their own feelings about it matter at all.  They don't matter.  It was pure egotism.

I didn't say praise, I said defend. You had your chance and heard what he had to say. He left because his story was full of holes and AGD was calling him on it. He couldn't defend his own story, so he played the hounded victim card and fled. If you wanna cry about it, that's on you. What did you really learn from what he said? Not much, I reckon? Do you really think he had that many amusing anecdotes bottled up that he just forgot to tell us yet? Me neither. His role in the BB story is the guy who gave Brian acid and happened to throw parties where he met some future collaborators. That's it.

The fact that he's also trying to plug himself as the guy who tried to save Brian from everyone else--including that *awful* Marilyn, who had the audacity to love him and worry about him--actually makes him look worse. And it doesn't even hold up, considering he bailed when the going got tough. It's not moralizing, it's just refusing to suck up to a despicable person for useless info.

The only one guilty of egotism is Daro.

That's a real gift you have there knowing that everything you type is 100% indesputable fact. Who needs those three letters IMO, after all? It's great we have a guy on the board that can sum these threads up with such conviction. "Mods we can lock this one already - Mujan's cracked it!"
« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 02:44:38 PM by buddhahat » Logged

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« Reply #692 on: January 30, 2015, 02:48:52 PM »

I haven't see anyone praising Lorren in all this, so that's a crock.  All people were asking for was detachment and a chance to listen to him, whether he was right or wrong about things.  No-one had to like him or agree with what was said.  I don't get why people took what he said so personally.   He's a historical figure talking about other figures in the BB history.  That he feels so strongly, rightly or wrongly, was fascinating to witness in itself.  What we ended up with was just certain posters' desire to moralise taking precedence over the good of the board and putting their own feelings to the forefront.  It's putting themselves (mostly anonymous fans) at the same level of importance as Daro (a player in the history), as if their own feelings about it matter at all.  They don't matter.  It was pure egotism.

Well put, Fire Wind.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 02:50:01 PM by buddhahat » Logged

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« Reply #693 on: January 30, 2015, 02:50:35 PM »

But anyway, Daro made the point that we were asking the wrong questions.  Perhaps he didn't have more to say, but perhaps more to imply, to intimate, to lead us to thoughts ourselves that he couldn't say out loud.  It seemed to me he wanted it to be a collaborative affair.  I could be wrong, but, as it's over, it can't be drawn out to that level and I guess we'll never know (no, I'm not personally interested enough to email him for more).

I'm not crying about anything, just mildly irritated.  And again, just as I don't think anyone was praising him, no-one was sucking up to him, at least not for anything he's said or done.  That is the key point I was trying to make, which you seem unable to grasp.  People just didn't want this extremely delicate scenario ruined, but I guess it never really had a chance.

Anyway, it's over and I think we're pretty much done in what we can say.

Speaking personally, I wasn't asking him any questions: I was just taking what he was claiming, holding it up to the light and seeing if it fit in with what we already know... and it never did. We're not talking 50-year-old drug impaired recall here, we're talking flat statements of fact about events from the early 60s to 1991 that turned out to be, at best, highly questionable.
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« Reply #694 on: January 30, 2015, 02:57:14 PM »

I haven't see anyone praising Lorren in all this, so that's a crock.  All people were asking for was detachment and a chance to listen to him, whether he was right or wrong about things.  No-one had to like him or agree with what was said.  I don't get why people took what he said so personally.   He's a historical figure talking about other figures in the BB history.  That he feels so strongly, rightly or wrongly, was fascinating to witness in itself.  What we ended up with was just certain posters' desire to moralise taking precedence over the good of the board and putting their own feelings to the forefront.  It's putting themselves (mostly anonymous fans) at the same level of importance as Daro (a player in the history), as if their own feelings about it matter at all.  They don't matter.  It was pure egotism.

I didn't say praise, I said defend. You had your chance and heard what he had to say. He left because his story was full of holes and AGD was calling him on it. He couldn't defend his own story, so he played the hounded victim card and fled. If you wanna cry about it, that's on you. What did you really learn from what he said? Not much, I reckon? Do you really think he had that many amusing anecdotes bottled up that he just forgot to tell us yet? Me neither. His role in the BB story is the guy who gave Brian acid and happened to throw parties where he met some future collaborators. That's it.

The fact that he's also trying to plug himself as the guy who tried to save Brian from everyone else--including that *awful* Marilyn, who had the audacity to love him and worry about him--actually makes him look worse. And it doesn't even hold up, considering he bailed when the going got tough. It's not moralizing, it's just refusing to suck up to a despicable person for useless info.

The only one guilty of egotism is Daro.

That's a real gift you have there knowing that everything you type is 100% indesputable fact. Who needs those three letters IMO, after all? It's great we have a guy on the board that can sum these threads up with such conviction. "Mods we can lock this one already - Mujan's cracked it!"

He wasn't attacking you, so why this kind of response?

Fire Wind is right...we've said all there is to say. Both sides. Locking this.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2015, 02:58:14 PM by ♩♬ Billy C ♯♫♩ » Logged

RIP Alexa Lestage (8 May 1995- 10 June 2018) .

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