What If The SS Box Disappoints You?

[hypehat]

These dudes can do wonders with session tapes, as The Pet Sounds box will attest. A Child Is The Father Of The Man, all nicely EQ'd, with some tasteful reverb, from the instrumental and vocal multi-tracks...  you can't say we all want that?

I'll take Brian's 11/66 mix with no added reverb thank you.

Agreed. I wouldn't accept a 'restored' Mona Lisa with some new paint strokes here and there, done by a modern art worker, either.

Vintage Brian mix or not, the quality of the boots of that song are crap. I even find the SOT sessions too murky, in their unfettered sound.

 You two know exactly what I meant! I could have easily said Holidays/OMP/Fire/Lots of H&V sections/whatever has been passed around from cassette dubs and vinyl rips.

[rab2591]

Adding some EQ where EQ is needed is fine with me. Adding reverb where reverb is needed is fine with me. Whatever makes these songs sound pristine and crisp. Boyd and Linett know what they are doing - their 2009 stereo mix of 'Don't Worry Baby' blows me away every time I hear it.

and everyone here should be incredibly thankful that we have Alan Boyd and Mark Linett doing these mixes - hate the stereo mixes or love them - they are about 100x better than the Beatles stereo mixes. Beach Boys stereo mixes overflow with sound - whereas the Beatles stereo mixes are quite dull and lifeless....I very much prefer the Beatles in mono. But the Beach Boys are a different story.

[Sam_BFC]

On the whole I love Mark's recent stereo mixes of 60s tracks...as has been mentioned before the new Time to Get Alone lacked the 'depth' and dynamic of the original, though this could be a result of the mastering rather than the mixing...Don't Worry Baby has been mentioned, Kiss Me Baby is a favourite of mine, and the whole of Pet Sounds sounds great in stereo I think; Matt referred to the Sloop John B backgrounds, well I just love how the stereo mix immerses us in that wash of harmony personally, same with Wouldn't it be Nice.

In all, I am not sure we could really hope that the Smile material be in more capable hands, right?

(It does seem that Mark's stereo mixes are not everybody's cup of tea, which is cool.)

[Matt Bielewicz]

In all, I am not sure we could really hope that the Smile material be in more capable hands, right?

For what it's worth, I couldn't agree more. And yes, Sam, those Pet Sounds stereos! Those HARMONIES! "Sheriff John -- Waaaaaaaahhhhhh..." Mind-blowing stuff.

MattB

[Mikie]

whereas the Beatles stereo mixes are quite dull and lifeless....I very much prefer the Beatles in mono. But the Beach Boys are a different story.

Not on my home and car stereo systems are they dull and lifeless!!  I'll take the Beatles (and Beach Boys) in stereo any day o' the week! The new Beatles stereo remasters are superb!! Even better than Ebbetts!

[Roger Ryan]

Geez, I posted within a few mins. of yours. Why even call me on it? I saw that someone posted ahead of me, but couldn't see what was there.

My apologies, good doctor. I'm afraid I was starting to get wound up with the contentious tone of the board as of late and quickly replied without thinking (and then immediately shut the computer down as I was due at an appointment). Sorry for being so rude.

The initial post I was responding to questioned whether the material on the SMiLE box set will sound any better than the SOT boots. I think Matt B. has commented articulately on how the past work of Mark and Alan has enriched previously released sessions. I see no reason why their work on the SMiLE sessions should be anything less than an intriguing alternative to what is heard on the boots, and I fully expect it to be much better.

[drbeachboy]

Thank you, Roger!

I have a few beefs with a couple of Mark's stereo remixes, but on the whole I'm pretty happy with what he's done with the 2000-2001 Reissues. I expect Smile will be handled with care. I think it was on this board that someone said that Mark is great at making a sonic turd into a polished diamond or something like that.

[guitarfool2002]

I think the Pet Sounds Sessions stereo mix was a fantastic job.

[Chris Brown]

I think the Pet Sounds Sessions stereo mix was a fantastic job.

Agreed - these guys know what they're doing, and all the other re-mixes have been very tastefully done in my opinion, so I have no worries about the mixing aspect. 

[Awesoman]

I don't really care about the SMiLE box set.  Yeah I plan on purchasing it and believe I'll get something out of it, but I'm not one to blow things out of proportion.  I have no expectations for it.  Why should I?  The album was never completed.  A cohesive version of this album already came out in 2004.

Wasn't that more of a live version of Smile? Didn't really care for the production, instrumentation and vocals on that version. Still enjoyed it though

Well, it was the only official, completed version of SMiLE ever to be released. 

Sure it's cool that the Beach Boys' recordings of SMiLE is coming out.  But again, the album was *never completed*.  That is a point to ponder...

[Chris Moise]

I uploaded a sample of the Shut Down remix from Sounds of Summer below--I'd be interested in your thoughts on the first 30 seconds of the track.

http://www.sendspace.com/file/cmj6qs

[Andrew G. Doe]

I uploaded a sample of the Shut Down remix from Sounds of Summer below--I'd be interested in your thoughts on the first 30 seconds of the track.

http://www.sendspace.com/file/cmj6qs

Mmmm... might be my ears but the SOS remix sounds a bit overly 'bright'.

[drbeachboy]

Bright and LOUD! I never listen to it and spent money on both versions; SOS & Sights... With the DVD.

[Chris Moise]

Mmmm... might be my ears but the SOS remix sounds a bit overly 'bright'.

I agree. Now listen for the massive phasey, smeared sound during the intro. Awful isn't it? Also note how some elements are practically duophonic with other true stereo? At times the instrumental track sounds like it is fake stereo (treble on the left, bass on the right) with other elements like the vocals true stereo (albeit bright and hard). I don't understand how the Pet Sounds box was done so well where something like this is appalling.

[Andrew G. Doe]

By and large, the new remixes have been at worst acceptable, but the one that is totally indefensible is "Time To Get Alone" on Summer Love Songs, with the reedy whimper where there originally was a booming "deep and wide !". Ruins the whole song - I've not listened to that since I bought the CD.

[hypehat]

It also seemed a bit irrelevant, seeing as Time To Get Alone is ALREADY in stereo!

[guitarfool2002]

Bright and LOUD! I never listen to it and spent money on both versions; SOS & Sights... With the DVD.

That is an unfortunate by-product of modern mastering. It really got obnoxious around 1999, and since then the record companies value high levels and heavy compression over lower volumes and allowing the listener to turn up the track if they choose.

Radio stations never had this issue as they did this themselves at the stations: With the advent of mp3 players and shuffle-play, the companies want everything to be at an equal volume, so you get a situation where a new remix of an older Beach Boys song matches the volume of, say, an Eminem or Lady Gaga song.

Take any CD made before 1990 and compare it if you can to a recent "remastered" reissue of the same exact album. The differences in volume levels are in some cases shocking. This is jazz. rock, metal, country, etc.

[Roger Ryan]

As unpopular as this opinion may be, I actually prefer the remix of TTGA on SUMMER LOVE SONGS. I always felt that Carl's lead sounded buried/murky on the original mix and that the "deep and wide" vocal was too exaggerated and it unbalanced the rest of the recording. At the same time, I can easily see why some folks would be disappointed that the section was toned down. That's why it's great to have all the versions available so we can pick our favorites.

[drbeachboy]

What's kind of strange is that SOS is a 2003 release, yet TWOTS & SLS are later, but not nearly as loud. The reissues are brighter and louder than the 1990 versions, but not excessively so. SOS is by far the worst one of the lot.

[hypehat]

The Loudness Wars had kinda become a controversial point by the time the Warmth of the Sun comp had come out, right? So they were probably aware of that.

[guitarfool2002]

The Loudness Wars had kinda become a controversial point by the time the Warmth of the Sun comp had come out, right? So they were probably aware of that.

That is a great point. Once people who wouldn't normally consider such things as how an album was mastered started reading mainstream articles about it and hearing the difference with their own ears, I think the companies took notice. The one that started it if I recall was "Californication" by the Red Hot Chili Peppers in 1999, and after they released that album which was mastered so loud it actually distorted, so many others followed suit and the "Loudness Wars" were on. Then I guess the backlash helped bring it down a bit as you suggested.

[Chris Moise]

It also seemed a bit irrelevant, seeing as Time To Get Alone is ALREADY in stereo!

Yep, Shut Down too. Somehow the original tossed off in 5 minutes 1963 stereo mix of Shut Down slays the modern remix.

[PhilCohen]

The only way that the "Smile Sessions" box set can disappoint anyone is if it is actually released, and while the chances of this set being released appear reasonably good, Smile's history tells us that we have no guarantee that something won't go wrong at the last minute.

But after all the times(over the decades) that a hope of an official release has been raised, then crushed, I'll say this: this is the last time that I'm going to WANT an official "Smile" set. We're looking at(from the March 2011 announcement) anywhere from a 4 to 9 month build-up of fan expectations and speculation(during which we'll be given no further concrete information to sustain a rational online discussion), and this may(or may not) lead to an actual box set to play on our CD players. If it doesn't happen, I'll just make do with my own fan compilation(based on the Domenic Priore running order in the 2nd edition of "Look Listen Vibrate Smile"), which is actually quite good.

[drbeachboy]

Honestly, I don't think Capitol gives a crap whether or not we have stuff to talk about here. We do think very highly of ourselves here, eh?

Since both Mark and Alan visit here, I'm sure they will post something once they are given the green light to do so. I've waited 44 years, so another month or two is drop in the bucket.

This is just one more thing that proves that we are a society that wants and needs instant gratification.

[Andrew G. Doe]

The only way that the "Smile Sessions" box set can disappoint anyone is if it is actually released, and while the chances of this set being released appear reasonably good, Smile's history tells us that we have no guarantee that something won't go wrong at the last minute.

But after all the times(over the decades) that a hope of an official release has been raised, then crushed, I'll say this: this is the last time that I'm going to WANT an official "Smile" set. We're looking at(from the March 2011 announcement) anywhere from a 4 to 9 month build-up of fan expectations and speculation(during which we'll be given no further concrete information to sustain a rational online discussion), and this may(or may not) lead to an actual box set to play on our CD players. If it doesn't happen, I'll just make do with my own fan compilation(based on the Domenic Priore running order in the 2nd edition of "Look Listen Vibrate Smile"), which is actually quite good.

OK Phil - put up or shut up time: $50 says it gets released this year. Whaddaya say ?