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Author Topic: MIKE LOVE WANTS BRIAN WILSON BACK IN THE BEACH BOYS  (Read 33638 times)
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« Reply #150 on: July 11, 2013, 02:11:03 AM »

So anyway, backstage at Henley last night, I asked Mike if what the Daily Star reported about the end of the C50 tour was true, and he told me it was. Apparently, there is proof.

So, now you know.
Funny, I missed this part on your backstage Henley post on Brian's board.   Grin

No need. Big Brother is watching us. Big Sister too...  Thumbs Up

I hope so. Mike has essentially called Brian & Al liars while completely contradicting himself. We need answers. Let's start with that proof?  Head Spin
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« Reply #151 on: July 11, 2013, 03:03:43 AM »

This all seems to be a mess of contradictions and confusion. I very much doubt anybody involved has deliberately lied about anything here, but it's easy to see how things could have ended up as they have through poor communication, crossed wires, changes of heart, wilful misunderstandings etc etc. I haven't got a clue what actually happened, but to my mind things only get muddier with time and new information because everything seems so contradictory. Brian and Al say it was Mike's fault, Mike defends himself, Mike later says Brian didn't want to extend things (which may or may not be Mike contradicting himself). So who knows?

As several people have said previously, maybe they just weren't on the same page on the same days. At one point or another it seems that everyone has had a turn at be willing to keep things going further than they did, but not all at the same time. I don't think it matters much about why it ended, but I am interested in what's stopping things happening in the future. If Brian, Al and David want to tour with Mike, and Mike says they only stopped touring together due to Brian - what's the problem now? On that basis there could easily be another tour after any dates Mike and Bruce are booked for. Or maybe all the fall-out just makes it so much harder for all concerned to get back together. I honestly think that all sides handled some things badly at the end of the tour and it could all have been dealt with amicably (and/or behind closed doors). I don't mind that the tour ended, but I wish all parties would be open to something in the future. Who knows, maybe they are?
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« Reply #152 on: July 11, 2013, 03:31:25 AM »

So anyway, backstage at Henley last night, I asked Mike if what the Daily Star reported about the end of the C50 tour was true, and he told me it was. Apparently, there is proof.

So, now you know.
Funny, I missed this part on your backstage Henley post on Brian's board.   Grin

No need. Big Brother is watching us. Big Sister too...  Thumbs Up

I hope so. Mike has essentially called Brian & Al liars while completely contradicting himself. We need answers. Let's start with that proof?  Head Spin

It's starting to look clearer to me. I think Andrew Hickey is right. It seems they agreed to 50 dates. Then they agreed to 25 extra but Brian said no more. Mike made other plans based on Brian's end date and their previous agreement that they would go back to their respective touring situations after those dates. Brian [and Al] later decided he wanted more dates after all but now Mike already had commitments.
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« Reply #153 on: July 11, 2013, 03:40:57 AM »

So anyway, backstage at Henley last night, I asked Mike if what the Daily Star reported about the end of the C50 tour was true, and he told me it was. Apparently, there is proof.

So, now you know.
Funny, I missed this part on your backstage Henley post on Brian's board.   Grin

No need. Big Brother is watching us. Big Sister too...  Thumbs Up

I hope so. Mike has essentially called Brian & Al liars while completely contradicting himself. We need answers. Let's start with that proof?  Head Spin

It's starting to look clearer to me. I think Andrew Hickey is right. It seems they agreed to 50 dates. Then they agreed to 25 extra but Brian said no more. Mike made other plans based on Brian's end date and their previous agreement that they would go back to their respective touring situations after those dates. Brian [and Al] later decided he wanted more dates after all but now Mike already had commitments.

All very plausible. Throw in Brian's earlier back problems and concerns he might have had about that and then Mike's possible concerns about the size and cost of the touring band / entourage etc and it's all very understandable. But why is it so difficult for anyone to put forward a short but full explanation of how things happened? It's not that I think they need to particularly, its just that drip feeding bits of information has caused all sorts of confusion and a lot of (unnecessary) bad press for Mike.
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« Reply #154 on: July 11, 2013, 03:52:49 AM »

So anyway, backstage at Henley last night, I asked Mike if what the Daily Star reported about the end of the C50 tour was true, and he told me it was. Apparently, there is proof.

So, now you know.
Funny, I missed this part on your backstage Henley post on Brian's board.   Grin

No need. Big Brother is watching us. Big Sister too...  Thumbs Up

I hope so. Mike has essentially called Brian & Al liars while completely contradicting himself. We need answers. Let's start with that proof?  Head Spin

It's starting to look clearer to me. I think Andrew Hickey is right. It seems they agreed to 50 dates. Then they agreed to 25 extra but Brian said no more. Mike made other plans based on Brian's end date and their previous agreement that they would go back to their respective touring situations after those dates. Brian [and Al] later decided he wanted more dates after all but now Mike already had commitments.
But those commitments could have been rescheduled.  In fact, the two that were announced at the time (South America and a Club date) were both canceled (apparently they thought they were getting Brian, Al and David too). You could easily say that Mike agreed to 50. Then changed his mind and added 23 more.  How ever you couch it/spin it, it was Mike who had the power to keep it rolling and he chose not to.

Were his reasons valid? May well have been, and he had every right to make his own decision on it. And it did have to end some time.  As many have pointed out, Brian is not going to do 73+ shows every year.
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« Reply #155 on: July 11, 2013, 04:17:45 AM »

So anyway, backstage at Henley last night, I asked Mike if what the Daily Star reported about the end of the C50 tour was true, and he told me it was. Apparently, there is proof.

So, now you know.
Funny, I missed this part on your backstage Henley post on Brian's board.   Grin

No need. Big Brother is watching us. Big Sister too...  Thumbs Up

I hope so. Mike has essentially called Brian & Al liars while completely contradicting himself. We need answers. Let's start with that proof?  Head Spin

It's starting to look clearer to me. I think Andrew Hickey is right. It seems they agreed to 50 dates. Then they agreed to 25 extra but Brian said no more. Mike made other plans based on Brian's end date and their previous agreement that they would go back to their respective touring situations after those dates. Brian [and Al] later decided he wanted more dates after all but now Mike already had commitments.
But those commitments could have been rescheduled.  In fact, the two that were announced at the time (South America and a Club date) were both canceled (apparently they thought they were getting Brian, Al and David too). You could easily say that Mike agreed to 50. Then changed his mind and added 23 more.  How ever you couch it/spin it, it was Mike who had the power to keep it rolling and he chose not to.

Were his reasons valid? May well have been, and he had every right to make his own decision on it. And it did have to end some time.  As many have pointed out, Brian is not going to do 73+ shows every year.

I don't know either how many dates were already booked beyond the couple that were in the press, if any. I'm guessing Mike also had the rest of his group prepping themselves already in view of Brian's previous period on the end date and the previous agreement to go back to their groups. Maybe we get a little glib about somebody else just rearranging their lives because another guy changed his mind at the last minute.
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« Reply #156 on: July 11, 2013, 04:50:09 AM »

Let's face it. I think *everyone* was surprised that by the final dates the Beach Boys were still apparently enjoying performing together.

I get that Mike feels a need to keep his M&B touring band as a going concern to keep the money flowing. The question they might like to ask is how do they incorporate Al, Dave and Brian into, say, 30 big shows a year? Will people still turn up to the M&B shows?
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« Reply #157 on: July 11, 2013, 04:55:36 AM »

Let's face it. I think *everyone* was surprised that by the final dates the Beach Boys were still apparently enjoying performing together.

I get that Mike feels a need to keep his M&B touring band as a going concern to keep the money flowing. The question they might like to ask is how do they incorporate Al, Dave and Brian into, say, 30 big shows a year? Will people still turn up to the M&B shows?

Apparently. Looked like a full house last night, 5,000 or so.
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« Reply #158 on: July 11, 2013, 05:05:01 AM »

You could easily say that Mike agreed to 50. Then changed his mind and added 23 more. 

You could easily say that, mainly because it's true.  Grin

Quote
How ever you couch it/spin it, it was Mike who had the power to keep it rolling and he chose not to.

Agreed, he could have carried on... fact is he didn't. Now, with that established, maybe we should start considering why he didn't go along with the others wishes. Would have to be a very compelling reason, or set of circumstances, I'm thinking.
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« Reply #159 on: July 11, 2013, 06:27:11 AM »

I suppose this is as good a place as any to express my concern about what's been missing from the various discussions of late regarding Brian and Mike. This very well may have been brought up already, and if so, I apologize. But what I think has been missing from these discussions is the following very, very important piece of history:

The press release for TWGMTR clearly, VERY CLEARLY, stated that it would include new Wilson/Love songs. I remember this very clearly, because I was excited by the prospect, and I also remember very, very clearly, that in his quote in the the press release, Bruce expressed his excitement at new Wilson/Love songs as well. DOES ANYONE HAVE A COPY OF THIS? I think it needs to be shared.

The crucial point here is that although it SUCKS that it ended the way it did, I do think Mike feels he was shafted, and indeed, the very press release that kicked the whole 50th celebration off SPECIFICALLY STATED there would be Wilson/Love collaborations, and it seems that for the most part that just didn't happen. The press release to me is the crucial piece of evidence that proves that Mike had certain assumptions going into it that didn't pan out.

SO, it's understandable that Mike would be pissed. having said, I totally agree that in the big picture, Mike should have never made any such demands. Yeah, I'd like to see some Wilson/Love songs, but not at the expense of getting NO beach boys which is where we're at now.
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« Reply #160 on: July 11, 2013, 06:33:34 AM »

One should be careful what you wish for, because the wish might get fulfilled.

Brian wished that "Summer's Gone" would be the last song on the last BB album. He seemingly got his wish, even though he had changed his mind meanwhile.

I wished for a silly song on TWGMTR, and I got TPLOBAS (cringes)... Embarrassed
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« Reply #161 on: July 11, 2013, 06:43:38 AM »


I'd be happy with just one C50-style show a year.  On the Fourth of July, either in DC or at the Hollywood Bowl.

The other 364 days, let M&B tour and Brian record.
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« Reply #162 on: July 11, 2013, 08:50:07 AM »

I suppose this is as good a place as any to express my concern about what's been missing from the various discussions of late regarding Brian and Mike. This very well may have been brought up already, and if so, I apologize. But what I think has been missing from these discussions is the following very, very important piece of history:

The press release for TWGMTR clearly, VERY CLEARLY, stated that it would include new Wilson/Love songs. I remember this very clearly, because I was excited by the prospect, and I also remember very, very clearly, that in his quote in the the press release, Bruce expressed his excitement at new Wilson/Love songs as well. DOES ANYONE HAVE A COPY OF THIS? I think it needs to be shared.

The crucial point here is that although it SUCKS that it ended the way it did, I do think Mike feels he was shafted, and indeed, the very press release that kicked the whole 50th celebration off SPECIFICALLY STATED there would be Wilson/Love collaborations, and it seems that for the most part that just didn't happen. The press release to me is the crucial piece of evidence that proves that Mike had certain assumptions going into it that didn't pan out.

SO, it's understandable that Mike would be pissed. having said, I totally agree that in the big picture, Mike should have never made any such demands. Yeah, I'd like to see some Wilson/Love songs, but not at the expense of getting NO beach boys which is where we're at now.

Two questions: exactly what demands were these... and exactly how does not having new Wilson/Love songs of the album result in Mike - according to most posters here - deciding to go play with his own band instead of extending the C50 tour for a second time ?  Did he say "no, not going to because you wouldn't let me write with you" ? If that's truly the reason, then I'd be very critical of him... but I, and I suspect everyone else here whose posting initials aren't OSD, don't believe that for a moment. Hopefully I'll still be around when the true story of events last summer/fall finally emerge into the light of day, because I can't believe they'll be anything less than fascinating.
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« Reply #163 on: July 11, 2013, 09:08:25 AM »

I suppose this is as good a place as any to express my concern about what's been missing from the various discussions of late regarding Brian and Mike. This very well may have been brought up already, and if so, I apologize. But what I think has been missing from these discussions is the following very, very important piece of history:

The press release for TWGMTR clearly, VERY CLEARLY, stated that it would include new Wilson/Love songs. I remember this very clearly, because I was excited by the prospect, and I also remember very, very clearly, that in his quote in the the press release, Bruce expressed his excitement at new Wilson/Love songs as well. DOES ANYONE HAVE A COPY OF THIS? I think it needs to be shared.

The crucial point here is that although it SUCKS that it ended the way it did, I do think Mike feels he was shafted, and indeed, the very press release that kicked the whole 50th celebration off SPECIFICALLY STATED there would be Wilson/Love collaborations, and it seems that for the most part that just didn't happen. The press release to me is the crucial piece of evidence that proves that Mike had certain assumptions going into it that didn't pan out.

SO, it's understandable that Mike would be pissed. having said, I totally agree that in the big picture, Mike should have never made any such demands. Yeah, I'd like to see some Wilson/Love songs, but not at the expense of getting NO beach boys which is where we're at now.

Two questions: exactly what demands were these... and exactly how does not having new Wilson/Love songs of the album result in Mike - according to most posters here - deciding to go play with his own band instead of extending the C50 tour for a second time ?  Did he say "no, not going to because you wouldn't let me write with you" ? If that's truly the reason, then I'd be very critical of him... but I, and I suspect everyone else here whose posting initials aren't OSD, don't believe that for a moment. Hopefully I'll still be around when the true story of events last summer/fall finally emerge into the light of day, because I can't believe they'll be anything less than fascinating.

Exactly.  I think the fact that Mike Love "wasn't allowed" to write with Brian Wilson may have been a factor in his overall discontent as far as the C50 goes but I don't think it's the entire story either. 
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« Reply #164 on: July 11, 2013, 09:12:09 AM »

I suppose this is as good a place as any to express my concern about what's been missing from the various discussions of late regarding Brian and Mike. This very well may have been brought up already, and if so, I apologize. But what I think has been missing from these discussions is the following very, very important piece of history:

The press release for TWGMTR clearly, VERY CLEARLY, stated that it would include new Wilson/Love songs. I remember this very clearly, because I was excited by the prospect, and I also remember very, very clearly, that in his quote in the the press release, Bruce expressed his excitement at new Wilson/Love songs as well. DOES ANYONE HAVE A COPY OF THIS? I think it needs to be shared.

The crucial point here is that although it SUCKS that it ended the way it did, I do think Mike feels he was shafted, and indeed, the very press release that kicked the whole 50th celebration off SPECIFICALLY STATED there would be Wilson/Love collaborations, and it seems that for the most part that just didn't happen. The press release to me is the crucial piece of evidence that proves that Mike had certain assumptions going into it that didn't pan out.

SO, it's understandable that Mike would be pissed. having said, I totally agree that in the big picture, Mike should have never made any such demands. Yeah, I'd like to see some Wilson/Love songs, but not at the expense of getting NO beach boys which is where we're at now.

Two questions: exactly what demands were these... and exactly how does not having new Wilson/Love songs of the album result in Mike - according to most posters here - deciding to go play with his own band instead of extending the C50 tour for a second time ?  Did he say "no, not going to because you wouldn't let me write with you" ? If that's truly the reason, then I'd be very critical of him... but I, and I suspect everyone else here whose posting initials aren't OSD, don't believe that for a moment. Hopefully I'll still be around when the true story of events last summer/fall finally emerge into the light of day, because I can't believe they'll be anything less than fascinating.
There are two things at play here; continuing the reunion tour after C73 and a second album. I believe that we have not seen a second album due to Mike's writing expectations for TWGMTR. I think until he gets a commitment from Brian to allow him to write the bulk of the material, I doubt we will ever see a Follow-up studio album from the Beach Boys. Though, if I were a betting man, I'd wager we will see another album and another tour either next year or Summer 2015. We'll see!
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« Reply #165 on: July 11, 2013, 09:19:06 AM »

But why hold up the whole BBs group and demand from the fans over such a selfish request? Brian picks and choose who he works with since day one of 1961. So be it if he doesn't want to rewrite "do it again" for the 100th time with ML.
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« Reply #166 on: July 11, 2013, 09:22:21 AM »

But why hold up the whole BBs group and demand from the fans over such a selfish request? Brian picks and choose who he works with since day one of 1961. So be it if he doesn't want to rewrite "do it again" for the 100th time with ML.
Why do any of us do things like that at one time or another? Because we are human beings that have needs, egos, and feelings, etc., etc. etc..
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Thou Art In Hawthorne,
Harmonied Be Thy name
Your Kingdom Come,
Your Steak Well Done,
On Stage As It Is In Studio,
Give Us This Day, Our Shortenin' Bread
And Forgive Us Our Bootlegs,
As We Also Have Forgiven Our Wife And Managers,
And Lead Us Not Into Kokomo,
But Deliver Us From Mike Love.
Amen.  ---hypehat
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« Reply #167 on: July 11, 2013, 09:33:03 AM »


Exactly.  I think the fact that Mike Love "wasn't allowed" to write with Brian Wilson may have been a factor in his overall discontent as far as the C50 goes but I don't think it's the entire story either.  

I don't think Michael would play "hard to get" because of that or he's much meaner, vengenful (and stupider) than I had ever imagined he is. In the digital music age its become painfully obvious to those in the industry that the Big money is in touring, not recording -- things are quite reversed from Michael's halcyon days of the mid 1960's, you record an album of songs so you have a reason to tour and sell tickets/ product on the road, this is where the real profits are made.
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« Reply #168 on: July 11, 2013, 09:33:38 AM »

People here saying that any future collabs between Brian and Mike would be at "SIP" levels of bad using Mike's contributions "TWGMTR" as a yardstick are trippin'. Brian fed the title "Beaches in Mind" as well as the lyric "easy money, ain't life funny, what's it too ya, hallelujah" to Mike for the two new songs he was allowed to (under less than ideal conditions, by the sounds of it) contribute to. He was practically pushed him into writing lyrics that Mike's critics were going to deride either way. Given a little time, inspiration and Brian's support, I believe the two could do some impressive things together again.
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« Reply #169 on: July 11, 2013, 09:52:13 AM »

I suppose this is as good a place as any to express my concern about what's been missing from the various discussions of late regarding Brian and Mike. This very well may have been brought up already, and if so, I apologize. But what I think has been missing from these discussions is the following very, very important piece of history:

The press release for TWGMTR clearly, VERY CLEARLY, stated that it would include new Wilson/Love songs. I remember this very clearly, because I was excited by the prospect, and I also remember very, very clearly, that in his quote in the the press release, Bruce expressed his excitement at new Wilson/Love songs as well. DOES ANYONE HAVE A COPY OF THIS? I think it needs to be shared.

The crucial point here is that although it SUCKS that it ended the way it did, I do think Mike feels he was shafted, and indeed, the very press release that kicked the whole 50th celebration off SPECIFICALLY STATED there would be Wilson/Love collaborations, and it seems that for the most part that just didn't happen. The press release to me is the crucial piece of evidence that proves that Mike had certain assumptions going into it that didn't pan out.

SO, it's understandable that Mike would be pissed. having said, I totally agree that in the big picture, Mike should have never made any such demands. Yeah, I'd like to see some Wilson/Love songs, but not at the expense of getting NO beach boys which is where we're at now.

Two questions: exactly what demands were these... and exactly how does not having new Wilson/Love songs of the album result in Mike - according to most posters here - deciding to go play with his own band instead of extending the C50 tour for a second time ?  Did he say "no, not going to because you wouldn't let me write with you" ? If that's truly the reason, then I'd be very critical of him... but I, and I suspect everyone else here whose posting initials aren't OSD, don't believe that for a moment. Hopefully I'll still be around when the true story of events last summer/fall finally emerge into the light of day, because I can't believe they'll be anything less than fascinating.

Absolutely 100% true!! The only things I "know" are what I glean from this board! The true story will be fascinating. Luckily I MIGHT just be young enough to actually get to read it which is probably more than I can say for you old timers. WOW! SLAM. BOOM.  kidding, kidding
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« Reply #170 on: July 11, 2013, 09:56:57 AM »


I don't know either how many dates were already booked beyond the couple that were in the press, if any. I'm guessing Mike also had the rest of his group prepping themselves already in view of Brian's previous period on the end date and the previous agreement to go back to their groups. Maybe we get a little glib about somebody else just rearranging their lives because another guy changed his mind at the last minute.

No Cam, how dare Mike not change his plans to accommodate the ever changing daily whims of Brian Wilson.
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« Reply #171 on: July 11, 2013, 10:00:03 AM »


I don't know either how many dates were already booked beyond the couple that were in the press, if any. I'm guessing Mike also had the rest of his group prepping themselves already in view of Brian's previous period on the end date and the previous agreement to go back to their groups. Maybe we get a little glib about somebody else just rearranging their lives because another guy changed his mind at the last minute.

No Cam, how dare Mike not change his plans to accommodate the ever changing daily whims of Brian Wilson.

...and there may lie part of the problem.  As it has been stated on more than one occasion now (Stebbins?) that the C50 was the first time in years that Mike Love didn't have carte blanche to run "The Beach Boys" as he saw fit.  He had to acquiesce, make compromises and perhaps at times even cow-tow to other people's way of doing things.  That couldn't have made him very happy and may have been part of the reason why he isn't touring with Wilson/Jardine/Marks this summer.
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« Reply #172 on: July 11, 2013, 10:08:15 AM »

But why hold up the whole BBs group and demand from the fans over such a selfish request? Brian picks and choose who he works with since day one of 1961. So be it if he doesn't want to rewrite "do it again" for the 100th time with ML.

Because he might think he [and Al, maybe Bruce and Dave] should have some/more say on his own group's album?
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« Reply #173 on: July 11, 2013, 10:18:10 AM »

But why hold up the whole BBs group and demand from the fans over such a selfish request? Brian picks and choose who he works with since day one of 1961. So be it if he doesn't want to rewrite "do it again" for the 100th time with ML.

Because he might think he [and Al, maybe Bruce and Dave] should have some/more say on his own group's album?

I agree! And therein lies the fork in the road. The tectonic plates. The San Andres Faultline! Peter Carlin talked about it in depth - this band (post Pet Sounds) has always had a strange tug of war between their love & respect for Brian's talents, and their own needs as musicians. Carl was frequently in the middle of all that.

I happen to disagree with Cammy that a group 'democracy' album would be a good idea. It would be rather dull and uninteresting in my opinion. Of course, your opinion (and others) is quite the opposite.
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« Reply #174 on: July 11, 2013, 10:28:29 AM »

I think until he gets a commitment from Brian to allow him to write the bulk of the material, I doubt we will ever see a Follow-up studio album from the Beach Boys. Though, if I were a betting man, I'd wager we will see another album and another tour either next year or Summer 2015. We'll see!

I'm a bookie, with the odd inside line, and I'd put the odds at a new album in the next three tears as 50/1. New tour, 40/1. Both, 150/1.
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