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Author Topic: The Stephen Desper Thread  (Read 718578 times)
jiggy22
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« Reply #1825 on: March 30, 2016, 09:32:49 PM »

Fantastic work as always Mr. Desper! I love the remixes of Meant For You, Diamond Head, and Transcendental Meditation! You mention an alternate title for Busy Doin' Nothin' as "Bel-Air Bossa Nova". Was this an original, vintage name suggested for the song? What about Diamond Head, were those opening storm sounds originally part of the track? Thank you again!

COMMENT to jiggy22:

Thanks for the praise.  Just to be clear, these are not remixes, they are re-masterings -- big difference.
Questions:
     Bel-Air Gossa Nova was a tongue-and-cheek comic nickname sometimes used on the inside. Nothing official, but thought I'd put it there for the fun of it.
     I've never liked the spring-reverb substitute for thunder used on the original of Diamond Head. This was produced by shaking a Fender Guitar amphead making the spring used for echo generation produce vibrations up and down the spiral of the spring. I decided to replace it with the real thing, which I believe compliments the song much better and would have been used had it been available at the time.
    I also added a ring modulation effect to the dissonant parts of Transcendental Meditation as I thought it enhanced what Brian was trying to achieve -- IMO
.
~swd    

I gotta stop mixing up the words "remix" and "remaster"!  LOL Thanks a lot for the info Mr. Desper, I really do love the modulation effects on Transcendental Meditation, it makes a discordant song sound even more discordant!
« Last Edit: April 12, 2016, 05:35:22 PM by jiggy22 » Logged

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king of anglia
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« Reply #1826 on: March 31, 2016, 02:53:29 AM »

Friends is a very clean, simple recording, so this remaster seems to enhance the the stereo field and feeling of depth rather than reveal any hidden vocal or instrumental parts as per the Sunflower remaster.

Questions:

Do you know how the instruments and vocals were recorded Steve? Was it all recorded in mono and then panned around?
What kind of reverb was used? Chamber or plate? Was this recorded in stereo?
Did you apply any EQ to this remaster?
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« Reply #1827 on: March 31, 2016, 03:53:59 AM »

I've never liked the spring-reverb substitute for thunder used on the original of Diamond Head. This was produced by shaking a Fender Guitar amphead making the spring used for echo generation produce vibrations up and down the spiral of the spring. I decided to replace it with the real thing, which I believe compliments the song much better and would have been used had it been available at the time.
    I also added a ring modulation effect to the dissonant parts of Transcendental Meditation as I thought it enhanced what Brian was trying to achieve -- IMO
.
~swd   
I really do love the modulation effects on Transcendental Meditation, it makes a discondant song sound even more discordant!

That thunder effect bowled me over. Now I understand why. :=)

"TM" has to be the strangest song ever to promote a state of relaxed awareness!

The modulation effect on the brass reminds me of "Savoy Truffle", possibly for all the wrong reasons. 
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« Reply #1828 on: March 31, 2016, 04:03:46 AM »

Again all I can say is thank you Stephen for all your kind efforts.  Thumbs Up
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Stephen W. Desper
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« Reply #1829 on: March 31, 2016, 07:09:02 PM »

Friends is a very clean, simple recording, so this remaster seems to enhance the the stereo field and feeling of depth rather than reveal any hidden vocal or instrumental parts as per the Sunflower remaster.

Questions:

Do you know how the instruments and vocals were recorded Steve? Was it all recorded in mono and then panned around?
What kind of reverb was used? Chamber or plate? Was this recorded in stereo?
Did you apply any EQ to this remaster?

COMMENT to king of Anglia:
1) You are correct. All amplitude stereo.
2) Both plate and chamber, depending on the studio where the mixdown was made.
3) Not EQ exactly, but something I would call dynamic EQ. This is EQ that follows the waveform and regenerates the leading edge of the waveform usually lost over several copies and certainly in analog to digital conversion. The subjective effect this type of EQ technology gives is to bring out bass transients without boom, or to stress the bite of the bow while keeping the arco in balance, or clarifying enunciation without overbearing pronunciation of vocal words. I've developed circuits that do this quite good and seem to compliment most digital recordings or old analog re-issues. However, when the vocal is really badly down in the mix, using EQ with adjustable "Q" with respect to both bandwidth and level, I can find the sweet spot of the vocalist and lift them enough to make words understandable, when they were hard to hear in the original. I have also developed a technique to double an isolated vocal to some extent, which also helps the words to be understood without changing the character of the original recording. And you should know that I have developed equipment that can "reach back into the mix" and control to some extent the balance, spread and envelopment of each track. Not exactly the same control as one would have in a mixdown, but still a degree of adjustment.
~swd
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drbeachboy
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« Reply #1830 on: April 02, 2016, 12:52:30 PM »

I always liked Transcendental Meditation, but I like even more after hearing the backing track on MiC. That track has a great groove. A really rare track for Brian to write, as he never did the dissonant chord thing in a Beach Boys song quite like that.

COMMENT:  So drbeachboy, what did you think of the Study-Video Transcendental Meditation version with its enhanced dissonant chord sections? ~swd
Well, I am quite impressed with how it sounds. The stereo separation was a great listening experience. Here are some things that I noticed:
Be Here in The Morning- I didn't realize that there was echo on Brian's vocal during the refrains.
Anna Lee The Healer- Love that ping pong effect going on between the bass and bongos.
Little Bird- Wow, so clear. I can really hear the banjo more clearly and the cello sound was quite nice and more out front.
Diamond Head- Great thunder and water effects. During the ukulele break, the water effects had a phantom center that sounded really nice. The guitars had that nice steely Hawaiian sound to them.
Transcendental Meditation- Wow again. The Saxophone is right in your face. To what was being discussed at Hoffman between you and mpayan, there is that swooshy-ness going on throughout the track. It even drowns out Brian's "It's Cool" after the first verse and it becomes less so when he says later the song. Is this maybe the phasey-ness that he was speaking of?

Overall though, it was a great listen and I was hearing some things I have never heard quite so clearly before. The wide stereo separation really works well with this album.

Thank you again for your work! Smiley
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Thou Art In Hawthorne,
Harmonied Be Thy name
Your Kingdom Come,
Your Steak Well Done,
On Stage As It Is In Studio,
Give Us This Day, Our Shortenin' Bread
And Forgive Us Our Bootlegs,
As We Also Have Forgiven Our Wife And Managers,
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Stephen W. Desper
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« Reply #1831 on: April 02, 2016, 01:16:04 PM »

I always liked Transcendental Meditation, but I like even more after hearing the backing track on MiC. That track has a great groove. A really rare track for Brian to write, as he never did the dissonant chord thing in a Beach Boys song quite like that.

COMMENT:  So drbeachboy, what did you think of the Study-Video Transcendental Meditation version with its enhanced dissonant chord sections? ~swd
Well, I am quite impressed with how it sounds. The stereo separation was a great listening experience. Here are some things that I noticed:
Be Here in The Morning- I didn't realize that there was echo on Brian's vocal during the refrains.
Anna Lee The Healer- Love that ping pong effect going on between the bass and bongos.
Little Bird- Wow, so clear. I can really hear the banjo more clearly and the cello sound was quite nice and more out front.
Diamond Head- Great thunder and water effects. During the ukulele break, the water effects had a phantom center that sounded really nice. The guitars had that nice steely Hawaiian sound to them.
Transcendental Meditation- Wow again. The Saxophone is right in your face. To what was being discussed at Hoffman between you and mpayan, there is that swooshy-ness going on throughout the track. It even drowns out Brian's "It's Cool" after the first verse and it becomes less so when he says later the song. Is this maybe the phasey-ness that he was speaking of?

Overall though, it was a great listen and I was hearing some things I have never heard quite so clearly before. The wide stereo separation really works well with this album.

Thank you again for your work! Smiley


COMMENT to drbeachboy:
Thanks for your in-depth review and comments. Obviously you like to sit down and really listen and concentrate, so your observations are not casual. I took a lot of artistic freedom with Friends, more so than normal. Some elements I thought moved the track along better I emphasized and tried to bring out, other blends I shifted somewhat to bring out vocals or harmonies better -- and you noticed! 
As to mparyan (at Hoffman), I couldn't get much real information out of him. I thought he was describing the entire album as swooshy, which didn't make any sense to me, but if it was TM that he described as swooshy, I can see why since the ring-modulation I added to the dissonant chords is by nature kind of slushy or slides around, but that is its nature and why I wanted to add it to those parts. I felt the differentiation between the straight sound and the modulated sound gave even more meditative dissonance so that each could play off the other.
Like I said in an earlier post, the guitar spring re-verb as thunder always sounded "cheap" to me. I think Brian would have used the real thing if it has been available -- but, whatever, this time around I wanted to replace the spring re-verb with something that was really well recorded, with depth and width, thunder that rolls around in the heavens and sets the stage for the breaking clearer weather that Brian's theme assures in. It is a "tone-poem" after all. Then a transition to more intimate sounds down at the beach with breaking (small) waves and such.
Again, thanks for your feedback.
~swd     

« Last Edit: April 02, 2016, 01:45:30 PM by Stephen W. Desper » Logged
DRM
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« Reply #1832 on: April 02, 2016, 03:55:10 PM »

"People would say you're losing quality...but we LIKED this "loss" of quality.

If it's good enough for the Beatles...

Listen, please, to the sound Paul describes at 15:59.  I think it relates to where we are in this discussion.  The link should start at 15:30.

Artists and sound engineers at the highest level, having clearly mastered their craft and the fundamentals, can successfully experiment and "break" the rules.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9elQeVfrLOo&feature=youtu.be&t=930
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« Reply #1833 on: April 02, 2016, 04:14:01 PM »

If I could be allowed this one indulgence...as the discussion of genius rule breaking continues.  For David:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNqo0kIR-TU
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Rob Dean
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« Reply #1834 on: April 02, 2016, 05:58:47 PM »

If I could be allowed this one indulgence...as the discussion of genius rule breaking continues.  For David:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNqo0kIR-TU


 indulgence is certainly allowed when its this good, I've watch this BBC production many a time (before and after DB's passing) superb performance from a true icon and Band that certainly equals the Brian Wilson band

PS Some serious brilliant Bass playing
« Last Edit: April 02, 2016, 06:02:07 PM by Rob Dean » Logged
Shane
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« Reply #1835 on: April 06, 2016, 12:37:02 AM »

I'm sitting here tonight with your remasters of Friends and Surf Hits coming out of four speakers.   My listening room is actually two small bedrooms where somebody years ago tore down the wall in between the two rooms, creating a large long room.  I just wanted to say this sounds fantastic, and I'm hearing all kinds of things I didn't realize were there before.  One of the most striking things is the odd-sounding background vocals (?) on Busy Doin' Nothin'.  I've never heard that before.  Just wanted to say thanks for all the hard work.  Your ability to manipulate and bring out musical elements without an actual remix is really astounding. 
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« Reply #1836 on: April 12, 2016, 05:35:10 AM »

Once again, Stephen Desper, your remasterings are a completely mind blowing amen worthy experience.

I could not believe how every nuance of both the track and the vox glistened from my 2 way speakers in stereophonic glory - each instrumental element (some, like strummed guitars previously unnoticed by me) balanced and blended, somehow distinct yet remaining complimentary to the overall sound. 

The Beach Boys and friends sounded as though they were singing down to us from heaven, a very dreamy ethereal feel to the vocal presentation.

By way of comparison, I first played the recent UME vinyl reissue, as remastered by Ron McMaster; overall a great presentation with good sound stage and tonal balance - the deep throb of the picked bass, the crisp chink of the high-hats, the ambient key presses during the interlude of Be Here in the Morning; Your remastering completely blows the vinyl away - kinda like turning vehicle lights from low-beam to high-beam (I still love the recent vinyl but it can't compare to the experience presented here).

I hope any Friends fan unfortunate enough to read my patchy ramblings who hasn't had a listen to the Friends tutorial takes the time to do so - this is a definitive  listen (imho, as always).

I'm off to listen to it again, and again a million thanks  Transcendental Meditation- A
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« Reply #1837 on: May 02, 2016, 01:52:31 AM »

Hi Steve,

Do you think you'll do any more study videos in the vein of the "Cool Cool Water" video? Demonstrating different parts of the multitracks / isolated elements etc...?

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Stephen W. Desper
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« Reply #1838 on: May 02, 2016, 06:15:13 AM »

Hi Steve,

Do you think you'll do any more study videos in the vein of the "Cool Cool Water" video? Demonstrating different parts of the multitracks / isolated elements etc...?

COMMENT to king of Anglia:  Yes, but first I've got to conclude my book and get part two to the fans. ~swd
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« Reply #1839 on: May 03, 2016, 05:37:09 AM »

Great! Looking forward to whatever you come up with next!
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« Reply #1840 on: May 03, 2016, 09:53:37 AM »

Mr. Desper,

Do you think Carl Wilson spent his life musically doing things other than what he truly wanted to do?  I am getting the sense from items I've read that he really just wanted to 'rock out' with his guitar, but was instead thrust into the role of upholding Brian's legacy and keeping the band on track.  Even as a child, he didn't have much interest in singing....just enjoyed playing his guitar.  Don't get me wrong, I think the world was blessed with the beauty of his voice and I am so thankful I get to hear it whenever I want.  However, I'm not so sure it was even always the voice he wanted to use.  I feel way more enthusiasm from him on the songs that had more of the rock element.

Thank you for all your contributions. 
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« Reply #1841 on: May 05, 2016, 12:02:00 PM »

Mr. Desper,

Do you think Carl Wilson spent his life musically doing things other than what he truly wanted to do?  I am getting the sense from items I've read that he really just wanted to 'rock out' with his guitar, but was instead thrust into the role of upholding Brian's legacy and keeping the band on track.  Even as a child, he didn't have much interest in singing....just enjoyed playing his guitar.  Don't get me wrong, I think the world was blessed with the beauty of his voice and I am so thankful I get to hear it whenever I want.  However, I'm not so sure it was even always the voice he wanted to use.  I feel way more enthusiasm from him on the songs that had more of the rock element.

Thank you for all your contributions. 
COMMENT to bb4ever:  I have never sensed any frustration from Carl on any level. Nor did I get any vibs that he did not wish to be a singing member of the group. You can do a rock solo album and still be part of a vocal band. Besides, on the road there were plenty of hours he could "just enjoy playing his guitar" and did so to the thrill of thousands of clapping and screaming fans. Don't ever think that Carl did not enjoy singing. You're reading too much into what you read. Rather, enjoy Carl through the music and know his performance is genuine. Many times he would complain of larynx pain after a tour, go to see his doctors, be told not to phonate, ignore their advice, and the rest is unfortunate history. Carl enjoyed singing so much that in the end it was his nemesis, throat cancer. ~swd
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« Reply #1842 on: May 05, 2016, 05:22:55 PM »

Mr Desper:

Speaking of Carl's vocals...this following recording just knocks me out BEYOND anything......https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMFsy9fIaqQ   I cannot for the life of me fathom that he was only 17 at the time and managed to possess so much command and dynamics!    Again,  it is so overwhelming w/in 2-years this will be the voice behind "God Only Knows".... just proves how versatile and gifted a singer he was!    But to me...this performance...not just his vocals, but the entire band is at their most energetic.....just love it!   
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« Reply #1843 on: May 06, 2016, 05:27:14 AM »

Mr. Desper,

Do you think Carl Wilson spent his life musically doing things other than what he truly wanted to do?  I am getting the sense from items I've read that he really just wanted to 'rock out' with his guitar, but was instead thrust into the role of upholding Brian's legacy and keeping the band on track.  Even as a child, he didn't have much interest in singing....just enjoyed playing his guitar.  Don't get me wrong, I think the world was blessed with the beauty of his voice and I am so thankful I get to hear it whenever I want.  However, I'm not so sure it was even always the voice he wanted to use.  I feel way more enthusiasm from him on the songs that had more of the rock element.

Thank you for all your contributions. 
COMMENT to bb4ever:  I have never sensed any frustration from Carl on any level. Nor did I get any vibs that he did not wish to be a singing member of the group. You can do a rock solo album and still be part of a vocal band. Besides, on the road there were plenty of hours he could "just enjoy playing his guitar" and did so to the thrill of thousands of clapping and screaming fans. Don't ever think that Carl did not enjoy singing. You're reading too much into what you read. Rather, enjoy Carl through the music and know his performance is genuine. Many times he would complain of larynx pain after a tour, go to see his doctors, be told not to phonate, ignore their advice, and the rest is unfortunate history. Carl enjoyed singing so much that in the end it was his nemesis, throat cancer. ~swd
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« Reply #1844 on: May 06, 2016, 05:28:41 AM »

Thank you, Mr. Desper, for your timely and informative response.   It makes my heart happy to hear what you had to say.
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« Reply #1845 on: May 14, 2016, 11:47:10 PM »

Dear Mr. Desper:

I love the Friends mixes.  Anyone says that Brian was musically spent after the Smile situation is clearly wrong.  I makes me appreciate the album even more and now know why Brian sometimes names it as his favorite Beach Boys lp.

I live in Monterey, and recently saw a friend's parents 8 mm print of the Beach Boys performing at the Big Sur Folk Festival in 1970.  What stuck me, was that on the introduction to "Cottonfields,"  Mike puts down Capitol Records for not promoting the single (Number One in the Western World..except here).

I was wondering if the contractual situations in anyway helped or hindered their creativity at the time.  For example, did the idea of leaving Capitol get their creative juices going to prove Capitol was wrong in the way they were handled by the label post-"Pet Sounds?"  Was it ever at all disheartening when, for example, "Add Some Music To Your Day" didn't sell as well as hoped, or that "Sunflower" was presented, not accepted, and the group had to rework the album?  Or was the group was so professional and talented, that the creativity was  not harmed but the business matters?

I also found it surprising that Mike felt annoyed by "Cottonfields" failure in the US since the group had already been apart of the Warner/Reprise label for almost a year by that point and the single was released by Capitol.

Thank you for your response and incredible insights.

bluerincon
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Stephen W. Desper
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« Reply #1846 on: May 16, 2016, 06:42:19 AM »

Dear Mr. Desper:

I love the Friends mixes.  Anyone says that Brian was musically spent after the Smile situation is clearly wrong.  I makes me appreciate the album even more and now know why Brian sometimes names it as his favorite Beach Boys lp.

I live in Monterey, and recently saw a friend's parents 8 mm print of the Beach Boys performing at the Big Sur Folk Festival in 1970.  What stuck me, was that on the introduction to "Cottonfields,"  Mike puts down Capitol Records for not promoting the single (Number One in the Western World..except here).

I was wondering if the contractual situations in anyway helped or hindered their creativity at the time.  For example, did the idea of leaving Capitol get their creative juices going to prove Capitol was wrong in the way they were handled by the label post-"Pet Sounds?"  Was it ever at all disheartening when, for example, "Add Some Music To Your Day" didn't sell as well as hoped, or that "Sunflower" was presented, not accepted, and the group had to rework the album?  Or was the group was so professional and talented, that the creativity was  not harmed but the business matters?

I also found it surprising that Mike felt annoyed by "Cottonfields" failure in the US since the group had already been apart of the Warner/Reprise label for almost a year by that point and the single was released by Capitol.

Thank you for your response and incredible insights.

bluerincon

COMMENT to blueincon:  All your questions are addressed in Part Two of my book, due out soon as a Study-Video. ~swd
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« Reply #1847 on: June 23, 2016, 03:15:41 PM »

Thanks for the 'Study Videos'.
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« Reply #1848 on: June 29, 2016, 06:34:48 AM »

PHEW, just sat at home (in between jobs) and am watching the retro show 'The Royal' (a spin-off of Heartbeat) UK Fans will know it.
Both shows are set in the 60's and use a lot of 60's hits to its soundtrack (a lot of BB's are used)

HOWEVER on 'The Royal' they just played a minute of the STEPHEN DESPER 'Til I Die long instrumental intro, I nearly fell over  Shocked
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« Reply #1849 on: August 01, 2016, 05:42:22 PM »

Mr. Desper,

I have greatly enjoyed watching your study videos since I first encountered them recently. It is captivating to read in detail how songs were constructed, arranged, and mixed. I have also loved listening to your remasters of tracks from Friends and Sunflower; with your notes, it feels like listening to these songs for the first time! As an amateur musician, it has been very educational reading the technical details of how different equipment was used and the process of mixing a song to make it just how you want it.

I recently heard the Beach Boys song 'My Solution', recorded on Halloween 1970. It is definitely one of their most unique, unconventional songs. Do you have any stories about the recording of this song? Was it considered for an album release, or was it more of a spur-of-the-moment, novelty song?

Thank you for all your effort in creating your study videos. I'm looking forward to your video on Surf's Up!
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