The Kinks Discussion and Appreciation Thread

[Lonely Summer]

Mick seems like an affable sort of fellow, don't know what it is that makes Dave hate him - the only thing I can come up with is that Mick was buddies with Ray, and tended to side with Ray during arguments. I think Mick's way was always to choose the path of least resistance. Great drummer, really underappreciated. Any time talk turns to the Kinks, Ray's songwriting becomes the focus, and occasionally Dave's guitar playing and harmonies, but Mick and Pete were very important in the early years of the group. Dave and Pete liked to go out and party together. After Pete left, Dave tended to be alone a lot of the time, got more introverted. Relatively speaking, of course. During the 60's, I don't think Dave ever met a pill he wasn't willing to take, or a person - male or female - he didn't want to sleep with.

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

Mick seems like an affable sort of fellow, don't know what it is that makes Dave hate him - the only thing I can come up with is that Mick was buddies with Ray, and tended to side with Ray during arguments. I think Mick's way was always to choose the path of least resistance. Great drummer, really underappreciated. Any time talk turns to the Kinks, Ray's songwriting becomes the focus, and occasionally Dave's guitar playing and harmonies, but Mick and Pete were very important in the early years of the group. Dave and Pete liked to go out and party together. After Pete left, Dave tended to be alone a lot of the time, got more introverted. Relatively speaking, of course. During the 60's, I don't think Dave ever met a pill he wasn't willing to take, or a person - male or female - he didn't want to sleep with.

Or alien creature he wouldn't let himself be probed by 

It's funny that it was Ray who was the final straw for Mick..... According to Dave, they were recording in the mid 80's and were giving Mick a hard time and Ray said "I wonder how long it takes a thought to get from Mick's head down to his hands" ... unaware that Mick could hear him over the talk-back. So, he promptly rushed in and gave Ray a royal beating.

Mick belongs right up there with Ringo and Charlie Watts, thought the dirty little secret is, he was better than both of them.

[Freddie French-Pounce]

Mick's drumming on the Arthur album is incredible. 'nuff said.

[Lonely Summer]

I'm unfamiliar with the story of Mick's departure, was always told it was the friction between he and Dave that caused the split. Okay, not I gotta go listen to Arthur again - love his playing on "Australia".

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

I'm unfamiliar with the story of Mick's departure, was always told it was the friction between he and Dave that caused the split. Okay, not I gotta go listen to Arthur again - love his playing on "Australia".
[/quote/]

He quit in 86, I believe, but stayed on as the house manager for The Kink's KONK studios. I believe he still holds the position today. So, he quit, but remained a part of the family, so to speak.

[Mike's Beard]

Ray and Dave would get into terrible creative fights, Dave would ask for Mick for an opinion and Mick would never take a side. So with Ray the de facto leader, the status quo always remained (ie Ray got his way). By Mick not speaking up he was essentially siding with Ray. After many years of this Dave grew to despise Mick.

The friction between the brothers was always there, remember it was Dave and Peter Quaife who founded the band and then got Ray involved. Dave was the leader of The Kinks at the beginning, only to be usurped by Ray as the group developed.

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

Some prime Mick right here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rOkBvmsj9A

[Lonely Summer]

Ray and Dave would get into terrible creative fights, Dave would ask for Mick for an opinion and Mick would never take a side. So with Ray the de facto leader, the status quo always remained (ie Ray got his way). By Mick not speaking up he was essentially siding with Ray. After many years of this Dave grew to despise Mick.

The friction between the brothers was always there, remember it was Dave and Peter Quaife who founded the band and then got Ray involved. Dave was the leader of The Kinks at the beginning, only to be usurped by Ray as the group developed.

That is the generally accepted story of the Kinks beginnings, but if you read the Kinks Day By Day book, you can see that Ray was there right from the beginning. He didn't care much to sing in the beginning, though - I think it took the other guys drawing him out a bit to turn him into a frontman.

[Jurrasic Mark]

Huge fan, Arthur is one of THE great albums.

Had the privilege of playing with Mick and John Dalton, great guys, really nice and still great musicians. I wish they would do a reunion like the Beach Boys did. When I spoke to Mick and John about it they said that Ray had been in talks about it... maybe one day?

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

Huge fan, Arthur is one of THE great albums.

Had the privilege of playing with Mick and John Dalton, great guys, really nice and still great musicians. I wish they would do a reunion like the Beach Boys did. When I spoke to Mick and John about it they said that Ray had been in talks about it... maybe one day?

CONGRATS YOU LUCKY BASTARD!!!!!!!!! 

[Mike's Beard]

I'd love the RCA era line up to reform. Would John Dalton be up for it, I could be wrong but didn't he retire from the biz years ago?

[Gabo]

Ray and Dave would get into terrible creative fights, Dave would ask for Mick for an opinion and Mick would never take a side. So with Ray the de facto leader, the status quo always remained (ie Ray got his way). By Mick not speaking up he was essentially siding with Ray. After many years of this Dave grew to despise Mick.

The friction between the brothers was always there, remember it was Dave and Peter Quaife who founded the band and then got Ray involved. Dave was the leader of The Kinks at the beginning, only to be usurped by Ray as the group developed.

How could Ray not be the leader? He wrote all the songs (with some exceptions).

[Lonely Summer]

When the band started, they were mostly doing guitar instrumentals, Ray was too shy to sing.

[Gabo]

I bought Arthur a couple days ago in Madison before an Animal Collective concert. I haven't listened to it much yet though.

Edit:

I have to say I'm a little disappointed. It just sounds like classic "rawk" to me. The songwriting isn't as melodic or pretty as Village Green's. I will listen to it more and see if it grows on me.

[Mike's Beard]

When the band started, they were mostly doing guitar instrumentals, Ray was too shy to sing.

Plus, in the very early days although most didn't make it past the demo stage, Dave initially wrote just as much as Ray. Also notice on the debut lp Dave takes nearly as much leads as Ray.

[Freddie French-Pounce]

yeah, Ray always said that he thought Dave was the better 'Front man'. The more attractive one with the interesting voice, though to be honest many of his earliest leads aren't the softest on the ears.

[Mike's Beard]

I consider all Dave's lead vocals on the first two albums horrendous.

[Freddie French-Pounce]

I consider all Dave's lead vocals on the first two albums horrendous.

After that he's better. Love Milk Cow Blues

[Lonely Summer]

On the early albums, Dave sounds like what he was - a 16 year old British kid trying to sing like a 60 year old bluesman. Ray was the much better singer of the two in the beginning, and much more prolific as a writer. Dave didn't have time to write songs - too busy chasing girls. But underneath that wild party raver exterior, there was a very melancholy boy - nearly all his songs on their late 60's records were about his first love, Sue, the girl he got pregnant at 15. Susannah's Still Alive, Funny Face, This Man He Weeps Tonight, Mindless Child of Motherhood, all that stuff was about her.

[Outtasight!]

Everything from face to face to preservation act 1 is mindblowing (ok percy is less essential but gods children is beautiful). After that schoolboys, misfits and give the people what they want are great. To the bone is none too shaby b

[Outtasight!]

Damned phone posted before i was done. Rays solo albums are also great but the masterpieces are the villiage green preservation society, Arthur and Musswell Hillbillies. Great, great music.

[Gabo]

I consider all Dave's lead vocals on the first two albums horrendous.

After that he's better. Love Milk Cow Blues

I hate his voice even on Something Else. His only good vocal performance to my ears is Wicked Annabella. For some reason he managed to sound really great on that track.

[Jurrasic Mark]

I'd love the RCA era line up to reform. Would John Dalton be up for it, I could be wrong but didn't he retire from the biz years ago?

Yeah he technically did. But he still does some gigs, appeared with the Kast Off Kinks not so long ago.

[bossaroo]

sounds like Ray n Dave are indeed discussing a reunion...!
http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/dave-davies-odds-of-a-kinks-tour-in-2014-are-50-50-20130925

i very much doubt Mick will be involved due to Dave's complete disdain for him. unfortunate indeed.
but it's all about the Davies boys in the end, so i really hope it happens and i get to see it!

i met Ray briefly a couple years ago when he came through Charlotte. got my Great Lost Kinks Album signed!

so much brilliance, and so hard to pick a favorite album. anything from Something Else to Hillbillies is a worthy contender. and speaking of Contenders, i haven't seen quite enough praise for the Lola album. It's a masterpiece, and a commentary on the music industry as only Ray can deliver.

[bossaroo]

speaking of Mick, i love his playing on this live version of Waterloo Sunset from the BBC: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlnpF4RGrUo