Four more years!

[Bean Bag]

Tell yrself that whilst decent healthcare becomes the norm, la.

Really?  The same government that can't prepare or respond to a hurricane is going to deliver better healthcare than we have today?  That makes total sense to me.

Oh wait...you only said "decent" healthcare will become "the norm."  That makes sense now.  My family's great healthcare will become "decent."  Define decent -- no, wait -- don't.  I'm tired of propaganda and bumper stickers.  I'll allow reality to define what decent healthcare will mean for everyone.

Reality's coming.  Tick, tock...

[Chocolate Shake Man]

Tell yrself that whilst decent healthcare becomes the norm, la.

Where will this decent healthcare come from? A magic wand? The US government's unfunded liabilities are over 60 trillion dollars, no-one will receive anything in the future. What is your solution to that?

The "solution to that" is public healthcare since it has now been shown convincingly by economist Dean Baker that the very act of socializing health care would work to eliminate the deficit.

                                               

A convincing conclusion as a result of a research study.

[rn57]

Bruce Johnston is angrily downing yet another Pacifico...staring dumbfounded at the flickering teevee screen

I'm a happy man tonight. Very very happy.

Bruce probably smashed the TV using skills he learn from hanging out with Keith Moon.

Huh? I thought we all knew, from that outburst in NYC captured on video, that he didn't like Mitt and thought the last really good Republican was Reagan.

Anyway, I guess this means that the prospects for the guys playing a White House dinner before 2017 are pretty much nil, since I figure our President will stick to his tried-and-true performers like Stevie Wonder, Earth Wind & Fire, etc.

[Jason]

Tell yrself that whilst decent healthcare becomes the norm, la.

Really?  The same government that can't prepare or respond to a hurricane is going to deliver better healthcare than we have today?  That makes total sense to me.

Oh wait...you only said "decent" healthcare will become "the norm."  That makes sense now.  My family's great healthcare will become "decent."  Define decent -- no, wait -- don't.  I'm tired of propaganda and bumper stickers.  I'll allow reality to define what decent healthcare will mean for everyone.

Reality's coming.  Tick, tock...

Hype lives in a country where coverage is universal and a woman can go to the hospital where she is refused treatment because government drone "doctors" think that cancer is "nerve pain and anxiety". I dare you to watch the video in the link below and still tell me you supported socialized medicine.

John Bull's tyranny has gone to the point where you basically can't get treatment at all if you're sick, regardless of whether or not you can pay for it. Stay classy, England. Stay classy. If there's one country governed by people with no regard for human life, it's England.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2215532/My-sisters-cervical-cancer-misdiagnosed-30-times-mother-wrongly-told-suffering-anxiety.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

[hypehat]

i just edited my post to that because i thought calling swedish frog a conspiracy nut was a bad idea. Little did I know.

hey, you want the best healthcare, you can pay for it. No biggie. If you wanna pay for private healthcare in my socialist english utopia, you're welcome to do it. But everyone gets healthcare regardless.

I've said it before, but if that's socialism, I f***ing love socialism.


TRBB if I started parroting articles from FOX as the gospel, you'd laugh in my face, so just realise you're doing the exact same thing with the Daily Mail in this instance. The NHS is under attack from your equivalents in Britain, and that's what they're parroting. Not. the. case. If it's true, that kind of thing is what you get after three years of government (a party I don't support) deregulation, shipping elements off to private companies, and cutting public funds. So really, the NHS is being controlled in a way that you would approve of.

[hypehat]

I mean hell, I can't blame for you being uninformed on the matter, you get your news from The Daily Mail!

[Chocolate Shake Man]

Hype lives in a country where coverage is universal and a woman can go to the hospital where she is refused treatment because government drone "doctors" think that cancer is "nerve pain and anxiety". I dare you to watch the video in the link below and still tell me you supported socialized medicine.

John Bull's tyranny has gone to the point where you basically can't get treatment at all if you're sick, regardless of whether or not you can pay for it. Stay classy, England. Stay classy. If there's one country governed by people with no regard for human life, it's England.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-2215532/My-sisters-cervical-cancer-misdiagnosed-30-times-mother-wrongly-told-suffering-anxiety.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

Here's a good case for comparison. Either you can agree with the position that believes a more privatized system is faulty not only because it is the most expensive system but also because according to the framers of the health care policy, functions to deny care, and despite the fact that the US taxpayer pays more for health than any other industrialized system, it has nevertheless denied 10 of millions of people from care. Or you can believe the other side who believes that socialized medicine is bad because one time it affected one person badly. Seriously, if you honestly want to critique a system in a serious way (and I'm sure you don't - it's hard to take serious a guy like TRBB who is in favor of letting 4 and a half million children die per year on principle) then you can't simply pull out one case and then brush your hands like it's a job well done.

[Bean Bag]

it's hard to take serious a guy like TRBB who is in favor of letting 4 and a half million children die per year on principle

4.5 million children die each year?  Are we talking healthcare or abortion?

[Bean Bag]

by the way abortion is a great way to cut healtcare cost.  Communists know all about that.  So is letting granny die.  But there's plenty of time to find this stuff out for reals.

Yay Death Panels!

[Chocolate Shake Man]

it's hard to take serious a guy like TRBB who is in favor of letting 4 and a half million children die per year on principle

4.5 million children die each year?  Are we talking healthcare or abortion?

I'm talking about neither but am rather referencing a former conversation between me and TRBB that you had no involvement in.

[Bean Bag]

it's hard to take serious a guy like TRBB who is in favor of letting 4 and a half million children die per year on principle

4.5 million children die each year?  Are we talking healthcare or abortion?

I'm talking about neither but am rather referencing a former conversation between me and TRBB that you had no involvement in.

Still, that's a lot of children.

[hypehat]

by the way abortion is a great way to cut healtcare cost.  Communists know all about that.  So is letting granny die.  But there's plenty of time to find this stuff out for reals.

Yay Death Panels!

Yep. That's so how it works over here. In fact this was published in the latest Hansard,

"Honourable Member, what do you propose to do about the deficit? We are billions in debt!"

"As the honourable member from across the floor says, we are indeed billions in debt. But The Tories have the solution - KILL THE GRANNIES."

*Speaker calls everyone to order*

[Chocolate Shake Man]

by the way abortion is a great way to cut healtcare cost.  Communists know all about that.  So is letting granny die.  But there's plenty of time to find this stuff out for reals.

Yay Death Panels!

There is absolutely no credible study that supports the idea of death panels. It is widely understood that this was pure fabrication in order to stir up hysteria. And clearly, in some extremist circles, it still works despite the voluminous evidence that undermines it. Every other country in the industrialized world has a socialized health care system and do not have these death panels. It is telling that the ultra-right could not even tolerate a business-friendly non-socialist health care plan that had been twice offered by Republicans (Dole and Romney) but when your motivation is only to block whatever Obama is doing on the basis that Obama is doing it (nobody brought up death panels when Romney and Dole offered virtually identical health care plans) it is not surprising that one quickly stoops to outright hysterical lies and fabrications that are also the very textbook definition of hypocrisy.

[Chocolate Shake Man]

it's hard to take serious a guy like TRBB who is in favor of letting 4 and a half million children die per year on principle

4.5 million children die each year?  Are we talking healthcare or abortion?

I'm talking about neither but am rather referencing a former conversation between me and TRBB that you had no involvement in.

Still, that's a lot of children.

It is. Prey tell, where do these children live?

[Chocolate Shake Man]

by the way abortion is a great way to cut healtcare cost.  Communists know all about that.  So is letting granny die.  But there's plenty of time to find this stuff out for reals.

Yay Death Panels!

Yep. That's so how it works over here. In fact this was published in the latest Hansard,

"Honourable Member, what do you propose to do about the deficit? We are billions in debt!"

"As the honourable member from across the floor says, we are indeed billions in debt. But The Tories have the solution - KILL THE GRANNIES."

*Speaker calls everyone to order*

Too right. If there is any system that kills the grannies, it is the one that finishes second last amonst industrialized countries in effective care and last in safe care and as a result last in long, healthy, productive lives.

[Bean Bag]

it's hard to take serious a guy like TRBB who is in favor of letting 4 and a half million children die per year on principle

4.5 million children die each year?  Are we talking healthcare or abortion?

I'm talking about neither but am rather referencing a former conversation between me and TRBB that you had no involvement in.

Still, that's a lot of children.

It is. Prey tell, where do these children live?

They're dead.

[hypehat]

Bruce Johnston is angrily downing yet another Pacifico...staring dumbfounded at the flickering teevee screen

I'm a happy man tonight. Very very happy.

Bruce probably smashed the TV using skills he learn from hanging out with Keith Moon.

On a lighter note, Bruce Johnston has probably just fled California screaming http://www.sfgate.com/politics/article/Democrats-seize-supermajority-in-state-Legislature-4015861.php

[SMiLE Brian]

Bruce Johnston is angrily downing yet another Pacifico...staring dumbfounded at the flickering teevee screen

I'm a happy man tonight. Very very happy.

Bruce probably smashed the TV using skills he learn from hanging out with Keith Moon.

On a lighter note, Bruce Johnston has probably just fled California screaming http://www.sfgate.com/politics/article/Democrats-seize-supermajority-in-state-Legislature-4015861.php

Bruce is planning a revolution with Donald Trump as we speak.

[Chocolate Shake Man]

it's hard to take serious a guy like TRBB who is in favor of letting 4 and a half million children die per year on principle

4.5 million children die each year?  Are we talking healthcare or abortion?

I'm talking about neither but am rather referencing a former conversation between me and TRBB that you had no involvement in.

Still, that's a lot of children.

It is. Prey tell, where do these children live?

They're dead.

Why don't we just leave it at you don't know what you're talking about and haven't bothered to understand the context of the remark.

[Bean Bag]

by the way abortion is a great way to cut healtcare cost.  Communists know all about that.  So is letting granny die.  But there's plenty of time to find this stuff out for reals.

Yay Death Panels!

Yep. That's so how it works over here. In fact this was published in the latest Hansard,

"Honourable Member, what do you propose to do about the deficit? We are billions in debt!"

"As the honourable member from across the floor says, we are indeed billions in debt. But The Tories have the solution - KILL THE GRANNIES."

*Speaker calls everyone to order*

Wow, that's pretty ballsy of them to say it like that.

In America, I suspect they'll just make Granny wait in a really long line.  And if she's still alive when her number's called, the nice lady at the desk will tell her "Sorry, you don't qualify for this procedure.  But here's a pain pill."

But hey... I like your country's way too!!   

[Chocolate Shake Man]

by the way abortion is a great way to cut healtcare cost.  Communists know all about that.  So is letting granny die.  But there's plenty of time to find this stuff out for reals.

Yay Death Panels!

Yep. That's so how it works over here. In fact this was published in the latest Hansard,

"Honourable Member, what do you propose to do about the deficit? We are billions in debt!"

"As the honourable member from across the floor says, we are indeed billions in debt. But The Tories have the solution - KILL THE GRANNIES."

*Speaker calls everyone to order*

Wow, that's pretty ballsy of them to say it like that.

In America, I suspect they'll just make Granny wait in a really long line.  And if she's still alive when her number's called, the nice lady at the desk will tell her "Sorry, you don't qualify for this procedure.  But here's a pain pill."

But hey... I like your country's way too!!   

Actually, what you're describing is not Obamacare but rather how the US privitized health care system is supposed to work, according to the main framers of the policy. Remember too that Obamacare is nothing like the socialized health care system that you see in other industrialized nations.

[Bean Bag]

it's hard to take serious a guy like TRBB who is in favor of letting 4 and a half million children die per year on principle

4.5 million children die each year?  Are we talking healthcare or abortion?

I'm talking about neither but am rather referencing a former conversation between me and TRBB that you had no involvement in.

Still, that's a lot of children.

It is. Prey tell, where do these children live?

They're dead.

Why don't we just leave it at you don't know what you're talking about and haven't bothered to understand the context of the remark.

Hey...what's the matter with my ending?  Too bleak?     (Reality's coming...tick, tock...)


Either way...I agree.  Let's stick with your ending -- "I don't know what I'm talking about...because I don't understand the full conversation you were having."  Actually, I'm fine with ending it on "I hate women" or "war on women." "Right to choose," "it's their body" yadda, yadda, yadda.

There....I feel better.  Kind of like a pain pill!   

[Bean Bag]

by the way abortion is a great way to cut healtcare cost.  Communists know all about that.  So is letting granny die.  But there's plenty of time to find this stuff out for reals.

Yay Death Panels!

Yep. That's so how it works over here. In fact this was published in the latest Hansard,

"Honourable Member, what do you propose to do about the deficit? We are billions in debt!"

"As the honourable member from across the floor says, we are indeed billions in debt. But The Tories have the solution - KILL THE GRANNIES."

*Speaker calls everyone to order*

Wow, that's pretty ballsy of them to say it like that.

In America, I suspect they'll just make Granny wait in a really long line.  And if she's still alive when her number's called, the nice lady at the desk will tell her "Sorry, you don't qualify for this procedure.  But here's a pain pill."

But hey... I like your country's way too!!   

Actually, what you're describing is not Obamacare but rather how the US privitized health care system is supposed to work, according to the main framers of the policy. Remember too that Obamacare is nothing like the socialized health care system that you see in other industrialized nations.

I think the last time we debated here on this subject, we ended on "we're never going to convince each other..."  Hence my annoying mantra "Reality's coming...tick, tock."  We'll find out who's right.  The only question is how long can the media convince people it's working.  Long enough, I suspect, until no one remembers any other way.  And with fewer and fewer free societies on the market... it'll all be better if we just take our pill.

[Chocolate Shake Man]

it's hard to take serious a guy like TRBB who is in favor of letting 4 and a half million children die per year on principle

4.5 million children die each year?  Are we talking healthcare or abortion?

I'm talking about neither but am rather referencing a former conversation between me and TRBB that you had no involvement in.

Still, that's a lot of children.

It is. Prey tell, where do these children live?

They're dead.

Why don't we just leave it at you don't know what you're talking about and haven't bothered to understand the context of the remark.

Hey...what's the matter with my ending?  Too bleak?     (Reality's coming...tick, tock...)


Either way...I agree.  Let's stick with your ending -- "I don't know what I'm talking about...because I don't understand the full conversation you were having."  Actually, I'm fine with ending it on "I hate women" or "war on women." "Right to choose," "it's their body" yadda, yadda, yadda.

There....I feel better.  Kind of like a pain pill!   

Erm, no. My problem is that you don't know who I am referring to when I talk about the 4 and a half million children - you don't know who they are, where they are from, and why they are dying. This is why I have no patience for you sticking with your initial hunch that the number had anything to do with health care and or abortion. If you want to talk about those 4 and half million children, I am happy to do so. But I want to talk about the real ones not the pretend fairy tale ones that you have made up. I also have no patience for the pride you are taking in your ignorance nor your supremely despicable attempt to put words in my mouth. And the words you put into my mouth only reaffirm that you want to live in a fairy tale land. Why would I say you "hate women" - well, you think I would call you that, because you bizarrely think we are having a conversation about abortion, which I never brought up and haven't alluded to in the slightest until this very moment. Using your logic, I might as well rip your "yadda yadda yadda" comment from its context and assume that you're making some comment about Seinfeld. This is an embarrassment and for your own sake, I think you should drop it.

[Chocolate Shake Man]

by the way abortion is a great way to cut healtcare cost.  Communists know all about that.  So is letting granny die.  But there's plenty of time to find this stuff out for reals.

Yay Death Panels!

Yep. That's so how it works over here. In fact this was published in the latest Hansard,

"Honourable Member, what do you propose to do about the deficit? We are billions in debt!"

"As the honourable member from across the floor says, we are indeed billions in debt. But The Tories have the solution - KILL THE GRANNIES."

*Speaker calls everyone to order*

Wow, that's pretty ballsy of them to say it like that.

In America, I suspect they'll just make Granny wait in a really long line.  And if she's still alive when her number's called, the nice lady at the desk will tell her "Sorry, you don't qualify for this procedure.  But here's a pain pill."

But hey... I like your country's way too!!  

Actually, what you're describing is not Obamacare but rather how the US privitized health care system is supposed to work, according to the main framers of the policy. Remember too that Obamacare is nothing like the socialized health care system that you see in other industrialized nations.

I think the last time we debated here on this subject, we ended on "we're never going to convince each other..."  Hence my annoying mantra "Reality's coming...tick, tock."  We'll find out who's right.  The only question is how long can the media convince people it's working.  Long enough, I suspect, until no one remembers any other way.  And with fewer and fewer free societies on the market... it'll all be better if we just take our pill.

Your posts so far demonstrate that you are in no position to even begin to comment on reality. Why don't you deal with the substance of my post instead of showing me how you can spell the sound a clock makes.