Would you rather ... Smile Sessions!

[SurfRiderHawaii]

I'm very hazy on this SU Part 1, 2, 3 thing.

In my mind, Part 1 was the instrumental intro we all heart on the first VIGOTONE Smile boot.  No vocals, just the 'stormy horns' ,  plucking strings, etc.

Part 2 was the Brian vocal.

Part 3 was added later - the CITFOM part Brian finally added years later on the Carl version.

Is there evidence of something different?

[The Shift]

What's all this about two and two making four (or thereabouts)? What else is Mr AGD keeping to himself? We should be told.  If there isn't a 23.2-minute H&V segueing into Surf's Up Part III on this box set I'm not buying it, so tell us now, Mr AGD.

He's also as much as stated there'll be no surf music on this set. How can her be sure? Perhaps it's a red herring.

What else is Mr AGD keeping to himself?  Spill the beans Mr AGD: tonight's Lotto numbers for a start.

[Andrew G. Doe]

I'm very hazy on this SU Part 1, 2, 3 thing.

In my mind, Part 1 was the instrumental intro we all heart on the first VIGOTONE Smile boot.  No vocals, just the 'stormy horns' ,  plucking strings, etc.

Part 2 was the Brian vocal.

Part 3 was added later - the CITFOM part Brian finally added years later on the Carl version.

Is there evidence of something different?

it's been theorised for decades that, as the track for the first section is logged as "Part 1", there must be an equally ornate "Part 2", despite the absence of any documentation. At least two fans have claimed to have heard of this "Part 2" from someone who's heard it. Maybe the box will resolve this, maybe it won't, but this I will predict: if you think the conjecture thus far has been bad enough, what's going to explode once we actually get a tracklisting to pick over is almost unimaginable.

[Andrew G. Doe]

What else is Mr AGD keeping to himself?  Spill the beans Mr AGD: tonight's Lotto numbers for a start.

They'll be between 1 and 49. Of this I am absolutely sure.

[The Shift]

What else is Mr AGD keeping to himself?  Spill the beans Mr AGD: tonight's Lotto numbers for a start.

They'll be between 1 and 49. Of this I am absolutely sure.

What? All of them?

[The Heartical Don]

The only real conclusion I can draw so far after a couple thousand posts and replies: AGD knows more than we mere mortals do.

I would agree with that......

Bad form to report was told to you in confidence via PM. Perhaps you should edit your post?  

But I DID hold it in confidence until after Capitol made their official announcement.  I didn't reveal it at the point when Capitol still didn't want this to be known.  My point is that AGD is credible.

Whilst you are not!!

  I always was of the opinion that AGD is incredible...

[Roger Ryan]

I'm very hazy on this SU Part 1, 2, 3 thing.

In my mind, Part 1 was the instrumental intro we all heart on the first VIGOTONE Smile boot.  No vocals, just the 'stormy horns' ,  plucking strings, etc.

Part 2 was the Brian vocal.

Part 3 was added later - the CITFOM part Brian finally added years later on the Carl version.

Is there evidence of something different?

it's been theorised for decades that, as the track for the first section is logged as "Part 1", there must be an equally ornate "Part 2", despite the absence of any documentation. At least two fans have claimed to have heard of this "Part 2" from someone who's heard it. Maybe the box will resolve this, maybe it won't, but this I will predict: if you think the conjecture thus far has been bad enough, what's going to explode once we actually get a tracklisting to pick over is almost unimaginable.

This is fairly unusual as far as the SMiLE recordings go. All of the other major songs had full backing tracks recorded (as far as we can tell), but "Surf's Up" only has a backing track for the first two verses. Reportedly, when Darian asked Brian in '03 what the backing track was supposed to be for the middle section of the song, Brian replied something to the effect of "There would have been a string arrangement on there". Now was this just in Brian's head or was something like this actually recorded in '66/'67? It appears that the band did not have access to any such session in '71 when the track was finally completed, so I doubt the "Part 2" was ever recorded (or, perhaps, Brian junked it shortly after recording). As it stands, I think Paul Mertens' string arrangement on the BWPS version is a very nice addition.

[Andrew G. Doe]

Reportedly, when Darian asked Brian in '03 what the backing track was supposed to be for the middle section of the song, Brian replied something to the effect of "There would have a string arrangement on there".

Now, were I one of those folk who takes BW at his word on things musical, I'd point out that he didn't say "we recorded a string arrangement for tha", or any other indication that there actually was ever a "part 2" session: he said "there would have (been, I'm presuming)", not "there was".

But as I'm not... just saying'...  

[Roger Ryan]

Reportedly, when Darian asked Brian in '03 what the backing track was supposed to be for the middle section of the song, Brian replied something to the effect of "There would have a string arrangement on there".

Now, were I one of those folk who takes BW at his word on things musical, I'd point out that he didn't say "we recorded a string arrangement for tha", or any other indication that there actually was ever a "part 2" session: he said "there would have (been, I'm presuming)", not "there was".

But as I'm not... just saying'...  

Right (sorry about the poor grammar - I corrected it in the first post). While I don't recall the exact quote (and it was being paraphrased by Darian anyway), the suggestion was that the string arrangement was something Brian had thought about but had never gotten around to recording. "There was going to be a string arrangement on that part" is probably closer to the way Darian related the quote. Regardless, that's what Brian wanted in '03 which is why it's there on BWPS.

[Alex]

, got an A Level & 2 O Levels in it,

An O level? I have no idea what that means.

[Andrew G. Doe]

, got an A Level & 2 O Levels in it,

An O level? I have no idea what that means.

What we took pre-GSCE, and a damn sight harder.

[hypehat]

Now is not the time or place, AGD, but they were hard enough for me and everyone else I know 

Damn this speculation! I want a tracklist now! *cue tantrum*

[Andrew G. Doe]

Now is not the time or place, AGD, but they were hard enough for me and everyone else I know 

I'm talking 1971/72 here.

[Chris Brown]

Reportedly, when Darian asked Brian in '03 what the backing track was supposed to be for the middle section of the song, Brian replied something to the effect of "There would have a string arrangement on there".

Now, were I one of those folk who takes BW at his word on things musical, I'd point out that he didn't say "we recorded a string arrangement for tha", or any other indication that there actually was ever a "part 2" session: he said "there would have (been, I'm presuming)", not "there was".

But as I'm not... just saying'...  

You make a fair point AGD, but this is the same guy who in 2005 said he'd never recorded "White Christmas" before.  Granted, he's usually more accurate in his memories regarding something musical (as you point out), but I'm not sure I put much stock in his particular choice of words here.

I'd say the fact that the list of musicians for the January "Surf's Up" session doesn't seem to mesh with the description we've heard of part 2 is a lot more telling.

[SurfRiderHawaii]

I'm very hazy on this SU Part 1, 2, 3 thing.

In my mind, Part 1 was the instrumental intro we all heart on the first VIGOTONE Smile boot.  No vocals, just the 'stormy horns' ,  plucking strings, etc.

Part 2 was the Brian vocal.

Part 3 was added later - the CITFOM part Brian finally added years later on the Carl version.

Is there evidence of something different?

it's been theorised for decades that, as the track for the first section is logged as "Part 1", there must be an equally ornate "Part 2", despite the absence of any documentation. At least two fans have claimed to have heard of this "Part 2" from someone who's heard it. Maybe the box will resolve this, maybe it won't, but this I will predict: if you think the conjecture thus far has been bad enough, what's going to explode once we actually get a tracklisting to pick over is almost unimaginable.

Mahalo AGD!  Got that.

Possibly Brian always meant the "Child Is Father Of The Man" vocal tag (recorded in 1970) as Part 2?

[Catbirdman]

Possibly Brian always meant the "Child Is Father Of The Man" vocal tag (recorded in 1970) as Part 2?

You know, that's something I've often wondered. Stephen Desper described the situation as it happened in 1971: "About thirty minutes into the mix, Brian ... came bursting into the studio ... excitedly proclaiming that we should stop the mix and add just 'one more part' to the ending." The famous tag vocals were then "added postscript, and doubled at the last minute, as if always in his mind from conception, but heretofore forgotten, or perhaps suppressed." (emphasis mine)

While it's all conjecture on Stephen Desper's part, it does seem like an obvious question: was this a spur of the moment Brian idea or was it something he had tucked away since 1966? I wish someone would ask him, if they haven't already. Then again, his answer would probably just add more confusion to the matter.

[BJL]

You know, that's something I've often wondered. Stephen Desper described the situation as it happened in 1971: "About thirty minutes into the mix, Brian ... came bursting into the studio ... excitedly proclaiming that we should stop the mix and add just 'one more part' to the ending." The famous tag vocals were then "added postscript, and doubled at the last minute, as if always in his mind from conception, but heretofore forgotten, or perhaps suppressed." (emphasis mine)

While it's all conjecture on Stephen Desper's part, it does seem like an obvious question: was this a spur of the moment Brian idea or was it something he had tucked away since 1966? I wish someone would ask him, if they haven't already. Then again, his answer would probably just add more confusion to the matter.

Maybe they were actually part of the lyrics to Child is the Father of the Man?  Hence them not being sung or mentioned during the Surf's up demo, and then, when Brian realizes that Carl Wilson has adapted a second smile song for the outro of surf's up, he thinks to himself: well, might as well use the proper lyrics! 

[The Heartical Don]

Possibly Brian always meant the "Child Is Father Of The Man" vocal tag (recorded in 1970) as Part 2?

You know, that's something I've often wondered. Stephen Desper described the situation as it happened in 1971: "About thirty minutes into the mix, Brian ... came bursting into the studio ... excitedly proclaiming that we should stop the mix and add just 'one more part' to the ending." The famous tag vocals were then "added postscript, and doubled at the last minute, as if always in his mind from conception, but heretofore forgotten, or perhaps suppressed." (emphasis mine)

While it's all conjecture on Stephen Desper's part, it does seem like an obvious question: was this a spur of the moment Brian idea or was it something he had tucked away since 1966? I wish someone would ask him, if they haven't already. Then again, his answer would probably just add more confusion to the matter.

Confirms Peter Ames Carlin's story on the matter; Brian was allegedly in a bad state, but suddenly rushed in (in bathrobe?), and solved the problem in a jiff.

[The Shift]

Brian was allegedly in a bad state, but suddenly rushed in (in bathrobe?), and solved the problem in a jiff.

In a jiff? Or in his pyjamas?

[Alex]

, got an A Level & 2 O Levels in it,

An O level? I have no idea what that means.

What we took pre-GSCE, and a damn sight harder.

Please forgive me, I'm a yankee, but I'm guessing that's some sort of a test you had to take in school.

[Andrew G. Doe]

, got an A Level & 2 O Levels in it,

An O level? I have no idea what that means.

What we took pre-GSCE, and a damn sight harder.

Please forgive me, I'm a yankee, but I'm guessing that's some sort of a test you had to take in school.

Yup. GCE* O levels at 16, GCE A levels at 18.

[* General Certificate of Education]

[pixletwin]

So basically what you are saying is they are the equivalent of the O.W.L.s and N.E.W.T.S. in the Harry Potter books? 

[Andrew G. Doe]

So basically what you are saying is they are the equivalent of the O.W.L.s and N.E.W.T.S. in the Harry Potter books? 

I read the first Harry Potter book: thankfully, I have managed to expunge every trace of it from my memory.

[bgas]

So basically what you are saying is they are the equivalent of the O.W.L.s and N.E.W.T.S. in the Harry Potter books? 

I read the first Harry Potter book: thankfully, I have managed to expunge every trace of it from my memory.

So you didn't have to take the O.W.L.s and N.E.W.T.S, then?

[Andrew G. Doe]

So basically what you are saying is they are the equivalent of the O.W.L.s and N.E.W.T.S. in the Harry Potter books? 

I read the first Harry Potter book: thankfully, I have managed to expunge every trace of it from my memory.

So you didn't have to take the O.W.L.s and N.E.W.T.S, then?

Dunno about your hamlet, but bestiality's illegal over here.