What's VDP's problem?

[debonbon]

It's amazing how much insight people have on what went on and what the intentions and motivations were of artists without actually being there or even born at the time.

[Pinder's Gone To Kokomo And Back Again]

Hey our children's children's children will be arguing and pontificating about this stuff 50 years from now.

People are also still discussing the intentions/motivations of Nero, Hitler, JFK,  and Jesus Christ too.

[MBE]

You ask people who were there questions you find film, newspaper, books, and audio and you form your view. Insider books are almost always less accurate than those where research is done by a fan for fans. One exception is Bill Wyman from the Stones who has most of the facts right as he kept track of everything in his 30 years with them.

[southbay]

Wish i could believe that, but anyone else just thinking in their gut: Man this new album is going to be awful.

I wish they'd just drop it. Enough attempts were made to tarnish their rep in the '80's - it'd be so much better if they just STOPPED! Let the bands incredible back catalogue speak for itself. Release more of the (superb) unreleased material from their prime if they really wanna release something.

Yeah it's nice to see 'em getting together in the Do It Again video, but that's the only nice thing about it. I'd just rather they got together in private and finally just left the legacy alone.

No, SIP can't be the last BBs album.

You mean the one VDP played on?

A great irony if I must say because Van Dyke was involved on both the most arty album (smile) and most commercial crap album (SIP)

Yep, that's what I was getting at.

[MBE]

I'm just glad I'm not still raked over the coals for some stupid merda I did or said when I was still in my mid 20's!

Sheesh!

I made that point in the interview actually. It would suck for people to know all the stupid things I did back when I was young.

[NightHider]

The way I read that interview, VDP seems to be upset that his lyrics have been repeatedly dismissed by ML as 'druggy' ramblings and incomprehensible when VDP (among many others) feels the lyrics were artistic, deep and abstract while still being meaningful prose.  I would firmly agree with VDP while agreeing with ML that most listeners would not 'get it'.  

Based on my personal 'conversations' with VDP, I would summise firstly that he is not pleased with the way Brian is 'handled' (hence the "....led into this reunion" comment) and also that he is displeased with the way his 'esoteric' lyrics have consistenly been disregarded by ML as the primarily 'weak link' in the commerical appeal and 'non-support' of the SMiLE album.

In correspondence I had with VDP years ago, he expressed his dissatisfaction with the fact the Brian Camp was unwilling to sign off on a remastered re-release of Orange Crate Art.  It still has not seen a reissue.  OCA is a GREAT album and deserves to be available remastered on CD and on vinyl as well.   VDP also commented on how stiff and impersonable Brian's handler's were in delivering him by limo to the recording sessions for OCA and how they demanded BW have a break at a designated time for a special chicken salad sandwich lunch.  

I am also sure I had read an interview with VDP around the time of the 'That Lucky Old Sun' release where VDP stated something like Brian was ...."working on an album as an ode to California, I wonder where he got that idea."  Touche' sir.

[MBE]

NightHider I like your post on this.

Funny I love his Smile lyrics so why put me in the heading? I did write him tonight so I hope he understands I am just trying to take a middle ground.  Personally I don't think anyone would let Mike Love dictate what they like or not. I would  have no problem with the Van Dyke  except I honestly think he just makes himself look bad everytime he attacks Mike. Parks should get as much chance to talk as Mike, but Mike has never gotten personal with Van Dyke in public. In fact he has even said he likes him.

I don't like OCA that much as of now, but vinyl can open me up to sounds and I would like the chance to hear it in that format.

I am always open to hearing good things about Parks or anyone. Again my only seriousl objection is the stuff he has been saying since the TV movie came out. It's nothing to do with his work which I will always enjoy even if he puts up a dartboard of my picture.

[Wirestone]

I would  have no problem with the Van Dyke  except I honestly think he just makes himself look bad everytime he attacks Mike. Parks should get as much chance to talk as Mike, but Mike has never gotten personal with Van Dyke in public.

You don't think creating a TV movie portraying Van Dyke as a drug pusher who ruined Brian's life isn't getting personal?

Really?

That was libelous, you know. The TV movie was changed under threat of legal action.

How would you feel if your good name -- one you spent decades proving as an arranger, composer and performer -- was dragged through the mud on national television? It would feel pretty personal to me, especially if that TV show was spearheaded by the person I'd butted heads with decades earlier.

And for saying his piece in a little elliptical essay on his website, Van Dyke looks bad?

Really?

[MBE]

Yep because he dragged me into it for no reason.

He wasn't a drug pusher in the movie . He was there during drug scenes but he wasn't a pusher at all. I've seen the movie have it on tape and I thought Van Dyke was funny in the movie. Most of the quotes were taken from real life.  Never understood why it had to be changed. Is there some sort of directors cut? Otherwise back up your unfounded claims. If he had let him use the lyrics "Smile" would have come off better and that's his own fault.  The movie sucked in the second half but more on how they treated Brian (like a drooling madman) , Dennis (like a dumb angry kid with a touch of talent), and even Mike as far as him almost hitting Brian. Doubt that happened. Why are you bothering me about it anyway I didn't write it and don't even like it. I just mentioned that's when Parks took a turn in public.  Parks has in Mojo and the other UK music mags,, the net, etc.  has been very angry sounding and nasty and  it's unbecoming no matter what Mike or anyone did. I don't like what I have read and heard periof.

Also isn't it so that Van Dyke was on speed? I've read that a few times. Not saying at all he got Brian on it but it by far was the worst drug Brian did at the time. Van Dyke isn't exactly the poster boy for being anti drug in 1966-67 was he.

What is your thing about what I think about Van Dyke as a person? It has no bearing on how I write about his music at all. Read the interview it's not anti Van Dyke it's just my views on the period. Why he took offense or you take offense (as a wise man once said) "God Only Knows".  

I give up trying to explain myself to you and I've said what I have to say and that's that. I've tried to keep cool about this and be nice but enough is enough.

[Ron]

When Van Dyke Parks put out his last album, did Mike Love write a commentary on a website somewhere telling you what a piece of sh*t Van Dyke Parks is?  No.  


When Mike Love decided to tour around the world with his cousin and his friends, did Van Dyke Parks decide to write a commentary about what a piece of sh*t Mike Love is?  Yes.



VDP is a bigger prick than Mike could ever be.

Brian lost a multimillion dollar lawsuit to Mike.  Yet Brian's standing on stage next to him.  How's that make Brian look?  He looks like a man, he looks like someone who forgives and forgets.

Al has been sued by Mike, but there he is on the same stage with him making good music.  How's that make Al look?  It makes him look like a man, he looks like someone who forgives and forgets.

VDP needs to

A. Shut the hell up

or

B. Pick up the phone, like a man, and call Mike up and apologize for being such a dick to him.  


Of course he won't do either, because he's a small, petty person who's not even in the same universe as Mr. positivity.  

BTW, Mike's lyrics in "Good Vibrations" are better than anything VDP ever wrote.  

Not trolling; just attacking VDP's hatred.  He decided to talk trash, so that invites more negativity.  


















Here's the dirty secret.  If you're a VDP fan, don't read this.  You'll get so mad you'll stay up another 7 pages telling me what an idiot I am.  DO NOT READ BEYOND THIS IF YOU ARE A VDP FAN.

















You know why VDP is really still mad?  Because he's all about the money.  He's pissed that in his mind, Mike didn't let the album come out, and he didn't get paid as much for it.  Now keep in mind  many of the good songs were released on other albums anyways, so ultimately what he's pissed about is that he didn't get paid enough for the half-assed songs on the album that didn't make it onto other albums.  

I know it sucks.  I wish he'd just be honest about it, he's pissed that the money he got for his contribution wasn't what he though it should be.  He should be paid, and paid well for his work, but why doesn't he just come out and THANK! Mike Love for all the money he's made off those songs over the years.

What a lot of people hate about Mike Love (his money lubbin ways) is the same affliction VDP suffers from.  

[endofposts]

I don't understand why Van Dyke Parks should say anything about the Beach Boys' reunion.  It's none of his business.  He was never a member of the band.  His harping on Mike Love is stupid.  Brian Wilson was the person who decided not to release "Smile" and do "Smiley Smile" instead.  It's not like Van Dyke Parks' lyrics didn't get used prior to the recent release, because they did, repeatedly, both on "Smiley Smile" and on subsequent releases over the years of tracks like "Surf's Up."  Does Van Dyke know how illogical he sounds?  He's trying to greatly puff up what he meant to the Beach Boys and also Brian Wilson.  No wonder Brian has become estranged from him at various times over the years, with Parks' patronizing attitude.  I'm a Van Dyke fan, too.  I've seen his show and have a couple of his CD's.  He's entitled to his opinion, but it's not very nice to Brian himself, let alone Mike or the other band members.  If Van Dyke thinks he's poor and is jealous of the Beach Boys' money and success,  he should think about David Marks.  At least one guy is benefitting from it who doesn't already have a lot of money.

[mammy blue]

It's amazing how the wheels of fandom have turned. These days, it seems pretty passe in some circles to in any way implicate Mike in the creative stallout of the Beach Boys, and why can't Van just *get over it*, right? Except that, as others in this thread have pointed out far more eloquently than myself, Mike made a subtle point of connecting his distaste for VDP's lyrics with drug use and the effects of said abuse on the band's future.. get it? This was in the official SMiLE booklet. VDP, nonetheless, kept quiet about it until the endless questioning in person and speculation on the internet reached a point of ridiculousness. So, he responds with characteristic wit and a little fire in his belly on a little corner of his website, so what??? The little guy is entitled to his opinion outside the confines of Beach Boys Inc., and I for one am happy to hear it. Might he be a little bitter? Well, hell yeah! It must still be kinda tough to read all the accolades for a musical project released in 2012 that the authors had every intention to release back in 1966.... and to witness the, now perfectly safe realignment of the other Beach Boys post BWPS regarding this work... HELL, YEAH, it was a realignment. Mike, Bruce and Al are all to a certain extent covering their asses and singing a different tune now that they know music history is on the side of SMiLE, largely thanks to BW and VDP's completion of the work in 2003. Back in the day, Dennis was the only other BB who stood by SMiLE from beginning to end; ask anyone who was there. VDP was a personal witness to all this and more. Cut the guy some slack, OK?

BTW, I like Mike Love and I love TM; I practice it every day and swear by it; the results really are incredible. A mindless VDPite I am not.  

[MBE]

I don't understand why Van Dyke Parks should say anything about the Beach Boys' reunion.  It's none of his business.  He was never a member of the band.  His harping on Mike Love is stupid.  Brian Wilson was the person who decided not to release "Smile" and do "Smiley Smile" instead.  It's not like Van Dyke Parks' lyrics didn't get used prior to the recent release, because they did, repeatedly, both on "Smiley Smile" and on subsequent releases over the years of tracks like "Surf's Up."  Does Van Dyke know how illogical he sounds?  He's trying to greatly puff up what he meant to the Beach Boys and also Brian Wilson.  No wonder Brian has become estranged from him at various times over the years, with Parks' patronizing attitude.  I'm a Van Dyke fan, too.  I've seen his show and have a couple of his CD's.  He's entitled to his opinion, but it's not very nice to Brian himself, let alone Mike or the other band members.  If Van Dyke thinks he's poor and is jealous of the Beach Boys' money and success,  he should think about David Marks.  At least one guy is benefitting from it who doesn't already have a lot of money.

You are so very right.

[endofposts]

It's Brian Wilson who was the heroic one in the "Smile" story, not Van Dyke Parks.  For an intellectual, Van Dyke has a poor understanding of mental illness.  It's like he doesn't even think or care about the hell Brian went through all those years. None of which was caused by Mike Love, by the way.  It just happened.  But Van Dyke has said things in interviews such as Brian "just needs his ass kicked."  He also enabled Brian by taking him out on the LA party scene back when Van Dyke was young and going though his own thing, and he should be grateful both of them cleaned up and are still thriving.   I respect the fine work he's done outside of the Beach Boys, as well as the work he did with them and with Brian, but that's all.  He should realize that the situation has moved on and he should be cheering his buddy Brian on, not putting him down for reuniting with the Beach Boys or having "handlers." I'm sure Brian would have a difficult time without some handlers, given his condition.

[Wirestone]

Yep because he dragged me into it for no reason.

He wasn't a drug pusher in the movie . He was there during drug scenes but he wasn't a pusher at all. I've seen the movie have it on tape and I thought Van Dyke was funny in the movie. Most of the quotes were taken from real life.  Never understood why it had to be changed. Is there some sort of directors cut? Otherwise back up your unfounded claims. If he had let him use the lyrics "Smile" would have come off better and that's his own fault.  The movie sucked in the second half but more on how they treated Brian (like a drooling madman) , Dennis (like a dumb angry kid with a touch of talent), and even Mike as far as him almost hitting Brian. Doubt that happened. Why are you bothering me about it anyway I didn't write it and don't even like it. I just mentioned that's when Parks took a turn in public.  Parks has in Mojo and the other UK music mags,, the net, etc.  has been very angry sounding and nasty and  it's unbecoming no matter what Mike or anyone did. I don't like what I have read and heard periof.

Also isn't it so that Van Dyke was on speed? I've read that a few times. Not saying at all he got Brian on it but it by far was the worst drug Brian did at the time. Van Dyke isn't exactly the poster boy for being anti drug in 1966-67 was he.

What is your thing about what I think about Van Dyke as a person? It has no bearing on how I write about his music at all. Read the interview it's not anti Van Dyke it's just my views on the period. Why he took offense or you take offense (as a wise man once said) "God Only Knows".  

I give up trying to explain myself to you and I've said what I have to say and that's that. I've tried to keep cool about this and be nice but enough is enough.

Love the shouting. Keep it up, it really makes your points so much more ... red?

If you don't understand why I wrote what I did, perhaps you should take a moment to re-read. The points are perfectly clear.

You don't like Van Dyke's attitude. I was attempting to describe why such an attitude might arise after dealing with a show that libeled him in front of a national TV audience. The show was a direct, personal insult from Mike to Van Dyke. You may not believe it to be so, but it was certainly interpreted as such by many at the time (including, most importantly, Van Dyke).

(A word to the wise, by the way. I doubt the wisdom of a post with flaming red highlights about how your personal feelings on Van Dyke don't affect your writing. The, um, flaming red highlights cast a soupçon of doubt upon that point.)

[MBE]

He hates the red color. We must change it!

I changed the shade to a calmer red.   I wasn't yelling but making a point. I thought yelling is caps! Anyhow don't lose sleep.

[DonnyL]

When Van Dyke Parks put out his last album, did Mike Love write a commentary on a website somewhere telling you what a piece of sh*t Van Dyke Parks is?  No.  


When Mike Love decided to tour around the world with his cousin and his friends, did Van Dyke Parks decide to write a commentary about what a piece of sh*t Mike Love is?  Yes.



VDP is a bigger prick than Mike could ever be.

Brian lost a multimillion dollar lawsuit to Mike.  Yet Brian's standing on stage next to him.  How's that make Brian look?  He looks like a man, he looks like someone who forgives and forgets.

Al has been sued by Mike, but there he is on the same stage with him making good music.  How's that make Al look?  It makes him look like a man, he looks like someone who forgives and forgets.

VDP needs to

A. Shut the hell up

or

B. Pick up the phone, like a man, and call Mike up and apologize for being such a dick to him.  


Of course he won't do either, because he's a small, petty person who's not even in the same universe as Mr. positivity.  

BTW, Mike's lyrics in "Good Vibrations" are better than anything VDP ever wrote.  

Not trolling; just attacking VDP's hatred.  He decided to talk trash, so that invites more negativity.  


















Here's the dirty secret.  If you're a VDP fan, don't read this.  You'll get so mad you'll stay up another 7 pages telling me what an idiot I am.  DO NOT READ BEYOND THIS IF YOU ARE A VDP FAN.

















You know why VDP is really still mad?  Because he's all about the money.  He's pissed that in his mind, Mike didn't let the album come out, and he didn't get paid as much for it.  Now keep in mind  many of the good songs were released on other albums anyways, so ultimately what he's pissed about is that he didn't get paid enough for the half-assed songs on the album that didn't make it onto other albums.  

I know it sucks.  I wish he'd just be honest about it, he's pissed that the money he got for his contribution wasn't what he though it should be.  He should be paid, and paid well for his work, but why doesn't he just come out and THANK! Mike Love for all the money he's made off those songs over the years.

What a lot of people hate about Mike Love (his money lubbin ways) is the same affliction VDP suffers from.  

wow.

[DonnyL]

I believe some of the people who were there during the SMiLE period feel Mike Love was representative of what caused Brian to withdraw and scrap the album.  I don't think most of these folks will say so publicly, but privately they will.  I believe Mike was seen as a sort of 'party crasher' or 'narc' and was not into the scene at all. 

Let's keep in mind we as fans don't really know what really happened, and Brian and Mike obviously have a very strong (musical and familial) bond.  I wouldn't discount the influence of Mike's opinion on Brian.  Brian disassociated himself with most people from the SMiLE scene within a few months.

Van Dyke Parks has more right than any of us to comment on the Beach Boys' reunion.  And his statement was not particularly negative, but more observational.

[Billgoodman]

This thread sounds just like Gorilla vs Bear (or my dad could beat up your dad)


VDP doesn't get along with ML. We shouldn't be surprised, lot's of people don't get along with him. Couple of years later they share the stage with him again. People change for lot's of reasons.


I met VDP once and he was wonderful. My dad (who could beat up your dad...) ran into him in a Belgian restaurant the day after a concert and said 'Mr. Parks, I dont want to bother you, but I was really delighted that you played ....[song title I forgot]  last night, thanks'. 15 minutes later a glass of wine is served at my fathers table with VDP's card. So, free wine and a bussiness card from one of your heroes. That's very friendly, if you ask me.

Doesn't sound like a guy 'who is all about the money'. His bitterness about TSS or BB Celebration could very well be about money, though. But I have a feeling it's more driven by the same old SMILE-questions over the years.

It's not just Smile, it's also that VDP helped the Beach Boys get a deal with Warner, helped them out with Sail on Sailor, helped them out on Kokomo and helped Mike Love get a plain ticket. VDP has been very vocal that Mike Love screwed him over in almost all those cases. But as we all know, you could look at the Smile Saga for instance from Mike's point of view and understand his actions. Lately, there has been a rehabilitation of Mike on this board and that's great.
 
On the other hand, if that anecdote about the plain ticket is true, then Mike Love is truly an asshole.

[Aegir]

what's the "plain ticket" anecdote? I didn't read every page in this thread because the arguing makes my brain melt.

[b00ts]

Blah blah blah...

I am a fan of both VDP and Mike Love, and after seeing your sexist comments, and now the questions you've posed and oh-so-daringly answered yourself, I am finally through reading anything you write. Long-overdue.

However, Wirestone and MBE, I am enjoying your back-and-forth. I am learning lots of new information. MBE, I can understand why you feel personally slighted by VDP, and perhaps he took what you said in the interview a little too personally. I don't think Wirestone is trying to attack you personally, though. It seems like a fairly civil exchange of views, in spite of the passions running high.

E-mailing VDP directly was the best thing you could have done at this point, and I applaud you for it.

I suppose the answer to VDP not being involved with the Smile Sessions is "all of the above" - he said all he felt he could say on the subject in the past, and is not a huge fan of Mike Love. This begs the question, though: why did he play on Summer in Paradise, with no BDW involvement?

Also, we all know Brian has a long history of having others run interference for him. For instance, the "special chicken salad sandwich" break during the OCA sessions seems to be something Brian wanted. Why does VDP never blame Brian directly for his actions? He seems to blame Brian's handlers and others, but not Brian himself. Clearly he knows BW much better than I ever will, but from what I know of Brian, it still seems a bit odd.

[b00ts]

what's the "plain ticket" anecdote? I didn't read every page in this thread because the arguing makes my brain melt.

Here it is, via Luther, via VDP's website, circa 2005. It also answers my questions about VDP playing on Kokomo and Summer in Paradise... Luther's words:

Here is the cost-sharing-flight story, discussed in this thread mostly from recollections, as told in the April 6, 2000, issue of the New York Times (copied and pasted from vandykeparks.com). I figured it's worth having on the record.
..............

"Many years later, when [producer] Terry Melcher wanted to take the song 'Kokomo' to the tropical islands, he called me and wanted to use my Rolodex, so to speak. So, I brought some great   musician friends -- people who'd played with Sinatra, Fitzgerald, Cecil Taylor -- to play with me on that session. I was paid well for my work, although it was a nonunion session -- no hospitalization, no dental, nothing extra if it went   commercial. The Beach Boys, after all, were Republicans -- unions weren't something to mention to them. We weren't dealing with Studs Terkel. We were dealing with Bruce Johnston and Mike Love, who'd become the entity known as the Beach Boys. Of course, the song went to number one, and Mike Love always made a very big deal out of the fact that it was made without Brian Wilson. And that was always very alarming to me because beyond the Beach Boys' beautiful music, my allegiance has always been to Brian Wilson, who hired me years ago and told me he'd give me 50 percent of anything we wrote together. He said that speaking from his throne at a time when I was nobody. Isn't that the sign of a marvelous person?"

Parks recalls he saw Love one final time when Melcher called him to Monterey to play synthesizer on the Beach Boys' final album, recorded without Brian, 1992's dreadful Summer in Paradise. A neighbor offered to fly the musician to Monterey in his one-engine plane if Parks agreed to cover gas and other expenses. When he got there, Love was meditating in Melcher's living room. "For the first time in 30 years, he was able to ask me directly, once again, 'What do those lyrics -- Over and over the crow flies, uncover the cornfield -- mean?'" Parks said about that meeting in '95. "And I was  able to tell him, once again, 'I don't know.' I have no idea what those words mean. I was perhaps thinking of Van Gogh's wheat field or an idealized agrarian environment. Maybe I meant nothing, but I was trying to follow Brian Wilson's vision at that time." Parks says Love asked if he could fly back to L.A. in the plane with him. "We had a nice chat and he insisted that he wanted to split the cost of the flight with me, so he gave me a card with his number on it. The next morning, I called to discover it was a disconnected number. And that was the last time I saw Mike Love."

[Aegir]

hahahahaha that's amazing.

[Cam Mott]

I would  have no problem with the Van Dyke  except I honestly think he just makes himself look bad everytime he attacks Mike. Parks should get as much chance to talk as Mike, but Mike has never gotten personal with Van Dyke in public.

You don't think creating a TV movie portraying Van Dyke as a drug pusher who ruined Brian's life isn't getting personal?

Are you saying you think Mike created that TV movie?

[MBE]

Yeah that was a very jerky thing on Mike's part, but to be pissed for two decades about it? I would have called BRI if the number was disconnected and made the sucker give! Anyhow I do know Mike praised him highly in his 1992 Goldmine interview. In fact Mike was nicer about him than his bandmates.

I hope Wirestone understands that I am not attacking him, but I just thought that maybe if I explained myself we could reach a resolution of sorts. To agree happily to disagree. I tried with a little humor on my last post. It was meant in fun just so you all know. You can't hear my inflection on a message board, but I just have an offball sense of humor that surfaces when I am not sure how to respond. Again I really hope he understands my POV, I do his. I don't agree with it but that's not important I do respect it.

I still don't understand why people are so upset over a movie of the week that has rarely been seen since. It's not on DVD and its airing on cable once in a while really doesn't make much impact. I don't know anyone who takes TV movies purely on face value. Honestly the caracrture of him seems to have been the producers attempt at comedy, and I don't think anyone was hurt by it in the long run. People who belive such nonsense aren't the ones who are going to buy his work anyhow. It has passed into history and Van Dyke Parks has always received  his due critical alclaim.

Actually I think he's been writen about more kindly than almost any other songwriter I know of. I may not like his tatics against Mike, and yes I think they are worse than what Mike ever did to him,  but I hope now he knows my interview was just trying to make sense of the 46 six year "Smile" conflict.  Again as far as "Smile" and "Holland" goes I love his work. Red letters or not I didn't change my opinions on his work over the last dozen years. Hell I like it more now and if anything that is what's reflected.

Mike can say whatever he likes about any given writer or song. The bottom line is that he did what he was told to do and it shouldn't matter. I mean what group likes every song that even the lead member brings in? After all Mike has always liked the music and vocal arrangements. Why would his objection over one line in a song make Brian freak out? I really doubt the (in truth minor) conflict would be remembered much today had the LP come out. People around then may or may not like Mike, but nobody in their right minds would say Mike had near the power of Brian (let alone Carl or even the pre Manson Dennis) had in the sixties. The Wilsons ran that group and Mike was simply one voice of four in business and one voice in six in the studio. He did great work as a writer, singer and MC, but it wasn't his band then.

The one thing that we should remember is that Brian himself went on to praise the post "Smile" period as one where the group got along and worked together well. Keep in mind that during Stephen Desper's original tenure everyone stopped anything and everything when Brian wanted to work. This changed when he came back in 1979, but through 1971 Brian was easily the most powerful and respected member of the band.  I think it does Brian a great diservice to give so much power to Mike. Past is past and it's time to let go Van Dyke is just not doing himself any favors and I have said that for twelve years..

Bottom line they made great music that made us happy, If they do a little more together it's not a bad thing, Even if the record and tour turns out to be a dud we will finally have closure and maybe some personal peace. Also  David for one deserves this tour and album as really they all do.
As Ringo said to end his mail rant..peace and (Mike) love,