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Author Topic: Student Demonstration Time  (Read 21668 times)
TMinthePM
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« on: June 19, 2013, 07:14:13 AM »

I am somewhat perplexed by the many denunciations of Student Demonstration Time that I have come across while perusing the conversations on this board over the years. I can tell you that while listening to the LP Surf's Up at the time of its release, this particular cut came as a welcomed rush of energy at the close of side one. That response may well have been a function of our, how shall we say, medicated minds, but I clearly recall an electrifying performance of the tune in concert in Miami in '72, and, I'm pretty sure, at C.W. Post in '73 or '74, bring the crowd to its feet. If you can get ahold of the Live at Carnegie performance you will see what I mean.

The Beach Boys of course were never overtly political in their lyrical content, but they certainly did reflect cultural currents of the times during which they were active, from the unabashed hedonism of the early '6os, thru the mind expanding mid-60's, to the dark turmoil of the late-60s. And SDT neatly captures a sense of that turmoil while offering a capsule chronicle of at least a part of "The Movement."

Placing the tune side by side with Street Fighting Man by the Rolling Stones, and Revolution by the Beatles is illustrative. The Stones are all about plunging into the chaos - "summer's here and time is right for rising in the street, boy."  The Beatles are ambivalent - "but when you talk about destruction, well don't you know that you can count me out/in."  The Beach Boys shy away - "next time there's a riot well, you best keep out of sight..."

With the great Pluto-Uranus square now wheeling back into alignment, igniting a revolutionary upsurge world-wide, and reigniting Brian Wilson's creative juices, it will be very interesting to hear the new music he is currently producing and how it now, as did SDT then, reflects the zeitgeist of our times.









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Micha
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« Reply #1 on: June 19, 2013, 07:36:53 AM »

I like it, anyway. And, it's Dennis' last recorded drumming before his hand accident.  Cool
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« Reply #2 on: June 19, 2013, 08:01:20 AM »

I agree with the OP about the need for more of a high energy track on Surf's Up, though I think I would have preferred "Sound of Free" here.  There are a couple of problems with SDT:  First, I've never found the Beach Boys to be particularly convincing in heavy rock mode.  It usually comes off sounding forced or wimpy, though this track is arguably more effective than some of their other efforts in this vein.  More problematic are the lyrics.  It's seems like he's really straining to be relevant and engage with some serious issues, but he doesn't have anything meaningful to say about them.  He brings up all of this strife and protest, but then the final conclusion is like "Yeah, it's a real drag, man, best just to avoid it altogether."  Those final lines seem like a disappointing cop out.  I don't think SDT is quite as bad as some make it out to be, but to me, it makes their Reilly inspired efforts to be socially relevant seem like kind of an empty pose. 
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pixletwin
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« Reply #3 on: June 19, 2013, 08:03:15 AM »

The thing about SDT is that the over all message seems to discourage trying to effect social change because a riot may break out and you'll get hurt.  LOL
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« Reply #4 on: June 19, 2013, 08:08:38 AM »

Live so much better.

The Carnegie Hall version is amazing. They were an awesome live band in those days and they could rock. Marcella is another great example.
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MBE
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« Reply #5 on: June 19, 2013, 08:55:34 AM »

I always thought it was a powerful record. Most Beach Boys fans I met who don't like it tend not to like hard rock so much. Not a put down just in my experience.
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Tristero
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« Reply #6 on: June 19, 2013, 09:05:36 AM »

I always thought it was a powerful record. Most Beach Boys fans I met who don't like it tend not to like hard rock so much. Not a put down just in my experience.
Not me.  I dig Hendrix, Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, the Who.  I've just never felt that that this was the Beach Boys' strong suit, though I would agree that the live version is preferable.
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Quzi
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« Reply #7 on: June 19, 2013, 09:17:30 AM »

I have a problem with Mike blaming the victims for protesting and not directing any venom towards the authority's manner of conduct in the shootings. In essence, it's a song about allowing yourself to get trodden on by whatever oppressive regime is coming down on you... a pretty easy message to deliver when you're a white, millionaire rock star who hasn't a fight to be passionate about...

Also, I for one think the basic track kicks ass (the sirens are a bit annoying...) so that's definitely not where my derision comes from. I think the boys should have rocked out a little more to be honest. My disliking of the track is wholly rooted in the lame message, if it weren't for that, I'd like it a lot.
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« Reply #8 on: June 19, 2013, 09:20:42 AM »

I have no problem with the music or even the message, only the lyrics which sound trite and forced - kind of like Don't Go Near the Water, another cringe worthy effort from Mr. Love.  They should have kept this number as the cover of Riot in Cell Block 9 which is where they copped the music from.  Solid version of it at Big Sur 1970.
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« Reply #9 on: June 19, 2013, 09:26:11 AM »

In this thread Mr. Desper gives some detailed well-written explanation as to why Mike changed the words in the subject:

http://smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,14463.25.html Reply #44. Good read, Mr. TM!
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« Reply #10 on: June 19, 2013, 09:29:39 AM »

I have no problem with the music or even the message, only the lyrics which sound trite and forced - kind of like Don't Go Near the Water, another cringe worthy effort from Mr. Love.  They should have kept this number as the cover of Riot in Cell Block 9 which is where they copped the music from.  Solid version of it at Big Sur 1970.
I've always found something amusing and ironic about the Beach Boys singing "Don't Go Near The Water", kind of an interesting inversion for them.  Yeah, he lyrics are pretty trite and the "tooth paste & soap will make the oceans a bubble bath" line always gives me a chuckle, but at least ecology was still a fairly fresh topic back then.
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« Reply #11 on: June 19, 2013, 09:31:04 AM »

The thing about SDT is that the over all message seems to discourage trying to effect social change because a riot may break out and you'll get hurt.  LOL

These were mainly peaceful demonstratons. (As in "Give Peace a Chance.")  Students were not carrying weapons, and were "no match" for irrational law enforcement, and on the heels of "Four Dead in O-hio" with CSNY (Old Buffalo Springfield) when on May 4, 1970, four unarmed protesters were gunned down in cold blood.  

And, I didn't get that impression, that it was designed to ward off protest but, more to know who the opponent was and decide with information. It also conveyed the danger which had become escalated.  Or, maybe protest, but you might need a flak jacket.  I think it is a great song, and also pertinent to the Band, because those who died, were protesting the war that Carl was arrested for, as a result of his failure to report to the Draft Board.  He had asserted a CO or Conscientious Objector status.

I think it is a grand song. And I'm still proud that they recorded that harsh in-your-face response to what was going on at the time.  It was a small part of raising consciousness for the times.  
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TMinthePM
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« Reply #12 on: June 19, 2013, 09:46:53 AM »

Here's that Desper quote, thanks to RangeRoverA!:
 

COMMENT: 

There is no right nor wrong in art, only preference.   But I would take issue with you on saying the production values are sloppy, just because you don't like the sound of a megaphone or sirens. The production values of this song are just as strong, and more complex, than other songs on the Surf's Up album.

If you lived through the 60s, the civil riots, the unrest, the antiwar demonstrations, the crowds of unruly students in the streets, with hundreds of young soldiers dieing every day -- every day, and in-depth TV coverage of people being shot at close range coming into our living rooms every night, you might have more understanding of "the why and wherefore" of the song being part of a surf album. 

Yes, Michael is very correct in stating his concerns. He was seeing all this going on in Santa Barbara, CA where he lived. It was in his front yard. It was in all our lives. It was a sick time. The country was sick. And much of it was needless.

So Michael was moved to write a song about war protest. His approach was to offer vocal advice to the listener as to what to do when you may be caught up in one of these civil unrests -- so as not to get killed.  Remember Kent State was still in the news when the lyrics were written.

Production Values.  The tonal picture Michael wished to paint OR the setting he wanted use to present his song did give me a challenge to keep production values at their standards and still make a listenable song.

Picture Michael speaking to a crowd of students that are in a rally, in a school yard, surrounded by school buildings and administration structures. He is speaking to them using a PA system and the reflection of his speech is bouncing off of the buildings. There is also other activity and antiwar demonstrations taking place. the sirens are moving around the school yard builds and can be heard around you.

Unfortunately, the sound picture colapes fairly flat in stereo. When you hear this song properly (with Matrix resolution) the production makes more sense. You do get a sense of the school yard space and the buildings sound further removed. The sirens move around the room, not just side to side. The lyric message remains the same, but the production values put into the sound-picture are more easily heard and appreciated.

Some day soon you will hear what I mean.  Until then,

Good Listening,  ~Stephen W. Desper
 

 
   
 
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TMinthePM
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« Reply #13 on: June 19, 2013, 10:03:30 AM »

In a way, the Beach Boys' response to the political/cultural upheaval of the late '60s was quite proactive. I'm thinking here of Friends which, while lost in the general hysteria rioting for "PEACE NOW!" - actually offers an antidote in the Zen-like epiphanies of the meditative state. No, TM did not bring the war to an end, but the fundamental insight that aggression/non-aggression is a state of mind, points the way to diffusing the impulse to violence.

                                                                              "Be still and know you are..."

I wonder if Brian and the boys were tuning in to Alan Watts?
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« Reply #14 on: June 19, 2013, 10:04:49 AM »

Thanks TM and Rangerover. That quote from Desper really puts the song in a newish light for me.
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« Reply #15 on: June 19, 2013, 11:10:38 AM »

My least favourite song on the album, but I love the album and like the song.
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drbeachboy
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« Reply #16 on: June 19, 2013, 11:39:51 AM »

It's funny, but in 1971 I don't remember anyone mistaking the lyrical meaning like people do in here. Over the years something has gotten lost in translation. It was always FOR protesting, but to be prepared that the protest could turn into a riot. Usually, when that type of thing happens it is because the establishment over reacts (not the protesters) causing the riot.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2013, 11:42:13 AM by drbeachboy » Logged

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« Reply #17 on: June 19, 2013, 12:22:14 PM »

The thing about SDT is that the over all message seems to discourage trying to effect social change because a riot may break out and you'll get hurt.  LOL

It basically sounds like a song commissioned by government in order to keep people home. Wonder how big Myke's paycheck was that year?Huh I kid ofc.. LOL
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MBE
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« Reply #18 on: June 19, 2013, 12:39:22 PM »

It's funny, but in 1971 I don't remember anyone mistaking the lyrical meaning like people do in here. Over the years something has gotten lost in translation. It was always FOR protesting, but to be prepared that the protest could turn into a riot. Usually, when that type of thing happens it is because the establishment over reacts (not the protesters) causing the riot.
That's what I hear in the song.
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filledeplage
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« Reply #19 on: June 19, 2013, 12:46:52 PM »

The thing about SDT is that the over all message seems to discourage trying to effect social change because a riot may break out and you'll get hurt.  LOL

It basically sounds like a song commissioned by government in order to keep people home. Wonder how big Myke's paycheck was that year?Huh I kid ofc.. LOL

Glad you're kidding.  Mr. Desper was correct in all he said. Having been in college then, even going to and from class could be a volatile situation.  It is hard to fathom now, that the rage of the country, from coast to coast, over this Vietnam War, had mobilized students in nearly every college, even and especially "working class" public colleges, which were not the likely center of protest.   And they mobilized before the world wide web.  

Many days you'd get to whatever building your class was in and it would be surrounded by cops, as it was "occupied" (before "Occupy") by student protesters.  No class that day!  

And, it didn't die down as quickly as the authorities wanted.  And, lots of Vietnam Vets who were students under the GI Bill were organizers and participants.  And, they had eyewitness knowledge and personal experience, which was credible.  Things started to change, I think, when their voices began to be heard. They were almost like whistleblowers of their day.

When I hear that song, it "brings it back."   Wink

So glad that Mike did that song.  It ain't pretty, the truth ain't always pretty.

Bravo!
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pixletwin
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« Reply #20 on: June 19, 2013, 12:57:56 PM »

The thing about SDT is that the over all message seems to discourage trying to effect social change because a riot may break out and you'll get hurt.  LOL

It basically sounds like a song commissioned by government in order to keep people home. Wonder how big Myke's paycheck was that year?Huh I kid ofc.. LOL

Good thing you put that disclaimer at the end. Some people here might actually believe that.  LOL
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Iron Horse-Apples
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« Reply #21 on: June 19, 2013, 01:07:54 PM »

Most Beach Boys fans I met who don't like it tend not to like hard rock so much. Not a put down just in my experience.

Not a put down. I'm in this demographic. To me this is not Beach Boy music,  It gets skipped within seconds.
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drbeachboy
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« Reply #22 on: June 19, 2013, 01:12:47 PM »

Most Beach Boys fans I met who don't like it tend not to like hard rock so much. Not a put down just in my experience.

Not a put down. I'm in this demographic. To me this is not Beach Boy music,  It gets skipped within seconds.
So you have them pigeonholed just like most of John Q Public? Thought we hard-cores were better than that. Wink
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The Brianista Prayer

Oh Brian
Thou Art In Hawthorne,
Harmonied Be Thy name
Your Kingdom Come,
Your Steak Well Done,
On Stage As It Is In Studio,
Give Us This Day, Our Shortenin' Bread
And Forgive Us Our Bootlegs,
As We Also Have Forgiven Our Wife And Managers,
And Lead Us Not Into Kokomo,
But Deliver Us From Mike Love.
Amen.  ---hypehat
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« Reply #23 on: June 19, 2013, 01:22:23 PM »

I think I can understand why one might not consider it to be "Beach Boys' music" lyrically. Musically, however, I would, and probably needlessly, point out that SDT is a straight re-write of the Coasters' Riot in Cellblock Number 9, which places it firmly in the back-to-roots trend of the day. Interestingly, the Beatles had also covered the Coasters "Searchin'" for their Decca Audition, and I think the Stones did as well, although I can't quite recall what tune.
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filledeplage
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« Reply #24 on: June 19, 2013, 01:37:18 PM »

I think I can understand why one might not consider it to be "Beach Boys' music" lyrically. Musically, however, I would, and probably needlessly, point out that SDT is a straight re-write of the Coasters' Riot in Cellblock Number 9, which places it firmly in the back-to-roots trend of the day. Interestingly, the Beatles had also covered the Coasters "Searchin'" for their Decca Audition, and I think the Stones did as well, although I can't quite recall what tune.

They did plenty of covers.  I agree with drbeachboy 100%.  It marginalizes what some think the Band should be doing, which is what they (The Band) consider pertinent.  This is the same Band of "The Trader" dealing with colonialism issues. 

Why shouldn't they have a opinion? Surely their education "on the road," seeing places like the Berlin Wall, The Czech crisis, and their own country's turmoil over time should credentialize them to compose non BB stereotype material.  They should all have Ph.D's with what they've learned about world events.

Write-on, Mike!  Wink
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