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Author Topic: New date for Smile sessions.  (Read 23419 times)
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« Reply #50 on: May 08, 2011, 01:44:24 PM »

At this stage of the game I'll be pleasantly surprised if it ever sees the light of day

Capitol really did jump the gun announcing the project.
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« Reply #51 on: May 08, 2011, 01:59:03 PM »

At this stage of the game I'll be pleasantly surprised if it ever sees the light of day

Capitol really did jump the gun announcing the project.

Nope - they announced it would be released in the summer. Summer's not started yet.
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« Reply #52 on: May 08, 2011, 02:01:49 PM »

Is it true that some fans dislike Dom due to the fact that he is apparently part of "Camp Wilson" and therefore has been judged by some to not be as impartial as he could be in some of his more recent writings? 

Just wondering.

No, not at all. Dom & I locked horns for something like 20 years over many subjects (we finally met in 2007: no blood was shed, no dukes raised), but the general feeling was that his theories on Smile back in the 80s were presented as fact, and that got many folks backs up. Be interesting to see what his essay has to say.
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« Reply #53 on: May 08, 2011, 02:13:37 PM »

At this stage of the game I'll be pleasantly surprised if it ever sees the light of day

Capitol really did jump the gun announcing the project.

Nope - they announced it would be released in the summer. Summer's not started yet.
And Summer doesn't end until September 23. One week prior to the Grammy cutoff. Wink
« Last Edit: May 08, 2011, 02:15:10 PM by drbeachboy » Logged

The Brianista Prayer

Oh Brian
Thou Art In Hawthorne,
Harmonied Be Thy name
Your Kingdom Come,
Your Steak Well Done,
On Stage As It Is In Studio,
Give Us This Day, Our Shortenin' Bread
And Forgive Us Our Bootlegs,
As We Also Have Forgiven Our Wife And Managers,
And Lead Us Not Into Kokomo,
But Deliver Us From Mike Love.
Amen.  ---hypehat
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« Reply #54 on: May 08, 2011, 02:47:16 PM »

At this stage of the game I'll be pleasantly surprised if it ever sees the light of day

Capitol really did jump the gun announcing the project.

Nope - they announced it would be released in the summer. Summer's not started yet.
And Summer doesn't end until September 23. One week prior to the Grammy cutoff. Wink

LMAO, That's actually true.

I stand corrected  LOL
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« Reply #55 on: May 08, 2011, 03:27:20 PM »

Not gonna front, the introduction to LLVS pretty much sealed the SMiLE myth for me. Such passion, and it's so infectious. So I know the guy has passed some bad facts in his time, but his love for this music is undeniable. And he's been there from way back. I don't mind him writing it.
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« Reply #56 on: May 08, 2011, 05:07:41 PM »

I totally agree with Hypehat about the introduction to LLVS!
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« Reply #57 on: May 08, 2011, 06:21:25 PM »

Dom is partially the reason that this set is happening. His work in gathering Smile related background brought the non BW world`s s attention to Smile a a great if unfinished piece of music. He brought Darian and Nick in to the fold, and their work is a big reason we have Smile as a performance piece. So for the people who doubt Dom`s role in this set coming out, you really don`t know the whole story.  His theory may not match yours. But all anyone has is theories. The answer is locked in Brian`s mind, and he is not spilling it.

And all due respect to Dom. Hat tipped.

As to 'locked in' Brian's mind, should that more accurately be 'long gone from'?
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« Reply #58 on: May 08, 2011, 06:25:39 PM »

So I know the guy has passed some bad facts in his time

Man, you make it sound like he's passed kidney stones...
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« Reply #59 on: May 08, 2011, 08:47:12 PM »

The answer is locked in Brian`s mind, and he is not spilling it.

I think that right there tells us a lot about the upcoming release. (IMHO)  Smiley
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« Reply #60 on: May 08, 2011, 11:13:59 PM »

The answer is locked in Brian`s mind, and he is not spilling it.

I thought one reason Smile wasn't finished was because the answer wasn't in Brian's mind: he didn't know how it was all supposed to fit together.

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« Reply #61 on: May 09, 2011, 12:42:54 AM »

Dom is partially the reason that this set is happening. His work in gathering Smile related background brought the non BW world`s s attention to Smile a a great if unfinished piece of music. He brought Darian and Nick in to the fold, and their work is a big reason we have Smile as a performance piece. So for the people who doubt Dom`s role in this set coming out, you really don`t know the whole story.  His theory may not match yours. But all anyone has is theories. The answer is locked in Brian`s mind, and he is not spilling it.

I'm a fan of Domenic's writing and research, and I'm looking forward to his essay in the forthcoming booklet. If Domenic's writing had a fault, it was in its suggestion that Smile was more "finished" than the available evidence would seem to support.  But, in the scheme of things, that's a minor criticism. 

Any objective fan should salute Domenic for being absolutely essential in keeping the Smile legend alive over the decades, particularly back in the dark days of the '80s to early-'90s.   Look back at the Beach Boys' old interviews from that period.  Brian, Mike and Al didn't agree on much, but they sure as heck seemed to agree on one thing.... Smile was just some old bits and pieces that Brian had junked. And that was that.

But then you had Domenic (and David Leaf and Darian and Bob Hanes and many others including some on this board) saying and writing just the opposite... that Smile was great, important music... a lost masterpiece.   I mean, consider the irony of the situation.   The Beach Boys themselves were saying Smile was essentially worthless.  And fans like Domenic were saying that the BBs were wrong about their own work!  And whose point of view ultimately prevailed?  That's an incredible story in and of itself.




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« Reply #62 on: May 09, 2011, 12:48:01 AM »

Can I beg Capitol to put out Domenic Priore-less version?

Just throw out the book that comes with the deluxe version, and you'll be Priore-less!

Better to just remove the pages Dom wrote, if you're of a mind to. I wouldn't throw the whole thing away.

Have you some stuff in there Andrew ?"??
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« Reply #63 on: May 09, 2011, 01:06:05 AM »

Can I beg Capitol to put out Domenic Priore-less version?

Just throw out the book that comes with the deluxe version, and you'll be Priore-less!

Better to just remove the pages Dom wrote, if you're of a mind to. I wouldn't throw the whole thing away.

Have you some stuff in there Andrew ?"??

Not that I'm aware, unless they used something off 10452, in which case, being fine and honourable gentlemen, this time I'll get credited.  Grin  No reason why I would have been asked anyway: better talent closer to home.
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« Reply #64 on: May 09, 2011, 04:16:24 AM »

Can I beg Capitol to put out Domenic Priore-less version?

Just throw out the book that comes with the deluxe version, and you'll be Priore-less!

Better to just remove the pages Dom wrote, if you're of a mind to. I wouldn't throw the whole thing away.

Have you some stuff in there Andrew ?"??

Not that I'm aware, unless they used something off 10452, in which case, being fine and honourable gentlemen, this time I'll get credited.  Grin  No reason why I would have been asked anyway: better talent closer to home.

I thought they might ask you to do some proper proof reading and fact checking - you know what'll happen - there will be some small thing that is disputed by a dickwad - hahaha- they need you to give it the once over IMHO
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« Reply #65 on: May 09, 2011, 05:53:40 AM »

Can I beg Capitol to put out Domenic Priore-less version?

Just throw out the book that comes with the deluxe version, and you'll be Priore-less!

Better to just remove the pages Dom wrote, if you're of a mind to. I wouldn't throw the whole thing away.

Have you some stuff in there Andrew ?"??

Not that I'm aware, unless they used something off 10452, in which case, being fine and honourable gentlemen, this time I'll get credited.  Grin  No reason why I would have been asked anyway: better talent closer to home.

I thought they might ask you to do some proper proof reading and fact checking - you know what'll happen - there will be some small thing that is disputed by a dickwad - hahaha- they need you to give it the once over IMHO

We'll see. Plenty of time.  Wink
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« Reply #66 on: May 09, 2011, 06:15:22 AM »

Can I beg Capitol to put out Domenic Priore-less version?

Just throw out the book that comes with the deluxe version, and you'll be Priore-less!

Better to just remove the pages Dom wrote, if you're of a mind to. I wouldn't throw the whole thing away.

Have you some stuff in there Andrew ?"??

Not that I'm aware, unless they used something off 10452, in which case, being fine and honourable gentlemen, this time I'll get credited.  Grin  No reason why I would have been asked anyway: better talent closer to home.

I thought they might ask you to do some proper proof reading and fact checking - you know what'll happen - there will be some small thing that is disputed by a dickwad - hahaha- they need you to give it the once over IMHO

We'll see. Plenty of time.  Wink

 Evil
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« Reply #67 on: May 09, 2011, 10:32:39 AM »

In response to Jugglers post above, I personally know from conversations with Brian and several people who love him that he believes with his heart that the songs he wrote for Smile were a peak if ot THEpeak of his career. The fact that he felt this way is now common knowledge, but it wasn`t always that way. It was easier for him to dismiss that music (Smile) than to relive the painful memories of that time.

David Leaf, Bob Hanes, and later people were simply carrying on the torch that Brian lit, and that people like David Anderle, Paul Williams, and Derek Taylor reflected on. I believe that The Beach Boys were as devastated by it not happening as Brian. I think that Brian simply hit the glass ceiling interms of the technology he had versus what he was trying to accomplish.

Smile has always been the albatross around the group, Brian. and Van Dyke`s neck until 2004. The specialness of the music is now undeniable. Brian has decided to step aside and let it speak for itself. The music always speaks for itself if people let it. There is nothing wrong with theories about how it might have been...the key words are might have been.

As it is, we have hours of sessions that several fine people are trying to present in a manner that shows the world why this music is undeniably unique, special, and terribly beautiful. Give the folks who are assembling this package the credit they so deserve...how can an unfinished album live up to thousands of peoples` differing ideas of what it should sound like? THAT is the reason Brian us sitting this one out, not because he has forgotten...the guy has an amazing memory, trust me!
« Last Edit: May 09, 2011, 10:39:11 AM by Peter Reum » Logged

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« Reply #68 on: May 09, 2011, 11:16:18 AM »

Give the folks who are assembling this package the credit they so deserve...how can an unfinished album live up to thousands of peoples` differing ideas of what it should sound like? THAT is the reason Brian us sitting this one out, not because he has forgotten...the guy has an amazing memory, trust me!

Thanks, Peter, for all you've done for Brian and the Beach Boys' legacy over the years.

I just have one comment/question regarding the above. When you say that Brian is "sitting this one out," do you mean in terms of assemling a final sequence and overseeing the overall compilation of the audio material? If so, I can definitely see the wisdom in that. After all, he has had his final say with BWPS, and he made himself vulnerable to the public by sticking with that project. It paid off; most of us LOVED it. But it was a huge, courageous risk. When it comes to this upcoming archival release, it seems appropriate for Brian to take a back seat and allow others to execute the retrospective.

On the other hand, I hope he will NOT be"sitting it out" in terms of answering questions and sharing his memories. My hope is that the producers of the box set will drive relentlessly for new insights into the history and theory (and properly distinguishing the difference between history and theory too, by the way) of the recordings and compositions. Those details are important, and will be important for future Smile scholars long after the primary sources are no longer with us.

« Last Edit: May 09, 2011, 11:27:38 AM by Catbirdman » Logged

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« Reply #69 on: May 09, 2011, 01:49:50 PM »

i don't think they should "drive" into brian.  if they can get into a mood where he's relaxed and candid, then they'd get somewhere.  but it isn't necessary.  maybe if he heard it all together he'd get inspired to move things around. 
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« Reply #70 on: May 09, 2011, 02:12:08 PM »

i don't think they should "drive" into brian.  if they can get into a mood where he's relaxed and candid, then they'd get somewhere.  but it isn't necessary.  maybe if he heard it all together he'd get inspired to move things around. 

Didn't mean to imply that they should "drive" Brian. I can see how what I wrote could be misinterpreted; it is not what I meant.

I wrote that they should "drive relentlessly for new insights." That means gathering as much detailed information as possible from all sources possible. When it comes to Brian, a sensitive and respectful approach clearly would best serve his dignity as a human being and also be most likely to yield results.

But I DO think it is important. If someone Brian trusts and feels comfortable with were to go through the various recordings and compositions and try to (gently) pin him down on what specifics he remembers, just think how valuable that information could be. Even assuming his memory isn't 100% accurate.
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« Reply #71 on: May 09, 2011, 02:37:11 PM »

I'm also very interested by Peter's description of Brian as 'sitting this one out'. I understand how this might have come about, but like Catbirdman, I hope it doesn't preclude Brian from adding some insights to the documentation with the box set.

Catbirdman is right, too, in that a loose, friendly chat about the MUSIC, done with humour and passion, always seems to yield far more from Brian than a hard-hitting, documentary-style grilling. And of course, having a fit lass ask the questions doesn't hurt. I think I'd rather have Zooey Deschanel ask him all the questions than Domenic Priore... It worked a treat before...    Wink

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« Reply #72 on: May 09, 2011, 03:16:44 PM »

Re: Brian sitting this one out:

I understand people's desire to get as much info regarding sequence and insights but if I were Brian I might "sit it out" too.  There is something to be said for letting a little mystery and the myths of SMiLE continue to exist and percolate in the minds of the listener.  It makes it more interactive and allows one to formulate their own sequences and theories about how it fits together and what it all means (even if their ideas infuriate and baffle others).  It reminds me of Frank Zappa's advice to Alice Cooper  (re- the chicken throwing incident) regarding not explaining yourself too much to your audience as their imagination will usually come up with a better story.

Don't get me wrong, I do love insightful interviews with people who were there (and I'd enjoy a good factual sessionography as well as a bunch of cool period photos), but I feel like some of the key answers that people are looking for just don't exist (much like some of the music), or may even be made up for lack of a real answer being available.

I enjoy the STORY of SMiLE but the recorded MUSIC means more to me.  I accept that it wasn't finished, but I am so happy to see that this beautiful music will finally get a release.  I do hope for new audio that we haven't heard yet (I'm sure there will be a few reasonable surprises and I'm not too greedy - a few new tidbits would thrill me).  Even if there is little or no new audio I will still be happy to take this set home and rejoice that it will reach a larger audience.  I'm still very excited and looking forward to the eventual release (I'm bracing myself for a few more short delays...so I don't flip out ala Phil Cohen).   ;-)



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« Reply #73 on: May 09, 2011, 10:13:06 PM »

In response to Jugglers post above, I personally know from conversations with Brian and several people who love him that he believes with his heart that the songs he wrote for Smile were a peak if ot THEpeak of his career. The fact that he felt this way is now common knowledge, but it wasn`t always that way. It was easier for him to dismiss that music (Smile) than to relive the painful memories of that time.

David Leaf, Bob Hanes, and later people were simply carrying on the torch that Brian lit, and that people like David Anderle, Paul Williams, and Derek Taylor reflected on. I believe that The Beach Boys were as devastated by it not happening as Brian. I think that Brian simply hit the glass ceiling interms of the technology he had versus what he was trying to accomplish.

Smile has always been the albatross around the group, Brian. and Van Dyke`s neck until 2004. The specialness of the music is now undeniable. Brian has decided to step aside and let it speak for itself. The music always speaks for itself if people let it. There is nothing wrong with theories about how it might have been...the key words are might have been.

As it is, we have hours of sessions that several fine people are trying to present in a manner that shows the world why this music is undeniably unique, special, and terribly beautiful. Give the folks who are assembling this package the credit they so deserve...how can an unfinished album live up to thousands of peoples` differing ideas of what it should sound like? THAT is the reason Brian us sitting this one out, not because he has forgotten...the guy has an amazing memory, trust me!

Hi Peter,
What you did to help Brian was a beautiful thing to do. I think the albatross is really a blessing in disguise. Can anyone look back in their past and not want to change something? It's understandable that a person wouldn't want to revisit painful memories, but it seems to me the lessons have been learned. The outcome is positive. The difficulty comes from being under a microscope, so I want to add to your remarks for the naysayers out there... Judge not lest ye be judged and let he who is without sin cast the first stone. I remember something George Harrison said in an interview when he decided to do the Bangladesh concert about using the John Lennon school of thought of going all out. Let's make it big. I can't help but think the best thing to do is take ownership. Just own it and tell people "yeah I did some stuff or stuff happened, but that's in the past... now take me off the top ten crazy guy list and check this stuff out!" You either get it or you don't... sometimes it takes people time to hear something they are not ready to hear. I think there are more people in the world who understand what Brian offers that don't speak up... who has the loudest voice? As a performer, I learned if you touch just one person in the audience, you have succeeded. The rest will just have to wait and maybe one day they will hear it, too. I did read that Van Dyke wished the celebrity of the piece hadn't become so big, but I see it as part of the beauty and the humanity of the whole thing. I still remember the conversations taking place 20 years back. I wasn't into it at the time but I still remember my friends talking about SMiLE... it is a part of people's lives and will more than likely remain. It doesn't matter what people think it should or shouldn't sound like, as long as it doesn't sound like a bad mp3..yikes. I think Brian has really only said one thing about this release... that people will get to hear the music with the "angelic voices" of the Beach Boys... and he is right and that is where I am keeping my expectations. It is a positive thing. Loved reading your interview, btw.. great stuff...
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« Reply #74 on: May 09, 2011, 11:24:19 PM »

"Smile is the name of the new Beach Boys album which will be released in August 2011, and with a happy album cover, the really happy sounds inside and a happy in-store display piece you can’t miss, we’re sure to sell a million units. In August."

 LOL
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